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Roland Fantom thoughts
#2887864 09/07/19 12:11 PM
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Anyone experienced one of these new Rolands? Comments? THANKS.

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Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2887869 09/07/19 12:25 PM
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My buddy has the last iteration Fantom. He thinks it is fabulous. He is a working musician playing in popular cover bands. And he said now that 80's music is real hot, synth sounds are very important. Further, he uses the Fantom to control his gigs. Beyond this, I have no idea what he means by how important this board is to his playing live but he swears by the product. I am not a preforming musician so I can't say. He also uses it to build his own crazy spacy synth tunes but again, I have no idea if this unit is that all important. He says it is. He said there is nothing like it.

What impresses me, as an RD 2000 owner who loves the V-Piano grand sounds, the new Fantom has the same keybed and V-Piano engine. Wow... an RD-2000 that does so much more. But it is quite expensive.

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Last edited by Bruce In Philly; 09/07/19 12:26 PM.

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Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2887877 09/07/19 12:59 PM
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That was a suprise release for professionals.

Compared to the RD2000, the new 2019 Fantom demos seem to have better sound quality IMO and should have pro quality output stages. At this price the keybed should be wonderful synth aftertouch style. Also that new touchscreen looks a lot like the fantastic Yamaha touchscreen.

Anderton's has a good UK intro video by Jack Duxbury. I think he worked in the store as retail sales guy as a teenager but is now a rather popular touring musician / producer. Maybe Roland etal. pay him a fee for promotions but I wouldn't be suprised if he videos as a favour to the Anderton's family and for fun.

The YouTube comments have some good insight also.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5yMlMzSSsA

Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2887885 09/07/19 01:26 PM
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Prices are $3300 for 61 keys, $3600 for 76 keys, and $4000 for 88 keys. The side panels are painted Nord-red.


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Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2887960 09/07/19 05:00 PM
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I hope this doesn't mean that the newer action than the PHA-50 won't be going into a stage piano. The LX706 is cheaper and has the newer action.

Last edited by johnstaf; 09/07/19 05:02 PM.
Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
johnstaf #2887996 09/07/19 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by johnstaf
I hope this doesn't mean that the newer action than the PHA-50 won't be going into a stage piano. The LX706 is cheaper and has the newer action.

The cost of this is significantly based on the workstation functionality. If you want a performance instrument, this is a lot of user interface complexity baggage.


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Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2888549 09/09/19 08:12 AM
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I have an unused Fantom XR modular synth (last model with Sample Tools v2) including 5x SRX expansion boards if anyone interested. Message me if interested.

I used to have the original Fantom X8 keyboard too which was really nice, so the new ones are sure to be excellent instruments. If I bought another Roland synth now it may well be the new Jupiter X as I have fond memories of my Jupiter 8 from the 80s too!!! Yes, I am getting on a bit now. : )

Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2888567 09/09/19 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by AB99
Anyone experienced one of these new Rolands?

They've only been shipping for about a day, so I think the literal answer to your question is going to be "no."

They look to be quite different from previous Fantom models (which haven't been made for quite a few years), so I wouldn't extrapolate anything from people's experiences with other boards that happen to have the same name.

Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
anotherscott #2888617 09/09/19 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by anotherscott
Originally Posted by AB99
Anyone experienced one of these new Rolands?

They've only been shipping for about a day, so I think the literal answer to your question is going to be "no."

They look to be quite different from previous Fantom models (which haven't been made for quite a few years), so I wouldn't extrapolate anything from people's experiences with other boards that happen to have the same name.


To me it seems an awkward product as I believe the workstation era is over. So many gimmicks that you can actually do the exact same or even much better/more efficiently in a DAW.

An All-in-One sound module with superb control surface is what Roland/Yamaha/Korg should release and they will never release it as it will be the end of their business.

The new FANTOM has some functionality similar to Mainstage and Garageband in iOS. Hopefully, Apple will add new features to these apps and it will put an end to copy-caters.


Kawai MP7SE, Yamaha MOTF XF6, Yamaha WX5, Yamaha Pacifica 112v
Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
Abdol #2888635 09/09/19 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Abdol
An All-in-One sound module with superb control surface is what Roland/Yamaha/Korg should release

I think that's kind of what the Fantom is. I think it's got the best control surface I've ever seen.

Originally Posted by Abdol
The new FANTOM has some functionality similar to Mainstage

It's actually designed to integrate especially well with Logic/Mainstage, if that's how you want to use it. Check out this video starting at about 21 minutes in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELYQKUdIayg

Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2888641 09/09/19 04:03 PM
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For a sound module rather than keyboard, a Roland Integra-7 plus VST piano would cover it— maybe don’t even need the VST if the Roland Supernatural pianos in the Integra-7 work for you.


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Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
anotherscott #2888717 09/09/19 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Sweelinck
For a sound module rather than keyboard, a Roland Integra-7 plus VST piano would cover it— maybe don’t even need the VST if the Roland Supernatural pianos in the Integra-7 work for you.


I personally don't like the sampled voices in Integra 7.
Originally Posted by anotherscott
Originally Posted by Abdol
An All-in-One sound module with superb control surface is what Roland/Yamaha/Korg should release

I think that's kind of what the Fantom is. I think it's got the best control surface I've ever seen.

Originally Posted by Abdol
The new FANTOM has some functionality similar to Mainstage

It's actually designed to integrate especially well with Logic/Mainstage, if that's how you want to use it. Check out this video starting at about 21 minutes in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELYQKUdIayg



I have watched that video. there are still plenty of gimmicks such as arpeggiations and workstation capabilities. It doesn't need to be a workstation <---- this is my point. Integration is something else.

Also those sliders are mostly useless as everytime you change them you have change their position.


Kawai MP7SE, Yamaha MOTF XF6, Yamaha WX5, Yamaha Pacifica 112v
Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
Abdol #2888723 09/09/19 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Abdol
I have watched that video. there are still plenty of gimmicks such as arpeggiations and workstation capabilities. It doesn't need to be a workstation <---- this is my point. Integration is something else.

They're giving you a choice. You want an integrated sequencer composition environment? You've got it. You prefer to use a computer? It will enhance that approach as well. There is probably no additional manufacturing cost for including the built-in sequencer. Don't like it? Don't use it. But some people may buy it because it's there. After all, there are lots of people online who complain that this Motif functionality was removed from the Montage.

Originally Posted by Abdol
Also those sliders are mostly useless as everytime you change them you have change their position.

I don't understand. Sliders work the way they do on any board with sliders. They're are often a preferred way of balancing a mix of split/layered sounds, and operating organ drawbars, for example. But Roland has the advantage of LEDs that at least show you the current positions when you recall a preset.

Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2888742 09/09/19 10:11 PM
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Quote

I personally don't like the sampled voices in Integra 7.

It is not just sampled sounds. There is a modeled virtual analog synthesizer and modeled virtual tonewheel organ, in addition to supernatural acoustic samples and the entire original fantom library (including all SRX cards)-- 6000+ builtin sounds plus what you can create with the VA synth and clonewheel.

The problem is that when you power it up in a store, the best sounds may not be what you see on the screen at first. Finding the sounds you want from the 6000+ can be a bit daunting. But how many virtual analog synths are there with 128 voice polyphony to support rich layering of sounds with top-tier sound quality? That is the biggest strength of the integra-7 and Jupiter-50/80.


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Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
newer player #2888747 09/09/19 11:00 PM
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Originally Posted by newer player
That was a suprise release for professionals.

Compared to the RD2000, the new 2019 Fantom demos seem to have better sound quality IMO and should have pro quality output stages. At this price the keybed should be wonderful synth aftertouch style. Also that new touchscreen looks a lot like the fantastic Yamaha touchscreen.

Anderton's has a good UK intro video by Jack Duxbury. I think he worked in the store as retail sales guy as a teenager but is now a rather popular touring musician / producer. Maybe Roland etal. pay him a fee for promotions but I wouldn't be suprised if he videos as a favour to the Anderton's family and for fun.

The YouTube comments have some good insight also.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5yMlMzSSsA


Pretty he doesn't work for Roland, because he does lots of videos of competing brands.

------

And to contribute to the thread:

Here's a demo from one of my favorite keyboard/pianists, Keiki Uto (from the Japanese band HoneyWorks) https://youtu.be/Uhpf1dAuXm0 Pretty epic what a pro can do lol

Last edited by Kougeru; 09/09/19 11:10 PM. Reason: added new link
Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
AB99 #2888756 09/09/19 11:52 PM
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If the Fantom 8 ever goes for $3000 I’ll get one.
That would be $1000 on top of RD-2000 functionality, which I’d find acceptable.
Sadly however, it seems not all of the Integra’s Supernatural Acoustic sounds are included.

Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
anotherscott #2888819 09/10/19 04:33 AM
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Originally Posted by anotherscott
But Roland has the advantage of LEDs that at least show you the current positions when you recall a preset.


I am not sure I will talk about the same as you guys but in the RD2000 the LEDs do not show the current position of the sliders, they show the position they had when the program was stored. If you do not move the sliders after recalling the program, it is OK but once you touch them, the slider position would take over and that could have unintended effects (e.g. sudden change on the zone volume). In this regard, a rotary encoder like those above the sliders would be more convenient as there is no fixed physical position.


Kawai ES8, Roland RD2000, Yamaha AG06 mixer, Presonus Eris E5 monitors, Sennheiser HD598SR phones.
Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
EVC2017 #2888883 09/10/19 07:46 AM
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I'm in a quandry as I ordered the RD-2000 a day or two before the Roland announcement and received it Saturday, but it has some shipping damage and I need to return it. I have the option to upgrade to the Fantom 8 now. For someone just playing for his own amusement it's an extravagant toy but I'm looking at this as a long term purchase.

Originally Posted by EVC2017
Originally Posted by anotherscott
But Roland has the advantage of LEDs that at least show you the current positions when you recall a preset.


I am not sure I will talk about the same as you guys but in the RD2000 the LEDs do not show the current position of the sliders, they show the position they had when the program was stored. If you do not move the sliders after recalling the program, it is OK but once you touch them, the slider position would take over and that could have unintended effects (e.g. sudden change on the zone volume). In this regard, a rotary encoder like those above the sliders would be more convenient as there is no fixed physical position.


Like most devices with non-motorized faders and current state LEDs, you can set the sliders to be pass-through rather than jump (called Catch or Direct respectively on the RD-2000 under Menu -> System -> Slider Mode) to avoid that, meaning you have to move the slider to the current value to "pick up" the adjuster and then smoothly change the value from there. I believe this was added in the 1.5 firmware update so make sure you have that. It also adds more V-Piano tones and has the same ones that the Fantom includes.

Last edited by Liquidmantis; 09/10/19 07:47 AM.
Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
EVC2017 #2889014 09/10/19 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by EVC2017
Originally Posted by anotherscott
But Roland has the advantage of LEDs that at least show you the current positions when you recall a preset.


I am not sure I will talk about the same as you guys but in the RD2000 the LEDs do not show the current position of the sliders, they show the position they had when the program was stored. If you do not move the sliders after recalling the program, it is OK but once you touch them, the slider position would take over and that could have unintended effects (e.g. sudden change on the zone volume). In this regard, a rotary encoder like those above the sliders would be more convenient as there is no fixed physical position.

This is no different from Nord effects knobs, and is true of many keyboards. When you call up the sound, if it sounds the way you want, you don’t have to pay attention to the knobs/sliders. If it does not sound the way you want, as soon as you move the knob/slider the effect level and slider/knob position will sync up. I’d rather get used to that behavior than pay more to have the control moved automatically, or give up the physical control for a menu-based control that was always in sync.


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Re: Roland Fantom thoughts
Liquidmantis #2889026 09/10/19 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Liquidmantis
Like most devices with non-motorized faders and current state LEDs, you can set the sliders to be pass-through rather than jump (called Catch or Direct respectively on the RD-2000 under Menu -> System -> Slider Mode) to avoid that, meaning you have to move the slider to the current value to "pick up" the adjuster and then smoothly change the value from there. I believe this was added in the 1.5 firmware update so make sure you have that. It also adds more V-Piano tones and has the same ones that the Fantom includes.

Thanks for the tip. I have been using RD very little out of pure laziness (ES8 is way more plug and play). I have installed 1.5 when it was just released but this feature went unnoticed.


Kawai ES8, Roland RD2000, Yamaha AG06 mixer, Presonus Eris E5 monitors, Sennheiser HD598SR phones.
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