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1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 #2882525
08/22/19 07:21 PM
08/22/19 07:21 PM
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inna_denver Offline OP
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I am on the market for a yamaha baby grand, preferably Japanese made, but since I currently own Clavinova 635, its not too urgent for me. I could easily practice on a digital another year and do more research whats on the market. With that said, i am a beginner (8 months) and my kids are as well. Was looking at a C1 1998 priced at 13K today (plus taxes and delivery) vs. 2016 CG1 priced at 16k. What ate your thoughts on those and their prices? Includes warranty.

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Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882553
08/22/19 09:31 PM
08/22/19 09:31 PM
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 4,484
Southeast US
ShiroKuro Offline
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Hmm, the C1, at 21 y/o seems overpriced to me. Did you play them? How do they sound?

I don’t know enough about the GC series to know what’s different, but a,l things being equal (which they never are) I would probably go with the 3 y/o GC rather than the 20 y/o C...

Are you determined to buy from a dealer? If you’re going to buy a 20 y/o piano, you will likely get a better deal, a better piano for less, by buying from a private seller.

If you’re wanting to buy a newer instrument, like a 3 y/o piano, then going with the dealer is probably better.

BTW I just bought a 20 y/o C2 from a private seller, the price was good and it is a great instrument, I couldn’t be happier! I did have it evaluated by my tech before purchasing.

Good luck!


Started piano June 1999.
Proud owner of a Yamaha C2

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Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882576
08/22/19 10:41 PM
08/22/19 10:41 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,959
Georgia, USA
terminaldegree Offline
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The 635 series Clavinova certainly won't get in your way for another year. I have a lab full of them at the college, and they work well, with seemingly excellent durability. Their only shortcomings are more piano-lab related than something anyone would experience in home use.

The prices you're being quoted are on the high side of normal. This would be fine by me, if the pianos were both in much better than typical condition for their age and use. Otherwise, I'd try and negotiate a little, or keep looking (and including more than one brand in your search criteria).

As used pianos, know that the warranty is offered by the store, not the manufacturer.


Pianist, teacher, apprentice technician, internet addict.
Piano Review Editor - Acoustic and Digital Piano Buyer
Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: ShiroKuro] #2882578
08/22/19 10:49 PM
08/22/19 10:49 PM
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inna_denver Offline OP
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Thanks. I was hesitant as well, so that's why i did not make a decision. I played it and it sounded good, but for a beginner like me, it's hard to tell. It sounded mellow, not bright at all. CG1 sounded bright. How much did you pay for C2 and what year?

Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882581
08/22/19 10:56 PM
08/22/19 10:56 PM
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inna_denver Offline OP
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Terminaldegree, does it make a difference for the buyer whether a warranty is through the store or a manufacturer? Also, do you think I will do any harm to my learning by keeping practicing on a digital for another year, or its not going to matter at all? From talking to the GM, I understood that the most they could come down to on 1998 C1 would be 12k plus taxes and delivery. However, this is still a 22 yr old piano.

Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882592
08/23/19 12:18 AM
08/23/19 12:18 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,959
Georgia, USA
terminaldegree Offline
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The warranty has more "oomph" through the manufacturer, because it follows the owner anywhere they're located in the US, and you're not bound to the selling dealer for coverage or claims. A dealer warranty has value also, but the warranty is usually not discussed or disclosed in detail, and its limitation is the level of customer service by the dealer, or the dealer's ability to remain in business.

I don't think you're going to harm yourself by practicing on a solid midlevel digital piano in your first year or two of study, no.

The used C1 at $12k is a more correct looking price to my eye, should the condition be very good. 22 years of home use in a good environment is nothing to worry about for a quality piano. However, 22 years of institutional use in a room with horrible humidity control IS something to worry about. This is where the standard recommendation for a pre-purchase, independent tech inspection is something you hear us say so often.

Be sure you're enamored with the touch and tone (not just the name) before proceeding further.


Pianist, teacher, apprentice technician, internet addict.
Piano Review Editor - Acoustic and Digital Piano Buyer
Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: terminaldegree] #2882595
08/23/19 12:55 AM
08/23/19 12:55 AM
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inna_denver Offline OP
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THANK YOU so much!!!

Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882605
08/23/19 03:57 AM
08/23/19 03:57 AM
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Hakki Offline
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I would go with the 2016 model.

Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882622
08/23/19 06:33 AM
08/23/19 06:33 AM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,454
Southwest
j&j Offline
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Terminaldegree has given you excellent advice. There’s no real need for you to buy an acoustic piano yet, you can certainly learn and continue playing your digital until you find the perfect acoustic piano. I do think practicing on a good acoustic does help you learn how to achieve more expression in your playing.
The C series, now the Cx series pianos are a bit more rugged instruments with a few more features than the GC series. The age difference between the two nearly cancel out the C1’s advantages, in my humble opinion. Go play both and see which sounds and feels better would be the only way to decide. An independent piano technician inspection can also show any hidden problems you can’t see or feel or hear.
Dealer warranty is basically given in place of a manufacturer warranty on used pianos. Even on a new piano with a manufacturer’s warranty, any work needed is done through the local dealer. The warranty is I suppose a benefit of buying from a dealer over private sales, but the dealer has to stand behind the warranty so be sure to check reviews.
Keep us posted on what you decide. Best of Luck!


J & J
Yamaha C3 PE
Casio Privia PX-330
Pianos - the reason God made trees!
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Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882626
08/23/19 06:51 AM
08/23/19 06:51 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 11,537
Philadelphia/South Jersey
Rich Galassini Offline
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I have an additional thought to consider.

My company sells 20 to 30 year old pianos all the time, but we give a tremendous amount of value as well. As an example, I have a 1998 Baldwin model R right now that was used in the home of an avid amateur who also had 3 children who played.

We put new hammers, hammer flanges and shanks, rebushed the keys along with standard key work, installed new treble and bass strings, replaced the tuning pins, refinished the frame (for looks only), refinished the piano, and regulated and voiced the piano. The brass hardware was polished and lacquered and our full 5 year warranty can be upheld by any RPT in the United States, which rarely happens. IMHO, this piano plays as well as, or better than, when it was new. I am saying this because there are varying degrees of work performed (and quality of work performed) on a "used piano". Not all used pianos are equal and some companies give a lot of additional value for the money spent.

I have no idea where the OP is considering their purchase, but it is possible that some substantial work was put into the piano they are considering.

My 2 cents,


Rich Galassini
Cunningham Piano Co.
Phila, Pa.
(215) 991-0834 direct line
rich@cunninghampiano.com
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Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882630
08/23/19 07:08 AM
08/23/19 07:08 AM
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inna_denver Offline OP
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As far as I was told, no amount of work has been done to this 20 year old piano, other than buffing the scratches. smile

Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882632
08/23/19 07:09 AM
08/23/19 07:09 AM
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inna_denver Offline OP
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Do you recommend for an independent technician to check a piano EVEN if it's bought from the yamaha dealer, with a lifetime trade in policy?

Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882637
08/23/19 07:17 AM
08/23/19 07:17 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 11,537
Philadelphia/South Jersey
Rich Galassini Offline
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Originally Posted by inna_denver
Do you recommend for an independent technician to check a piano EVEN if it's bought from the yamaha dealer, with a lifetime trade in policy?


Yes.


Rich Galassini
Cunningham Piano Co.
Phila, Pa.
(215) 991-0834 direct line
rich@cunninghampiano.com
Subscribe to our YouTube channel for great content every week:
https://www.youtube.com/user/CunninghamPiano
Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: Rich Galassini] #2882658
08/23/19 08:36 AM
08/23/19 08:36 AM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,454
Southwest
j&j Offline
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Southwest
Originally Posted by Rich Galassini
Originally Posted by inna_denver
Do you recommend for an independent technician to check a piano EVEN if it's bought from the yamaha dealer, with a lifetime trade in policy?


Yes.

A good, knowledgeable dealer shouldn’t be offended if you want an independent piano technician to inspect it.
Just my added two cents 😁.


J & J
Yamaha C3 PE
Casio Privia PX-330
Pianos - the reason God made trees!
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Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882659
08/23/19 08:42 AM
08/23/19 08:42 AM
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inna_denver Offline OP
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Understand. I thought a life time trade policy would be of use if anything horrible is found. In Any case I am geared towards a 3-4 yr old piano CG1

Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882670
08/23/19 08:57 AM
08/23/19 08:57 AM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,454
Southwest
j&j Offline
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j&j  Offline
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Originally Posted by inna_denver
Understand. I thought a life time trade policy would be of use if anything horrible is found. In Any case I am geared towards a 3-4 yr old piano CG1

I may be boo’ed for this response. For the 3-4 year old GC1 with lifetime trade in opportunity, I’d maybe just talk to the store’s piano tech about that piano. What was done since taking it in for trade? What had to be done before putting it on the floor? I surely would never skip the independent tech inspection for the 22 year old C1. A heck of a lot could happen in 22 years. Make sure you thoroughly check reviews and ratings of the piano dealer if you decide to skip the tech review on the GC1. Best wishes!


J & J
Yamaha C3 PE
Casio Privia PX-330
Pianos - the reason God made trees!
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Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882671
08/23/19 09:05 AM
08/23/19 09:05 AM
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 615
Rockville, MD
Seeker Offline
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Rockville, MD
From Yamaha's marketing materials for the next level up GC piano from the GC1... "The beautiful GC2 combines the duplex scaling and rich tonal character of the coveted C2 grand with cost-saving advantages in materials and production to create an instrument that's both exceptionally expressive and uncommonly affordable".

The details of the "cost-saving advantages in materials and production" I cannot tell you. That differences from the "C" series exists, is, by Yamaha's own words, indisputable.

Price on the used C1 seems on the high side to me for just "buffing out scratches".

Don't know your market, but I'd look elsewhere, let things cool a little with the dealer. As long as you get an inspection from a qualified technician, you could very well do better buying from a private party.


Andrew Kraus, Pianist
Educated Amateur Tuner/Technician
Rockville, MD USA
www.AndrewKraus.com
www.YouTube.com/RockvillePianoGuy
Twitter at @IAmAPianist

1929 Steinert 6'10" (Close copy of New York S&S "B")
Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882723
08/23/19 11:18 AM
08/23/19 11:18 AM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,454
Southwest
j&j Offline
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So I found the specifications on the new GC1. It does have duplex scaling and a sostenuto middle pedal.
Yamaha GC 1 and GC2 specifications


J & J
Yamaha C3 PE
Casio Privia PX-330
Pianos - the reason God made trees!
[Linked Image]
Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882732
08/23/19 12:02 PM
08/23/19 12:02 PM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,780
Atlanta, GA
PianoWorksATL Offline
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Because of the popular size, brand reputation, and because not as many new C1's were sold, they do tend to be overvalued in the market compared to some other models. In our market, one that is in excellent condition, detailed, action serviced and polished to look really good, the asking price is reasonable. That's assuming a lot, but we've sold several from the late 1990's for $13k+.

The GC1 is unusually young, and is still in the early part of the depreciation curve. Many customers will look at the 3 year old GC1 vs new and pay the extra for new.

Nothing wrong with the pianos you are considering, but you may be overemphasizing "Japanese-made", especially in the GC1.

Have you expanded your choices to consider other brands and models? A Yamaha may win out for you, but there is quite a lot of good competition out there for pianos in that size and price range. You might enjoy the comparison and have even more confidence in your ultimate choice.


Sam Bennett
PianoWorks - Atlanta Piano Dealer
Bösendorfer, Estonia, Seiler, Grotrian, Hailun
Pre-Owned: Yamaha, Kawai, Steinway & other fine pianos
Full Restoration Shop
www.PianoWorks.com
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Re: 1998 C1 vs. 2016 CG1 [Re: inna_denver] #2882736
08/23/19 12:08 PM
08/23/19 12:08 PM
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inna_denver Offline OP
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Thank you guys for your replies. I will definitely take more time and do more research whats on the market. I was thinking to spend right around 15k, so in the worst case i will just wait another year playing on the digital I have and get a CG1 next year when I make sure to shop around first.

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