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Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: MacMacMac] #2896905
10/03/19 08:00 PM
10/03/19 08:00 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 7,778
Tyrone Slothrop Online content OP
Tyrone Slothrop  Online Content OP

7000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 7,778
Originally Posted by MacMacMac
In the meantime the choices don't matter much. Fingers on the keys ... that's what matters.

Yes, yes. I have an RCM level 4 exam coming up in December so I certainly have enough fingers on the keys.


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
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Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2898354
10/08/19 06:13 PM
10/08/19 06:13 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 7,778
Tyrone Slothrop Online content OP
Tyrone Slothrop  Online Content OP

7000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 7,778
Those who have both VSL Synchron pianos and the Garritan CFX, can you tell me if the VSL pianos are different enough from the Garritan CFX that it might still be worth it for me to get the Garritan CFX if I already have all three of the VSL Synchron pianos? Does it sound different? Is it a worthwhile experience?

Also, anyone who has Yamahas own CFX sound (for example, on the Avantgrands) and also Garritan CFX, can you tell me if these are different enough to be worth the money having Garritan CFX also? (When I was planning on getting Garritan earlier, because it got some many votes from forum members, I hadn't realized I would end up with a DP with a built in CFX voice.)


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2898376
10/08/19 07:59 PM
10/08/19 07:59 PM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 15,700
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Kawai James  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 15,700
Hamamatsu, Japan
Tyrone, I think it might be interesting to compare different recordings/mixing variations of the same piano.

However, are you really seeking justification from the PianoWorld community to spend more money?


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Kawai James] #2898377
10/08/19 08:07 PM
10/08/19 08:07 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 7,778
Tyrone Slothrop Online content OP
Tyrone Slothrop  Online Content OP

7000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 7,778
Originally Posted by Kawai James
Tyrone, I think it might be interesting to compare different recordings/mixing variations of the same piano.

However, are you really seeking justification from the PianoWorld community to spend more money?

Actually, just the opposite. Garritan was the highest vote getter in my informal poll (above) - not just by a little, but by 14-3 as the next vote getter. However, I just acquired VSL so I'm thinking I've realism covered. So if I don't get Garritan, I'd just spend my money on something else instead. wink Might still be a VST, but maybe a totally different piano, like the Wavesfactory Mercury Fazioli, for example. Anyways, it's easy to buy Garritan since it got so many votes and supporters. It's much harder to decide what to get instead, because of the high probability of ending up with something cr@ppy.


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2898382
10/08/19 08:39 PM
10/08/19 08:39 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 171
R
robinlb Online content
Full Member
robinlb  Online Content
Full Member
R

Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 171
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Those who have both VSL Synchron pianos and the Garritan CFX, can you tell me if the VSL pianos are different enough from the Garritan CFX that it might still be worth it for me to get the Garritan CFX if I already have all three of the VSL Synchron pianos? Does it sound different? Is it a worthwhile experience?

Also, anyone who has Yamahas own CFX sound (for example, on the Avantgrands) and also Garritan CFX, can you tell me if these are different enough to be worth the money having Garritan CFX also? (When I was planning on getting Garritan earlier, because it got some many votes from forum members, I hadn't realized I would end up with a DP with a built in CFX voice.)


Tyrone, all other people's opinions, including experiences, are personal and subjective, and can never replace your own ideas. Now that you have a powerful music workstation, compare them by yourself and use it as a new benchmark for others in the future. May be the best way I think. laugh


CA98~~RME ADI2 DAC~~VSL CFX&D274&Bluthner1895
Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2898383
10/08/19 08:40 PM
10/08/19 08:40 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 334
G
Grazilerimba Offline
Full Member
Grazilerimba  Offline
Full Member
G

Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 334
The Garritan CFX is unique to me because its room ambience is very natural and fitting. I personally don't like the Synchron Stage in the VSL pianos, it takes a lot of work to make it sound tolerable. The Abbey Road Studios though sound fabulous in the Garritan piano right out of the box. The two downsides, coming from the VSL pianos, are that the Garritan has a lower dynamic range which you might find distracting, and the room reverb is very prominent, borderline being too much. To me it is beautiful, but plenty of others here have said that it's too much for them. On the other hand, the Garritan CFX is the most evenly playable sampled piano out there. In the Classic mic configuration, there is no note sticking out, no out of tune notes. Everything is as it should be.

I would also advise against getting the Lite version - coming from the VSL pianos, it will most likely be a disappointment as it lacks the room mic and you won't get the full effect of the studio hall. Most people here advise getting the Lite version to upgrade to the Full version later. Coming from VSL, you will most likely not get that much out of the Lite version. But that's just my opinion.

Other than that, ask yourself what it is that you would most likely want to get more of, compared to the VSL. Is it "life" and "tone"? Then it's most likely gonna be the Embertone, but it has some pretty harsh flaws, especially when coming from the VSL offerings, and playability doesn't compare to them.

Is it playability? IMHO the American Concert D has a really great playability, and also the Bechstein Digital. Former seriously lacks in its sustain pedal sound but has half and repedaling, latter requires a beast PC to run properly, but has sustain samples and also has solid playability, but lacks half pedaling or repedaling as far as I'm aware.

OH and wait for a couple of weeks before purchasing anything else, Black Friday is coming!

Last edited by Grazilerimba; 10/08/19 08:42 PM.
Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2898385
10/08/19 08:47 PM
10/08/19 08:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 213
USA
J
JJHLH Offline
Full Member
JJHLH  Offline
Full Member
J

Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 213
USA
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Also, anyone who has Yamahas own CFX sound (for example, on the Avantgrands) and also Garritan CFX, can you tell me if these are different enough to be worth the money having Garritan CFX also? (When I was planning on getting Garritan earlier, because it got some many votes from forum members, I hadn't realized I would end up with a DP with a built in CFX voice.)


To my ear I prefer Garritan CFX over the native CFX of the N1X by a fairly wide margin. It sounds absolutely glorious on my near field monitors. If I close my eyes I can actually imagine I am playing a CFX at Abbey Road Studios. The atmosphere is superb. I’m so impressed with it I don’t plan to get any other VST.

The weak link is my playing skills. But the beautiful sound motivates me to practice more.


Yamaha N1X, P-515. Garritan CFX. Genelec 8331 monitors.
Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2898444
10/09/19 02:14 AM
10/09/19 02:14 AM
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 9
Slovenia
5penguins Offline
Junior Member
5penguins  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 9
Slovenia
VST users, do you use internal piano speakers or external monitors/speakers?

Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2898448
10/09/19 02:41 AM
10/09/19 02:41 AM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 381
U
U3piano Offline
Full Member
U3piano  Offline
Full Member
U

Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 381
As for sampled vst's my opinion has changed.

I now prefer acoustic samples Kawai ex pro over both garritan cfx and ravenscroft.

Somehow i can't get garritan cfx to sound good over my speakers, (jbl lsr305's) and i'm done spending time trying. Strangely it sounds fine over my headphones. So at first i blamed the speakers, but everything else sounds better using them.

Pianoteq sounds good over my speakers while i don't really enjoy the sound with my headphones.


Now Acoustic samples Kawai ex-pro, this one sounds just great over my speakers as well as my headphones. And it's just very realistic, evenly sampled and playable. I think the recording technique/microphones/environment they used is just the best. It's my go to (sampled) piano now. A real joy to play, and that bass end is just amazing. Im wondering about their C7 now, anyone got experience with that?

Also in both garritan cfx and ravenscroft i find some notes stand out/sound a little different than others which can be annoying. None of this in kawai ex pro.

Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2898466
10/09/19 04:11 AM
10/09/19 04:11 AM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 101
Tenerife-Canary Island-Spain
S
sorrownightingale Offline
Full Member
sorrownightingale  Offline
Full Member
S

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 101
Tenerife-Canary Island-Spain
Tyrone Slothrop since I have VSL Synchron Pianos I don't use Garritan CFX or any other

Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: U3piano] #2898471
10/09/19 05:01 AM
10/09/19 05:01 AM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 9,676
Raleigh, North Carolina
MacMacMac Offline
9000 Post Club Member
MacMacMac  Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 9,676
Raleigh, North Carolina
I, too, have fallen away from the Garritan.
Originally Posted by U3piano
I now prefer acoustic samples Kawai ex pro over both garritan cfx and ravenscroft.
Somehow i can't get garritan cfx to sound good over my speakers, (jbl lsr305's) and i'm done spending time trying.
Maybe it's just that I don't like the Yamaha sound?

Regardless, I like the EX Pro better than the Garritan ... and I like the Steinways (Vintage D and Grandeur) much better. Despite their flaws the sound is much more to my liking.

Re: What is the best sampled VST for classical piano? [Re: U3piano] #2898473
10/09/19 05:05 AM
10/09/19 05:05 AM
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 98
C
Craig Richards Offline
Full Member
Craig Richards  Offline
Full Member
C

Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 98
Originally Posted by U3piano
As for sampled vst's my opinion has changed.

I now prefer acoustic samples Kawai ex pro over both garritan cfx and ravenscroft.

Somehow i can't get garritan cfx to sound good over my speakers, (jbl lsr305's) and i'm done spending time trying. Strangely it sounds fine over my headphones. So at first i blamed the speakers, but everything else sounds better using them.

Pianoteq sounds good over my speakers while i don't really enjoy the sound with my headphones.


Now Acoustic samples Kawai ex-pro, this one sounds just great over my speakers as well as my headphones. And it's just very realistic, evenly sampled and playable. I think the recording technique/microphones/environment they used is just the best. It's my go to (sampled) piano now. A real joy to play, and that bass end is just amazing. Im wondering about their C7 now, anyone got experience with that?

Also in both garritan cfx and ravenscroft i find some notes stand out/sound a little different than others which can be annoying. None of this in kawai ex pro.


Yes, the Acoustic Samples Kawai EX Pro really flys under the radar in the sampled piano world. It was produced by Lance Herring, who went on to release the VI Labs True Keys collection (Steinway D, Fazioli 308 & C.Bechstein) & the Ravenscroft 275 grand. He really know his stuff.

Despite the Acoustic Samples Kawai EX Pro being quite old and basic by today's piano sampling standards, it just has a body and presence which is really appealing to me also, and benefits from multiple release samples based on velocity & duration which really helps with the realism. I've used it live and to record with, and it just works. I also have the Acoustic Samples C7 which is very solid & playable, but I play the Kawai EX Pro more often - it just has that something extra smile


Pianist, Composer & Arranger
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