Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.7 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Find a Professional
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Advertise on Piano World

(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Who's Online Now
108 registered members (camperbc, Boboulus, Apache, bobrunyan, Calavera, Animisha, AYS, Boylan, 29 invisible), 1,546 guests, and 560 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: florhof] #2848471 05/15/19 12:19 PM
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,890
J
jdw Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
J
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,890
Originally Posted by florhof
To write down fingerings is most important, not only when you learn a new piece, but also - perhaps even more - to re-activate it after a longer break. Write as much as necessary and as little as possible.


Yes, it's when going back to a piece after a while that I especially need the reminders of what worked. Too often, I find that I decided something was obvious or easy to remember while learning a piece and didn't write it in, only to wish for guidance on returning to it later.


1989 Baldwin R
Currently working on:​
Schubert, Op. 90 no. 2
Sinding, Frühlingsrauschen (Rustle of Spring)
Beethoven, Sonata no. 14 in C# minor (Moonlight)
Piano & Music Gifts & Accessories (570)
Piano accessories and music gift items, digital piano dolly, music theme party goods
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: RmntcPianoLvr] #2848482 05/15/19 01:35 PM
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 135
T
TwelfthRoot2 Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
T
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 135
I write fingering for pretty much every note (for something like Bach), but less for "argpeggiated" type things, but I'm still a fingering Nazi. I think if you start to become very advanced then fingering will become less and less important. Zimerman claims that he often switches fingering on the fly during a performance. I don't know how accurate that is, but it would be impressive.

In the end, I think not using set fingering makes you a better pianist, but using set fingerings allows you to perform a certain piece better.

One thing you can do to sort of break your dependence on set fingering is to improvise (with or without looking at the keys, but preferably without).

Good luck!

Last edited by TwelfthRoot2; 05/15/19 01:37 PM.
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: TwelfthRoot2] #2848492 05/15/19 02:04 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
MichaelJK Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by TwelfthRoot2
I write fingering for pretty much every note (for something like Bach), but less for "argpeggiated" type things, but I'm still a fingering Nazi. I think if you start to become very advanced then fingering will become less and less important. Zimerman claims that he often switches fingering on the fly during a performance. I don't know how accurate that is, but it would be impressive.

In the end, I think not using set fingering makes you a better pianist, but using set fingerings allows you to perform a certain piece better.

One thing you can do to sort of break your dependence on set fingering is to improvise (with or without looking at the keys, but preferably without).


Yes, in improvising you don't really plan out fingering. My ideal is for all performance to feel like improvisation (thus, no careful planning of fingering). This ideal is well within reach!

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: MichaelJK] #2848527 05/15/19 04:55 PM
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573
S
ShyPianist Offline
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
S
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by TwelfthRoot2
I write fingering for pretty much every note (for something like Bach), but less for "argpeggiated" type things, but I'm still a fingering Nazi. I think if you start to become very advanced then fingering will become less and less important. Zimerman claims that he often switches fingering on the fly during a performance. I don't know how accurate that is, but it would be impressive.

In the end, I think not using set fingering makes you a better pianist, but using set fingerings allows you to perform a certain piece better.

One thing you can do to sort of break your dependence on set fingering is to improvise (with or without looking at the keys, but preferably without).


Yes, in improvising you don't really plan out fingering. My ideal is for all performance to feel like improvisation (thus, no careful planning of fingering). This ideal is well within reach!


Start improvising your fingering in a Bach fugue and you’ll be in trouble very very quickly!


Pianist, independent music arranger, violinist, mother
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: ShyPianist] #2848537 05/15/19 05:16 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
MichaelJK Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by ShyPianist
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by TwelfthRoot2
I write fingering for pretty much every note (for something like Bach), but less for "argpeggiated" type things, but I'm still a fingering Nazi. I think if you start to become very advanced then fingering will become less and less important. Zimerman claims that he often switches fingering on the fly during a performance. I don't know how accurate that is, but it would be impressive.

In the end, I think not using set fingering makes you a better pianist, but using set fingerings allows you to perform a certain piece better.

One thing you can do to sort of break your dependence on set fingering is to improvise (with or without looking at the keys, but preferably without).


Yes, in improvising you don't really plan out fingering. My ideal is for all performance to feel like improvisation (thus, no careful planning of fingering). This ideal is well within reach!


Start improvising your fingering in a Bach fugue and you’ll be in trouble very very quickly!


Actually, I came to this conclusion when I realized that music such as fugues and open choral scores are far easier to play when you don't plan out fingering. I find that planned fingering is most helpful for fast scales.

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: MichaelJK] #2848597 05/15/19 10:33 PM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,669
O
outo Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
O
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,669
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by ShyPianist
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by TwelfthRoot2
I write fingering for pretty much every note (for something like Bach), but less for "argpeggiated" type things, but I'm still a fingering Nazi. I think if you start to become very advanced then fingering will become less and less important. Zimerman claims that he often switches fingering on the fly during a performance. I don't know how accurate that is, but it would be impressive.

In the end, I think not using set fingering makes you a better pianist, but using set fingerings allows you to perform a certain piece better.

One thing you can do to sort of break your dependence on set fingering is to improvise (with or without looking at the keys, but preferably without).


Yes, in improvising you don't really plan out fingering. My ideal is for all performance to feel like improvisation (thus, no careful planning of fingering). This ideal is well within reach!


Start improvising your fingering in a Bach fugue and you’ll be in trouble very very quickly!


Actually, I came to this conclusion when I realized that music such as fugues and open choral scores are far easier to play when you don't plan out fingering. I find that planned fingering is most helpful for fast scales.


I assume you are not memorizing this music? Or if you do, do you then memorize the notes only so that you can decide the fingerings on the fly? I find it too difficult to memorize without fixing the fingerings, although I have noticed that if I know the piece well enough when playing from memory they can indeed be changed and improvisef without causing trouble.

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: RmntcPianoLvr] #2848677 05/16/19 06:51 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 26,183
pianoloverus Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 26,183
I think improvising fingering or not using consistent fingering is an extremely bad approach except maybe for some world class pianists. Nothing to be gained and significant chance of creating problems. I know of no high level teacher that recommends this approach.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 05/16/19 06:52 AM.
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: pianoloverus] #2848685 05/16/19 07:21 AM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,669
O
outo Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
O
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,669
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think improvising fingering or not using consistent fingering is an extremely bad approach except maybe for some world class pianists. Nothing to be gained and significant chance of creating problems. I know of no high level teacher that recommends this approach.

Agree, but sometimes one has to because one wrong finger leads to another and eventually it takes some time before you get back on track. So if you know the notes as well, not just the drilled physical movements, it's easier. I can never 100 % trust my brain to use the correct finger no matter how well practiced. I call these moments my "ticks". Suddenly my 3rd finger just decides to replace the 4th or the 2nd the 3rd without any conscious intention.

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: outo] #2848726 05/16/19 09:07 AM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
MichaelJK Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by outo

I assume you are not memorizing this music? Or if you do, do you then memorize the notes only so that you can decide the fingerings on the fly? I find it too difficult to memorize without fixing the fingerings, although I have noticed that if I know the piece well enough when playing from memory they can indeed be changed and improvisef without causing trouble.


The idea isn't exactly to just "decide the fingerings on the fly". It's that, in general, the best (or good enough) fingering is usually pretty obvious, but you need to train your instincts to be able to see that fingering on the fly. The only way to do that is to practice relying on instinct to choose the correct fingering. Don't plan your fingering, let your hands make whatever mistakes they need to make as they learn, and see what happens.

I should also point out that if you are not used to working this way, you may have to take a few steps back before going forward. When you stop micromanaging, you will start making lots of mistakes that you didn't make before. So you have to be willing to go through that. It is worth it, though.

As far as memorization goes, I do not try to memorize notes or fingerings. I memorize larger patterns. Like if I were memorizing a presentation. It would not make any sense to talk about memorizing syllables or tongue positions or whatever.

Last edited by MichaelJK; 05/16/19 09:07 AM.
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: pianoloverus] #2848729 05/16/19 09:11 AM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
MichaelJK Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think improvising fingering or not using consistent fingering is an extremely bad approach except maybe for some world class pianists. Nothing to be gained and significant chance of creating problems. I know of no high level teacher that recommends this approach.


There's actually a lot to gain. You gain physical and mental freedom. You gain the ability to see larger patterns in the score, rather than keeping your attention focused on a narrow window. This makes memorization and sight-reading far easier.

You have to do this work honestly, though, or yes, it will backfire. You must be willing to make mistakes and let yourself learn. If you simultaneously (a) try to get every single note right and (b) refuse to zoom in to the level of detail required, then you will create patterns of tension that will make things worse.

(EDIT: Also, every single high-level teacher does this, even if they don't talk about it. I've never seen any piano teacher insist that every single finger number be written over every single note. Of course not, because most fingerings are obvious. But at one time they weren't obvious. What I'm advocating is broadening the scope of what is obvious.)

Last edited by MichaelJK; 05/16/19 09:16 AM.
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: MichaelJK] #2848735 05/16/19 09:24 AM
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573
S
ShyPianist Offline
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
S
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think improvising fingering or not using consistent fingering is an extremely bad approach except maybe for some world class pianists. Nothing to be gained and significant chance of creating problems. I know of no high level teacher that recommends this approach.


There's actually a lot to gain. You gain physical and mental freedom. You gain the ability to see larger patterns in the score, rather than keeping your attention focused on a narrow window. This makes memorization and sight-reading far easier.

You have to do this work honestly, though, or yes, it will backfire. You must be willing to make mistakes and let yourself learn. If you simultaneously (a) try to get every single note right and (b) refuse to zoom in to the level of detail required, then you will create patterns of tension that will make things worse.

(EDIT: Also, every single high-level teacher does this, even if they don't talk about it. I've never seen any piano teacher insist that every single finger number be written over every single note. Of course not, because most fingerings are obvious. But at one time they weren't obvious. What I'm advocating is broadening the scope of what is obvious.)


I'd suggest there's a slight case of talking at crossed purposes here. I think there's a lot to be said for experimenting and allowing your fingers to find the most comfortable fingering, taking into account all the things mentioned above. BUT, once you have found that comfortable fingering I think it's generally advisable to stick to it. It is for me anyhow. That isn't to say I always do, but there are definitely scenarios where that then gets me into trouble. And I do go back to my example above of a typical Bach fugue. Unless you're going to cheat by using the sustain pedal, there aren't normally too many options that allow the proper finger pedalling and they aren't always immediately obvious either.


Pianist, independent music arranger, violinist, mother
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: MichaelJK] #2848749 05/16/19 10:10 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 26,183
pianoloverus Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 26,183
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think improvising fingering or not using consistent fingering is an extremely bad approach except maybe for some world class pianists. Nothing to be gained and significant chance of creating problems. I know of no high level teacher that recommends this approach.


There's actually a lot to gain. You gain physical and mental freedom. You gain the ability to see larger patterns in the score, rather than keeping your attention focused on a narrow window. This makes memorization and sight-reading far easier.

You have to do this work honestly, though, or yes, it will backfire. You must be willing to make mistakes and let yourself learn. If you simultaneously (a) try to get every single note right and (b) refuse to zoom in to the level of detail required, then you will create patterns of tension that will make things worse.

(EDIT: Also, every single high-level teacher does this, even if they don't talk about it. I've never seen any piano teacher insist that every single finger number be written over every single note. Of course not, because most fingerings are obvious. But at one time they weren't obvious. What I'm advocating is broadening the scope of what is obvious.)
I'm not talking about writing down every single fingering. I'm talking about the opposite extreme of not writing down any fingerings. I think most pianists at every level and all good teachers would recommend writing down at least some fingerings unless the pianist was so talented that it was unnecessary.

I also disagree with the idea that most fingerings are obvious based on my more than half century of experience. Of course, that would depend on one's definition of "most". As I've gotten older I write down more fingerings because, for me at least, the best fingering is quite often far from obvious. This may be partly due to my switching from playing mostly classical to mostly jazz transcriptions since the best jazz fingerings sometimes aren't classical type fingerings.

If one looks at various fingered edition one can often see quite a variety of fingerings, and I think this shows that the best fingering is not so obvious much of the time. There can be many reasonably good fingerings for a passage but finding the one that works best for me is often not obvious.

Finally, regarding sight reading I don't see how not writing down fingerings improves sight reading. I consider myself an excellent sight reader for an amateur but I write down a lot of fingerings(not so much when I was a teenager). While sight reading, one just does the best one can but few would use all the same fingerings when studying a piece that they used when sight reading that piece.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 05/16/19 10:14 AM.
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: RmntcPianoLvr] #2848766 05/16/19 10:35 AM
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 889
C
Colin Miles Offline
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
C
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 889
In some 70 years I have never written down any fingering. Just don't find it necessary to remind me what I should be doing. Yes there are very occasional times when the fingering is 'awkward' and they cannot decide what is best, but I don't need to write anything down to remind me of that fact. Just practice until something sticks. Perhaps this is all down to the fact that I am a very good sight reader, or maybe not. We are all different and need different strategies.


Roland LX7

South Wales, UK
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: pianoloverus] #2848964 05/16/19 06:09 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
MichaelJK Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think improvising fingering or not using consistent fingering is an extremely bad approach except maybe for some world class pianists. Nothing to be gained and significant chance of creating problems. I know of no high level teacher that recommends this approach.


There's actually a lot to gain. You gain physical and mental freedom. You gain the ability to see larger patterns in the score, rather than keeping your attention focused on a narrow window. This makes memorization and sight-reading far easier.

You have to do this work honestly, though, or yes, it will backfire. You must be willing to make mistakes and let yourself learn. If you simultaneously (a) try to get every single note right and (b) refuse to zoom in to the level of detail required, then you will create patterns of tension that will make things worse.

(EDIT: Also, every single high-level teacher does this, even if they don't talk about it. I've never seen any piano teacher insist that every single finger number be written over every single note. Of course not, because most fingerings are obvious. But at one time they weren't obvious. What I'm advocating is broadening the scope of what is obvious.)
I'm not talking about writing down every single fingering. I'm talking about the opposite extreme of not writing down any fingerings. I think most pianists at every level and all good teachers would recommend writing down at least some fingerings unless the pianist was so talented that it was unnecessary.

I also disagree with the idea that most fingerings are obvious based on my more than half century of experience. Of course, that would depend on one's definition of "most". As I've gotten older I write down more fingerings because, for me at least, the best fingering is quite often far from obvious.

If one looks at various fingered edition one can often see quite a variety of fingerings, and I think this shows that the best fingering is not so obvious much of the time. There can be many reasonably good fingerings for a passage but finding the one that works best for me is often not obvious.

Finally, regarding sight reading I don't see how not writing down fingerings improves sight reading. I consider myself an excellent sight reader for an amateur but I write down a lot of fingerings(not so much when I was a teenager). While sight reading, one just does the best one can but few would use all the same fingerings when studying a piece that they used when sight reading that piece.


If you consider yourself a good sight-reader, then you would have to agree that most fingerings are obvious. How else can you sight-read music where most of the notes do not have written finger numbers?

It also depends on what your standards are. For me, a "good fingering" is one that lets me play the notes and express the music the way I want it to go. Once I have found something that works, I don't keep looking for a better fingering, comparing different editions and what not. The only time I think about fingering is when something just really isn't working. I used to think about it much much more, but I realized that most of that was more a search for a sense of security than it was actually helping me play better.

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: ShyPianist] #2848966 05/16/19 06:15 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
MichaelJK Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by ShyPianist
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think improvising fingering or not using consistent fingering is an extremely bad approach except maybe for some world class pianists. Nothing to be gained and significant chance of creating problems. I know of no high level teacher that recommends this approach.


There's actually a lot to gain. You gain physical and mental freedom. You gain the ability to see larger patterns in the score, rather than keeping your attention focused on a narrow window. This makes memorization and sight-reading far easier.

You have to do this work honestly, though, or yes, it will backfire. You must be willing to make mistakes and let yourself learn. If you simultaneously (a) try to get every single note right and (b) refuse to zoom in to the level of detail required, then you will create patterns of tension that will make things worse.

(EDIT: Also, every single high-level teacher does this, even if they don't talk about it. I've never seen any piano teacher insist that every single finger number be written over every single note. Of course not, because most fingerings are obvious. But at one time they weren't obvious. What I'm advocating is broadening the scope of what is obvious.)


I'd suggest there's a slight case of talking at crossed purposes here. I think there's a lot to be said for experimenting and allowing your fingers to find the most comfortable fingering, taking into account all the things mentioned above. BUT, once you have found that comfortable fingering I think it's generally advisable to stick to it. It is for me anyhow. That isn't to say I always do, but there are definitely scenarios where that then gets me into trouble. And I do go back to my example above of a typical Bach fugue. Unless you're going to cheat by using the sustain pedal, there aren't normally too many options that allow the proper finger pedalling and they aren't always immediately obvious either.


I do often use the sustain pedal in Bach fugues, and I don't consider that cheating. Even if I forced myself to play without the pedal, it wouldn't make a huge difference, though. There would be a couple spots where I would have to spend extra time practicing if I wanted to include all of the notes. But overall, same basic experience.

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: MichaelJK] #2849003 05/16/19 07:24 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 26,183
pianoloverus Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 26,183
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
If you consider yourself a good sight-reader, then you would have to agree that most fingerings are obvious. How else can you sight-read music where most of the notes do not have written finger numbers?
When sight reading I often use less than ideal or even good fingering and does the best one can. I think it's still possible to sight read a piece quite well with far from ideal fingering.

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: MichaelJK] #2849028 05/16/19 09:01 PM
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,669
O
outo Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
O
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,669
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think improvising fingering or not using consistent fingering is an extremely bad approach except maybe for some world class pianists. Nothing to be gained and significant chance of creating problems. I know of no high level teacher that recommends this approach.


There's actually a lot to gain. You gain physical and mental freedom. You gain the ability to see larger patterns in the score, rather than keeping your attention focused on a narrow window. This makes memorization and sight-reading far easier.

You have to do this work honestly, though, or yes, it will backfire. You must be willing to make mistakes and let yourself learn. If you simultaneously (a) try to get every single note right and (b) refuse to zoom in to the level of detail required, then you will create patterns of tension that will make things worse.

(EDIT: Also, every single high-level teacher does this, even if they don't talk about it. I've never seen any piano teacher insist that every single finger number be written over every single note. Of course not, because most fingerings are obvious. But at one time they weren't obvious. What I'm advocating is broadening the scope of what is obvious.)
I'm not talking about writing down every single fingering. I'm talking about the opposite extreme of not writing down any fingerings. I think most pianists at every level and all good teachers would recommend writing down at least some fingerings unless the pianist was so talented that it was unnecessary.

I also disagree with the idea that most fingerings are obvious based on my more than half century of experience. Of course, that would depend on one's definition of "most". As I've gotten older I write down more fingerings because, for me at least, the best fingering is quite often far from obvious.

If one looks at various fingered edition one can often see quite a variety of fingerings, and I think this shows that the best fingering is not so obvious much of the time. There can be many reasonably good fingerings for a passage but finding the one that works best for me is often not obvious.

Finally, regarding sight reading I don't see how not writing down fingerings improves sight reading. I consider myself an excellent sight reader for an amateur but I write down a lot of fingerings(not so much when I was a teenager). While sight reading, one just does the best one can but few would use all the same fingerings when studying a piece that they used when sight reading that piece.


If you consider yourself a good sight-reader, then you would have to agree that most fingerings are obvious. How else can you sight-read music where most of the notes do not have written finger numbers?

It also depends on what your standards are. For me, a "good fingering" is one that lets me play the notes and express the music the way I want it to go. Once I have found something that works, I don't keep looking for a better fingering, comparing different editions and what not. The only time I think about fingering is when something just really isn't working. I used to think about it much much more, but I realized that most of that was more a search for a sense of security than it was actually helping me play better.


You probably don't need to battle with too small hands wink When it takes some effort to figure out how to play all the notes so that the end result is convincing, it's seems wise to write it down...

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: RmntcPianoLvr] #2849146 05/17/19 06:56 AM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 497
M
MH1963 Offline
Silver Subscriber
Full Member
Offline
Silver Subscriber
Full Member
M
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 497
What I try to do is that if the hand has to be picked up, always mark the fingering for the first note after. Or any odd spot, such as left hand where it’s 1-2-1where the 2 is on a higher note. Also, I mark the last couple notes on passages prior to really tricky sections, to help avoid the problem of not having the correct finger readily available.

If I get that, it’s a good start, and then I add in any oddities as needed.

I try not to put in everything, I just try to put it into the important places where the pitfalls are.


MH1963

'63 Mason & Hamlin Model A
[Linked Image]

Working on: Chopin - Mazurka 7 No. 2 / The Prayer - Coates Arrangement / Einaudi - Nefeli
Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: outo] #2849276 05/17/19 12:30 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
MichaelJK Offline
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 266
Originally Posted by outo

You probably don't need to battle with too small hands wink When it takes some effort to figure out how to play all the notes so that the end result is convincing, it's seems wise to write it down...


I'm not sure why it is that small hands would make fingering harder. Can you give an example?

Re: Writing Too Much Fingering a Bad Thing? [Re: MichaelJK] #2849345 05/17/19 03:55 PM
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,845
gooddog Offline
5000 Post Club Member
Offline
5000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,845
Originally Posted by MichaelJK
Originally Posted by outo

You probably don't need to battle with too small hands wink When it takes some effort to figure out how to play all the notes so that the end result is convincing, it's seems wise to write it down...


I'm not sure why it is that small hands would make fingering harder. Can you give an example?

A few examples: For me, reaching anything larger than a 9th will require redistributing notes between my hands or dropping notes. Finding the best fingers for launching into jump and landing accurately and sweetly can be a challenge because the jump is comparatively larger for me than for someone with larger hands. Sometimes the music will require consecutive fingers to play a rapid succession of notes but I can't reach them. I can only accomplish this with an extra thumb-over or by starting on a different finger. Pinkies reaching too far can create a weak sound that can only be solved by changing to other fingers.


Best regards,

Deborah
Page 2 of 3 1 2 3

Moderated by  Brendan, Kreisler 

ad
Rob Mullins Holiday Album
Rob Mullins Holiday Album

Rob is an amazing jazz pianist in LA,a composer, and a friend of mine.
Frank B. / Piano World
Shop our Store for Music Lovers!
Christmas Ornaments Music Theme
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq Bechstein
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Finger Bands
by DutchTea - 12/14/19 10:35 AM
AI will "complete" Beethoven's 10th
by bennevis - 12/14/19 08:56 AM
Automatic room Humidifier and Dehumidifier?
by U3piano - 12/14/19 08:42 AM
NEW Roland RD4000 Keyboard
by Mr Jazz Man - 12/14/19 07:41 AM
Keyboard Action
by Mr Jazz Man - 12/14/19 07:31 AM
What's Hot!!
Our August Newsletter is Out!
------------------
Mason & Hamlin Piano Factory Tour!

-------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
Forum Statistics
Forums41
Topics195,651
Posts2,901,556
Members95,232
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers


Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2019 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3