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Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815294
02/14/19 05:30 PM
02/14/19 05:30 PM
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mydp Offline
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Bruce, I would say that there are two types of people: those who would buy a good grand piano, but can’t afford it, or can’t afford the noise it makes or the room it needs, and buy instead a digital piano (hoping it will be more or less similar), and those who want an electronic instrument, for the many reasons you can buy one. In this forum the former are much better represented. The latter are the ones that would seek and enjoy all the “extras” you talk about.


P-515
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Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815304
02/14/19 05:42 PM
02/14/19 05:42 PM
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Everything is pretty niche isn't it?


Roland FP-90 - Touchkeys - TEC BC - MIDI Expression
Kontakt - Arturia Piano V - Sonivox Eighty-Eight - Spitfire Symphony Orchestra

whitepianos.blogspot.com
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815322
02/14/19 06:06 PM
02/14/19 06:06 PM
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I care only about action and real piano sound. As a guitarist for over 60 years, I watched so many cats just marry into a dozen pedals, dead set on recording, mixing , just involving themselves in so much technology. I realized when they do all of these activities, they are not practicing guitar and it’s painfully obvious.
I have had my piano nearly two years, pay $100 bucks an hour for private lessons w a master, practice 4 -5 hrs a day and I have yet to test out any other sounds ( except piano)and any of those bells and whistles.
I guess when I get lots better on piano. I’ll have to read my owners manual.

Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: mydp] #2815333
02/14/19 06:20 PM
02/14/19 06:20 PM
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JoeT Offline
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Originally Posted by mydp
Bruce, I would say that there are two types of people: those who would buy a good grand piano, but can’t afford it, or can’t afford the noise it makes or the room it needs, and buy instead a digital piano (hoping it will be more or less similar), and those who want an electronic instrument, for the many reasons you can buy one. In this forum the former are much better represented. The latter are the ones that would seek and enjoy all the “extras” you talk about.

It is as if there is one group preferring classical compositions on acoustic pianos and one group preferring modern music on electronic pianos.

Manufacturers found out how satisfy each of them with a bouquet of digital instruments.


Yamaha P-515 | Kawai ES100 | Steinberg UR22 | Sony MDR-7506
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: JoeT] #2815338
02/14/19 06:37 PM
02/14/19 06:37 PM
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R111 Online content
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Originally Posted by JoeT
Originally Posted by mydp
Bruce, I would say that there are two types of people: those who would buy a good grand piano, but can’t afford it, or can’t afford the noise it makes or the room it needs, and buy instead a digital piano (hoping it will be more or less similar), and those who want an electronic instrument, for the many reasons you can buy one. In this forum the former are much better represented. The latter are the ones that would seek and enjoy all the “extras” you talk about.

It is as if there is one group preferring classical compositions on acoustic pianos and one group preferring modern music on electronic pianos.
.

I enjoy playing classical compositions with pianos, harpsichords, guitars, harps, marimbas, steel drums, some saxophones, and would love to have lots of other quality instruments/voices, like wind instruments, horns, lutes, classical clavichords, other historical instruments, etc. but my current rig is somewhat lacking in those latter categories.

Each instrument breathes new life into a piece. Some pieces were meant for a clarity or crispness of tone that you can't find in today's piano.

Last edited by R111; 02/14/19 06:43 PM.
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815354
02/14/19 07:08 PM
02/14/19 07:08 PM
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I had a ton of fun on my DGxs, three of 'em. I put up with the less than perfect action. It was an instrument I heard in a church, and sounded very good many years back. I loved the variety of sounds, particularly the warm strings and strident solo stuff. Since I'd always wanted to record multi track, (I was terrified of the technology) it was a very innovative, convenient piece of kit for one such as I.
There was a plentiful variety of eastern instruments if anyone wanted to record Yoga or Pilates sounding tracks. Never quite got around to that.
They never had a penny whistle or a piccolo, so Irish folk music was somewhat stymied.
Nowadays, I prefer piano only.


"I am not a man. I am a free number"

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Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815373
02/14/19 07:51 PM
02/14/19 07:51 PM
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Posts: 535
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I do all of my practicing on an acoustic piano, so when I play for pleasure, I often move over to electronic keyboards so I can layer sounds and add rhythm. So, yes, I look for the extra features when choosing a keyboard. Am also a big fan of Kontact and Reason. All of this probably makes me an outlier in this forum, but please don't kick me out because I still enjoy the discussions here.


[Linked Image]
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815414
02/14/19 09:59 PM
02/14/19 09:59 PM
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I have an RD-2000 in my project studio, use mostly VSTi though. I bought it for the action which is one of the best out there IMHO... My biggest complaint or disappointment with the RD-2000 is the lack of support. I'm not sure if it's because other professionals like me already know how to use all the capabilities that this slab offers or if support is truly lacking. The Roland Clan site is a ghost town and so are other sites. Yamaha and Casio have far more action on their sites. And it's the same for the Roland Integra-7 module. A powerhouse but yet another overly complex Roland product... Still, I've stated this before, action, action and action... You can always run VSTi of different flavors but if the action sucks, you are stuck so choose wisely.

Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: MacMacMac] #2815546
02/15/19 04:26 AM
02/15/19 04:26 AM
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Originally Posted by MacMacMac
A continuous sostenuto pedal?

The regular kind behaves thusly:
Pedal up: No action
Pedal down: Sustain all notes already held down, but none pressed afterwards

So a continuous sostenuto would behave how? I'm lost trying to figure out what that would mean.
This perhaps ...
Half-pedaled sostenuto: Maybe sustain some of the notes already held down, but maybe not (random).
Then maybe sustain some that are pressed afterwards ... or maybe not?


I think it is less about "continuous sostenuto" (though the idea of "random" cracked me up though) and more about the ability to assign the pedal to another function, say mod wheel or volume footswitch for other VSTi.

@Topic: Well I bought the VPC-1, so the answer to the question would be: nope. 88keys and a quality action are all I need for now. I have to learn to fry way bigger fish than to worry about added in features. laugh


The backbone of modern industrial society is, and for the foreseeable future will be, the use of electrical Power.
VPC 1 -> Pianoteq 6 Std / Pearl Alto Flute 201
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: MacMacMac] #2815616
02/15/19 09:07 AM
02/15/19 09:07 AM
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anotherscott Online content
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Originally Posted by MacMacMac
A continuous sostenuto pedal?

The regular kind behaves thusly:
Pedal up: No action
Pedal down: Sustain all notes already held down, but none pressed afterwards

So a continuous sostenuto would behave how? I'm lost trying to figure out what that would mean.

It would make a difference when releasing the pedal. Which is where most of the benefit of a continuous sustain pedal is, as well.

Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: JazzBow] #2815659
02/15/19 10:33 AM
02/15/19 10:33 AM
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 204
Philadelphia
Bruce In Philly Offline OP
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Originally Posted by JazzBow
I have an RD-2000 in my project studio, use mostly VSTi though. I bought it for the action which is one of the best out there IMHO... My biggest complaint or disappointment with the RD-2000 is the lack of support. I'm not sure if it's because other professionals like me already know how to use all the capabilities that this slab offers or if support is truly lacking. The Roland Clan site is a ghost town and so are other sites. Yamaha and Casio have far more action on their sites. And it's the same for the Roland Integra-7 module. A powerhouse but yet another overly complex Roland product... Still, I've stated this before, action, action and action... You can always run VSTi of different flavors but if the action sucks, you are stuck so choose wisely.


+1 .. Roland support via email has answered all my questions so far.... but yes, I am surprised such a major product from a leading maker has so few channels for support. Are they selling any? Is the RD2000 a dud? I am still learning the board and I don;t even use those stupid knobs that are there to make it "easy".... the menu system, while confusing themselves, is more intuitive and powerful than those dumb super-assignable knobs.

But back to the question I posted.....

I guess most folks on this forum are just piano players. Not a cut... not at all.... I like to record, and then play arranger/producer and play say a string over my melodies... or a bass line underneath. I suck at it, but it entertains me. Why wouldn't anyone want to do this? For this, having features is very appealing to me. True, I use only a small percent of the keyboard's capabilities, but I do dabble in them. I guess I expected more players to want to do this... why not? The tech is sitting right in front of you.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

Last edited by Bruce In Philly; 02/15/19 10:36 AM.

Peace
Bruce in Philly
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815664
02/15/19 10:43 AM
02/15/19 10:43 AM
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JoeT Offline
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Originally Posted by Bruce In Philly

I guess most folks on this forum are just piano players. Not a cut... not at all.... I like to record, and then play arranger/producer and play say a string over my melodies... or a bass line underneath. I suck at it, but it entertains me. Why wouldn't anyone want to do this?

It cuts from practice time.

Quote
For this, having features is very appealing to me. True, I use only a small percent of the keyboard's capabilities, but I do dabble in them. I guess I expected more players to want to do this... why not? The tech is sitting right in front of you.

My P-515 can do arrangements as well. Haven't used that yet.


Yamaha P-515 | Kawai ES100 | Steinberg UR22 | Sony MDR-7506
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815671
02/15/19 10:56 AM
02/15/19 10:56 AM
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 801
SoCal
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My answer to the OP’s question is: no. I think it was almost two years ago, I mixed the “slow strings” sound with SKEX on my CA97. It was kind of pretty. I haven’t used any of the various Kawai sounds since. IMHO, Kawai could cut the cost a little by eliminating the HL sound engine in the CS and NV models and maybe use the extra space inside for something else. Maybe different speakers?


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Kawai Novus NV10
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: JoeT] #2815699
02/15/19 12:16 PM
02/15/19 12:16 PM
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mydp Offline
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Originally Posted by JoeT
Originally Posted by Bruce In Philly

I guess most folks on this forum are just piano players. Not a cut... not at all.... I like to record, and then play arranger/producer and play say a string over my melodies... or a bass line underneath. I suck at it, but it entertains me. Why wouldn't anyone want to do this?

It cuts from practice time.

Quote
For this, having features is very appealing to me. True, I use only a small percent of the keyboard's capabilities, but I do dabble in them. I guess I expected more players to want to do this... why not? The tech is sitting right in front of you.

My P-515 can do arrangements as well. Haven't used that yet.


It does cut from practice time but, who cares? Isn't music a form of play? what would music be without the play factor? I have also spent hours developing sounds, or mixing them, and making (admittedly pitiful) compositions. That is: playing. Isn't that what lies at the beginning of it all?.
It is said that Chopin wasn't able to compose without his piano. At the same time he was a great pianist. Did his composing cut from his practice time?
I understand you, don't think otherwise, but there are many folks (including me) that prefer having fun to master the piano. The great thing about electronics is that it allows you to, without the need to go through great pains first.


P-515
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815703
02/15/19 12:21 PM
02/15/19 12:21 PM
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I'm another no who very,very seldom uses anything other than my chosen piano sound. This is also because II find most of the other sounds disappointing. There is so little actual variation or the ability to customise them. If I want a string I play my violin, if an organ I would want to play an organ where I can use all the stops instead of the very limited preset sounds. If I had the room I would probably have an acoustic and keep the digital for silent practice and recording.


Roland LX7

South Wales, UK
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: Bruce In Philly] #2815704
02/15/19 12:23 PM
02/15/19 12:23 PM
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I don't understand why composing / arranging / recording would cut from practice time. Get in your practice first, and if you have time left over, do other stuff that you think is fun, whether that's reading a book, watching a movie, or fooling around with more music stuff. It can be in addition to practice, not instead of it.


Decent upright bassist, aspiring decent pianist
Casio PX-160, Casio CDP-130
Roland KC-80
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: mydp] #2815715
02/15/19 12:47 PM
02/15/19 12:47 PM
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JoeT Offline
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Originally Posted by mydp
It does cut from practice time but, who cares?

I do. I enjoy piano practice, so why cut it short?

Quote
I have also spent hours developing sounds, or mixing them, and making (admittedly pitiful) compositions.

I already have the perfect sound: the concert grand piano. No need to "develop" a new one.

Quote
there are many folks (including me) that prefer having fun to master the piano.

I'm having fun trying to master the piano. laugh

Fun fact: Something is much more rewarding, if you have to make an actual effort. Why do I need to explain this in a piano forum?

So going back to the Roland RD-2000:

[Linked Image]

Some people prefer playing the colorful knobs in the upper half, I prefer the black and white piano keyboard in the lower half. The latter is all you need to create piano music. That's essentially what this silly discussion boils down to.


Yamaha P-515 | Kawai ES100 | Steinberg UR22 | Sony MDR-7506
Re: Do you care - about number of features and sounds? [Re: TheophilusCarter] #2815732
02/15/19 01:25 PM
02/15/19 01:25 PM
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Posts: 172
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R111 Online content
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Originally Posted by TheophilusCarter
I don't understand why composing / arranging / recording would cut from practice time. Get in your practice first, and if you have time left over, do other stuff that you think is fun, whether that's reading a book, watching a movie, or fooling around with more music stuff. It can be in addition to practice, not instead of it.


Having different voices makes me practice more. After I'm sick of hearing a piece in piano, I'm interested to hear how it sounds in harpsichord, guitars, harps, organ, marimba etc.

Last edited by R111; 02/15/19 01:25 PM.
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