Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Forum Why do people not favor uprights??

You are wise, Lady Bird. I've heard some people brag a lot about how well they can play a piano. When I actually heard them play, I was rather disappointed. Not that I can play all that well myself. But if you are going to lift yourself up on a pedestal of piano playing greatness, there needs to be some evidence or demonstration to justify all the boasting. Of course, there is a great deal of individual subjectivity when it comes to listening to others play and accessing or judging how well they can play a piano, or not.

Also, there is something else I've learned over the years. You don't have to play extremely well or achieve musical perfection in order for others to enjoy your musical performance. Presentation and persona can be just as important as musical coherence.

Oh yea, while I'm on a roll here, no matter how well someone can play a piano, there is someone else who can play a lot better. For some reason, this conversation reminds me of a song written by Charlie Daniels about a fiddle player... "Devil went down to Georgia"

Sorry for the OT... or is it really OT?

Rick

I am just being my over defensive self Rickster, I go through these times ?
This thread has been like a roller-coaster, so many things have been said.(by me as well which I am sorry for ) and just when I
think it's going to fizzle out.........
It really is time for me to run away from it.
What does OT stand for? I have not listened to the song yet ,but I will
Thank you.


..

OT = Off topic.
Not really related to the subject of a discussion thread.

Don't know if you are referring to computerpro3 since this is trailing back to his post, but his performance on a Kawai Novus NV10 hybrid with a VST, recorded for the ABF recital is here.

Forums are a strange beast. We can sometimes feel good and safe as we read posts but also feel insulted and offended by a few potent words in a reply. Adding a comment to a thread is slower and requires a bit more thought than it does on Facebook or Twitter and I try to use the extra time to stay calm, relaxed, and learn from PW forums. As a member here for a few years I’ve learned (and this has been more than a little difficult) not to get defensive about which piano resides in my home. The very fact that we have a home, an acoustic and/or digital pianos, that we can hear, enjoy, and play to whatever proficiency these instruments, tempers all my piano inadequacies and piano playing deficiencies. On Piano World, we all share something we all love and should be able to read different opinions, even if it’s tough to listen to. There’s always that one friend that when you show them your new car or SUV, just has to say something about it’s low rating on Consumer Reports or “why didn’t you get a real truck instead of that?” “Why didn’t you buy a good piano like a Steinway?” “You had room for a bigger piano in this room, why didn’t you get a bigger one?”
Truthfully it brings me down and I don’t have snappy comebacks in the moment. By reading and participating on PW forums, I’m able to be happy with the many blessings I’ve received and feel good because I’m able to enjoy this hobby fully.

+1

Excellent post, j&j! Made my day!

I certainly can't add anything to your comments above, and, you are so right. Sometimes these threads on PW can morph into "my piano is better than yours", or "I can play better than you". Yet, and still, these threads on the PW forums are not quite as hostile as they used to be, and that's a good thing.

All the best!

Rick

I am, I think as every person on PW knows very happy with my piano.Yes I am oversentive about it being a Sauter upright because there was a great deal of controversy about the past distributor.I was in the process of buying the piano when there was a thread which seemed more like a war.For some reason I almost felt it involved me !
After that there was little said about on PM about Sauter until I arrived.
As for quality of piano playing .I only try and practice an hour a day(if that) So my playing is certainly not up to much anymore !
It is for my husband ,my dog and the goldfish.(that's enough !)
But yes one cannot not deny that this has not been the most sensitive of threads especially when it comes to descriptions even of appearance or apparent lack of worth of upright accoustic pianos.
At one point I lost my temper and denigrated digital pianos.So I am sorry about that.
Yes the point of being thankful should be taken but I think that applies to everyone weather you own a Sauter ,Yamaha,Steinways, Essex,Roland , Bluthner ,Avant Grand, Casio or Kawai.To everyone,enjoy your pianos and especially your playing.

Norbert, a long-time PW member/piano dealer owns a Sauter upright piano. He used to be a Sauter dealer. I saw a video he sent me of him playing the Sauter upright and it sounded superb! Had a nice low bass. And he can play the "Boogie-Woogie" quite well!

So, you see, we can and do develop an appreciation and respect for other members here who may own a different piano than us or play a different kind of music. Diversity is a good thing...

Rick

I have just received a message from Norbert, as I sent him a message. I think we respect each other very well! I have heard him play and yes he plays very well .I may be a bit Fugual in my approach to music but that was my training.
Yes and I think we should respect each others pianos and not try and make them"lesser" or cheapen them in any way because despite what you say I have seen that happen ! You are a kind person and would not ,from what I have seen do that.

Have I been critical of someone's piano playing ???
Please tell me !!?

The internet can bring out the best and the worst of us, but we are all in the same boat and I think at times we get upset but that helps us to understand when others do as well. And, heaven forfend, we sometimes go OTT in our comments.
I'm currently a Casio player 'by default' (it was bought as a portable keyboard to take on holiday many years ago when I had extra money) because my ancient Amyl acoustic (described dismissively as 'noisy furniture' on one site by some 'expert' or other - humph, idiot!) really seems to be at the end of its life and I will miss it badly, so at times the 'Casio comments' get to me - but really, people have different views and have their reasons for them. We can't all always agree and none of us is perfect (OK, a bit trite), but we can appreciate (and enjoy) the diversity of opinions.
Your last point is so apposite (used a 'clever' word there......) and to me the most important aspect of the whole discussion. To me it's about making and enjoying music.
I always appreciate your posts, btw., and no, I don't have an audience except my wife. No dog or goldfish, though.

Hey, I have a Casio digital piano too! (Privia PX310)

I like it a lot, and play it often. In fact, I'm surprised it has held up as well as it has between my grandchildren and me pounding on it. That said, I'm quite impressed with it.

As far as playing for an audience, I had the privilege of playing in front of about 3000 people at a large Church several years ago. Since I play mostly by ear, hence, muscle memory, I got distracted due to tremendous stage freight, sitting next to other professional musicians, and looking up at the huge TV broadcast monitor showing me close-up and personal, I messed up, big-time, during my performance. However, I did learn a very important lesson when it comes to performing music in public... the art of recovery.

Back to your comments, I liked this the best "To me it's about making and enjoying music". That indeed transcends whether we play a digital, hybrid, upright or grand...

Rick

There is a difference between playing "well" and having good technique.

I was speaking rather narrowly as to stick to the topic of the thread. There are tons of pianists in this world who have incredible technique, but I think their playing stinks for musical reasons. But from a technical standpoint, they are much more qualified to speak to the qualities of an upright vs. a digital vs. a digital hybrid than someone whose playing I immensely enjoy, but plays simpler repertoire that does not push the technical limitations of their instrument.

I can play a slow bach prelude and fugue that doesn't have much ornamentation musically and equally well on an upright, digital, or hybrid digital. I can't play a Rachmaninov concerto equally well on an upright and a hybrid digital due to the action limitations on an upright. To me, the purpose of a piano is a tool that I can make music on.

Thus, the very simple answer of why anyone would choose a digital hybrid over an upright for the same money is: because personally, I can make better music on a digital hybrid than I can on an upright due to the far superior action.

Thank you!
I appreciate your post. Yes calling your accoustic upright " noisy furniture "is the kind of weird comments that sometimes appear on
PW and it is unfortunate because many older uprights maintain thier charm for many years .I am glad you love playing your Casio piano.
I often play my digital piano in the late evenings when I do not want to disturb anyone.So we shall carry on making music---war or no war
on PW !!! (Just joking ! )

I just can’t stop thinking about this post. When it was mentioned that Norbert has a big beautiful sounding Sauter upright, I was wondering if it’s just that big beautiful German uprights that sound fabulous are something of a niche market. When I look at the prices of those tall Sauter’s it makes me wonder if the average piano customer immediately moves over to look at the grands. Of course Norbert would know. I’ve shopped for pianos and played other people’s pianos but I’ve never seen or had the opportunity to play anything better in an acoustic upright than a YUS1 or a similar Kawai upright (can’t remember the models). I certainly wasn’t even thinking of handmade ? German uprights when I was writing about why I prefer grands.

Well, since this thread seems to keep going on and on and on, like the Energizer Bunny Rabbit, ( ) I'll join in once again...

Chances are, Norbert got a good discount on his Sauter upright, being a dealer and all. But I'm just speculating. That could have been one incentive for him to choose his Sauter upright piano over something else.

My experience with acoustic pianos, both uprights and grands, is very limited. That said, I do have an older Kawai K48A upright piano in my living room that I like a lot. Being a 1969 model, although probably one of the most expensive of Kawai's upright pianos at the time, it does have some wear and has had some of the "goodie" played out of it. But it still retains a fairly high level of quality playability as a musical instrument. I enjoy playing it a lot and play it often.

But if I had to choose only one piano that I currently own, it would be my Yamaha C7 semi-concert grand. And, like the Kawai upright, even though it has some wear, being a 1978 model in mostly original condition, it is still a fabulous musical instrument in my opinion. I just played it a few minutes ago, and enjoyed it immensely.

People choose an upright over a grand (or a digital/hybrid) for various reasons. Personally, I would not criticize someone for choosing an upright over a grand; it is a personal choice. There are lots of reasons that I can think of why someone would choose a very expensive upright over a similarly priced grand. It is an individual decision.

Why do people not favor uprights? That can only be answered by those who do not favor uprights. I would suggest buying the piano you like best and live and let live, instead of trying to convince someone they should have made a different choice for whatever reason.

Just my .02 that keeps adding up but doesn't increase beyond .02 .00.

Rick

I can hear the greater richness of the German uprights when they’re compared to Yamaha uprights in YouTube videos.

How much does it have to do with voicing the piano? Can a Yamaha YUS5 be made to sound like a German upright?

I understand the prices of all these German uprights are rather high.
Many may prefer a grand. Just enjoy your piano.I have tried a Yamaha C3 and it was wonderful ! At this stage in life I did not
want to be tied to a grand.As it is this upright is just so large it
scares me a little.But my Kawai grand was somehow irreplaceable
being an early gift from my parents who passed away just a few
months before I turned 20.So this upright whose tone we loved
became ours instead of a YUS5.
The Kawai was bought from us and has a knew life I believe and
has been restrung and repaired so that gives me joy.
At times when things are too much I just imagine that Kawai
being played by someone and that's enough !

The Yamaha YUS5 I tried in a store had very a mellow sound.I know they have German strings and very nice grand piano hammers.It was similar to a European tone.I was at that time trying out quite few German uprights.So it is a good alternative.

Rickster,
Yes you have a barrel load of cents already, it is all adding up !
I am just not sure where they keep your money on this thread ?
Thank you for your last post. As you say there are a whole number
of reasons why people buy an upright after a grand.
Your C7 sounds like a lovely piano!