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Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action #2834115 04/02/19 03:43 AM
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Kenny Cheng Offline OP
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https://www.nordkeyboards.com/products/nord-grand

88-note Kawai Hammer Action with advanced triple sensors

That's interesting!

Not sure which Kawai action they are using ...

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Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834121 04/02/19 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Kenny Cheng
https://www.nordkeyboards.com/products/nord-grand

88-note Kawai Hammer Action with advanced triple sensors

That's interesting!

Not sure which Kawai action they are using ...


This is very interesting...ever more interesting will be the price tag...Nords with Fatar Action cost an arm and a leg...I am guessing with the Kawai action (especially if using anything like GF compact or II even) buyers might need to throw a kidney in the deal too...

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834123 04/02/19 04:02 AM
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CyberGene Offline
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Wow if not an April’s fool joke it’s quite something! Judging by no mention of wood it’s RH3, not GF or RM3. They mention it’s the first time they have triple sensors on hammer rather than on keys. No more Fatar complaints I guess smile

Last edited by CyberGene; 04/02/19 04:03 AM.

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Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834126 04/02/19 04:05 AM
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In Nord’s web, it says “Kawai Responsive Hammer keybed with Ivory Touch”

It seems it will be RH3

Kind of disappointed....

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834127 04/02/19 04:07 AM
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Interesting! Finally one of the brands who don't build their own action not using a Fatar action.

Originally Posted by Kenny Cheng
Not sure which Kawai action they are using ...

It says Kawai Responsive Hammer action, so it seems to be a version of the RH. My guess would be RHIII, like in the ES8 (which also has Ivory Touch).

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834129 04/02/19 04:09 AM
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jamiecw Offline
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120 Voice Polyphony....?? Is this 2005 still!?

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834131 04/02/19 04:19 AM
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There’s note stealing. 120 is more than enough.


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Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834132 04/02/19 04:21 AM
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Iaroslav Vasiliev Offline
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I also think it will be RHIII like on ES8 and MP7SE.

The wooden case looks awesome.

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834141 04/02/19 04:51 AM
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Wow. This is what I've been saying and recommending for years now.

Kawai James may remember wink


Shigeru Kawai SK-2, etc.
Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: maurus] #2834144 04/02/19 05:01 AM
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Originally Posted by maurus
Wow. This is what I've been saying and recommending for years now.

Kawai James may remember wink

I need to check when I first suggested that Nord should use Kawai keyboards, it was so long ago, let's compete! wink


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Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: CyberGene] #2834148 04/02/19 05:04 AM
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
Originally Posted by maurus
Wow. This is what I've been saying and recommending for years now.

Kawai James may remember wink

I need to check when I first suggested that Nord should use Kawai keyboards, it was so long ago, let's compete! wink

And the winner gets royalties!

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834151 04/02/19 05:33 AM
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maurus Offline
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I won't claim priority here - it has been an obvious thought for many reasons smile


Shigeru Kawai SK-2, etc.
Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834154 04/02/19 05:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Kenny Cheng
In Nord’s web, it says “Kawai Responsive Hammer keybed with Ivory Touch”

It seems it will be RH3

Kind of disappointed....

Me too... this DP seems to have plenty of space inside the case to feature a wooden action derived from Kawai's GF-II/GF-C. The Kawai RH is definitely a step up from the Fatar action, but a wooden action would be a much better option imo. The wooden case and the controls look amazing...

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834159 04/02/19 06:00 AM
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Well, take in mind it's the first time Kawai gives their actions to another brand. I am amazed they agreed, TBH. But they wouldn't give them their best action, would they?


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Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: arc7urus] #2834160 04/02/19 06:03 AM
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Iaroslav Vasiliev Offline
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Originally Posted by arc7urus
Originally Posted by Kenny Cheng
In Nord’s web, it says “Kawai Responsive Hammer keybed with Ivory Touch”

It seems it will be RH3

Kind of disappointed....

Me too... this DP seems to have plenty of space inside the case to feature a wooden action derived from Kawai's GF-II/GF-C. The Kawai RH is definitely a step up from the Fatar action, but a wooden action would be a much better option imo. The wooden case and the controls look amazing...

It may be that Kawai is not willing to supply their best keyboards to competitor, but it seems more probable to me that Nord is not willing to buy them. Nord seems to be traditionally concerned with electric pianos and additional instruments, and wooden keyboard is imo not a good idea for EPs.

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834183 04/02/19 07:28 AM
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What puzzles me is that the weight of this Nord Grand is only 20.9kg according to their spec webpage!!!

So how exactly have Clavia made this so much lighter in weight than most of Kawai's own wooden action stage pianos?
I mean, it looks to me like they based it on the VPC1 (maybe Kawai are now discontinuing VPC1 and about to release a VPC2 and so can sell the older VPC1 chassis off to Clavia? The VPC1 itself was a development from the MP10 case chassis) and that model VPC1 has RM3 action (3 sensor, but not the full Grand Feel keystick length) and weighs 29.5kg. It's their lightest. Most of the wooden action MP series are somewhere between 32kg and 35kg. And the old Kawai CA-X was 30kg - which looks almost the same physical design as Nord Grand does today!
So it's amazing to me that Clavia have managed to produce such a thing with it only weighing 20.9kg. My gut feeling is, either some corners have been cut somewhere in the Kawai action for this, or Clavia's red casework must be very minimalist lightweight design (but doesn't look like that to me) or perhaps that 20.9kg spec is a misprint.


Anyway - as with all Nord keyboards - shame it's red. Gloss black would be the better colour.
120 polyphony is pathetic, I agree.
Shame it has no pitch bend or mod wheels - all stage pianos need these.
Shame it has no professional balanced XLR outs or AES/EBU or S/PDIF outs - only amateur unbalanced jacks (pathetic again)
Nice that they've now upgraded 2GB for the pianos, rather than 1GB as they put on the Nord Piano 4, but still probably not enough for all the libraries you might want. Surely 8Gb or more would be possible these days?
Very interesting that Kawai are now supplying OEM keyboards to 3rd party manufacturers like Clavia - especially to play all their Steinway, Bosendorfer and Yamaha samples from! No Kawai pianos?!
Wonder if the plastic key brigade (Roland, Yamaha, Kurzweil) will be on the phone when they see this wanting to buy OEM wooden Kawai actions for theirs too...?!
Shame that Kawai haven't got a new model themselves, like MP12 with all the features professionals want to see.


Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Kenny Cheng] #2834185 04/02/19 07:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Kenny Cheng
https://www.nordkeyboards.com/products/nord-grand

88-note Kawai Hammer Action with advanced triple sensors

That's interesting!

Not sure which Kawai action they are using ...


Hi Kenny,

What is this essentially?
= Nord Piano 4 + New Action (RHIII) + 2 GB Piano library memory instead of 1GB + slanted user interface & flat roof.

Why release this?
I think this is Nords response to the CP88!
In other words: the NP4 is down on action to the CP88, not any more! They've given buyers a harder choice by upping the Piano library size to 2 GB and providing the Nord with an action many would think of as being slightly better than the Yamaha NW-GH action.

So, for all that difference in look (dimensions, weight, and slanted facing front-panel), the specs show only 2 functional differences to the NP4---albeit the insertion of the RHIII action is a shrewd move.

What do you guys think?

Also, although it looks more substantial (due to the shape), but it actually weights approx. only 2 Kg more than the NP4. Seems to me that this is still aimed at the live user?!

Another thing I quite like straight away: I used to own a PSR7000 keyboard with a slanted UI. This Nord has a flat top for your laptop---lovely jubbly---and a slanted control board which makes it slightly easier to work with!

Kind regards,

Doug


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Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Iaroslav Vasiliev] #2834188 04/02/19 07:41 AM
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Doug M. Offline
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Originally Posted by Iaroslav Vasiliev
Originally Posted by arc7urus
Originally Posted by Kenny Cheng
In Nord’s web, it says “Kawai Responsive Hammer keybed with Ivory Touch”

It seems it will be RH3

Kind of disappointed....

Me too... this DP seems to have plenty of space inside the case to feature a wooden action derived from Kawai's GF-II/GF-C. The Kawai RH is definitely a step up from the Fatar action, but a wooden action would be a much better option imo. The wooden case and the controls look amazing...

It may be that Kawai is not willing to supply their best keyboards to competitor, but it seems more probable to me that Nord is not willing to buy them. Nord seems to be traditionally concerned with electric pianos and additional instruments, and wooden keyboard is imo not a good idea for EPs.


Hi Iaroslav,

Yep, Kawai keep the cream for themselves; however, by providing one of the best actions after the Grand Feel and VPC actions, Kawai have essentially handed competitive advantage to Nord. So whilst Kawai aren't selling a Nord like instrument (not operating in that sub-market), they've managed to nobble one of the advantages that the Yamaha CP88 had over the NP4 lol...Shrewd for Kawai me thinks!

Kind regards,

Doug.


Instruments: Current - Kawai MP7; Past - Yamaha PSR7000
Software: Sibelius 7; Neuratron Photoscore Pro 8
Stand: K&M 18953 Table-style Stage Piano Stand
Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: propianist] #2834189 04/02/19 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by propianist
What puzzles me is that the weight of this Nord Grand is only 20.9kg according to their spec webpage!!!

So how exactly have Clavia made this so much lighter in weight than most of Kawai's own wooden action stage pianos?

They didn't. Because it's not a wooden action (Responsive Hammer).

Re: Nord introduces Nord Grand with Kawai Hammer action [Re: Iaroslav Vasiliev] #2834191 04/02/19 07:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Iaroslav Vasiliev

It may be that Kawai is not willing to supply their best keyboards to competitor, but it seems more probable to me that Nord is not willing to buy them.


Yes, I think this is likely the case. RH3 would be a direct upgrade to the Fatar actions in other Nords. A GF action would be creating a new category of product.

Also. Kawai doesn't make a wooden action slab much under 70lb, which is quite a limitation for a "stage piano" meant to be carried on gigs. I think Nord picked the action that best suited their needs, and it was RH3 for this product.


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