Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.7 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Find a Professional
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Advertise on Piano World

(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Who's Online Now
76 registered members (Chrispy, Animisha, beeboss, BarryDMD, BigIslandGuy, almo82, 22 invisible), 1,345 guests, and 6 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Is this slightly OCD? #2850910
05/21/19 10:56 PM
05/21/19 10:56 PM
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 5
East Gippsland, Australia
D
Deltajockey Offline OP
Junior Member
Deltajockey  Offline OP
Junior Member
D

Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 5
East Gippsland, Australia
Hi all,
I don't know if anyone has ever asked this question before ....I must be weird,....blush

well here goes...

I've always mostly played my own pieces, as I'm a composer, so don't tend to play other's compositions much,
however when practicing, or even just noodling, I usually finish my session with a final arpeggio or at least a "2 handed chord", and I often have the urge to finish my session in C major, or at least one of the majors, and if I finish in minor, I have this niggling unfinished feeling. Maybe it's just a sense of performance completeness if playing to an audience, (which I do very little of), or my general musical upbringing?

Is this a common feeling amongst piano players, or am I truly unique in this world! I know it's a pretty abstract question, but I just got wondering, and thought here would be an easy place to ask.

thanks


Chris


Last edited by Deltajockey; 05/21/19 10:57 PM.
Piano & Music Gifts & Accessories (570)
Piano accessories and music gift items
Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: Deltajockey] #2850939
05/22/19 02:04 AM
05/22/19 02:04 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 22,385
New York
Mark_C Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Mark_C  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 22,385
New York
This might be the first time I didn't avoid a thing that's in what my work is. grin

I can't resist, because it's a great question, and one that I'm very interested in.

The thing you're saying is a thing that we could say sounds like it could be that -- but it isn't -- unless it's a problem.

How do you know if it's a problem?

Well, if you don't, who else would? smile

It sounds to me like it isn't. It sounds to me like just a thing that you really like.

Some ways that such a thing might be a problem:

Main way: That you can't help doing it, and it plagues you.

Also: If it badly limits what you do musically-- like, if knowing that you're going to end like that forces you to do only some particular kinds of things leading up to it.

If you'd said that you need to play the chord over and over and over and that you can hardly bring yourself to stop, that would be a different story....but you're not saying anything like that.


BTW, it reminds me of a thing in an old "Honeymooners" TV episode (the show with Jackie Gleason and Art Carney) -- maybe it's mainly the old-timers here who will know this. There's an episode where Art Carney plays some songs on a piano (in real life he was really a very good piano player), and they have him needing to 'warm up' before every song with a couple measures of Swanee River.
That turned out to be more than just a quirk. It had major plot significance in the episode -- to the extent that there can be major plot significance in a TV comedy. ha

Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: Mark_C] #2850941
05/22/19 02:07 AM
05/22/19 02:07 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 22,385
New York
Mark_C Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Mark_C  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 22,385
New York
P.S. Here's that TV thing:
(it's actually just half the length of the video; for some reason they have some parts of the episode repeated after the first run, as though there were a couple of da capos or something) grin


Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: Deltajockey] #2850944
05/22/19 02:25 AM
05/22/19 02:25 AM
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 16
G
girflush Offline
Junior Member
girflush  Offline
Junior Member
G

Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 16
Whether it's OCD, whatever that means, I cannot say, not being a psychologist.. But I think generally not because at one time composition taught as a guideline that a work could not end on a minor chord the reasoning being that a minor chord could not give a complete sense of closure, that only the major chord could, and that the start and end should express perfection, embodied in the major triad. You see this in practice from the time..for instance i"m working on the d minor prelude in book 1 of the wtc. Despite being in d minor, the final chord contains a major third rather than the minor.. Of course things have gotten a bit lax since in regards to "rules"... So I'd say you're thinking here is entirely consistent with historical practice, and not particularly ocd, unless one is to call traditional music practice ocd - which many undoubtedly have!

Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: girflush] #2850947
05/22/19 02:29 AM
05/22/19 02:29 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 22,385
New York
Mark_C Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Mark_C  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 22,385
New York
Originally Posted by girflush
....unless one is to call traditional music practice ocd - which many undoubtedly have!

Yeah. grin
I just posted on another thread about being into playing a 1½ minute piece over and over. That's probably a lot more OCD than what DJ is saying. ha

Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: Deltajockey] #2851015
05/22/19 08:22 AM
05/22/19 08:22 AM
Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 5
East Gippsland, Australia
D
Deltajockey Offline OP
Junior Member
Deltajockey  Offline OP
Junior Member
D

Joined: Mar 2019
Posts: 5
East Gippsland, Australia
thanks for your thoughtful and detailed reply Mark. I do vaguely remember the Honeymooners!
You sound like you study the psychology of music on the human mind? I have to confess I've always had a bit of an interest in how sound and music affects emotions. My life long interest in music is more driven by my emotions than the entertainment value!

Thank you also girflush for your comments, I partly was thinking the same when I mentioned whether my upbringing may have influenced this too. Somewhere in the past I would have been told about the traditional music conventions. Quite ironic really, even though music and piano has been a big part of me for my whole life...over 50 years, I have only had minimal formal training, and pride myself in a unique free style driven by my heart and my own empirical rules, and not by written conventions.

On reflection, I was perhaps too literal in using the term OCD. I was probably thinking it colloquially. You are right Mark, it is not something which rules my behaviour at all. It's just an observation, and wondered how unique I was in this way. If I am interrupted while playing and have to leave the piano, I don't give it a thought. It's more when I'm in that "perfection" mood that I have the urge to finish off major, and feel the incompleteness if I don't. Certainly, if I leave the keys with that niggling feeling, I haven't gone back to put it right. Perhaps that would be truly obsessive?

Perhaps there is another musical analogy in my life, which has been influenced by my life experiences. I have produced a couple of albums in the past. My style is generally music in minor keys, filmscore, emotional style. On both albums, I finish with the last track being in major. The journey has been sombre but it has a happy ending!


So, I hope that makes some sense smile

Chris

Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: Deltajockey] #2851018
05/22/19 08:35 AM
05/22/19 08:35 AM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 4,783
Tyrone Slothrop Offline
Tyrone Slothrop  Offline


Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 4,783
Originally Posted by Deltajockey
You sound like you study the psychology of music on the human mind?

I think he's saying he's a psychiatrist for people like me, with real diagnosed OCD, as opposed to people who are only wondering if they have OCD. smile


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: Deltajockey] #2851123
05/22/19 12:39 PM
05/22/19 12:39 PM
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 35
K
KenBakerMN Offline
Full Member
KenBakerMN  Offline
Full Member
K

Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 35
My thought (as a non-expert, non-professional, so you're getting what you paid for) is that it is mostly due to what your musical ear is used to, and you can train yourself out of it. I used to have the same feeling, but as a amateur composer I made a conscious decision never to end on a straight major triad. A plain minor triad is an unsatisfying ending, but try a major 7 #11, or a suspended 3rd. A minor 9th chord with open voicing has a nice restful sound, with a sort of major-minor ambiguity. You can even end on a bluesy dom 7.

There are many other possibilities if you don't insist on ending with a triad. Actually that's true for the harmony throughout the piece.

Last edited by KenBakerMN; 05/22/19 12:40 PM.
Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: Deltajockey] #2851221
05/22/19 05:00 PM
05/22/19 05:00 PM
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,726
B
bennevis Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
bennevis  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
B

Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 11,726
If Schoenberg can end his greatest work on an exultant C major chord (with no 'added' notes) hyperextended to heavenly length (unless you're one of the singers in the choirs, in which case it's h*llish length), I have no problem finishing all my opuses with a heavenly C major chord.

Except, of course, if my piece happens to be in C# minor, in which case I like to end with an exultant D flat major......


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: KenBakerMN] #2851223
05/22/19 05:03 PM
05/22/19 05:03 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 22,599
Victoria, BC
BruceD Offline
Gold Subscriber
BruceD  Offline
Gold Subscriber

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 22,599
Victoria, BC
Originally Posted by KenBakerMN
[...]You can even end on a bluesy dom 7.

[...]


As did Chopin in the F major Prelude, No. 23 from Op. 28.

That one E-flat in the final F major arpeggio just leaves the ending suspended without resolution.

Regards,


BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190
Re: Is this slightly OCD? [Re: bennevis] #2851459
05/23/19 11:56 AM
05/23/19 11:56 AM
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 35
K
KenBakerMN Offline
Full Member
KenBakerMN  Offline
Full Member
K

Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 35
Bennevis, in a way you made my point. Ending a piece on a heavenly or exultant major chord is great, but it's been done. And done, and done, and done. That said, a composer more skillful than I am, which probably means most of you, can still be creative and original with basic triads.

Simply as a matter of my own taste, I like exploring some of the odd corners of harmony and meter without, if you'll pardon the mixed metaphor, going too far out in the weeds. And to my ears, ending on, for example, a minor 9th doesn't sound at all unresolved.

If you're familiar with Copland's Piano Variations, it ends on gnarly growl down in the dungeon. Carl Ruggle's Sun Treader ends on a hair-raising yowl. But there is nonetheless an unmistakeable finality in both cases.

Last edited by KenBakerMN; 05/23/19 12:03 PM.

Moderated by  Brendan, Kreisler 

Shop Our Online Store!
Shop Our Store Online
Shop PianoSupplies.com

Did you know Piano World has an online store, and that it's loaded with goodies pianists and music lovers want?
Check it out and place your order.

Special Purchase!
Keyboard and Roses Piano Bench Cushion Keyboard & Roses 14"x30" piano bench cushions Regularly sold for $79 to $100, now only $39. (while supplies last)

(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq Bechstein
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Control Piano APP on iPad from Roland RD-800
by BarryDMD. 06/16/19 05:36 AM
Steinway O Chladni Figure
by Chernobieff Piano. 06/16/19 12:55 AM
Who is the better pianist?
by AssociateX. 06/15/19 10:41 PM
What's Hot!!
PIANO TEACHERS Please read this!
-------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
Forum Statistics
Forums41
Topics192,539
Posts2,838,266
Members93,618
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2019 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1