2017 was our 20th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
Who's Online Now
68 members (aesop, Ash Piano, 36251, anotherscott, BachToTheFuture, B3boy, Baltguy, APianistHasNoName, 13 invisible), 546 guests, and 546 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 5 of 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878162 08/09/19 07:01 PM
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 55
N
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
N
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 55
This is so fascinating to watch!

I think I should stop complaining about piano prices. Now any price on any piano feels like a bargain.

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878285 08/10/19 08:23 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 3,487
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 3,487
This has been a fun journey to watch!



[Linked Image]
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878312 08/10/19 12:17 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 102
P
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
P
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 102
Maybe you have inspired some piano manufactures to think out the box and use more creative finishes besides the typical shiny ebony on almost all pianos.


C2XPEC
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878330 08/10/19 01:29 PM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,041
j&j Online Content
4000 Post Club Member
Online Content
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 4,041
It’s maybe strange but I do really enjoy the pictures taken at each step of the rebuild and refinishing. It’s completely amazing how much work and effort each step takes. I probably won’t stop complaining about high piano prices but at least I know why they’re so expensive.


J & J
Estonia L190 Hidden Beauty
Casio Privia PX-330
My piano’s voice is beautiful!
[Linked Image]
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878417 08/10/19 08:35 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 5,730

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015
5000 Post Club Member
Offline

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015
5000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 5,730
I read this update earlier today on my phone, and the new pictures wouldn't load. I have to confess that I did not think I would like it, based on the description, but now that I've seen the pictures I have to admit it doesn't look too bad. And I understand the rationale for doing it.

Keep going guys. I'm hoping to see this finished before you go back to school!


January is National Slavery and Human Trafficking Awareness Month
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878521 08/11/19 10:13 AM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,672
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,672
This is fascinating. It ain't everyday one sees a piano with no strings attached.


Some men are music lovers. Others make love without it.
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878781 08/12/19 05:43 AM
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 148
M
Man Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
M
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 148
Originally Posted by LovingPianos
As soon as we were done with the lid painting, it was given 3 coats of automotive clear lacquer to seal the artwork.

[Linked Image]

And now the final test-fitting! We lost count of how many times the lid went on and off the piano! grin

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Some more interesting lighting...this girl is on FIRE! cool

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

And finally, the rebronzed plate went in for the LAST time!!!

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Note: this update is actually as of July 17th! We've already advanced far ahead, so we'll try to write more updates soon! It's a project in itself writing all these stuffs! tired sleep



What you have achieved so far is utterly amazing! Absolutely wonderful job!
Congratulations!

Who said that your piano project is not going to fly?

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878851 08/12/19 10:04 AM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 125
J
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
J
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 125
Beautiful. I hope when it's all done you make a Youtube playing it so we can hear it too.

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2878857 08/12/19 10:12 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 24,585
Gold Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Gold Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 24,585
Originally Posted by LovingPianos
[...]
[Linked Image]

Note: this update is actually as of July 17th! We've already advanced far ahead, so we'll try to write more updates soon! It's a project in itself writing all these stuffs! tired sleep


The Eagle has landed!


BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2886577 09/03/19 01:34 PM
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,204
L
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
L
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,204
Guys, how is the piano doing?


When you play, never mind who listens to you. R.Schumann.

Casio GP-400
Schimmel SP-182T "I wish I had the room to keep you around"
August Forster 215
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2886631 09/03/19 04:49 PM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 434
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 434
Awesome lid! Why didn't make the interior rim the same way?


Hamburg Steinway & Sons C-227
Yamaha Stagea Electone ELS-02X
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
Retsacnal #2886642 09/03/19 05:20 PM
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 6,217
L
6000 Post Club Member
Offline
6000 Post Club Member
L
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 6,217
Originally Posted by Retsacnal
Originally Posted by ando
it's been fascinating to watch the twists and turns of this project - and also how rapidly it's all happening. Usually these things move along at a glacial pace, so it's great to see it evolving from day to day. I've never seen a piano project advance so quickly. I like how you just attack it like there's no tomorrow! Can't wait to see it strung up and playing.

^^^ this ^^^

Couldn't have said it better myself. smile

Like I keep saying, it's inspiring.

True ! inspiring is the word !

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
Learux #2886652 09/03/19 05:51 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 3,487
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 3,487
Originally Posted by Learux
Guys, how is the piano doing?



Yes, any updates??



[Linked Image]
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2890469 09/14/19 10:57 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 29
L
Full Member
OP Offline
Full Member
L
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 29
Hello everyone! smile smile smile smile smile smile smile

Apologies for the cliffhanger!! grin

It's been so long since we last posted.....time flies by so fast!! The biggest update for now is likely the fact that we have left Thailand for 23 days already! That means the Estonia is currently sitting quietly and alone in the house, wondering why we need to study piano so far away from her... Here in Indiana, we are surrounded by herds of Steinway Ds.... crazy which are frankly boring, but in a good way! We're also enjoying Baldwin, M&H, and Steinway COFFINS in the practice rooms...no offense, but they are really abused! ....and the worst part, we still continue to abuse them...

Now back to the Estonia, our pride and joy. The real question is...did we ever manage to finish what we started? Honestly, we don't even know!

We'll just go by what we initially wrote over a month ago....it's not easy to pick up writing from so long ago! Note: many super-exciting stuffs we wrote are no longer THAT exciting as of now, but we don't want a boring finale, so here goes....

Now...where we left off, was the preparation for the restringing! laugh

We got in touch with a professional piano technician (frankly who, together with our piano teacher who sold it, are both Uzbekh...) to take care of the restringing works, with us assisting him in whatever ways we could. The plate preparation began with the wooden bushings installation...which came with a new problem; making them fit! Sounds like an easy job, but it's not when the bushings we purchased were 1 mm (in diameter) too big!!! They ruined the plate earlier, too! mad

We initially thought of ordering a new set of bushings that would be a better fit for the Estonia plate, but they are very hard to find. Local woodworking shops could custom-make new bushings, but the high cost, unsuitable wood type, and time limit made this option less preferable. After some more searches, we realized this is a very normal adjustment work regularly done by piano rebuilders, and it seemed like one of the easier tasks for them. By then we had a few days before the technician comes in and start killing us one by one! (He certainly is NOT someone to be messed with!) crazy

We took a step back and re-inspected the bushings we had again, and with nothing to lose, we started looking for ways to down-size them. We had the idea of mounting the bushings on a drill machine and sand them off in a similar way to a lathe. The problem was, there was nothing on earth that could fit the bushing holes tight enough to make a good spinning axis! We couldn't produce more than a few bushings per one sanding 'session'. We had to persevere working on them, with the help of masking tapes, and lots of positive thoughts! sick We masked the tapes on a suitably-sized screwdriver shaft, to increase the diameter to a good tight fit with the bushings, mounted it on the chuck, and worked our way with 100 grit sanding block.

The tough and time-consuming part was getting them out of the taped rod. We could sand 14 bushings at most (and not often!), in a time span of around 20 mins! So as you can imagine, it's a painstakingly tedious job!

[Linked Image]

A few days later, the technician came in to start the restringing work. With the slow bushing works, we prepared them section by section, just to cover what the technician could do for the day. All was going pretty well, and he was just finished with the 2nd high-treble stringing, when he notified us of an issue. He pointed out that the Capo D'astro bar is putting too much tension on the strings, and the angle of the string from the bar to the bridge was too steep, potentially causing bad sound and short sustain. In other words, he suspected the down-bearing to be too much.

Since all the wooden plate supports were installed correctly in their original places, there is no way this could result from any error in the mounting of the iron plate. We suspected that this was the Estonia plate design itself, and that it shouldn't be a problem, but we followed our tech's advice anyway. He then proposed a solution of raising the height of the rear duplex bar to even out the angle.

Here is a shot of the angle, measured with a down-bearing gauge:

[Linked Image]

There is a gap of around 1.5 mm, meaning there is a good amount of down-bearing...but could that have been too much? We don't know...

So, we glued thick cardboard on the underside of the bar, cut to shape, then test fit. We painted the cardboard part the same plate color.

Gluing the cardboard:

[Linked Image]

Now in place:

[Linked Image]

It did reduce the angle, but before anyone yells at us for this, yes, there was a problem with the new fix, too!

So, once the down-bearing of the high treble was adjusted, and the piano was tuned to some extent to inspect the tone, the problem that came up was...they still sounded pinched, and the sustain decayed quickly, particularly in the highest section! We re-inspected the down-bearing to see if anything was wrong with it....and after a lot of research into this subject, we learned that the raised bar height introduced the worst problem -- a negative downbearing!!! The angle of the strings going through the Capo d'astro up to the bridge wasn't a problem, but the section after the bridge angled upwards slightly. The string's pressure therefore rest pretty much on the front edge of the bridge, and halfway into it, the string contact was lost. To our untrained eyes, this "half bridge" contact seems like a big issue, so we'd appreciate anyone in the know clarifying this.

The negative bearing is greater on the upper capo d'astro section:

[Linked Image]

A little less on the lower section, but it's there...

[Linked Image]

Now, going fast forward, when the restringing was complete, we consulted with the technician, and he agreed to let us reverse the process and get rid of the negative bearing. What we did was simply reduce the rear duplex bar height, but it was by no means simple! We started by releasing the string tension in the capo d'astro section to an extent enough to be able to push the rear duplex bar out. Then we removed the glued cardboard, and, together with the front bars, polished to a shiny brass color! Putting them back wasn't very easy, but we managed after a while.

Here is the result! And we did it all ourselves, just to be able to brag about it! cool The tech gave us the tools, and along the process, we got to go through some of the final steps of restringing.

[Linked Image]

Now...after this fix, it frankly didn't sound like a big tone improvement either! And this scared us quite a bit! It wasn't after we pitched up the entire treble section, however, that it started to sound pretty decent! Our technician ensured us that once the strings start settling in with the tension, the sustain quality will improve. This could take up to a year for a piano that will never get tuned for two school semesters...which we are of course away for the whole time anyway... Missing her a lot already! cry cry

As of then, the piano had been settling down for few days, and after several tunings, she started to hold tune with a nice clear treble!

Another big disaster avoided! Next section will cover the restringing progress from start to finish! And don't ask what color those felts are....they're red, but the camera obviously didn't pick it up! We'll go into that later on...

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2890473 09/14/19 11:28 PM
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,204
L
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
L
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,204
Thanks for the update, I have been thinking about you guys.

Sounds like this is heading into the right direction. When will you be back home?

I have learned so much about piano's through your detailed reporting, thank you for that!

Still keeping my fingers crossed.


When you play, never mind who listens to you. R.Schumann.

Casio GP-400
Schimmel SP-182T "I wish I had the room to keep you around"
August Forster 215
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2890496 09/15/19 01:01 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 5,730

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015
5000 Post Club Member
Offline

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015
5000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 5,730
Thanks for the update!


January is National Slavery and Human Trafficking Awareness Month
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2890576 09/15/19 07:45 AM
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 517
T
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
T
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 517
Bloomington, Indiana?

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2890600 09/15/19 08:43 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 3,487
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 3,487
Appreciate the update!



[Linked Image]
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2890625 09/15/19 10:37 AM
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 809
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 809
I hope we will listen soon to you playing Beethoven's "Eroica" on this lovely Estonia. What a thrilling journey! Fingers crossed, and good luck to you!


Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. (falsely attributed to Plato)
Vlad,
Adult beginner
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2890724 09/15/19 04:46 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,151
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,151
Thanks for the update! I always look forward to your posts on this project.


August Förster 215
Page 5 of 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

Moderated by  Ken Knapp, Piano World 

Link Copied to Clipboard
What's Hot!!
News from the Piano World
100,000!
---------------------
NEW! Sell Your Piano on our world famous Piano Forums!
---------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Do you normally ask dealer to tune piano?
by tony3304 - 01/18/21 07:25 AM
iPad pro (2020) MIDI Output not consistent
by Almar - 01/18/21 05:33 AM
used Kawai RX-1 or new Kawai GL-30?
by Guido, Roma - Italy - 01/18/21 05:23 AM
Roland F701 vs FP-90X (?)
by Mulberg - 01/18/21 02:17 AM
Garritan CFX, Sustain Release Samples ???
by DigitalMusicProduc - 01/17/21 11:18 PM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Forum Statistics
Forums42
Topics204,352
Posts3,048,304
Members100,102
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers


Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


© copyright 1997 - 2021 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.4