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Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: akc42] #2858508
06/14/19 11:29 AM
06/14/19 11:29 AM
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millsj1134 Offline
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Originally Posted by akc42
Although I am liking my ipad with the bigger screen a lot - I am still finding the tighter tolerance on the timing of the first note after the count down so frustrating I am likely to head back to my laptop.


This has been fixed and should be released in the next build of iPad beta soon! smile

Last edited by millsj1134; 06/14/19 11:29 AM.
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Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: millsj1134] #2858551
06/14/19 01:59 PM
06/14/19 01:59 PM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 491
Just outside London UK
akc42 Online content
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akc42  Online Content
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Originally Posted by millsj1134
Originally Posted by akc42
Although I am liking my ipad with the bigger screen a lot - I am still finding the tighter tolerance on the timing of the first note after the count down so frustrating I am likely to head back to my laptop.


This has been fixed and should be released in the next build of iPad beta soon! smile


I am looking forward to that. smile

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2859517
06/17/19 10:00 AM
06/17/19 10:00 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 10
Australia
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Bretts Offline
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Anyone else on 6B - Eine kleine Nachtmusik? Finding it very hard to get to speed at 120bpm. nice challenge though. Generally finding i fly through the technique sections, and get bogged down on method.

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Bretts] #2859710
06/17/19 06:44 PM
06/17/19 06:44 PM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 491
Just outside London UK
akc42 Online content
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Originally Posted by Bretts
Anyone else on 6B - Eine kleine Nachtmusik? Finding it very hard to get to speed at 120bpm. nice challenge though. Generally finding i fly through the technique sections, and get bogged down on method.


Have you searched the main library. You can find this music there and load it up to your library. You then have a whole load of exercises at different speeds to build up to the entire piece. I am doing that at the moment with 6A Prelude in C which is also insanely fast.. I did briefly look for and load up Eine Kleine Nachtmusik and try the first right hand exercise.

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2859872
06/18/19 06:21 AM
06/18/19 06:21 AM
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 20
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Music&Lyrics Offline
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Inversions, inversions, inversions...a lot of them. What's the best approach to learn it? Practice all of them 1 by 1? Or just some of them in e.g. a combination of chords progression? Or maybe just follow the PM lessons without any additional exercises?

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2859877
06/18/19 06:35 AM
06/18/19 06:35 AM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,649
Groove On Offline
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I found it useful to first practice each inversion as a set of 12. So 12x roots round the circle/chromatically, then 12x 1st inversions, then 12x 2nds.

After that, you could try doing Triad Cycles where you alternate inversions as you go around the circle/chromatically. For example, play root of C, then 2nd inv F and continue round circle.

After that, start adding musical patterns in the other hand, starting with 5-finger scales and basic rhythms and then adding more musical things like bass lines or right hand riffs.


We are the music makers,
And we are the dreamers of dreams.
Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: akc42] #2859962
06/18/19 10:44 AM
06/18/19 10:44 AM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 491
Just outside London UK
akc42 Online content
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Originally Posted by akc42
Originally Posted by Bretts
Anyone else on 6B - Eine kleine Nachtmusik? Finding it very hard to get to speed at 120bpm. nice challenge though. Generally finding i fly through the technique sections, and get bogged down on method.


Have you searched the main library. You can find this music there and load it up to your library. You then have a whole load of exercises at different speeds to build up to the entire piece. I am doing that at the moment with 6A Prelude in C which is also insanely fast.. I did briefly look for and load up Eine Kleine Nachtmusik and try the first right hand exercise.


In the end I got so taken with Eine Kleine Nachtmusik I ended up completing RH and LH (or the first exercise, but up to the fastest speed and then started working on hands together. This was last night when I should have gone to bed - ended up going to bed at 12:30am.

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2860014
06/18/19 12:15 PM
06/18/19 12:15 PM
Joined: Jun 2013
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I'm going to change the main line of discussion for Piano Marvel, and go in a different direction.

Either on my own, or with the help of the employees at PM, I've uploaded a number of songs into my Library, and in learning these songs I've accepted compromises. Using MuseScore, a free app, it's impossible to enter in several printed commands, such as sustain measures throughout a song. And so I've learned these songs with additional guidelines from the printed score that sits beside my Surface Pro.

It is also not possible in Piano Marvel to isolate and emphasize measures. Nor, or course, to alter the tempo of these measures, and it isn't possible to do so even with instructions on the printed sheet. The solution to that, I've found, is to first memorize the song through PM, which I've found to be rather mechanical. Once memorized, I've listened closely to the composer's rendition to understand the musical message he's sending, copying that rendition, and then spinning off in my own direction.

After that, for a particular song PM is great in brushing up when any particular measure suddenly goes out of whack, which really happens quite often, especially when you haven't played a song in quite a while.

The point I'm making here is that Piano Marvel can be a very good program for learning just about any new song, but it's paramount that you understand PM's limitations, and how to account for them.

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: ADWyatt] #2860108
06/18/19 04:18 PM
06/18/19 04:18 PM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 491
Just outside London UK
akc42 Online content
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Originally Posted by ADWyatt

It is also not possible in Piano Marvel to isolate and emphasize measures.


Not sure what you mean by this. You can certainly make exercises that cover those few measures, or you can select those measures and play them.

Quote
The point I'm making here is that Piano Marvel can be a very good program for learning just about any new song, but it's paramount that you understand PM's limitations, and how to account for them.


Despite my enthusiasm - I actually agree with you entirely. I have been (and still am) learning Mozart's Turkish March. Much of the conversation with my teacher is about issues totally not detectable in Piano Marvel, such as legato v staccato, peddling, even/smooth playing (ie where or where not the emphasis on notes should be). I would also go as far as to say that much of the conversation in my lesson today was how to learn how to play the last two sections, and the techniques that we discussed there wouldn't be applicable in Piano Marvel either (various exercises using strange emphasis, or learning the chords without the grace notes and then adding them in afterwards).

That said - I do have lots of fun doing stuff that isn't my main piece - especially trying pieces I haven't tried in their full form.

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2860156
06/18/19 06:24 PM
06/18/19 06:24 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 5,551
Tyrone Slothrop Offline
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Posts: 5,551
I completely agree with ADWyatt and akc42, and I dare say many of us long-timers on PM (I've used it since Feb 2018) are aware of these limitations and the workarounds addressed here.


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2860317
06/19/19 06:48 AM
06/19/19 06:48 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 243
Wuustwezel Belgium
Sarah65 Offline OP
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I see PM more as a learning program, to really learn from 0 which note corresponds to which key. It is and remains mechanical and robotic, a computer program will never be able to display all the nuances of sheet music. A combination of both is ideal, I think, for further learning, a teacher and PM for drilling difficult passages.


Piano Marvel level 4B and everything I like smile
Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Groove On] #2860549
06/19/19 05:08 PM
06/19/19 05:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 20
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Music&Lyrics Offline
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Originally Posted by Groove On
I found it useful to first practice each inversion as a set of 12. So 12x roots round the circle/chromatically, then 12x 1st inversions, then 12x 2nds.

After that, you could try doing Triad Cycles where you alternate inversions as you go around the circle/chromatically. For example, play root of C, then 2nd inv F and continue round circle.

After that, start adding musical patterns in the other hand, starting with 5-finger scales and basic rhythms and then adding more musical things like bass lines or right hand riffs.



Thank you for the idea. That sounds like a good plan. I've downloaded Musescore and I'm going to start making some sort of inversions exercises and upload them into PM (new experience for me).

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2862128
06/23/19 09:19 PM
06/23/19 09:19 PM
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 20
Colorado Springs, CO
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Hi fellow PM users!

I have a question about the three main areas within PM: Method, Technique, and Sight Reading / SASR.

I just completed units 2B in both Method and Technique (yay, me!). To date, I have not tried any of the SASR tests. To be honest, when I first started with PM a couple of months ago, I looked at one of the tests and it scared me as I was definitely not ready for any such stuff. But I knew I'd probably get to the SASR module eventually.

For those of you using PM, how have you used the SASR module in your practicing? After going through the Method and Technique modules, do the SASR tests provide any educational benefit? Or are these SASR tests for nothing more than tracking your progress?

Last edited by John_C; 06/23/19 09:20 PM.

John_C - Colorado Springs
Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: John_C] #2862181
06/24/19 02:00 AM
06/24/19 02:00 AM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 491
Just outside London UK
akc42 Online content
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akc42  Online Content
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Originally Posted by John_C

For those of you using PM, how have you used the SASR module in your practicing? After going through the Method and Technique modules, do the SASR tests provide any educational benefit? Or are these SASR tests for nothing more than tracking your progress?


I use the sight reading tests to improve my sight reading.

I have completed the first 5 levels of PM's Method and Technique sections. But as near to daily as I can, I take the SASR test. I start as an intermediate level student - which normally means it gives me and exercise from level 2 as the first sight reading piece. This is random from 2A to 2E. Scoring 100% on that will then normally present a level 3 piece at the same level (ie if previous was 2A then 3A, or if 2E then 3E) and 100% on that will present level 4. But, as is often the case I score slightly less, then the jump isn't a complete level - so I might jump from 2E to 3C and from 3C to 4B. If you do particularly poorly you may even go back some - so I have scored badly at 5A it them gives me a 4C piece.

Your score tends to reflect the level - so level 2 is in the 200-299 range, level 3 is 300-399 and so on. But it lags slightly especially removing score after a bad performance on a piece, I tend to start to fall apart as we get to the top end of level 4 or early level 5 so I have had scores which may have just crept into 500, done badly - been given a 4D piece scored 100% and not gained any score, but then been given another level 5 piece - scored badly on that but had the score jump up quite a bit.

Currently I am practicing Bach's Prelude in C to try and move on through level 6A (so far got stuck at 99% on the measure 1-19 exercise), so what I am playing is way above what I can achieve in the SASR tests where I am currently scoring in the low 500s on a regular basis. I regard the SASR test as trying to improve me sight reading skills. I don't think it is truely that though because - having taken the test daily for a long time I am clearly being presented with pieces I have been presented with before and true sight reading should be from stuff you have never seen before. However I don't regard it as too bad - as it is helping me recognise patterns quickly and get my fingers to play them - and that is the main aim.

I am improving - a few weeks ago I was averaging high 400s

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: akc42] #2862253
06/24/19 08:34 AM
06/24/19 08:34 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 33
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millsj1134 Offline
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Originally Posted by akc42
[quote=John_C]
I am improving - a few weeks ago I was averaging high 400s


smile smile smile

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: John_C] #2862273
06/24/19 09:52 AM
06/24/19 09:52 AM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 5,551
Tyrone Slothrop Offline
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5000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 5,551
Originally Posted by John_C
Hi fellow PM users!

I have a question about the three main areas within PM: Method, Technique, and Sight Reading / SASR.

I just completed units 2B in both Method and Technique (yay, me!). To date, I have not tried any of the SASR tests. To be honest, when I first started with PM a couple of months ago, I looked at one of the tests and it scared me as I was definitely not ready for any such stuff. But I knew I'd probably get to the SASR module eventually.

For those of you using PM, how have you used the SASR module in your practicing? After going through the Method and Technique modules, do the SASR tests provide any educational benefit? Or are these SASR tests for nothing more than tracking your progress?

If you have a very good memory of musical scores, you can't use the SASR to learn to sight-read, as it doesn't generate the test musical scores, but uses pre-canned fragments out of an internal database. I found that after taking a few SASR tests, I was performing better, but not because I was better at sight reading, but because I'd already inadvertently memorized all of the fragments of music being tested during previous test attempts! This obviously, at a minimum, skews the validity of the SASR.

Instead, those with very good memories should use the SASR only every 1-2 weeks as an assessment of sight-reading progress, and then use something else for the actual daily improvement work. I've had great results with www.sightreadingfactory.com.

And to Josh: Here's me requesting a new feature in PM, either integrated with SASR or separate, which does something similar to www.sightreadingfactory.com with generated music instead of pre-canned, easy to memorize, music!


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2862293
06/24/19 10:53 AM
06/24/19 10:53 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 243
Wuustwezel Belgium
Sarah65 Offline OP
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Sarah65  Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
[quote=John_C]Hi fellow PM users!
Instead, those with very good memories should use the SASR only every 1-2 weeks as an assessment of sight-reading progress, and then use something else for the actual daily improvement work. I've had great results with www.sightreadingfactory.com.

And to Josh: Here's me requesting a new feature in PM, either integrated with SASR or separate, which does something similar to www.sightreadingfactory.com with generated music instead of pre-canned, easy to memorize, music!


Tyrone, did you know that there are already SASR exercises in the library? I made a map with a series of mixed exercises, from level 1 to level 5 and I try to play it randomly. Actually surprise yourself. wink And when you know everything in your folder by heart, you create a new folder, especially those with the numbers are interesting because then you do not know what is coming, I mean if the title says "arabia" then you know enough. laugh


Piano Marvel level 4B and everything I like smile
Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2862568
06/25/19 02:00 AM
06/25/19 02:00 AM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 491
Just outside London UK
akc42 Online content
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FInally got 100% on Prelude in C (m 1 -19) thumb I've been trying to nail that since April 2018

Followed that up with 100% in (m 20-29) thumb

Couldn't quite do m 33-35 - (95% - but that part is so short - it was effectively only the very last chord that wasn't clean).

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: Sarah65] #2862572
06/25/19 04:19 AM
06/25/19 04:19 AM
Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 491
Just outside London UK
akc42 Online content
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akc42  Online Content
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First sit down at the piano this morning and now got m33-35 at 100%.

I used the practice techniques my teacher had been showing me to isolate the problems (fingering for the second bar, failure to jump fast enough to the last chord) - practice up to but not beyond the problem - play it several times slowly to get it correct into my fingers, and then eventually at full speed. Voila 100%!

Now stoked for my lesson to start in the next 10 to 20 mins (teacher comes to me)

Re: Other people do Piano Marvel? [Re: akc42] #2862576
06/25/19 05:31 AM
06/25/19 05:31 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 243
Wuustwezel Belgium
Sarah65 Offline OP
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Wuustwezel Belgium
Originally Posted by akc42
FInally got 100% on Prelude in C (m 1 -19) thumb I've been trying to nail that since April 2018

Followed that up with 100% in (m 20-29) thumb

Couldn't quite do m 33-35 - (95% - but that part is so short - it was effectively only the very last chord that wasn't clean).


Congrats thumb thumb thumb


Piano Marvel level 4B and everything I like smile
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