 |
Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments. Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers
(it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!
|
|
|
|
46 members (36251, Boboulus, Beowulf, Bett, ambrozy, Bill McKaig,RPT, anotherscott, APianistHasNoName, 10 invisible),
563
guests, and
508
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
 Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 9,824
9000 Post Club Member
|
OP
9000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 9,824 |
The test does a good job of testing test taking skills -- can you figure out what the person who make the test was looking for -- but has nothing whatsoever to do with musical skill, IMHO. This could be said about most standardized test, including IQ test, could it not?
![[Linked Image]](http://forum.pianoworld.com//gallery/42/medium/12282.png) across the stone, deathless piano performances "Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano "Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person "Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573
500 Post Club Member
|
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573 |
The test does a good job of testing test taking skills -- can you figure out what the person who make the test was looking for -- but has nothing whatsoever to do with musical skill, IMHO. Since I got 100% obviously I believe it has everything to do with musical skill lol! You do need to have some listening skills but really pretty basic. Is the music going up or down? Is this phrase the same as that phrase, longer, shorter, different shape? How many instruments are playing. That's it really. What it has to do with shape associations is anyone's guess. My guess is nothing!
Last edited by ShyPianist; 05/01/19 08:37 AM.
Pianist, independent music arranger, violinist, mother
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 1,091
1000 Post Club Member
|
|
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 1,091 |
The test does a good job of testing test taking skills -- can you figure out what the person who make the test was looking for -- but has nothing whatsoever to do with musical skill, IMHO. Exactly
Roland LX706
South Wales, UK
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 9,824
9000 Post Club Member
|
|
OP
9000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 9,824 |
Since I got 100% obviously I believe it has everything to do with musical skill lol! A musical genius!  
across the stone, deathless piano performances "Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano "Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person "Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573
500 Post Club Member
|
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573 |
Pianist, independent music arranger, violinist, mother
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,871
3000 Post Club Member
|
|
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,871 |
But remember, they are only trying to have you decide the most likely choice.
Then we are not wrong, but they are. The logical form of assessment should be: 100% probability, 75% probability, 50% probability, 25% probability; or something like that.
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 9,824
9000 Post Club Member
|
|
OP
9000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 9,824 |
But remember, they are only trying to have you decide the most likely choice. Then we are not wrong, but they are. The logical form of assessment should be: 100% probability, 75% probability, 50% probability, 25% probability; or something like that. It's very possible they are wrong too. Although note that PW members, such as ShyPianist, already seemed successful with the test maker's own mapping. I doubt the test maker is a psychometrician, and I doubt these questions were tested on test subjects for validity. I'd like to think it's the fault of the test maker that I only got 65%, and I am very glad I am in your good company as you are a better musician than I will ever hope to be!
across the stone, deathless piano performances "Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano "Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person "Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573
500 Post Club Member
|
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573 |
But remember, they are only trying to have you decide the most likely choice. Then we are not wrong, but they are. The logical form of assessment should be: 100% probability, 75% probability, 50% probability, 25% probability; or something like that. It's very possible they are wrong too. Although note that PW members, such as ShyPianist, already seemed successful with the test maker's own mapping. I doubt the test maker is a psychometrician, and I doubt these questions were tested on test subjects for validity. I'd like to think it's the fault of the test maker that I only got 65%, and I am very glad I am in your good company as you are a better musician than I will ever hope to be! Remember I did it twice though, because their mapping made no sense at all to me the first time around!
Pianist, independent music arranger, violinist, mother
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,626
5000 Post Club Member
|
|
5000 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 5,626 |
>dumb.com ? Mmmm
And I don't see any test on their page, just an introduction text. No next button or whatever You have to make sure that Adobe Flash is turned on in your browser. This is almost the last hurray for this test. Soon no one will have Flash. Ah that explains, thanks. Flash is arleady on the way out since 2017 https://blog.mozilla.org/futurereleases/2017/07/25/firefox-roadmap-flash-end-life/
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,086
2000 Post Club Member
|
|
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,086 |
Total: 95%
Pitch discrimination: 95.7%
Musical memory: 97%
Contour discrimination: 91.6%
Attention: 92.5%
Musical/visual abstraction: 94.3%
I would say that this test is a combination of musical aptitudes as well as ability to quickly tease apart symbolic abstractions--almost like interpreting a language.
The first part of the test does relate to purely musical skills. Skills like ability to remember phrases, separate out multiple voices, listen to the direction of the change of pitch, and analyze the construction of the phrases at a high level definitely do test some musical ability. Having poor musical ability here would almost certainly make the second part of the test a guessing game.
The second part is about translating that musical understanding and analysis into a symbolic language. It's not so much that the music should be evoking particular visual images but instead that specific elements in the diagrams--the use of the same shape versus different shapes, the use of different colors, and the presence of sloping arrows have attributes that represent different elements of the musical phrases.
That the shape is a triangle or a square or whatever is not directly representative of some sense of what the music should be evoking; rather, the shape is used in a consistent matter to represent something about the structure of the music and that meaning stays consistent across the exercises.
So this *is* a test where you are trying to get into the examiner's head but it is not wholly arbitrary. The test is structured like a primer... it begins with simple exercises that define the 'rules' in a rather isolated fashion and it ends with more complicated exercises that use a combination of rules.
Doing well on the questions in the latter half of the test likely requires that you spent the first part of the test trying to "break a code"
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 3,786
3000 Post Club Member
|
|
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 3,786 |
Okay I'm going to cancel my workday to begin this test....
Steinway A3 Boston 118 PE YouTubeWorking OnChopin Nocturne E min Bach Inventions "You Can Never Have Too Many Dream Pianos" -Thad Carhart
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,765
4000 Post Club Member
|
|
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,765 |
Sorry to say I do not even get the idea behind the test. The selected shapes make no sense to me in relation to music. I could probably figure it out by just guessing myself through the test first, but don't see the point... Like many questions on IQ tests, these are associations. So for example, here is a non-musical association to shapes - that is, instead of shapes, I am using numbers - and I've exactly seen this (or something very close to it) before on IQ-like tests: Is the numeric sequence "2 5 8 5 2" like the shapes /\ or the shape \/ or the shape <> or the shape [] ? In this case, you one would consider the 5 numbers and note that they go up steadily to 8 and come back down the same way, so among the 4 visual shapes, the one that has the closest association would be the shape that also goes up and back down: /\. This is how associations work between two types of objects which might not be immediately related. Obviously, in the case of the test, we are talking musical tones and not numbers, but frankly, tones and numbers map to each other. I think now you might see how sequences of tones might relate to shapes. For example, if you have heard C-D-E-F-G-C-D-E-F-G, and you have a number of shapes to choose from, but one of them is / /, you might choose that one because it shows to identical lines slanting upward like the 'C-D-E-F-G'. On the other hand, you might not be given '/ /' as a choice, but instead one of the choices might be '[] []' Well this might also be a good association. Why? Because 'C-D-E-F-G' repeats twice, just like the '[]' repeats a second time in the shape. Obviously here, you are simply trying to choose one set of shapes which is better than the other choices. One final example: you hear C-D-E-F-G-C-D-E-F-G, but the second 'C-D-E-F-G' gets softer (diminuendo) while the first one stays at the same dynamic. One shape choice is '[] []' and another is '[] |>'. Here, the second one suggests the diminuendo while the first suggests an exact repeat, so you might select the second one instead as a better association than the first. Do you understand how it works now, outo? If you've never seen this sort of thing before, I can completely understand your confusion. I have done enough IQ tests to understand the concept, that was not the issue
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 28,841
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
|
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 28,841 |
I think now you might see how sequences of tones might relate to shapes. For example, if you have heard C-D-E-F-G-C-D-E-F-G, and you have a number of shapes to choose from, but one of them is / /, you might choose that one because it shows to identical lines slanting upward like the 'C-D-E-F-G'. On the other hand, you might not be given '/ /' as a choice, but instead one of the choices might be '[] []' Well this might also be a good association. Why? Because 'C-D-E-F-G' repeats twice, just like the '[]' repeats a second time in the shape. Obviously here, you are simply trying to choose one set of shapes which is better than the other choices. One final example: you hear C-D-E-F-G-C-D-E-F-G, but the second 'C-D-E-F-G' gets softer (diminuendo) while the first one stays at the same dynamic. One shape choice is '[] []' and another is '[] |>'. Here, the second one suggests the diminuendo while the first suggests an exact repeat, so you might select the second one instead as a better association than the first. I cannot view the test, but if it works similarly to you explanation I think it's very flawed. One could hear and remember things very clearly but simply not be able to form the association with the shape which is a separate skill.
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,765
4000 Post Club Member
|
|
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,765 |
But remember, they are only trying to have you decide the most likely choice. Then we are not wrong, but they are. The logical form of assessment should be: 100% probability, 75% probability, 50% probability, 25% probability; or something like that. It's very possible they are wrong too. Although note that PW members, such as ShyPianist, already seemed successful with the test maker's own mapping. I doubt the test maker is a psychometrician, and I doubt these questions were tested on test subjects for validity. I'd like to think it's the fault of the test maker that I only got 65%, and I am very glad I am in your good company as you are a better musician than I will ever hope to be! Remember I did it twice though, because their mapping made no sense at all to me the first time around! Exactly! But unlike you I did not feel like spending any time on it 
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 3,786
3000 Post Club Member
|
|
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 3,786 |
I have done enough IQ tests to understand the concept, that was not the issue That many? What happened, did you fail the first few? Just kidding .
Steinway A3 Boston 118 PE YouTubeWorking OnChopin Nocturne E min Bach Inventions "You Can Never Have Too Many Dream Pianos" -Thad Carhart
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,765
4000 Post Club Member
|
|
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,765 |
I have done enough IQ tests to understand the concept, that was not the issue That many? What happened, did you fail the first few? Just kidding . I probably did Actually as a psychology minor I was used as a guinea pig, it was a requirement for the courses to be available for all sorts of testing. Some of them were quite weird
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573
500 Post Club Member
|
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 573 |
Exactly! But unlike you I did not feel like spending any time on it Having got an A in A level music and done really well in aural tests throughout all my exams, I was not going to be defeated by it ;-)
Pianist, independent music arranger, violinist, mother
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 3,786
3000 Post Club Member
|
|
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 3,786 |
First attempt:
Pitch discrimination: 76.8%
Musical memory 70.6%
Contour discrimination 71.1%
Attention: 74.2%
Musical/visual abstraction: 76.9%
There is a learning curve as to what the symbols are designating. I didn't first understand that the red and black were different voices, and the arrows were pitch, so I got a few wrong in the beginning of the first attempt. Second one was...
Pitch discrimination: 91.3%
Musical memory 90.1%
Contour discrimination 95.2%
Attention: 95.7%
Musical/visual abstraction: 93.9%
Total 95%.
Steinway A3 Boston 118 PE YouTubeWorking OnChopin Nocturne E min Bach Inventions "You Can Never Have Too Many Dream Pianos" -Thad Carhart
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 24,581
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
|
|
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 24,581 |
This was on a first attempt, not initially sure of what I was doing:
Total score; 80%
Pitch discrimination: 76.8%
Musical memory: 79%
Contour discrimination: 79.5%
Attention: 78.5%
Musical/Visual abstraction: 78.5%
Regards,
Last edited by BruceD; 05/01/19 12:35 PM.
BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190
|
|
|
Re: The Musical Visual Intelligence Test
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 17,298
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
|
|
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 17,298 |
Total Score: 100%
Pitch discrimination: 100.0%
Musical memory: 100.0%
Contour discrimination: 95.2%
Attention: 97.8%
Musical/visual abstraction: 100.0%
I also had trouble the first time I did it because I had no idea what I was looking at. So I did 2 and then figured out what they were getting at, then restarted the whole thing. I can see how it test aural skills, and then you have to figure out how the picture may represent that sound. But strictly aural skills, I think.
There much more to musical intelligence than aural skills, so I think the test is valid for that very narrow aspect of musical ability.
private piano/voice teacher FT ![[Linked Image]](http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/gallery/42/thumbs/2529.jpg) ![[Linked Image]](http://forum.pianoworld.com//gallery/42/medium/9342.png)
|
|
|
|
Forums42
Topics204,277
Posts3,047,093
Members100,069
| |
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
![[Linked Image]](http://www.pianoworld.com/Uploads/files/RedDotMedalSmall.jpg)
