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Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? #2842368
04/25/19 03:26 PM
04/25/19 03:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 131
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SuzyUpright Offline OP
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SuzyUpright  Offline OP
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Hey folks smile
I have a RCM book from 1955 containing pieces from the syllabus at the existing time ( grade IX ).
My teacher has asked me to give the Six Ecossaises a try so I've been listening to a few recordings....strangely, there's a whole other section in my book that isn't included in any of the recordings I've heard, or any other scores I looked at either!
The section is still in Eb, with similarities to the rest of the piece, but written almost totally in the treble ( allegretto ).

What is this mystery Seventh Ecossaises?? Inquiring minds must know! smile

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Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842378
04/25/19 03:52 PM
04/25/19 03:52 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 22,605
Victoria, BC
BruceD Offline
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BruceD  Offline
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Victoria, BC
SU:

There is a seventh Ecossaise, it's a WoO (Werk ohne Opus), in E-flat available on IMSLP. Here is a link:

Beethoven Ecossaise in E-flat

Regards,


BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190
Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842379
04/25/19 03:56 PM
04/25/19 03:56 PM
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SuzyUpright Offline OP
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Thanks for the reply Bruce, unfortunately that's not it though...
I'll see if I can post a pic of the extra page

Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842384
04/25/19 04:04 PM
04/25/19 04:04 PM
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SuzyUpright Offline OP
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Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842501
04/26/19 12:01 AM
04/26/19 12:01 AM
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 233
Canada
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LXXXVIIIdentes Offline
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LXXXVIIIdentes  Offline
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My Beethoven-Busoni copy of this piece has the same last page - definitely seven little pieces in total in it, according to the double bar lines. I always thought of it as a theme and variations. It's charming, amusing and clever.

It's not at all like the link that Bruce shows. The whole music score fits into four pages.

It is titled:
Ecossaissen
fur Pianoforte
von
Ludwig van Beethoven

Fur den Konzertvortrag bearbeitet und Fraulein GERDA SJOSTRAND
zugeelgnet von
Ferruccio B. Busoni

(Breitkopf & Hartel, Wiesbaden, Germany)

If anyone wants a PDF copy, PM me.

Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842505
04/26/19 12:16 AM
04/26/19 12:16 AM
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 233
Canada
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LXXXVIIIdentes Offline
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LXXXVIIIdentes  Offline
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Canada
Aha - just found "my" version on IMSLP- it's in the arrangements listing, not the original page. Posted in 2009.
(It's not a duet, as the "two hands" reference might imply. It does need one player with two hands to play it although it is not hard!)

Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842530
04/26/19 04:08 AM
04/26/19 04:08 AM
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SuzyUpright Offline OP
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Thank you LXXXVIIIdentes! That is the same section...
After reading your post, I counted the bar lines in my 65 year old copy ( RCM of Toronto), and they omitted the usual second bar line...so the piece actually still shows as six.

I find it charming and clever too....but a challenge for me at my level. I'm happy to be giving it a go, it will be one of the last pieces I'll get to do under a teachers guidance for quite a while.

So the question remains...why is there a discrepancy in the length of this piece? It doesn't seem it be the norm to perform it with the 'extra section', but it definitely seems like it belongs as part of the score! How do changes like this happen? It makes me wonder what gets lost over many decades ( before the digital age occurred )

Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842546
04/26/19 05:38 AM
04/26/19 05:38 AM
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Posts: 362
Germany
Pianist685 Offline
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As far as I remember, Monica Alianello has posted a recording of this version with the additional page on www.pianosociety.com I do not know where this last page comes from, I only have the impression that some editor added it as a sort of coda in order to provide an elaborated ending to the bunch of six. It is not a seventh ecossaise but rather a reprise of #1 in the treble section followed by the "refrain" with some slight changes in the left hand and a concluding repetition of the last figure (which cannot be seen on your scan). You can play either version, even if that last page should not be by Beethoven himself. Such a small concluding section is okay and probably makes the composition better... IMHO, there are so many other pieces by Beethoven that are worth playing, these Ecossaises only have one advantage: they are not that difficult. But I do not really like them, although I have recorded them for the IMSLP. After having posted my recording I liked them even less and have not played them any more since...

Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842551
04/26/19 05:59 AM
04/26/19 05:59 AM
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SuzyUpright Offline OP
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Thanks for your reply Pianist685.....yes my pic was cut off when uploaded, but LXXXVIII's direction to IMSLP shows the score.
Your explanation makes sense to me....I'll probably include the extra bit, I like my piano's treble smile

I'm sure there are many other worthy Beethoven pieces...but what's easy for some, can be challenging for others....so I'm doing whats accessible to me at the moment. I love recommendations though, so feel free!

Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842646
04/26/19 11:55 AM
04/26/19 11:55 AM
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Posts: 233
Canada
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LXXXVIIIdentes Offline
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LXXXVIIIdentes  Offline
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Canada
Hi again Suzy

Yes, there are some challenges in this piece, but you did post in the Beginners forum. smile (RCM Grade IX is much higher than an Alfred Books entrance level.) Refreshingly, the Ecossaises challenges come in little bite-size bursts which does encourage mastery of new skills for a budding pianist. It is a good piece for teachers to know about when seeking something to inspire a student.

This version is arranged by Busoni, and I find it very close on the whole in content and spirit to the original Beethoven. I am fond of many of Busoni's transcriptions/arrangements of other composers as well, many of which are very difficult, and performed widely by professionals. Busoni knows when to elaborate, and when to allow the original to speak for itself.

On that second IMSLP page, readers can find versions done by other arrangers, not just by Busoni.

Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: LXXXVIIIdentes] #2842660
04/26/19 12:42 PM
04/26/19 12:42 PM
Joined: Mar 2014
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SuzyUpright Offline OP
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Thank you for sharing that insight LXXXVIII....I'm only a handful of years into piano and classical music, so I've barely scratched the surface on all that's out there, and things to learn. I'll keep my eye out for Busoni...

Yes I added the information about the grade of the book in case it made a difference to my query....I've never done a grade IX piece, most of my pieces have been grade 4/5. This piece doesn't seem like a grade IX level at all to me. I'm not familiar with the RCM selection lists, but it was on the D list if that matters....maybe those are easier selections?

Thanks again for your thoughtful reply

Last edited by SuzyUpright; 04/26/19 12:46 PM.
Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842681
04/26/19 02:20 PM
04/26/19 02:20 PM
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Posts: 233
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LXXXVIIIdentes Offline
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Posts: 233
Canada
I'm not sure why the piece was placed in the RCM D selections. Back then it tended to include a variety of "for fun" pieces, just not the A, B, C requirements of a time period. It would be easy to play the piece for an exam without repeats.

I found these performances on Youtube:

Alfred Brendel - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5QwGEGxR24

Dr Huckleberry - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeQmsmpQ7HY More reasonable speed for a student

Busoni himself? 1922 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gehU9gJQng8 Really fast! Not his own published ending? Interesting discussion of the origins of the piece included in heading by poster

Wilhelm Kempff - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlEnAhfgbNk Adds a couple of chords to start

Carl Reineke - 1905 performance - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuyfYfPt4sw Includes a fancy ending Is this his 1897 version on IMSLP?

Evgeny Kissin - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1ne-ds40-k

Re: Beethoven Six Ecossaises extra section? [Re: SuzyUpright] #2842707
04/26/19 04:10 PM
04/26/19 04:10 PM
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SuzyUpright Offline OP
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They are all so different! I like the fancy ending on the Reineke one...thanks for the inspiration smile


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