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Thanks everyone. I do suggest to parents to look second hand, but either they had their reasons to not, or there was nothing available. This situation of them 'thinking' about buying a half decent DP has been going on now for half a year, and it was overdue then.

I appreciate its a big investment etc, but honestly don't want to rock the boat any further by making any other alternative suggestions :-) or we will be another six months while they check out those ...

I'm not going to make the final decision for them, just wanted to weed out any with issues I was unaware of. I've always been pretty solidly a yamaha fan, but need to keep a more open mind these days I think.

I've played both a fair bit and prefer the key action of the Kawai. I've had 3 Yamahas so I should be biased that direction, but since getting an acoustic I've changed my preference. As far as sound, I find all internal speakers and sound generator to be adequate but not spectacular because I use a vst and external sound system.

+1,

The Kawai ES110 is a superior instrument as it plays more like a piano: better action, more nuanced sound. The Yamaha P125 has a slightly brighter clearer sound (which is nice) but the Kawai piano sampling has more nuances which make it feel better to play.
IMO, the Roland FP30 is the only competitor to the ES110 at the beginner level portable pianos range---the FP30 action (PHAIV standard) is very good for the price. I would give them these two options to compare.

Pretty they can't stretch to the ES8/P515/FP90 price range, as these instruments are more suitable for intermediate to advanced level (grade 6 to 8).

I think there was a difference in opinion between the parents - one would have gone for the higher spec and take them all the way, but one felt it too much for beginners when they might give up ...

I completely understand the budget and think that the more conservative parent certainly has a point on waiting to see if the children will stick with piano lessons. However, I'm at a lost why/how they eliminated the Roland FP30. I personally agree with CyberGene when he says...

Note: I have an ES110 in Amsterdam and had an FP30 in Washington DC, so I am familiar with both of these.

Is Roland like Marmite? either you love the sound or hate it

Honestly I dunno why. I suppose I could add it back on the list and hope it doesn't derail them completely ...

Hi Jimmy,

I don't think it's quite that. The thing with modern beginner portables is that most people have either a PC, laptop or tablet that could be attached to the USB port/MIDI ports on all these instruments. You can replace the sound with Pianoteq or Garritan CFX grand and have a really responsive and/or great sounding piano on a beginner portable piano that only has a relatively cheaper version of the manufacturers piano sample.

The action on the Roland is just very good for that price, so it is worth considering for that reason alone. As the FP30 doesn't have fully modelled Roland sound, it's not that it's like marmite for those who don't like the fully modelled sound. Of course, it still might not be to their liking in comparison. Actually, compared to the earlier ES100 and P115, the FP30 sound is much better. The others caught up a bit (P125, ES110 and casio PX-S1000) with their sample quality, so it's about even on that score.

These things have to be taken in the round. For a small investment (if you already own a VST capable device like a PC/laptop), you can upgrade the sound on a budget---so going for the best action makes really good medium-term financial sense, as the instrument might last till Grade 6.

KR,

Doug.

Sorry for the ignorance, but what happens after Grade 6 so that you cannot practice anymore on a digital piano in that price range? Fast repetitions? More playing that requires a deep pivot position?

Thanks for the explanation - yes that makes sense. I'm not very techy - kind of plug and play :-)

Hi Doug,

Maybe a bit of a nit, but I believe the ES100 and the ES110 share the same sound engine (Harmonic Imaging) and likewise the P-115 and P-125 do as well (Pure CF Sampling of the CFiiiS)? So the tone generation may not have changed at all between these generations.

The Casio does have a new sound engine in the S1000 though.

Hi Gombessa,

You're right of course.

Looking into it, well, seems that the speaker systems have improved. According to blurb. This makes sense, as how an instrument projects the sound can make a huge difference. So I guess technically, the sample quality improved, just not from the sampling tech.

BLURB...***Yamaha has included a newly improved 2-way speaker system that allows the sound to be produced in both upward and downward directions. Especially in comparison to the Yamaha P-115, the P125 is a sound that is much more rich and lush.

Kind regards,

Doug.

You come down with severe G.A.S. after giving-in to having a go at the music store. :-).

I think it's more akin to racing cars: you don't want to still be racing a 1.1 L banger after 5 years of racing, not unless it's stock car racing. You want better breaks, more power, more downforce and better handling.

You hear professionals doing demos for beginner level portables, and you can hear often the limitations of the instrument and see how so much they're enjoying themselves lol.

KR,

Doug.

When a professional plays on a low-range piano to make a demo of it, usually I feel that the instrument is much better of what it really is... They are able to "hide" the shortcomings of the DP... The piano has trouble in low velocities? He plays a fast piece. The piano has trouble in the low register? He plays more on the middle/high ranges. The piano has a boring, looped sustain sound? He never plays a long sustained note, etc.

lol, yep. And you also need to use a professional who is capable of hiding their emotions on their face---a feat that someone I watched recently couldn't quite manage.

But sometimes is difficult to distinguish between a contracted face because the pianist is "feeling" what he plays, or because he thinks: "WTF sound is this!?". There is a very subtle line...