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Chopin Etudes #2922667 12/13/19 04:53 PM
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I recently got etude book and am learning nouvelle etude 2 which I think is one of the easy ones. I had a quick look at the others but they all looked from difficult to impossible and so I decided to stop looking through them. I could not see any other possibilities. Are there any others that may be doable? I only found one possibility so far, nouvelle etude 1. Thanks.

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Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2922676 12/13/19 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Moo :)
I recently got etude book and am learning nouvelle etude 2 which I think is one of the easy ones. I had a quick look at the others but they all looked from difficult to impossible and so I decided to stop looking through them. I could not see any other possibilities. Are there any others that may be doable? I only found one possibility so far, nouvelle etude 1. Thanks.

Have you looked at: 10/6 and B130/1?





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Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2922679 12/13/19 05:13 PM
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Thank you. I think it may be doable but I cant tell well from a video. I still prefer the nouvelle etude 1 which sounded more fun to learn.

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2922681 12/13/19 05:15 PM
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Not everyone studies the Chopin Etudes(or any etude) with the idea of performing them in a competition or playing them at the same speed a major pianist would choose. I think many teachers assign some of the etudes to help develop technique knowing the student will not be able to play them at the highest virtuoso level. And I think some of the etudes like the Black Key and Butterfly sound very good at quite a bit less than virtuoso speed. Some of the slow etudes are also doable without virtuoso technique.

With that approach in mind, I think Op.10 Nos. 3, 5, 6, 9 and Op. 25 Nos.1, 2, and 9 are reasonable for those without conservatory level technique.

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: pianoloverus] #2922701 12/13/19 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
[...]
With that approach in mind, I think Op.10 Nos. 3, 5, 6, 9 and Op. 25 Nos.1, 2, and 9 are reasonable for those without conservatory level technique.


To that list I would add Op. 25, No. 7 in C-sharp minor.

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Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2922875 12/14/19 02:01 PM
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Thank you. I have written the suggestions in the book.

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2923770 12/17/19 01:09 AM
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Hi! I think that learning one of the other etudes with not immediately planning on playing it in the full speed might be helpful. Here are 2 videos that I came across that explain exercises for the first 2 Chopin etudes for every level and speed:

Chopin op. 10 no. 2:
https://youtu.be/u7wBCbcxfaw

Chopin op. 10 no. 1:
https://youtu.be/t00V9nTaBP4

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Piano Fan 93501] #2923888 12/17/19 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Piano Fan 93501
Hi! I think that learning one of the other etudes with not immediately planning on playing it in the full speed might be helpful. Here are 2 videos that I came across that explain exercises for the first 2 Chopin etudes for every level and speed:

Chopin op. 10 no. 2:
https://youtu.be/u7wBCbcxfaw

Chopin op. 10 no. 1:
https://youtu.be/t00V9nTaBP4
But I don't think either of those sound half decent at a moderate speed and No.2 is way too hard at any except an absurdly slow speed for a first Chopin Etude.

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2923895 12/17/19 11:07 AM
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Tyrone Slothrop Offline
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Danae Dörken, the concert pianist seems to be teaching very nice exercises on these two etudes. However, it will be much too hard for me for many years to come.





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Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2924043 12/17/19 05:50 PM
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Thank you for the videos. They still look in the impossible range for me. The arpeggio passages reminds me of Mendelssohn Etude in B minor I want to play but it still impossible.

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: pianoloverus] #2924064 12/17/19 07:12 PM
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I understand your point. Although I can imagine at least op. 10, no. 1 sounding okay even at a slower speed, maybe the ones to look into and that might be more interesting for you actually are op. 10, no. 3 and no. 9 as well as op. 25, no. 1 and no. 2.

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: pianoloverus] #2927772 12/29/19 03:11 AM
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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Not everyone studies the Chopin Etudes(or any etude) with the idea of performing them in a competition or playing them at the same speed a major pianist would choose. I think many teachers assign some of the etudes to help develop technique knowing the student will not be able to play them at the highest virtuoso level. And I think some of the etudes like the Black Key and Butterfly sound very good at quite a bit less than virtuoso speed. Some of the slow etudes are also doable without virtuoso technique.

With that approach in mind, I think Op.10 Nos. 3, 5, 6, 9 and Op. 25 Nos.1, 2, and 9 are reasonable for those without conservatory level technique.


Thanks for that. I myself would play some of the etudes from time to time but no where near performance level. I always kick myself for not being able to achieve performance level after seeing 12 yo kids playing them at high level on YouTube.

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2927791 12/29/19 05:43 AM
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Paul Barton has some nice exercises that build up to the Etudes. There are some videos on YouTube.


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Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2927793 12/29/19 06:18 AM
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Her Op.10 No.1 video reminds me of a practice technique reportedly used by a pianist who had to learn and perform Rachmaninoff's 2nd Concerto in a week. He'd play notes 1-5 as fast as possible, and then 5-9, 9-13 etc. Then 2-6,6-10,10-14 etc. until every note was the start of a group. He'd also change the size of the groups.

I just give five-note groups as an example.

He said it worked very well (at avoiding a catastrophe at least), but he didn't feel he knew the piece properly even though the performance was a success on that occasion.

There's a very similar story on Quora by a pianist who used the same techinque. I think it was the same concerto as well.

Last edited by johnstaf; 12/29/19 06:27 AM.
Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: johnstaf] #2927823 12/29/19 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by johnstaf
Her Op.10 No.1 video reminds me of a practice technique reportedly used by a pianist who had to learn and perform Rachmaninoff's 2nd Concerto in a week. He'd play notes 1-5 as fast as possible, and then 5-9, 9-13 etc. Then 2-6,6-10,10-14 etc. until every note was the start of a group. He'd also change the size of the groups.

I just give five-note groups as an example.

He said it worked very well (at avoiding a catastrophe at least), but he didn't feel he knew the piece properly even though the performance was a success on that occasion.

There's a very similar story on Quora by a pianist who used the same techinque. I think it was the same concerto as well.

My teacher has me use this technique all the time to make fast passages more even. In addition to what you mention, also playing in rhythms (long-short-long-short) and with intentionally migrated accents/emphasis (accented, unaccented, unaccented, unaccented, accented, unaccented, ...).


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across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2927824 12/29/19 09:38 AM
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Johnstaf
‘Playing in rhythms’ is just intended to be one technique to use in practicing but is not intended to be the only way a passage is practiced. Could he have learned the Rach 2 by only using this one option? If so, of course he wouldn’t feel comfortable with playing it as written.

Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2927827 12/29/19 09:51 AM
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I have been learning the nouvelle etude 2 and it is a lot easier than the suggestions as its is only a 3 against 2 which I found an easy rhythm. There is other one nouvelle etude 1 which is also nice but it has a harder rhythm with 4 against 3. The other one recommended to me long ago was this one opus 10 no 10. I have not looked at the score but this may be another option rather than the op 10 no 1 or 2 which I think are a lot harder.



In the end I ordered the preludes by chopin as from the suggestions there is not much in the etudes I can play. I found another piece to learn from the preludes once the etude is done.


Last edited by Moo :); 12/29/19 09:52 AM.
Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Moo :)] #2927830 12/29/19 09:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Moo :)
In the end I ordered the preludes by chopin as from the suggestions there is not much in the etudes I can play.

Did you try 10/6 yet? Piano syllabus considers it a Grade 8.


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across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2927843 12/29/19 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Did you try 10/6 yet? Piano syllabus considers it a Grade 8.


No. My teacher suggested we play another Rach prelude as the D minor one he said probably should move on as it will take too long to polish. I picked B major but it is quite an easy one. I think it is time again for some Mendelssohn but I cant find the score. I am looking for this one opus 13 prelude and fugue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YObJX1HR98g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXC67Py_RtY

Last edited by Moo :); 12/29/19 10:17 AM.
Re: Chopin Etudes [Re: dogperson] #2927850 12/29/19 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by dogperson
Johnstaf
‘Playing in rhythms’ is just intended to be one technique to use in practicing but is not intended to be the only way a passage is practiced. Could he have learned the Rach 2 by only using this one option? If so, of course he wouldn’t feel comfortable with playing it as written.


He said it was the most efficient way for him to learn the notes in a few days. AFAIK he completely ignored the written rhythm. The idea was to turn the piece into a sequence of notes, and to make the transitions as reflexive as possible. After that, it was easy to play it as written. I assume this initial phase only took a couple of days, so he probably moved on to actually playing the piece pretty quickly but I don't know.

Of course he must have already been a serious virtuoso to get the gig, so learning the notes was all he needed to do.

Last edited by johnstaf; 12/29/19 10:48 AM.
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