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Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 #2925095 12/20/19 01:10 PM
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This is my first post to this forum. I am a guitar and upright bass player looking to place a nice instrument in my condo apartment upgrading from a Weber/Young Chang 150. I would be getting this for friends to play on as well as to learn on for myself. I am looking at three used instruments that are in my ~ 10K price range:
1) Schimmel 1985 from dealer
2) Kawai RX2 1998 from local private seller. (also 2005 RX 2 for 3K more money)
3) Yamaha C3 1985.
The Yamaha is really pushing regarding size for the space I have.
All are said to be in great shape. The Schimmel is said to have very little use.
I am leaning towards the Schimmel based on what I perceive to be reputation and discussion with my current Piano tech. Any thoughts? Thanks! Steve

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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: steve_tampa] #2925101 12/20/19 01:37 PM
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Your piano technician is the best one to advise you, because the ultimate worth and serviceability of a used piano depends upon its condition. The Schimmel and the Yamaha are almost 35 years old, so a comparison will only be valid based on the condition of each. "...said to be in great shape..." may be a valid comment, but it depends upon the source of the comment.

I would rely upon a technician's assessment.

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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: steve_tampa] #2925144 12/20/19 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by steve_tampa
====SNIP=====
I am looking at three used instruments that are in my ~ 10K price range:
1) Schimmel 1985 from dealer
2) Kawai RX2 1998 from local private seller. (also 2005 RX 2 for 3K more money)
3) Yamaha C3 1985.
The Yamaha is really pushing regarding size for the space I have.
All are said to be in great shape. The Schimmel is said to have very little use.
I am leaning towards the Schimmel based on what I perceive to be reputation and discussion with my current Piano tech. Any thoughts? Thanks! Steve

Have you played all three?
Which one do you like the best?
Hire an independent technician to evaluate the condition before purchasing.
A C2 would be comparable to an RX2. The C and RX series are "conservatory" models, usually seen as a step up from a "living room" model.
The Schimmel is... a bit different. You might research the brand to see where the 5'10" model is placed, i.e., "living room", "good teaching piano", etc.
You might also look at this thread:
http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/1982026/Thoughts%20on%20a%205%2710%22%20Schim.html

Boiled down, depending on actual condition, the three candidates seem **roughly** commensurate in quality. Given that, the only thing that matters is which one you like assuming a clean "bill of health" from a qualified independent technician.


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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: steve_tampa] #2925162 12/20/19 04:40 PM
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Since these are middle-aged used pianos, your personal preference and current condition matter an awful lot more than reputation. These specific pianos will all feel and sound markedly different.


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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: terminaldegree] #2925331 12/21/19 08:53 AM
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Thank you all!. Update. The Schimmel is a 5' 7" so I think one of their 169 pianos. So a bit smaller than the RX2. Given that the RX2 is in my general area and newer, I am leaning towards that one, but my piano tech, although not having seen the Schimmel is very into it as he really likes Renner actions, which the Schimmel is supposed to have. The Schimmel and RX2 fit better in the space I have. I have read that the Schimmels, being European, are voiced brighter than American pianos. Would this make the Schimmel closer to the Yamaha in voicing? Thanks again!

Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: steve_tampa] #2925337 12/21/19 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by steve_tampa
Thank you all!. Update. The Schimmel is a 5' 7" so I think one of their 169 pianos. So a bit smaller than the RX2. Given that the RX2 is in my general area and newer, I am leaning towards that one, but my piano tech, although not having seen the Schimmel is very into it as he really likes Renner actions, which the Schimmel is supposed to have. The Schimmel and RX2 fit better in the space I have. I have read that the Schimmels, being European, are voiced brighter than American pianos. Would this make the Schimmel closer to the Yamaha in voicing? Thanks again!

I played a new Schimmel 169 when I was piano shopping. Having had Yamahas, it wasn’t bright at all. IMHO it kicked the Yamaha C2X’s butt both in tonal quality and action but it was more expensive. Both the Yamaha C series and the Kawai RX series are rated by Larry Fine as consumer pianos while the Schimmels are ranked as performance pianos, which might be why your tech likes Schimmel. I love Schimmel’s. The treble is perfectly clear and bell-like, no “scratchiness” or tinny sound in the high octaves.
But as was mentioned before these three pianos are used and 24 and 34 years old so it all depends on what usage they’ve received and maintenance they were given. Condition is everything.


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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: steve_tampa] #2925340 12/21/19 09:35 AM
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Steve
It is still not clear that you have played these pianos. Since each brand, and within that brand are individualistic, it is highly recommended. What might make me very happy might make you snarl. That does not mean that either one of us are wrong. Once you have found a piano that you love to play, have it inspected


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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: steve_tampa] #2925354 12/21/19 10:51 AM
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The mid 1980s Schimmel grand models are mostly not the same designs as the current ones. My first acquaintances with them were the 5’10” and 6’10” grands from the late 1980s. They seemed well made, with a tone that was on the bright/clear side and not particularly complex. It’s the sort of sound that you’re likely to have a strong opinion about, the first time you hear it.

Shopping used grand pianos from a distance is not advisable, unless you’re going to travel to try them in person and have an independent tech (working on YOUR behalf) doing an inspection, prior to making a purchase.

A mid 1980s Yamaha C3 and a mid 1980s Schimmel will probably both be bright (*in their original form, who knows what’s happened to them since then), but they sound nothing like each other.


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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: dogperson] #2925551 12/21/19 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by dogperson
Steve
It is still not clear that you have played these pianos. Since each brand, and within that brand are individualistic, it is highly recommended. What might make me very happy might make you snarl. That does not mean that either one of us are wrong. Once you have found a piano that you love to play, have it inspected
This. (1) Play it yourself and (2)have it inspected. Your tech's preference for certain brands or actions is interesting info, but it is the pianos themselves that count.


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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: terminaldegree] #2925558 12/21/19 07:24 PM
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Originally Posted by terminaldegree
The mid 1980s Schimmel grand models are mostly not the same designs as the current ones. My first acquaintances with them were the 5’10” and 6’10” grands from the late 1980s. They seemed well made, with a tone that was on the bright/clear side and not particularly complex. It’s the sort of sound that you’re likely to have a strong opinion about, the first time you hear it.

Au contraire. My late 80’s Schimmel is the opposite of your description. It has a rich, mellow tone, singing treble notes and complex undertones. I think that many of the German pianos that are not mass produced have some individual characteristics. It also depends on the skills of the technician who originally voiced it and how well it has been maintained over the years. I agree with the other commenters that it is a personal choice and to get a professional opinion about their condition.



Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: PianogrlNW] #2929678 01/03/20 07:26 AM
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Hi all... to now add to the mix, I am considering also a 1995 Petrof IV as an alternative to the Schimmel. The Petrof is closer. Not sure if this one has Renner action. Price is similar to the Schimmel although 10 yrs younger piano. Thoughts? Worth considering?

Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: steve_tampa] #2929688 01/03/20 08:04 AM
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Play them and report back...

Rich


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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: Rich D.] #2929713 01/03/20 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Rich D.
Play them and report back...

Rich

Exactly. I’ve only played one Petrof in my life. It was at a friends house and the piano looked to be at least 7 feet so it’s really hard to guess what a piano from the same company sounds like that’s at least a foot shorter. I really enjoyed the big Petrof but your results may vary. I’m not sure why but Petrof piano has many fans and many critics on Piano World? Go and try them, take good notes and report back.


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Re: Schimmel 5'10" vs. Kawai Rx2 vs. Yamaha C3 1985 [Re: steve_tampa] #2929740 01/03/20 11:01 AM
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We're waiting to hear what your thoughts are on these pianos. Being primarily a guitar player you may not feel qualified to make the judgment, but the fact is you'll be the one playing it, so yours is the only judgment that matters.

I've played a Petrof IV from roughly that time period, the action was nice but the bass was a tad anemic. Other than that it sounded fine, but not inspiring (to me). YMMV.


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