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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
halherta #2810200 02/03/19 12:42 PM
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I can’t believe a 7x or 6X would need an aluminium or metallic chassis.
( what for?...)
If a 8X is made of plastic, of course a shorter one Would be ok for that as well both with weighted action.
( example: p121 as said above)
My opinion is it’s just a marketing decision.

It’s a pity because for travelling purpose, it would be a good answer.

Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
rolex67 #2810226 02/03/19 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by rolex67
I can’t believe a 7x or 6X would need an aluminium or metallic chassis.
( what for?...)
If a 8X is made of plastic, of course a shorter one Would be ok for that as well .

You missed the point. It's about the cost of producing a new mold, and comparing that to how many finished units you expect to sell. Unless you are very confident in your ability to sell many thousands of keyboards using your new 7x-sized plastic mold, it is cheaper to use metal. Once you sell in high volume, it becomes cheaper to use plastic. But before it exists, it's hard to be sure of how many people will buy your new product.

Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
halherta #2810303 02/03/19 06:10 PM
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Well,
perhaps you are in the business, with good knowledge of “ how to build a keyboard”
But as far as I know ( and see in the shops ex: p-121/Roland rd 64 etc, etc...) I havent seen yet anything cheaper made in metal than in plastic...
But never mind, it’s out of topic ;-)

Last edited by rolex67; 02/03/19 06:15 PM.
Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
rolex67 #2810341 02/03/19 08:35 PM
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Originally Posted by rolex67
I havent seen yet anything cheaper made in metal than in plastic...
This is not about what you see on the market, it's about production decisions. For low volume, a metal chassis is cheaper. For high volume, a plastic chassis is cheaper. (Which is also why you often see the same plastic chassis repurposed for multiple models.)

Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
anotherscott #2810445 02/04/19 06:53 AM
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The cost of a new plastic mould is negligible for a company like Casio, which not only controls this part of the production chain but also targets volume markets and often reuses the same mould in several models. Anyway, Casio already has keyboards with 7x-keys. It could make some sense to introduce 88-key + 7x-key models if/when Casio replaces the PX-560 and PX-5S stage/pro pianos. But Casio did not do that in the past with these two models, so it all depend on the volume they expect to sell and if they decide to continue developing a stage/pro piano range. But the S1000 and S3000 are not replacing the PX-560 or the PX-5S.

Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
arc7urus #2810513 02/04/19 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by arc7urus
The cost of a new plastic mould is negligible for a company like Casio.

The size of the company doesn't matter, it still has to be a profitable decision. For example, unless maybe you're selling a premium priced product, you may be hesitant to spend 6 figures on design and fabrication if you only expected to sell a couple of thousand of something, because you'd have to charge too much for each one just to get your initial costs back. The fact that you're a big company doesn't change that calculus, it just means you have the resources to do it IF you think it makes financial sense.

Originally Posted by arc7urus
Casio...also targets volume markets and often reuses the same mould in several models.

That's my point. A 7x-key chassis would make sense for them if they felt confident that it was a volume market, and related to that, even better if there would be enough demand for this type of board that they could make, not just one, but multiple models (esp. higher priced variants), to maximize the return on the fabrication cost. If and when they feel confident about that, you'll probably see them. They're probably keeping an eye on how Yamaha does with the P121, and maybe how Studiologic does with the SL73 (which interestingly sells for exactly the same price as the 88 version, which provides an interesting testing ground to determine, price aside, what percentage of people prefer 73s vs 88s on their low cost hammer action boards).

Originally Posted by arc7urus
Anyway, Casio already has keyboards with 7x-keys.

Yes, but they can't use that chassis because those are for the non hammer action. (Though it's an interesting question... now that they have shrunk the size of hammer actions in the new S series, I wonder if they could fit one in something like the WK-7600 chassis. I suspect not, but I don't know.)

But to the bigger point, I suspect that boards like the WK-7600 have not sold as well as they'd have hoped, that more people by far were selecting the 61 key versions. If the 7x versions were the big sellers, you'd probably have seen 76-key versions of the subsequent MZ-X and CT-X series, which are conspicuously absent. Disappointing 76 sales might also make them hesitant about introducing a 76-key Privia, though obviously the market is not identical, and a 76-key Privia would be a smaller option whereas on a non-hammer board, a 76-key model is a bigger option. So you could also look at any disappointing WK-7600 sales the opposite way, that it means buyers prefer smaller options, which would argue in favor of the 76 piano! But that's the kind of thing they'd need to try to figure out.

Originally Posted by arc7urus
It could make some sense to introduce 88-key + 7x-key models if/when Casio replaces the PX-560 and PX-5S stage/pro pianos. But Casio did not do that in the past with these two models, so it all depend on the volume they expect to sell.

Yup, again, it depends on the volume they expect to sell.

Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
anotherscott #2810795 02/04/19 10:27 PM
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Once again anotherscott demonstrates why he is the smartest guy in the room. wink

Originally Posted by anotherscott
Which is also why you often see the same plastic chassis repurposed for multiple models.


This. The five recently announced PX-S and CDP-S models all use the same chassis, ensuring economies of scale. I believe this was also the case for the previous generation (two generations?) PX models - including the PX-5S.

I'm very interested to see how the P-121 performs, and if Yamaha utilised any tricks to share cabinet fabrication costs with the P-125...

James
x


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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
Kawai James #2810812 02/05/19 12:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
I'm very interested to see how the P-121 performs, and if Yamaha utilised any tricks to share cabinet fabrication costs with the P-125...

Well, the mold can't be the same, but Yamaha changed the pedal assembly for the stand, so it can be shared between different width P-121, P-125 and P-515


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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
JoeT #2810816 02/05/19 12:55 AM
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Originally Posted by JoeT
Well, the mold can't be the same...


Right, I had wondered if perhaps Yamaha had produced a 73-key chassis that could somehow be extended for 88-keys...but I agree, this would be highly unlikely.

Originally Posted by JoeT
...but Yamaha changed the pedal assembly for the stand, so it can be shared between different width P-121, P-125 and P-515


Ah, that's true...the triple pedal box hangs down now, similar to the ES8

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
halherta #2811457 02/06/19 03:36 PM
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and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
RosemaryGirl #2812818 02/09/19 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by RosemaryGirl
Thanks! I'd actually put the ES110 in my Thomann basket before deciding otherwise! I noticed too that they don't offer a pre-order option on the Privias, although Woodbrass in France do. They offer the PX-S3000 on pre-order at 899€ and supposedly can ship it in three weeks…

I definitely will wait. It might just be absolute perfect timing, actually. The PX-S3000 looks so good, now I've watched the videos! The friend who is lending me the Yamaha DGX-640 has been playing it (and only that) for 8 years, so if I'm going to have my first piano for that long, I want it to be the right one.

The PX-S3000 is on the thomann.de site for 755.46€ (at least that's the price it shows for me).


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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
Tyrone Slothrop #2815111 02/14/19 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Originally Posted by RosemaryGirl
Thanks! I'd actually put the ES110 in my Thomann basket before deciding otherwise! I noticed too that they don't offer a pre-order option on the Privias, although Woodbrass in France do. They offer the PX-S3000 on pre-order at 899€ and supposedly can ship it in three weeks…

I definitely will wait. It might just be absolute perfect timing, actually. The PX-S3000 looks so good, now I've watched the videos! The friend who is lending me the Yamaha DGX-640 has been playing it (and only that) for 8 years, so if I'm going to have my first piano for that long, I want it to be the right one.

The PX-S3000 is on the thomann.de site for 755.46€ (at least that's the price it shows for me).


That got me excited! But alas, it shows as 899€ for me here in Germany?? Is it one of those "legal semi-cons" where they can tell what computer you're connecting with, and if it's expensive, the prices go up, I wonder? How odd. Still only on pre-order though. Wonder when I'll be able to touch one…

Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
RosemaryGirl #2815114 02/14/19 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by RosemaryGirl
That got me excited! But alas, it shows as 899€ for me here in Germany?? Is it one of those "legal semi-cons" where they can tell what computer you're connecting with, and if it's expensive, the prices go up, I wonder?

The magic is called "taxes". You pay 143,54 € taxes, our friend from the US doesn't. wink


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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
halherta #2815119 02/14/19 12:37 PM
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But he'll have to pay import duties wink Unless Thomann opened a business in the US although it's highly unlikely they can compete with the established "sharks" over there.


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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
CyberGene #2815122 02/14/19 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
But he'll have to pay import duties wink

Thomann only shows, what they charge on the bill. They collect local taxes inside the EU as every dealership, so these are included in the display price.


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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
halherta #2815134 02/14/19 12:56 PM
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Pre ordered a PX-S3000 from Adam at Kraft. Expected mid to late March.

Last edited by rintincop; 02/14/19 12:58 PM.

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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
halherta #2815137 02/14/19 12:58 PM
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Interesting, PX-5S isn't listed on Thomann anymore, is it due to be updated too?


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Previously: NU1X, ES7, MP6, CA63, RD-700SX, CDP-100, FP-5, P90, SP-200
Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
halherta #2815259 02/14/19 04:32 PM
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I've decided to replace my PX-330 with the S3000, when it becomes available here in Oz. I don't think it sounds fantastic (so far), but if I ever gig with it (unlikely), I'll invoke Dr Popper's prophecy:
"No-one will notice, and even if they do notice, they won't care". 🤣

Greg.

Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
halherta #2815298 02/14/19 05:36 PM
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I sure would like to see the manuals for these. C'mon, Casio!


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Re: Casio PRIVIA PX-S1000 and PX-S3000
TheophilusCarter #2815308 02/14/19 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by TheophilusCarter
I sure would like to see the manuals for these. C'mon, Casio!


The availability of manuals probably has a connection to the proximity of actual retail sales. So I guess we better not hold our breath just yet! sleep


They say extra practice can make up for modesty of talent (up to a point) - I sure hope so...
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