Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Digital Pianos - Electronic Pianos - Synths & Keyboards Why no "High End" Digital Pianos?

What I mean is this: There must be a market for a specialized digital piano with nothing but the "Best". For example, action. Why no DP with a duplicated grand hammer action with sensors?

I have a RD 2000 and it has nice action.... but the RD 600 I had back in '97 was pretty good to and after 20 years, well I would have expected the RD 2000 to be way way better. It is better but no way way better. Further, I don;t feel the RD 2000's action is like a Steinway grand.... no way close. Nice, but no way.

So..... mimicking a real grand action would be expensive.... OK, so what? With a global market and premium pricing, why not?

For sound, a high-end unit would have modular boards than can be updated in the future..... huge memory..... and only the most complex samples.

For digital to analog conversion - again, modular boards or allow a digital out to use your own DAC

For analog electronics, high end amplifiers using top grade components.

There is a ton of money out there...... I gotta believe Roland or a niche maker could make big money on that... further, it can be a maker's halo product.... much like a Dodge Viper was to the Dodge line of cars.... sets a glow and gets a ton of press.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

Check Kawai and Yamaha. Both use acoustic actions from the proverbial grand piano. Kawai has a really nice one.

I think that what he tries to say is that even if you go all the way to the top AvantGrand or Kawai Novus, you still don't get that mindblowing experience of touch / sound combination. There are still cheap components used in these products, since good marketing seems to have better results, than actually building a top of the line piano. It is a known thing that digital piano technology advances pretty slow, and it's probably intentional, so that acoustic grands don't lose that much value.

You would only get the “best” action. Check for example the Alpha Grand or Studio pianos with Renner action. http://www.alpha-pianos.com/ These hybrids cost the same as a good acoustic. In any case, the sound is not comparable to an acoustic instrument. For a lower price, you have the AvantGrand and the Novus, that have an adapted acoustic action.

Bösendorfer had a digital that was more expensive than most mid-size grands. I don't think they made many of them.

Alpha Pianos most expensive digital is dearer than a Steinway Model D. They make digitals with conventional grand actions for €30,000.

P.S. Sorry Arc7urus. I didn't see your post.

The answer is diminishing returns: At some point a more expensive digital piano is just another digital piano.

I think a bespoke digital piano would be an excellent ploy. Choose your keyboard, sound engine, cabinet design, speaker and amp system and connectivity requirements. The manufacturers could get together on this. The cabinet might well be the most difficult thing to design and produce!

I can't imagine the NV-10 ever not being good enough.

Alpha Piano comes to mind indeed. I doubt they ever sold even a single one though. Totally wrong concept IMO. Why would you like nothing but the best and will then buy a digital piano? The best is an acoustic piano. You’re going to spend 100k on a digital because you live in a flat? Or you want to play Pianoteq instead of the real thing? Or you are cheap on tuning and regulation? Or you need to compose hip-hop music in a sequencer through a Renner action.

It just doesn’t make sense. There’s no such thing as high-end digital piano because that’s an oxymoron.

I don't believe this premise is correct.
Companies in pursue markets if there are profits in them, or reasons to believe profits are in them.

I’m not sure what the OP means as “high end”. The AG N3x is more expensive than most baby grands. A sure to be coming NV-3 will also be in that class. The various silent system acoustic piano, uprights and grands, that use the actual soundboard instead of speakers might qualify as high end.

Why will someone want to buy a high end digital, when they can get a good acoustics at the same price?

What about a revival of the Ballsandorfer CeusMaster? Only this time build it into the ‘155’ baby grand cabinet, use a soundboard, and a sensor technology similar to the Alpha Piano (sensors function as strings). Would that be high end enough?

Interesting.... I was unaware of the AG N3x action.... very cool..... but why not in a stage piano or similar unitl without speakers and amps?

Peace
Bruce in Philly

1. a real piano action is very heavy. There's not much market for a 150 lb stage piano.

2. one of the things that make these things sound more like "a piano in the room" than "a piano being played through speakers" is the particular array of speakers they build into them.

Because they don't want me to buy one... [tinfoil hat smiley]

If you were a business,would you invest all the necessary capital into producing a high-end digital piano?All the R&D,factory costs..... How many would you need to sell to just break even? However,have you tried the new Roland LX708 action?longer keys and different pivot points.Feels good to me.

I know a bit more about cars.... sports cars and the like... and I am throughouly amazed... just amazed at the size of the global market for high-end luxury goods. Million dollar cars.... etc.... Cars such as Koningsegg, Ferrari, McLaren, et al.... These are not just stupid-high priced cars.... they are seriously engineered. Koenigsegg literally makes just about everything... and by hand.... unbelivable engineering in their hand built engines... carbon fiber wheels.... etc etc....

The global market is so so big and there is so much money out there that a maker can charge a large price, develop a very special, highly engineered product, and make money.

I wanted a stage piano for my home.... I like the gadgets and all that candy even though I only layer two sounds at one time.... only dick with the others. I was pretty surprised that Rolands RD 2000, their top stage, was only $2400. Seriously, I would have thought they had some super-premium for the high-dollar folks. Again, the global market is huge.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

Hi Bruce, I think the comment about diminishing returns is spot-on.

Having said that, I purchased my Yamaha N3X three weeks ago and am over the moon happy with it. REAL hammer action, 12 speakers, spatial sampling... honestly I'd say the only limitations of the instrument are from the limitations of sampling methods. I do wish it had built-in wifi and Bluetooth but otherwise there is an amazing amount of tech built in to these things. The most beautiful part for me is that all the tech melts away when I play it... I'm just enjoying the living snot out of it. And it's GORGEOUS in my living room. One of the best purchases I've made in a long while.

I've heard great things about the Kawai NV-10, but there's no dealer in my town. If they'd built one in a grand cabinet with a powerful speaker system I may have traveled to go see it.

Anyhow I encourage you to check out the hybrids that our out there, the best known being from Yamaha, Kawai, and Casio. The only one in a grand cabinet was the N3X, so that was really my only choice. I'm thrilled with it, full-stop.

The V-Piano is/was Roland's most expensive stage piano. It still exists officially as a current product, but seemed to disappear from the real world not long after it was released.