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Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: ando] #2868928
07/13/19 09:27 AM
07/13/19 09:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 173
Washington State
AWilley Offline

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AWilley  Offline

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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 173
Washington State
Originally Posted by ando
Originally Posted by BDB
Actually, it is a worm gear system, like a guitar tuner. Mason & Hamlin used a screw thread and nut.

That picture simply shows a screw in a threaded lever. I think you are misinterpreting the picture as showing a rotating pin which the string is wrapped around. But if you look closely, all strings have identical Becketts, which means they don't rotate. It is the height of the lever that provides the tension adjustment, which is why they are at varying heights.

Oh my, you're right. Now that is truly unique. Also means there's an upper and lower limit on how far you can tune the piano. I wonder how you'd go about replacing a string and getting it stretched without exhausting all the play in the little lever


Anthony Willey, RPT
PianoMeter
Willey Piano Tuning
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Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: Vlad Ants] #2868929
07/13/19 09:29 AM
07/13/19 09:29 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 64
Kharkiv, Ukraine
Vlad Ants Offline OP
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Vlad Ants  Offline OP
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 64
Kharkiv, Ukraine
Originally Posted by ando
...It is the height of the lever that provides the tension adjustment, which is why they are at varying heights.
I completely agree.

Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: Vlad Ants] #2868964
07/13/19 12:13 PM
07/13/19 12:13 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 27,726
Oakland
B
BDB Offline
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Posts: 27,726
Oakland
Yes, it looks like that.

That eliminates the problem of the Mason & Hamlin comb breaking. but it looks like it would be difficult to tune the strings below the topmost mechanisms.


Semipro Tech
Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: Vlad Ants] #2868971
07/13/19 12:37 PM
07/13/19 12:37 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 64
Kharkiv, Ukraine
Vlad Ants Offline OP
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Vlad Ants  Offline OP
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 64
Kharkiv, Ukraine
Having seated the metal directly on the metal, without a wooden board of pin block, it is possible to achieve greater reliability of tuning and practically zero wear compared with a wooden board. But... for some reason, humanity did not follow such a simple path. Although attempts were made...

Last edited by Vlad Ants; 07/13/19 12:40 PM.
Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: Vlad Ants] #2868974
07/13/19 12:42 PM
07/13/19 12:42 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 27,726
Oakland
B
BDB Offline
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Posts: 27,726
Oakland
As I said, the costs were high and the benefits were low.


Semipro Tech
Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: Vlad Ants] #2868980
07/13/19 12:56 PM
07/13/19 12:56 PM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 2,596
New Hampshire
P
P W Grey Offline
2000 Post Club Member
P W Grey  Offline
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P

Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 2,596
New Hampshire
And the tuners would complain and then condemn it, making sales drop, therefore the manufacturer would quit making it.

Too good, and too well thought out to be commercially viable. No money to be made.

Pwg


Peter W. Grey, RPT
New Hampshire Seacoast
www.seacoastpianodoctor.com
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PK0T7_I_nV8
Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: Vlad Ants] #2868995
07/13/19 02:14 PM
07/13/19 02:14 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 64
Kharkiv, Ukraine
Vlad Ants Offline OP
Full Member
Vlad Ants  Offline OP
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Joined: May 2019
Posts: 64
Kharkiv, Ukraine
Very similar to the truth, and not that it would be more expensive.

Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: AWilley] #2869120
07/14/19 01:17 AM
07/14/19 01:17 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,570
KZ, Uralsk
Maximillyan Offline
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Happy Birthday Maximillyan  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,570
KZ, Uralsk
Originally Posted by AWilley
Originally Posted by ando
Originally Posted by BDB
Actually, it is a worm gear system, like a guitar tuner. Mason & Hamlin used a screw thread and nut.

That picture simply shows a screw in a threaded lever. I think you are misinterpreting the picture as showing a rotating pin which the string is wrapped around. But if you look closely, all strings have identical Becketts, which means they don't rotate. It is the height of the lever that provides the tension adjustment, which is why they are at varying heights.

Oh my, you're right. Now that is truly unique. Also means there's an upper and lower limit on how far you can tune the piano. I wonder how you'd go about replacing a string and getting it stretched without exhausting all the play in the little lever

thanks, AWilley
so it's there

Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: AWilley] #2869124
07/14/19 01:42 AM
07/14/19 01:42 AM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,748
Hobart, Australia
A
ando Offline
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ando  Offline
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A

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,748
Hobart, Australia
Originally Posted by AWilley
Originally Posted by ando
Originally Posted by BDB
Actually, it is a worm gear system, like a guitar tuner. Mason & Hamlin used a screw thread and nut.

That picture simply shows a screw in a threaded lever. I think you are misinterpreting the picture as showing a rotating pin which the string is wrapped around. But if you look closely, all strings have identical Becketts, which means they don't rotate. It is the height of the lever that provides the tension adjustment, which is why they are at varying heights.

Oh my, you're right. Now that is truly unique. Also means there's an upper and lower limit on how far you can tune the piano. I wonder how you'd go about replacing a string and getting it stretched without exhausting all the play in the little lever

The thread is quite long (Longer than the circumference of the pin), so in theory once it reaches the end of its adjustment, you could detach the lever, add another loop around the pin, wind the screw down to its minimum position and start again!

Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: ando] #2869126
07/14/19 01:53 AM
07/14/19 01:53 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 27,726
Oakland
B
BDB Offline
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 27,726
Oakland
When you string a piano, you get a feeling for how much extra length you have to allow. That would be the case for this, as well. But the fact that it is unusual means it would be a problem for a field technician who has not worked on these before.


Semipro Tech
Re: Pins without wooden pinblock [Re: BDB] #2869131
07/14/19 03:42 AM
07/14/19 03:42 AM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,570
KZ, Uralsk
Maximillyan Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Happy Birthday Maximillyan  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,570
KZ, Uralsk
Originally Posted by BDB
Yes, it looks like that.

That eliminates the problem of the Mason & Hamlin comb breaking. but it looks like it would be difficult to tune the strings below the topmost mechanisms.

+ extra 60 pounds weight of a piano

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