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The Musikmesse is a small/medium size event compared to other events that take place in the same location. So, if someone decided not to participate it was not because exhibition space was lacking. I do not know if established acoustic piano brands were regular participants in the past, but, due to the lack of such exhibitors, most instruments on display were mainly on the lower end of the spectrum. The scenario in the keyboard/digital pianos section was most depressing. There were plenty of exhibitors, but the majority were low quality products from dubious brands (like this one or this - these two had dozens of products on display). Above all, I don't have an explanation why the "big" keyboard/DP brands were not represented. I understand that the acoustic piano market, especially its upper tier, works in a different way. But, I was expecting to have plenty of mid- and high-range digital pianos and keyboards on display. As a result of this decision, the piano and keyboard area was in stark contrast to the rest of the event, where fine instruments were being showcased. There was also no lack of representation in the music book section, with all the big music editors there, along notation software and electronic music reading companies. So, if I had skipped entirely the keyboard area, I would have said that the event targets serious amateurs and concert/band players. I hope that next year they at least move the historic piano builders away from the shabby keyboard section.

Hello arc7urus, thank you for sharing your recent visit.



I was not expecting any Kawai area to be open to the public. Presumably this was outside of Kawai's dealer booth?



With headphones connected?



I will have to double-check the reason, however I believe this might be because the business area is required to be quiet.

Kind regards
James
x

I was planning on buying a GVIDO myself after I upgrade my piano. Can you elaborate on your comment about it being way too slow for annotations? What were you trying to do and what was it doing, or not doing, in response?

Just had a gig with the Kawai ES8 and I have to say that it sounded fantastic and the action was fantastic. Stick that action in a Nord and it makes me want to have a Nord as well! Congrats Nord - this was your weak point - Fatar - forget Fatar!

Toy manufacturers pay to exhibit, so they are allowed on the Messe. Most piano makers of the last centuries do not exist anymore, so they cannot go there. Conclusion: Piano is dead, toy keyboard replaced it, guitar is still doing well.

Joe, are you suggesting that "non-toy manufacturers" (whatever that means...) do not pay a fee to exhibit at Musikmesse?

Kind regards,
James
x

Kawai had a booth with walls around it. The dealer's area was inside the booth. The public area was around the booth. SKs acoustics were along one of the walls, the hybrid/DPs along another wall. The entrance to the dealer's area was between the CAs and the Aures.


Well, I tried to play the Aures and the NV10 without headphones but it was impossible since the whole area was extremely loud. I could not hear half of what I tried to play on a concert grand that was on display


Noise was probably not the reason Kawai's booth, along with the business area, was right in the middle of exhibition area. You had a few guys jamming with drums and other instruments a few meters away and dozens of people banging on the pianos. Yamaha and a few other brands were on the 4th floor, in the seminar and lounge area. I attended a seminar there and that area was quiet, but there were no instruments on display on that area.

Anyway, I was happy that Kawai was on the show! At least, a few visitors could test how a proper digital piano should feel - I say feel, because you could not hear anything

arc7urus, thanks for the additional info!

In previous years, Kawai has had a public booth in one of the main halls (which can get rather noisy), and a dealer booth in one of the business halls (which is usually very quite by comparison) - as I say, Musikmesse is very different this year.

Actually, I thought the exhibition was for business visitors only (not members of the general public) - may I ask how you were able to attend?

I'll try to find out why the Kawai grand pianos were unable to be played.

Kind regards,
James
x

Something a little bit more about keyboard action from another forum:

Kawai America HQ in California said: "The Kawai key action used in the Nord Grand is a plastic hammer key action developed specifically for Nord designated RH-N."

I presume that RH-N will be a RHIII with more plastic mechanism parts inside the keyboard, what in result will give lighter weight this instrument (important target of Nord) and a little bit a lighter keyboard action than RHIII but a little bit heavier and more controllable than Fatar.

Musikmesse 2019 was open to the general public the whole time in my impression. But I wasn't there.

Yes, that setup would make more sense. Btw, can you elaborate on those differences? Do you have any idea why so few known brands were exhibiting at the pianos & keyboards section?


From what I understood, only the "dealer booths" were not accessible to the general public. I visited with a friend who is a professional player and got tickets from the orchestra he works with. Anyway, I did not notice any restrictions. I bought a couple of music books and was asked by the seller if I was a business or private visitor. The people attending concerts and shows also had full access to the exhibition areas. The website also says that in 2018 they 72% trade visitors and 28% private visitors.

Well, to be honest, an exhibition hall is not the place to assess how a piano sounds, regardless of their quality and craftsmanship. But other exhibitors in the show (not in the piano area) had glass panes around their testing areas that managed to reduce the noise quite well. Imo, it would be much better to have GL/GX pianos that the visitors could freely play than locked up SKs. And right in front of Kawai's stand, Petrof had concert grands pianos that could be played...

arc7urus, what is the GVIDO annotation issue you mentioned above?

https://www.gvidomusic.com/

The GVIDO It is a dual screen, A4-sized, e-ink reader, featuring annotation and organization software to work with music scores. It is impressive in terms of readability as any e-ink reader such as the Kindle. The discount price at the Messe was 1700 EUR

The annotations are very slow and jerky as expected from such a display. After you write something there is no immediate feedback. It is similar as making annotations on a Kindle. For the price, I expected they had some better technology for this, but it reacts as any other e-ink screen. But for reading it is amazing. You can see an example of how annotations work here (starting around 5m45s): https://youtu.be/4dfL9Gz41S0?t=342

So say you are compare with a pair of iPad Pros (although I don't know if Forscore even supports a pair of linked iPad Pros in left-page-right-page format!), would you say a pair of iPad Pros running Forscore would be more usable than a GVIDO?

Indeed, that annotation speed doesn't seem very good. Would be very awkward to make annotations with, I think...

But I have another question:

Why have two pages, i.e. two screens?

The product could be much cheaper with only a single screen, which also would have the advantage that you could have it centered in front of you (now you have two pages that are both off center, the prime real estate right in front of you is used for margins and bevels, and the information you are looking for is offset to the sides).
I understand why double pages make sense with a paper book, but I don't understand it with a tablet type device. Especially not since it increases the price considerably.

TBH, it seems like an anachronism that is carried over from paper score books, without reflection of if it even still makes sense with the new technology.
Or maybe it is a deliberate skeuomorph design to attract people who are on the fence about using a tablet? Similar to how the first iOS versions had controls that mimicked real life buttons, sliders, dials, etc. to win over users who, at that time, were not yet used to touch screen UIs. An approach that was then dropped starting with iOS 7, when touch UIs had become commonplace and those skeuomorphs were no longer needed...

I like being able to look at the next measure while still playing the last measures on the previous page. Allows me to get ready for those next measures without having to remember either the last measures of the previous page or the first measures of the next page. Not that this is a big problem for me though, but it's just a nice-to-have thing.

Seems like some off-topic wanderings about e-readers might make this new topic harder to find in the future. There are lots of informative posts available on readers for music scores you might want to check out, e.g...

http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/2801399

... and others.

I have the same preference, actually.
But do you know about the half page turn feature in Forscore, Mobilesheets, etc.? That allows for the same thing, but with a single screen.
When you tap the page turn pedal, only the top half of the page is turned, so the lower half remains on the previous page. So you can play to the end of the page and then just move your eyes to the top where the beginning of the next page is already shown. Then a bit later you tap the pedal again to turn the lower half of the page too. The advantage is, as you say, that you don't have to memorize the measures around the page turn, as they are always on screen at the same time. And you don't have to tap the pedal exactly at the end of the page (when it may be inconvenient if you are busy playing some difficult). You can tap the pedal at any convenient moment while on the second half of the page (for example during a rest) and then again during a convenient moment on the first half of the next page.

I can think two reasons to have a two-page tablet. First, for some people who have played for decades looking for two or more pages in sequence it may feel odd to look always for the same "page" up <-> down. Something like GVIDO may give the feeling of reading a paper book. Second, with a two-page display we can anticipate the next page. These are two reasons that only a small number of people can find value, but I think a product like GVIDO is designed precisely for a very narrow market niche and with certain special needs.

Maybe there is a third and fundamental reason for having two pages: style, especially if it is a very expensive product.

I agree with JoBert. If they sold a one page model, they could price it at less than a iPad Pro. Which could increase sales. The accessories are also overpriced compared to the competition. It is elegant though with the leather cover.