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Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question #2910930 11/11/19 07:29 PM
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Hi guys

Loving my Kawai MP11
Been playing her all day today, I got the 3 pedal unit that came with her, but only really use the damper pedal to sustain.... is there another smaller pedal that would do the same job exactly?
Was thinking Roland DP10 or Yamaha FC3A?

Also... while playing a piano with a strings sound, how do I setup an expression pedal to turn the strings volume up and down during certain songs I’m playing? Any expression pedal recommendations?

I’m not very technical at all sorry

Also been playing my new Gold Korg Kronos 2 88 today, loving all the sounds on this beast, but still come back to my MP11

[img[img]https://drive.google.com/file/d/1nQKU0bwVkFFb2Ij9-ITeSh0s8QRV0OJz/view?usp=drivesdk[/img]


Wayne Harris
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Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2910943 11/11/19 08:00 PM
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One thing that surprised me about DPs is that the pedals are not as interchangeable as you would think. Yes, they all tend to use 1/4" plugs, but more often than not they're not fully compatible with each other (different resistive values from the pot, different polarities, etc.).

When I had an MP11, I could use a Yamaha FC3A for sustain, and it was mostly fine (it's a better pedal than the F-30 unit that comes with the MP11), but you'd get some weird behavior, such as the turning on the DP and having every note be sustained until you pump the pedal once or twice. A totally minor inconvenience but one I couldn't fully fix.

The only real way to tell if a different pedal will work is to try it.


Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11 || Kawai NV-10
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2911001 11/12/19 01:20 AM
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Manual to my MP7SE says
"The foot switch does not turn off
after releasing the pedal.

Check that the foot switch pedal is a ‘Normal Closed’ polarity type. If using
a ‘Normal Open’ polarity type, please set the FSW Polarity setting in the
SYSTEM:Pedal/Mod. menu to Reverse."

Manual to MP11SE says
"FSW Pedal Polarity normal, reverse
This parameter changes the polarity for the foot switch pedal.
MP11SE’s foot switch terminal is designed for use with ‘Normal
Close’ polarity pedals. If using a foot switch with ‘Normal Open’
polarity, please change this parameter to Reverse."

So seems strange if not there on MP11.

So guess any footswitch can be used on 1/4" input instead of where triple-pedal goes..

Kawai has on for MP7SE F-10H that I feel is just fine as footwitch.
I have a Roland too, just fine - don't remember model.

For expression I have a switch on back of MP7SE if tip and ring should be swapped or not. That is different between brands if slider is connected to tip or ring.

I have 3 EV-05 if it is Roland/Boss/Edirol but would prefer a smoother feel - but otherwise works fine.

Last edited by Nip; 11/12/19 01:29 AM.

Kawai MP7SE - Hammond XK3c - Synthesizers
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Nip] #2911004 11/12/19 02:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Nip

So seems strange if not there on MP11.


It's on the MP11 as well. I tried it, as well as the pedal calibration routine. It doesn't always work perfectly. I reported it here and Kawai James responded saying that 3rd party pedals basically aren't supported (even though there are all these options in the interface to work with all these different pedal types).

Originally Posted by Nip

So guess any footswitch can be used on 1/4" input instead of where triple-pedal goes..


The MP11 isn't like a standard triple-pedal input. It controls 3 pedals through two 1/4" jacks. I think the Sos may be hooked up to piggy back off some resistive value from the damper jack, which may be why I was getting some weird results with other pedals.


Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11 || Kawai NV-10
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2911006 11/12/19 02:21 AM
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I see - I thought the Kawai GFP-3 I was looking at getting for MP7SE was the one shipped with MP11.
That one has a round multi connector special type.

When it comes to damper footswitch - I don't see how it can go wrong - it's either closing or breaking a loop.
Some misconception here about calibrating footswitch to replace damper pedal.

It does exist though in some gear I saw that a combined input to do either footswitch or expression - so maybe that is the case then.


Kawai MP7SE - Hammond XK3c - Synthesizers
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2911027 11/12/19 04:29 AM
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Nip, the MP11SE and MP7SE are designed to work with the Kawai-produced GFP-3 pedal unit.

The MP11 and MP7 were designed to work with the F-30 pedal unit, which uses two 1/4" phone connectors (1x TS, 1x TRS).

I don't believe it's possible to connect an alternative pedal unit to the DAMPER terminal and still achieve progressive/half-damping. However simple on/off pedals *may* function.

However, it should definitely be possible to connect an on/off switch pedal to the SOFT terminal, then reassign this pedal as the Sustain function in the EDIT menu.

Originally Posted by Waynester
Also... while playing a piano with a strings sound, how do I setup an expression pedal to turn the strings volume up and down during certain songs I’m playing? Any expression pedal recommendations?


The MP11/MP7 can only use expression pedals wired for "Ring to WIPER" type expression pedals (e.g. the Yamaha FC7), and not "Tip to WIPER" type (e.g. the Roland EV5). The MP11SE/MP7SE can use both types.

Once connected, turn on the SUB section and select the desired Strings sound. Then select the Controllers category from the EDIT menu and ensure that Expression Pedal = On, and Expression Pedal Assign = Expression. This should do the trick. If the Expression pedal also changes the volume of the Piano sound, select the Piano section, enter Controllers in the EDIT menu, and set Expression Pedal = Off.

Note that there is also an Express Pedal Curve setting and Expression Pedal Calibration function in the SYSTEM menu, if desired.

I hope this helps.

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2911029 11/12/19 04:31 AM
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I guess, it might even be possible to plug a damper pedal (that does allow half-pedalling) into the Expression pedal connector, then reassign the function.


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2911033 11/12/19 04:48 AM
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Thanks to KawaiJames for clarification.

I think ElectroHarmonix has a killer expression pedal in flexibility and price
https://www.thomann.de/gb/electro_harmonix_expression_pedal.htm

For non european - reduce VAT by approx 20% for prices in us.
It's probably on amazon as well.

Swap tip/ring, swap order which way is increasing value and also limit movement values given. All passive, no batteries.
One review also said it could be adjusted with screwdriver how heavy it to should be to move - he felt it was a little light.

Checks all the boxes for me.

Last edited by Nip; 11/12/19 04:49 AM.

Kawai MP7SE - Hammond XK3c - Synthesizers
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Kawai James] #2911034 11/12/19 05:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
I guess, it might even be possible to plug a damper pedal (that does allow half-pedalling) into the Expression pedal connector, then reassign the function.


That was interesting - saw that Kawai F-10H seems to be half pedalling and good choice then.

I never knew - and I felt that I pressed pedal and sustain was so overwhelming in swell in volume by default - and I never knew it was two levels. I reduced that setting quite a bit to be more natural. We live and learn....


Kawai MP7SE - Hammond XK3c - Synthesizers
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Nip] #2911039 11/12/19 05:14 AM
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That ElectroHarmonix pedal looks pretty good! wink

I'm afraid I have no idea if connecting a Kawai F-10H to the EXP connector, and assigning the function will actually work...it's just an idea that came to me after writing my initial post.

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Kawai James] #2911042 11/12/19 05:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Kawai James


I'm afraid I have no idea if connecting a Kawai F-10H to the EXP connector, and assigning the function will actually work...it's just an idea that came to me after writing my initial post.

Kind regards,
James
x

It says F-10H on input and it is a TRS connector at the end - so just figured at least half pedaling too.
There is both footswitch and exp input too.
I have to check later....


Kawai MP7SE - Hammond XK3c - Synthesizers
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2911130 11/12/19 11:09 AM
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So can anyone confirm if another single damper pedal will definitely work on my Kawai MP11 as everyone else has answered someone else’s question lol


Wayne Harris
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www.bongiovi.co.uk
www.facebook.com/bongiovitributeband
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Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2911161 11/12/19 12:29 PM
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I tried here
http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthre...and-expression-question.html#Post2911001

Sorry, about hijacking and subtopic.

Expression pedal
--------------------------------
The EHX(Electro Harmonix brand) was also an attempt to suggest one for you.
http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthre...and-expression-question.html#Post2911033

It can do all changes on pedal - you don't need to do anything on MP11. Most common is swapped tip/ring to wiper.

Footswitch
--------------------
If you have a FSW Pedal polarity in MP11(I only have manual for MP11SE) any closing or breaking pedal should work. I have it on system settings.

If there is a setting Half Adjust(menu System->Pedal/Mod) the Kawai F-10H might be good idea also getting setting where it starts happening pressing pedal.


Kawai MP7SE - Hammond XK3c - Synthesizers
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Waynester] #2911379 11/12/19 11:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Waynester
So can anyone confirm if another single damper pedal will definitely work on my Kawai MP11 as everyone else has answered someone else’s question lol


Wayne, it really depends on the kind of pedal you're intending to connect, and which port you're plugging it into.
Then you also have to configure the MP11 so that the sustain function is assigned to the correct pedal.

Looking at your photo above, I assume you have pedals from other boards that can be tried with your MP11?

By the way, is there anything preventing you from simply using the triple pedal unit that came with the instrument? I don't use all the gears on my bike, but they don't cause me any problems so I leave them on there...

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Nip] #2911385 11/13/19 12:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Nip
Originally Posted by Kawai James


I'm afraid I have no idea if connecting a Kawai F-10H to the EXP connector, and assigning the function will actually work...it's just an idea that came to me after writing my initial post.

Kind regards,
James
x

It says F-10H on input and it is a TRS connector at the end - so just figured at least half pedaling too.
There is both footswitch and exp input too.
I have to check later....


EDIT not possible so quoting myself.

The F-10H is continuous pedal with potentionmeter inside. Setting half adjust on MP7SE to where you want things start happening and then it is continuous lift of dampers.

Really more than I anticipated - nice.

So checking on MP11 if half adjust is there - is would support this pedal too is my assumption.


Kawai MP7SE - Hammond XK3c - Synthesizers
Re: Kawai MP11 Damper Pedals and expression question [Re: Nip] #2911395 11/13/19 03:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Nip
So checking on MP11 if half adjust is there - is would support this pedal too is my assumption.


Unfortunately, the MP11 does not have a connector for the F-10H.

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019

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