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Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817171 02/19/19 12:49 AM
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PS. No excuse for bad dealers though. And hope Nordomus sorts his problem out very soon with MX Music.

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Re: New Roland Pianos
RichardHK #2817189 02/19/19 02:23 AM
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Originally Posted by RichardHK
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
... ...I'm also totally ticked off at Roland about how they seems to have channeled these LX-7xx series pianos in the US to only "brick & mortar" dealers who offer almost no discount, force you to buy "locally," and after the tiny discounts some of the offer, ... ...There is no good technical or customer service reason for Roland to take anti-consumer measures such as limiting the channel for the LX7xx's, except as a reward to their dealers.


Well, I much prefer to buy a piano from a dealer, not online. Just like I used to like buying books from a bookshop. Buying online sucks for many items and better to deal with humans than impersonal webpages for lots of stuff. Would hate to see music stores go the same way as so many businesses killed by online buying.



I think most of us do (allthough I love my Kindle for convienicence reasons), but if this leads to a monopole where local dealers charge absurd prices it sucks a bit. Especially when people can compare prices on forums like this.

Maybe it would be easier to adjust if every brand would act like that in the US, but its not like that. A 708 for the same price of a N1X - cant believe it...

Re: New Roland Pianos
Markuska #2817190 02/19/19 02:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Markuska
Maybe it would be easier to adjust if every brand would act like that in the US, but its not like that. A 708 for the same price of a N1X - cant believe it...

Well 4-14% higher than the 708 depending on if we are talking polished ebony or black walnut for the 708. But that's Washington DC area prices. I see that some other locations in the US, have stores that discount the 708 more. That doesn't help me since Roland makes it so you have to buy locally. That's one of the benefits of Internet sellers. It is a powerful for for market efficiency. Because of the actions of Roland, the market in Washington DC for 708s is not efficient.


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across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817194 02/19/19 02:36 AM
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Out of interest: how do they make one buy locally?

Re: New Roland Pianos
Markuska #2817196 02/19/19 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Markuska
Out of interest: how do they make one buy locally?

High shipping cost. I called one store out of the area and they said I'd have to arrange my own transport. That's horrible.


[Linked Image]
across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817445 02/19/19 01:31 PM
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Here's another update.

The LX708ch finally arrived and I have been testing it out with my very limited piano skills. Certainly, a nice jump from my ~8 years old sub $300 Casio. Actually, no comparison. :P

The two European versions both sound amazing to me. However, the American versions sound too metallic and has a very annoying 'clang' when striking the key. Maybe Steinways sounds like that in real life, I don't know. It sticks out so much probably due to my skills, but you'll hear it being played on Roland's official demo with the C# note. Viewers have commented that it sounds like a metronome. The ones that stand out the most for now are C#2 and Bb2. I have already adjusted the character to tone it down.

Speakers. The whole system packs a huge punch. Only complaint is that my left ear gets some ringing to certain midrange tones but that's unfortunate only to me because my left year is a bit sensitive to certain ranges. Too bad, I cannot isolate the certain range to reduce my ear problem. I can rid most of it by reducing the brilliance but that makes the whole piano sound too mellow and muffled which I don't like. Oh well... Sucks to have a left ear like me. It only likes the highest quality of high end audio equipment. lol

Haptic feed back is pretty cool. No way to judge since I don't have an acoustic side by side to compare the feeling and how it behaves but it's there on all keys. I can say it's not evenly distributed. One note is very obvious and the other one beside it is drastically reduced. But it's very difficult to feel unless I turn up the headphones very high. But that just makes my ears bleed. I don't feel anything with volume at around 30 unless I pound hard.

It sounds amazing with my Senns HD598. At low volume, I had to double check a few times if it wasn't played through the speakers too. lol

The piano samples are okay, I guess. I don't know if the samples are top notch or not. Playing one note at a time, it does sound pretty good. I have nothing to compare except that I don't use them especially after switching back to the modeled sound, there is no reason I should go to those sampled sounds when playing with both hands. It's night and day to me. Using the right pedal with the modeled sound is crazy compared to the the samples. The samples just sound dead.

At any rate, I'm happy with the LX708. Not happy with the price but like they say, no pain, no gain.

So much more to play around with. I just scratched the surface. The bluetooth control is awesome and the rhythm tempos sound cool which nobody really talks about. So far, I can't figure out how to adjust the volume for the rhythms. The default is too loud. I wish they have a rhythm button on the piano. I don't get why.

Nordomus: Sorry to hear about your problems still. I would have wagered that you'll get your piano fixed before mine arrived. No way Roland will not do right for you. The time they're taking is ridiculous.


Roland LX708 charcoal
Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817482 02/19/19 02:37 PM
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Honestly I already gave up on Roland, I just wait till the end of february for my refund and I will just buy another piano from another store. There is a chance they will deliver in last week but I don't count on it.

Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817488 02/19/19 02:48 PM
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Another as in another LX or another brand?

Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817504 02/19/19 03:16 PM
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Another brand, I'm pissed at Roland :]

Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817515 02/19/19 03:40 PM
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Thats crazy - if I would still study Marketing I would ask my professors to add this story to the bad examples..

Any idea what you want to get? Maybe Casio (hey Casio - do it!) brings new GPs?

Re: New Roland Pianos
Markuska #2817528 02/19/19 04:28 PM
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Exactly what you said- this situation is textbook example of how to NOT deal with customer.
If Casio would anounce new GP series I would probably wait for it but I can't be without piano so if nothing happens in 2 weeks then I'm considering either Kawai CA 98 or Yamaha CLP 685(which I've played quite a lot in music shop) I want to try different pianos because I really like testing new instruments smile
Anyway I'm leaning towards Kawai because it's overall more recent piano/technology.

Re: New Roland Pianos
Nordomus #2817538 02/19/19 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Nordomus
Anyway I'm leaning towards Kawai because it's overall more recent piano/technology.

I assume you've read up on this forum about "pianist mode" and MIDI, support of apps, and various other things about the CA98 on this forum so you can go into a purchase open-eyed, yes?

BTW, are the lower end hybrids like the NU1X outside your budget? They appear to only be about 30% more than a CA98 when purchased in Europe.


[Linked Image]
across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: New Roland Pianos
Nordomus #2817540 02/19/19 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Nordomus
Exactly what you said- this situation is textbook example of how to NOT deal with customer.
If Casio would anounce new GP series I would probably wait for it but I can't be without piano so if nothing happens in 2 weeks then I'm considering either Kawai CA 98 or Yamaha CLP 685(which I've played quite a lot in music shop) I want to try different pianos because I really like testing new instruments smile
Anyway I'm leaning towards Kawai because it's overall more recent piano/technology.

Sad to hear you leaving Roland smile Let us know how you feel with your new piano after you get one. As for choosing between Yamaha and Kawai, maybe you want to invest some time in reading about strange things happening to Kawai pianos ( with their latest series CA78/98 and the Novus ) . As far as I've seen, there seem to be some quality control issue, and some nasty software glitches with display / sound generator. Good luck with your shopping, and I must say I feel bad about your experience with Roland. I wonder how they treat customers with their 10 years warranty ( if it's just a gimmick ) smile


www.youtube.com/channel/UC073i6RnxK4NcnoFp1jYh7Q The place where I ocasionally post my amateur recordings smile
Criticism is welcomed since it helps improving and going forward!

Yamaha P-105 -> Roland HP-605 -> Roland LX708
Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817544 02/19/19 04:46 PM
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Cant go wrong with both I guess smile

Re: New Roland Pianos
Tyrone Slothrop #2817574 02/19/19 05:29 PM
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Yeah I've read a lot about all of the pianos but I don't recall anything about problems with pianist mode in Kawai. What's wrong with it?

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Originally Posted by Nordomus
Anyway I'm leaning towards Kawai because it's overall more recent piano/technology.

I assume you've read up on this forum about "pianist mode" and MIDI, support of apps, and various other things about the CA98 on this forum so you can go into a purchase open-eyed, yes?

BTW, are the lower end hybrids like the NU1X outside your budget? They appear to only be about 30% more than a CA98 when purchased in Europe.


Yeah a bit outside of my budget but I can check it out and ask around for a discount maybe BUT I keep reading about loud note issue on those pianos and Avant Grands so that is a big nono.

Re: New Roland Pianos
Nordomus #2817590 02/19/19 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Nordomus
Yeah I've read a lot about all of the pianos but I don't recall anything about problems with pianist mode in Kawai. What's wrong with it?

Check the Testing Kawai CA78/98 Advice thread in general. arc7urus, in particular, made a post which summarizes some of the issues.

Originally Posted by Nordomus
Yeah a bit outside of my budget but I can check it out and ask around for a discount maybe BUT I keep reading about loud note issue on those pianos and Avant Grands so that is a big nono.

With regard to the loud note problem, I've asked on this forum and had it confirmed this is specific to the NU1/NU1X and not the other Avantgard's in the N1/2/3 line. Because I am easily startled, I too worried about this and thought this issue would be the one that would prevent me from buying an NU1X, as it is a design limitation/flaw and can't be fixed in this generation of NU1X. However, Cybergene's hands-on research into this topic, and in particular this post of his did a lot to rehabilitate the NU1X in my eyes, as I realize that it is something you can workaround, and in fact Cybergene himself has already naturally adapted to this.

Since for me personally, the price difference is less of a consideration, the main issue is just the difference between the upright action of the NU1X versus the grand piano action of the N1X and NV10 and in particular a 7 Hz maximum repetition frequency on repeated notes or about 150 milliseconds between presses of the same key. While I'm only a beginner, I do expect to improve, and I'm planning to keep my next piano for awhile, so this might ultimately be a limitation for me. However, I think if one isn't playing classical repertoire with its ornaments, a 7 Hz limit shouldn't really matter at all.


[Linked Image]
across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817599 02/19/19 06:02 PM
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Thank you smile

Re: New Roland Pianos
Nordomus #2817618 02/19/19 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Nordomus
Another brand, I'm pissed at Roland :]


Wow, I'm not happy reading about your experience. Have you tried reaching out directly to Roland with a warranty claim? I find it hard to believe a reputable company would handle things so poorly. Perhaps the dealer is dropping the ball? Hoping nothing but the best for you in your search.


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Re: New Roland Pianos
tudor33sud #2817730 02/20/19 01:43 AM
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My apologies for intruding on a Roland thread, but...

Originally Posted by tudor33sud
As for choosing between Yamaha and Kawai, maybe you want to invest some time in reading about strange things happening to Kawai pianos ( with their latest series CA78/98 and the Novus ) . As far as I've seen, there seem to be some quality control issue, and some nasty software glitches with display / sound generator.


Some Novus customers have reported hearing a noise/buzzing from the speakers - this matter is still being investigated. As far as I am aware, there are no such reports from CA98/CA78 customers.

Some CA98/CA78/Novus customers have criticised the way "Favorite" memories are implemented (specifically, the inability to edit a Favorite memory after it has been stored, or load/save Favorites from USB memory).

I'm not aware of any other "nasty software glitches with the display / sound generator".

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.
Re: New Roland Pianos
Colin Miles #2817753 02/20/19 03:01 AM
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Where I live the Kawai dealer is one of the ones that will do everything to please you, including free delivery and setup, red carpet and everything.
Well Roland may no longer be the old Roland of past, probably loosing money as we speak by not being able to fit into ipad generation. They had many misses lately and none of their keyboard became significant killer. The FA came nowhere near the Kronos or MOTIF flavors. Their boutique series is overpriced against volcas. The plug-out and Aira is yesterdays news... Zoom boxed them out of home recording gear completelly. DJ gear is all in hands of novation, NI, Pioneer etc... I don't know. Looks bleak to me. In comparison the copy-cat Behringer is killing it with their synths and high end audio gear which used to be Rolands domain.


Last edited by oscar1; 02/20/19 03:04 AM.

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