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Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
#2842043 04/24/19 07:43 PM
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So,,,,

Q1: Why is it that there are so many headphone threads? Yes, many like headphones, but there has to be more than this going on.

QB: Why don't keyboard makers talk about how great their headphone amps sound?

Q3: Why is imported beer so expensive?

Ideas?

Peace
Bruce in Philly


Peace
Bruce in Philly
Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842048 04/24/19 08:03 PM
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Once I get my acoustic upright, I will care no more about headphones.

Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842063 04/24/19 08:43 PM
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When I purchased my Roland V-Grand, I just went with the headphones that were recommended for it. As I recall, they cost about $100 and are Samsung somethingorother. They sounded fine to me then, and they still do. It just wasn't an issue for me. I can certainly understand if other folks are more particular and need are looking for a certain sound.

Tony


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Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842119 04/25/19 12:07 AM
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Q1 because for some of us, headphones are all we got. Sensitive neighbors/crappily insulated walls and all that jazz.
Q2 I think Kawai did once with the funky Onkyo collaboration (CA 98?) but in general most DP makers rather speak about them speakers.
Q3 All of these poisonous ethanol tainted beverages are absurdly expensive compared to plain drinking water. No clue why people buy that crap anyway. *shrugs*


The backbone of modern industrial society is, and for the foreseeable future will be, the use of electrical Power.
VPC 1 -> Pianoteq 6 Std | Garritan CFX / Pearl Alto Flute 201
Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842123 04/25/19 12:46 AM
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+1 for water!


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Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842126 04/25/19 01:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Bruce In Philly
Q1: Why is it that there are so many headphone threads? Yes, many like headphones, but there has to be more than this going on.

I care about headphones because I usually practice piano between 2am and 4am because I'm very busy during the day. For example, it's past 1am right now and I have not even gotten to touch my piano yet today.

Under such circumstances, and living in a multi-occupancy building, I would be a bad neighbor indeed, if I tried to play an acoustic or even a DP with speaker turned low. You can imagine what one of my neighbors might think of my scales at 3am, even if I turned the speaker to a very low volume. I'd definitely be getting a visit from the police...


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Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842133 04/25/19 02:14 AM
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I try not to bother other people with my piano playing unless they are in the mood for it.
There are significant differences between headphones in terms open/closed, over ear or on ear, sound-wise, weight, size, aesthetics, price, value. all something you wear on your head, a rather important body-part. So unsurprisingly people care.

Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
John Road #2842141 04/25/19 03:03 AM
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Originally Posted by John Road
I try not to bother other people with my piano playing unless they are in the mood for it.

I agree that headphones make for good neighbors!

A few years ago, I had an upstairs neighbor, a young lawyer, who apparently would only listen to techno at home. He didn't turn it very loud, but the bass vibrations would make it through his floor into my apartment. The music was so rhythmic and repetitive it drove me batty and I ended up wearing a pair of noise-cancelling close-backed headphones even when not listening to music just to get rid of the low level rhythmic noisemusic. I would have been so happy if he had used headphones to listen to his noisemusic!


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across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
TonyB #2842197 04/25/19 06:10 AM
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Originally Posted by TonyB
When I purchased my Roland V-Grand, I just went with the headphones that were recommended for it. As I recall, they cost about $100 and are Samsung somethingorother. They sounded fine to me then, and they still do. It just wasn't an issue for me. I can certainly understand if other folks are more particular and need are looking for a certain sound.

Tony



I’ve tried the Samsung Somethingorother, and they’re okay; but the Sony Thisorthat are superb headphones, and they make a special version for people with headphone allergies.

Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842200 04/25/19 06:17 AM
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Why headphones? Perhaps it's because private listening is one of the reasons people buy digital pianos.

Why do many threads about headphones? It might be that people start threads here seeking advice ... because it's difficult to find phones in the shops that you can actually try out.
There are exceptions (such as the GC nearby that has over a dozen models on active display).

But there are too many core cases, like the GC I visited when I lived in Florida.
They had only a couple of no-name phones on display, while all the good merchandise was locked up behind the counter.
Originally Posted by Bruce In Philly
Why is it that there are so many headphone threads? Yes, many like headphones, but there has to be more than this going on.

Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842210 04/25/19 07:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Bruce In Philly
So,,,,

Q1: Why is it that there are so many headphone threads? Yes, many like headphones, but there has to be more than this going on.

QB: Why don't keyboard makers talk about how great their headphone amps sound?

Q3: Why is imported beer so expensive?

Ideas?

Peace
Bruce in Philly


Q3 - A - Import duty ?
QB - They don't talk about headphone amps do they... I am of the opinion that if you spend more than £1000 on a piano, you should get a high-end amp included (enough to power a 300 ohm set of cans).
Q1 - There are many threads about headphones, what piano should I buy, what piano has the best action for $X, what beginner piano should I buy etc....I am of the opinion that not enough people use MacMacMac's thread search tool (probably because they don't know it exists).

Headphone threads are also one of those things people can't easily test in a music store, as not many stores stock the best headphones for digital pianos.


Instruments: Current - Kawai MP7SE; Past - Kawai MP7, Yamaha PSR7000
Software: Sibelius 7; Neuratron Photoscore Pro 8
Stand: K&M 18953 Table-style Stage Piano Stand
Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842220 04/25/19 07:33 AM
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For me ... I don't care about headphones. I just happen to use them when I need to.

Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842227 04/25/19 08:02 AM
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Everything has already been said. But not everyone has said it yet, so:

Q1: Because it really makes a difference. DPs (and VSTs) may sound pretty bad with "bad" headphones that might be perfectly adequate for general music listening. Even "bad" DPs may sound better with better -- or more suitable -- headphones. And of course one reason to have a DP is to play it via headphones.

QB: Probably there isn't much to talk about. They are "good enough" for most users, but probably nothing remarkable.

Q3: Why's American beer so bad? Or is it? laugh

Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Doug M. #2842311 04/25/19 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Doug M.
QB - They don't talk about headphone amps do they... I am of the opinion that if you spend more than £1000 on a piano, you should get a high-end amp included (enough to power a 300 ohm set of cans).

Careful, high end HP amps will cost you something north of that piano. laugh

Before I'd splurge on an amp or DAC I'd get an awesomesauce headphone first THEN buy an amp that fits the cans if they even need further amping.

For example, I drive my Focal Clear Pro (55Ω) directly with my Titanium HD (audiophile oriented soundcard).
Everything beyond 25% output value is uncomfortably loud, so no need for further power. (Yes I know, the audiophile world would stone me to death for driving a 1500€ can with a friggin 150€ soundcard ^_^ )

Even my 250Ω DT-880 get plenty loud to damage my hearing.


The backbone of modern industrial society is, and for the foreseeable future will be, the use of electrical Power.
VPC 1 -> Pianoteq 6 Std | Garritan CFX / Pearl Alto Flute 201
Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842318 04/25/19 12:36 PM
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Q1: Like most others here, without headphones I would likely not play too much. Do not want to inflict scales and piece practice repetitions on others, whatever time of day! In my own world with headphones until ready to play on speakers to hopefully get a happy, emotional, and supportive response from any listeners. ; )

Q2: Roland does give their headphone output some time. And it does sound really good (LX705), even better than speakers which I am still working on. Here is the Roland marketing quote:
"Headphones Acoustic Projection for immersive and realistic playing experience when practicing on headphones." Certainly immersive and wonderful stereo spacing.

Q3: Prices high only cos people pay the price. Stop buying/drinking the stuff. And that goes for any bottled water product beyond basic, cheap mineral waters. smile

Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Granyala #2842319 04/25/19 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Granyala
directly with my Titanium HD (audiophile oriented soundcard).
Everything beyond 25% output value is uncomfortably loud, so no need for further power. (Yes I know, the audiophile world would stone me to death for driving a 1500€ can with a friggin 150€ soundcard ^_^ )

Cool. I have something similar: the X7 Limited Edition. In the next several months, I'm intending to upgrade myself to a different DAC though after I take care of my piano upgrade and will probably sell this one.


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across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Tyrone Slothrop #2842322 04/25/19 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Cool. I have something similar: the X7 Limited Edition.

Looks cute laugh
What do you hope to gain from another DAC?
Personally the only reason why I am contemplating an upgrade is the fact that the card is 9 years old and out of support, so it's only a matter of time till driver shenanigans force me to change it out. frown


The backbone of modern industrial society is, and for the foreseeable future will be, the use of electrical Power.
VPC 1 -> Pianoteq 6 Std | Garritan CFX / Pearl Alto Flute 201
Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Bruce In Philly #2842324 04/25/19 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Bruce In Philly
QB: Why don't keyboard makers talk about how great their headphone amps sound?

Piano manufacturers know that a terrific headphone amp costs $0.90. That's the price of a good opamp that most probably won't sound any different than a $5000 audiophile amp to a regular piano player. It would be very hard for manufacturers to convince regular piano buyers that a piano that costs $2000, should suddenly become $7000 because it contains an expensive headphone amp. I mean, the audiophile crowd and the piano buyer crowd are IMO not the same smile No offense.

Last edited by CyberGene; 04/25/19 01:03 PM.

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Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Tyrone Slothrop #2842327 04/25/19 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Originally Posted by John Road
I try not to bother other people with my piano playing unless they are in the mood for it.

I agree that headphones make for good neighbors!

A few years ago, I had an upstairs neighbor, a young lawyer, who apparently would only listen to techno at home. He didn't turn it very loud, but the bass vibrations would make it through his floor into my apartment. The music was so rhythmic and repetitive it drove me batty and I ended up wearing a pair of noise-cancelling close-backed headphones even when not listening to music just to get rid of the low level rhythmic noisemusic. I would have been so happy if he had used headphones to listen to his noisemusic!


It should be a simple matter for you Technies to rig up a response mechanism designed to shake his flat and everything in it whenever those low rumbles started up . . . The mind boggles as to what form this could take! It could be designed to make him think his stuff was responsible, which in a sense would be true. It'd drive him crazy trying to find out ha ha (Well, gotta be better than ending up before the beak on GBH . . . .)

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Re: Headphones - Why? Why SO SO many care?
Tyrone Slothrop #2842348 04/25/19 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

A few years ago, I had an upstairs neighbor, a young lawyer, who apparently would only listen to techno at home. He didn't turn it very loud, but the bass vibrations would make it through his floor into my apartment. The music was so rhythmic and repetitive it drove me batty and I ended up wearing a pair of noise-cancelling close-backed headphonesc!


So, use that as a freebie metronome -- just play something at the same tempo. I did that when I lived on the Venice Beach Boardwalk and the Hare Krishnas would park outside my window and jingle all day long.


-- J.S.

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