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Agreed. As much weight as we think the action itself matters, I think in reality a lot of it has to do with the supporting material--they frame and keybed needed to keep the action frame stiff and solid-feeling.

The 73-key P-121 is 22lb, compared to 26lb for the 88-key P-125. OTOH, the DGX-660 is 46lb, and though it does have larger speakers, its keys definitely feel more substantial me. These all use the same action (though the P-121 has fewer keys, of course).


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Originally Posted by anotherscott
Originally Posted by John Road
Yeah well that would be a bit sad since Yamaha themselves in their own video on their key actions called the GHS 'officially' an entry level action intended for beginners. I mean that doesnt mean it it's bad by any means but if BHS = ungraded GHS it its a rather expensive 73 stage piano for such an action. It might not deter me from getting one since 88 keys is just too big for my use case but it's somewhat of a disappointment since they could have made a different, arguably better, more fair design decision there (if proven to be true) for something at this price-point

I think the question there might be whether they can in fact design a better action than GHS (or a GHS derivative) that weighs so little. After all, a lot of the appeal of a CP73 is that it weighs just 28-something lbs. even in a metal case with an internal power supply. The NW-GH in the 38.5 lb CP4 still ended up at 41 lbs once it found its way into the CP88. The GH made the CP40 a little lighter than the CP4, but not much.


Well for me personally I would rather carry 1,5 - 3kg more and have a higher qualiy action on a 73 key keyboard (of which there are too few options anyway..). The most important aspect for me, even in terms of portability. Size is in many ways a more important aspect of portability than weight. Whether it fits in your car, a plane, is practical to carry around etc. For me personally isnt really determined by a few kg more or less.
So from that perspective I am not too happy with their design choice here (if it proves to be a balanced version of the BHS, because looking at that forum thread that was linked it appears Yamaha is very much dancing around pretty straightforward questions (key width, action). Hope we can get some people to share their experiences here.

Last edited by John Road; 04/04/19 03:14 PM.
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Just as small update. The CP73 balanced hammer standard is indeed a balanced version of the entry-level GHS action. Please note it’s yamaha’s own words in previous years to call GHS ‘entry level’ for beginner pianists.. and now they have put a variant of it in a 2000 dollar stage piano.
I am not saying it feels bad (to me it feels fine personally), but I am puzzled by this design decision, and I think many people who like a 73 key balanced hammer keyboard would have been fine with handling 2 or 3 pounds of additional weight to accommodate for a balanced hammer effect action(without the aftertouch). Then there’s of course the durability concerns associated with ghs.

I dont want to overdramatize this, as I am keeping this piano as the overall package, sound and design is great, but ad said I am puzzled here, a lot.

Last edited by John Road; 04/21/19 05:22 AM.
John Road #2841169 04/21/19 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by John Road
Just as small update. The CP73 balanced hammer standard is indeed a balanced version of the entry-level GHS action.

That's what I expected, but how did you confirm for certain? Also, I believe GHS has four zones of weighting, do you happen to know which octaves of GHS correspond in weight to the entirety of the BHS? That is, are all the keys like the top of a GHS, the bottom of a GHS, mid-left or mid-right?

Originally Posted by John Road
Please note it’s yamaha’s own words in previous years to call GHS ‘entry level’ for beginner pianists.. and now they have put a variant of it in a 2000 dollar stage piano.

It's also in the similarly priced MODX8.

Originally Posted by John Road
I think many people who like a 73 key balanced hammer keyboard would have been fine with handling 2 or 3 pounds of additional weight to accommodate for a balanced hammer effect action(without the aftertouch).

Low weight was presumably one of the design goals was the for the 73... people who are willing to travel with some more weight for a higher quality action also have the option of the 88. And I don't think the weight difference would have been only 2-3 lbs. The 73-key BHE S70XS topped 44 lbs (the 88 was almost 50). Although 88 keys, the BHE without aftertouch was used in the MO8, and that topped 46 lbs (and that had an external power supply and I think a plastic chassis). So I would not be surprised if the change you're suggesting would have added more like 10 lbs.

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Originally Posted by anotherscott
Originally Posted by John Road
Just as small update. The CP73 balanced hammer standard is indeed a balanced version of the entry-level GHS action.

That's what I expected, but how did you confirm for certain? Also, I believe GHS has four zones of weighting, do you happen to know which octaves of GHS correspond in weight to the entirety of the BHS? That is, are all the keys like the top of a GHS, the bottom of a GHS, mid-left or mid-right?


I have a CP73 right here. It’s a ‘hammer standard’ action, without the grading.

Originally Posted by anotherscott

Originally Posted by John Road
Please note it’s yamaha’s own words in previous years to call GHS ‘entry level’ for beginner pianists.. and now they have put a variant of it in a 2000 dollar stage piano.

It's also in the similarly priced MODX8.


No the MODX8 is several hundreds of dollars less expensive. They are not in the same price range.

Originally Posted by anotherscott
Originally Posted by John Road
I think many people who like a 73 key balanced hammer keyboard would have been fine with handling 2 or 3 pounds of additional weight to accommodate for a balanced hammer effect action(without the aftertouch).

Low weight was presumably one of the design goals was the for the 73... people who are willing to travel with some more weight for a higher quality action also have the option of the 88. And I don't think the weight difference would have been only 2-3 lbs. The 73-key BHE S70XS topped 44 lbs (the 88 was almost 50). Although 88 keys, the BHE without aftertouch was used in the MO8, and that topped 46 lbs (and that had an external power supply and I think a plastic chassis). So I would not be surprised if the change you're suggesting would have added more like 10 lbs.



The overall construction of the S70xs is/was significantly different.
But lets say a BH (non standard) action would have added 10 pounds (which I find questionable). That weight doesn't matter much. The largest factor in the CP73 being more portable for on the road use is the size, not a few pounds difference in weight.

There is just no good excuse for Yamaha here.


Last edited by John Road; 04/21/19 10:25 AM.
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Don't forget, the CP4 with an 88-key NW action (GH-based graded action with solid wooden core white keys) is under 40lb. The action contributes to the weight, but the chassis/keybed frame seems to make much more difference.


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John Road #2841182 04/21/19 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by John Road
I have a CP73 right here. It’s a ‘hammer standard’ action, without the grading.

But how did you determine that? i.e. by opening it up and looking at the design? By feel? By looking at the service manuals?

Originally Posted by John Road
No the MODX8 is several hundreds of dollars less expensive. They are not in the same price range.

In the U.S., the price difference is only $100 ($1899 vs $1999).

Originally Posted by John Road
But lets say a BH (non standard) action would have added 10 pounds (which I find questionable). That weight doesn't matter much. The largest factor in the CP73 being more portable for on the road use is the size, not a few pounds difference in weight.

That's you. That's not everyone. If it had ticked my boxes, I'd have considered it at its just-under-29 lbs, but that's just about my threshold. I already almost never gig with my SV1-73 because its 38.5 lbs is too heavy. So I usually gig with a lighter 88 (or sometimes even forego the hammer action). Yamaha probably also wanted to try to compete with Nord 76 key boards which are also in the 20s.

Gombessa #2841183 04/21/19 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Gombessa
Don't forget, the CP4 with an 88-key NW action (GH-based graded action with solid wooden core white keys) is under 40lb. The action contributes to the weight, but the chassis/keybed frame seems to make much more difference.

and the CP88 with the NW-GH is 41 lbs. Aluminum chassis instead of the CP4's plastic.

(The CP40 was lighter than the CP4, it used the GH action instead of NW-GH. GH actions are still heavier than GHS actions.)

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