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Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
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Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872550 07/25/19 08:16 AM
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We had to split the post due to picture limit, so...let's continue.

We used super glue to attach the letters onto the plate

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

However, there was a bit of a problem with the gold paint, as we began detailing the plate with the letterings after the finish had completely dried, and while doing so, everywhere we touched became unremoveable finger stains (this is common for some types of gold paints). To solve this, we set up a new spraying tent, and touched up the stains with gold spray. We took the chance to spray the letterings gold, and gave them a dark metallic gray accent. A Rustoleum glossy clear lacquer spray finished the job.

[Linked Image]

Attention level 1,000,000 here! sick

[Linked Image]

And this is how the finished plate looked like!

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Everything was going according to plan....and we put the plate back in the piano:

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Quite a nice progress eh? How would you feel if it's all lost? Hmm....we're about to know the answer!

Happy reading.....until something else happens! eek

Last edited by LovingPianos; 07/25/19 08:17 AM.
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872554 07/25/19 08:30 AM
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Good job guys, it looks so nice. Keep us posted.


When you play, never mind who listens to you. R.Schumann.

Casio GP-400
Schimmel SP-182T "I wish I had the room to keep you around"
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Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872603 07/25/19 10:32 AM
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I just cannot wait to hear the final result.


Some men are music lovers. Others make love without it.
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
ChatNoir #2872672 07/25/19 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by ChatNoir
I just cannot wait to hear the final result.



+1. Waiting for the final results.



[Linked Image]
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872673 07/25/19 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by ChatNoir
I just cannot wait to hear the final result.



+1. Waiting for the final results.



[Linked Image]
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
NobleHouse #2872677 07/25/19 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by NobleHouse
Originally Posted by ChatNoir
I just cannot wait to hear the final result.



+1. Waiting for the final results.


Me, too!


August Förster 215
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872683 07/25/19 03:21 PM
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Who would have thought rebuilding a piano would be this easy. It's like when I watched the video of my grandmother getting a total knee replacement. I thought to myself, gee, I could do that. All you need is a few Black and Decker tools and a hammer. No prooooblem!

Seriously though guys, looks great! More excited to see how it eventually sounds. I imagine that could range anywhere from a broken typewriter, a warped xylophone, or a world class instrument. If you pull it off I'll be on my knees worshipping you guys. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you guys! Good luck!

Last edited by Jethro; 07/25/19 03:26 PM.

Working on:

Bach/Busoni Chaconne in D minor BWV 1004
Preludio: Bach/Rachmaninoff E Major Sonata for Violin
Chopin: G Minor Ballade


Shigeru Kawai SK2
Kawai VPC-1
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872802 07/26/19 01:31 AM
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Very interesting project!
Most likely will turn out a very worthwhile venture! Good luck and let us know!
Norbert smile

Last edited by Norbert; 07/26/19 01:31 AM.

www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872822 07/26/19 03:09 AM
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+10!!!

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872947 07/26/19 11:20 AM
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Thanks for the kind words! We glad you all are enjoying the progress! Rebuilding a piano might look easy, but there is a gazillion amount of tedious details we have to work on that are not posted. Of course, if we can do it, so can you! Probably a million times better too! That's why an old Estonia is always worth ANY rebuilding attempt!

Originally Posted by AaronSF
Originally Posted by NobleHouse
Originally Posted by ChatNoir
I just cannot wait to hear the final result.
+1. Waiting for the final results.
Me, too!
Us too! Lol grin Fortunately, we are almost there!!

Let's continue with some more progress.... Now that we WERE done with the plate..........let's try hammering the first wooden bushing into the tuning pin holes in the plate.....

WHAT THE!!

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Okay...that was a little too dramatic and scary, but...THE PAINT CRACKED!! mad cursing We realized right away that, firstly....well....that it was a DISASTER! Secondly, the wooden bushings are not the right size....they are way too big! And thirdly, the Rustoleum spray paints weren't durable enough. The damage was not from direct hammer impact, but rather the side of the bushing pulling down the paint with it. We tested it again by stretching old strings over the hitch pins, and sure enough the paint flaked very easily! Even a slightly careless handling on the plate resulted in deep paint chipping, so we knew this would not survive even the most careful, softpawed restringing technician! It was quite a huge failure, but...the problem didn't just end there....let us explain... grin

We had a paint technician come in to inspect the damage, and he explained that the paint layer might be too thick, and that initially applying a lighter coat would help prevent such damages. However, he emphasized that ALL paints WILL crack upon severe impact...but more durable paints chip on the spot, and don't flake and peel around like flimsier paints. We checked our Yamaha C5 plate, and sure enough, the few scratches in there don't flake. Nevertheless, we all agreed on taking the plate out for another round of repainting!! Hopefully this will be the last!!

We brought in the same team of house builders to lift the plate off the piano once again, and this time we got help from the paint tech to help with the repainting process. As if we haven't got enough bad luck...the biggest disaster struck when he used a paint remover to strip the entire plate!! As some of you might know, this technique is a total no-go!!! The cast iron plate out of the mould is very rough, and piano factories refinish it with fillers to achieve the very smooth and even surface, before applying the primer and gold paint on top. We knew about this, but we didn't expect him to completely strip the paint AND filler layers! The paint remover nearly stripped everything down to the bare iron, and the whole plate simply looked like a huge piece of shi...uh...trash!

This picture....

[Linked Image]

...was taken seconds before....

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

...this happened! cry cry

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Muddy agraffes?

!!!!!!!!!!

At that moment, we actually thought of throwing the plate away....but on a second thought, that would take too much effort to get it disposed of!!! It required so much work just to get it back to how it looked originally, but the only thing we could do was to simply get down to our knees and start working!! We think it took well over half a can of red auto filler, and over 10 sheets of wet-sandpaper along with a dozen buckets of water just to get to where we were in the photos below!! We worked on the plate around 10 hours a day for a week.

Photographic proofs coming in the next post!

And meanwhile....enjoy the before and after pics!

Before:

[Linked Image]

After:

[Linked Image]

What on earth have we done????????????????????????????????????????????????

T_T T_T T_T T_T T_T T_T T_T

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872958 07/26/19 12:12 PM
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I think if I was attempting to do what you guys are doing I would have powder coated the iron plate. Rustoleum is best left for stuff you want to eventually throw away like rusty old bikes that I had when I was a teenager.

I'm also wondering whether or not the process used to strip the paint might have weakened/corroded those pins to the point that they can't the tons of force applied from the piano strings.

Last edited by Jethro; 07/26/19 12:16 PM.

Working on:

Bach/Busoni Chaconne in D minor BWV 1004
Preludio: Bach/Rachmaninoff E Major Sonata for Violin
Chopin: G Minor Ballade


Shigeru Kawai SK2
Kawai VPC-1
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2872986 07/26/19 01:38 PM
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Dang guys, what a setback.

Better luck on round two, I am rooting for you!


When you play, never mind who listens to you. R.Schumann.

Casio GP-400
Schimmel SP-182T "I wish I had the room to keep you around"
August Forster 215
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2873032 07/26/19 05:29 PM
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OUCH!!



[Linked Image]
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2873036 07/26/19 05:37 PM
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I was hoping the Before and After shots were swapped. Is it just me? I thought the plate looked beautiful.

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2873043 07/26/19 06:09 PM
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As they say "looks can be deceiving".


When you play, never mind who listens to you. R.Schumann.

Casio GP-400
Schimmel SP-182T "I wish I had the room to keep you around"
August Forster 215
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2873056 07/26/19 07:19 PM
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Good luck, guys! You have earned it! Thank you for taking the additional time and trouble to share the process with the rest of us.


"Serena," my Estonia L168.
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2873060 07/26/19 07:28 PM
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You guys are awesome - the dedication is inspiring - thank you.

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2873092 07/26/19 10:33 PM
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I'm still inspired! You guys are indomitable!

You're learning some lessons the hard way as you go, but if you ever rebuild another piano, then it'll go that much easier.

I'm anxious to see the finished product.


January is National Slavery and Human Trafficking Awareness Month
Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2873122 07/27/19 03:58 AM
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Thank you so much for the kind and encouraging words!

Originally Posted by Jethro
I think if I was attempting to do what you guys are doing I would have powder coated the iron plate. Rustoleum is best left for stuff you want to eventually throw away like rusty old bikes that I had when I was a teenager.

I'm also wondering whether or not the process used to strip the paint might have weakened/corroded those pins to the point that they can't the tons of force applied from the piano strings.

Powder coating seems like a good idea, but it's not something we could do ourselves (the kitchen oven is a bit too small to bake!), and transporting the plate to a facility would be very difficult. If we could for next time, we would! thumb
Wait...but...this is an old rusty piano we have as teenagers! What do you mean by throwing them away? grin grin grin

Apparently, the paint remover wasn't really the cause of this whole mess, as it was not very strong. Much of the original filler and primer (even some gold paint) were left intact throughout the plate, especially around the hitch pins base, therefore we don't think they would have sustained any damage. The real culprit was the spatula scraper used to scrape the paint itself. The tech guy wasn't aware that the frame originally had a lot of filler, and that damaging the smooth surfaces would lead to much more work. He wasn't careful with his tool, but no one expects you to be careful when stripping paint, right? cry grin

Originally Posted by LarryK
I was hoping the Before and After shots were swapped. Is it just me? I thought the plate looked beautiful.


Not just you! Lol! But the following pictures will hopefully leave you a little more light-hearted!

First round of red auto filler (out of an umpteen):

[Linked Image]

First round of sanding (out of a gazillion!):

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

First coat of gray primer...

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

The rough surfaces are still visible at this stage:

[Linked Image]

....so we filled and sanded:

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

After a coat of white primer:

[Linked Image]

Filled and sanded again:

[Linked Image]

More filling and sanding!

[Linked Image]

Here, the letter "P" was re-engraved according to the original:

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Any idea what this might stand for?

To be continued ------------->

Re: Estonia Concert Grand
LovingPianos #2873142 07/27/19 07:00 AM
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Fascinating. I never knew automotive filler, what we called Bondo when I was a kid, was used to fill piano plates. With cars, people would use small magnets to figure out how much of the car had been “Bondoed,” not a good sign, but I guess it doesn’t matter for pianos plates.

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