2022 our 25th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Who's Online Now
31 members (crab89, CraiginNZ, bwv543, Cominut, Colin Miles, Andre Fadel, BWV846, Animisha, 9 invisible), 1,226 guests, and 272 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 86
T
Full Member
OP Offline
Full Member
T
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 86
Hi,
Today my student asked me why pressing a key and then relaxing hand (wrist upward) has the rounded and good sound unlike pressing the key and stiff hand which has harsh and ugly sound.
Could you please explain to me in term of piano mechanism?
Thanks

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 19,678
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 19,678
I once saw a demo, using a pencil, where the teacher could make all kinds of qualities of sound with that pencil. I just tried it myself. I was also able to make a harsh and ugly sound with the "relaxing upward", by landing with great speed on the key which translates into force. So is the thing that you want to have explained actually a reality? What I understand is that if you land and keep pressing without any kind of release, it stiffens the hand and arm, which makes fluid playing difficult, and can lead to discomfort and possible injury.

Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 24
W
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
W
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 24
A pianist's finger controls only two things: the volume produced and the length the note is allowed to sound. There is nothing else although an awful lot of people who really should know better imply otherwise.

A loud FF staccato may sound ugly compared to a P that is held until it dies away, but that is a psychological reaction.

Ugliness of sound only becomes meaningful when two or more notes are played. Then we get into the realm of voicing which is another topic.

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 19,678
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 19,678
It was pointed out to me privately that my earlier post sounds like I trying things out and wondering. I was trying to be diplomatic. A loud sound (which some people might consider ugly) is produced by how fast a key is made to descend. It makes the hammer fly at the strings with more force. I was guessing that the OP was referring to loud, but I agree with Waxwing's explanation.

Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 832
Z
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Z
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 832
After the key is pressed, it doesn't matter what you do with your hand, it doesn't affect the sound. My guess is that if your student knows that they are going to have a relaxed hand or stiff hand after pressing the key, this subconsciously influences the way they press the key in the first place, perhaps i.e. they are actually pressing the key with a relaxed or stiff hand, thereby pressing it faster or slower or similar.

Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 6,521
G
6000 Post Club Member
Offline
6000 Post Club Member
G
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 6,521
I did not comment. The idea that any teacher could possible think that we can control the "tone" of a sound on the piano by what we do after we press the keys just made me want to cry.

This is one of the first things I teach every student. We create the illusion of "tone" by how long we hold notes (often with the pedal) and the balance of sound between the fingers (voicing). That's it. The hammer is projected towards the strings by how quickly we start it, and once it's on it's way we have no more control over the result than throwing a brick out a winder and thinking we can mentally change the path or result of the brick falling.

Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 749
T
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
T
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 749
But what your fingers do after they pressed the keys, or more precisely, between they press the keys, is some how a reflection on how they pressed the keys. No?

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,949
8000 Post Club Member
Offline
8000 Post Club Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,949
Originally Posted by The Monkeys
But what your fingers do after they pressed the keys, or more precisely, between they press the keys, is some how a reflection on how they pressed the keys. No?

I don't understand what you are trying to say. What do you mean by "a reflection on"???


Private Piano Teacher and MTAC Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,949
8000 Post Club Member
Offline
8000 Post Club Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 8,949
Originally Posted by Waxwing
Ugliness of sound only becomes meaningful when two or more notes are played.

The quality of the piano has a lot to do with the "ugliness" of sound. There are pianos out there that are incapable of producing any nice sounds, and every single note is ugly.

And there are concert grands out there that have such lovely tone, no matter how hard you bang on the keys, the sound is still beautiful.


Private Piano Teacher and MTAC Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,555
T
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
T
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,555
Originally Posted by Gary D.
I did not comment. The idea that any teacher could possible think that we can control the "tone" of a sound on the piano by what we do after we press the keys just made me want to cry.

This is one of the first things I teach every student. We create the illusion of "tone" by how long we hold notes (often with the pedal) and the balance of sound between the fingers (voicing). That's it. The hammer is projected towards the strings by how quickly we start it, and once it's on it's way we have no more control over the result than throwing a brick out a winder and thinking we can mentally change the path or result of the brick falling.


That is my belief too.
I suspect less than 1% of piano players understand or believe this.


gotta go practice
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 142
B
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
B
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 142
Originally Posted by TimR
Originally Posted by Gary D.
I did not comment. The idea that any teacher could possible think that we can control the "tone" of a sound on the piano by what we do after we press the keys just made me want to cry.

This is one of the first things I teach every student. We create the illusion of "tone" by how long we hold notes (often with the pedal) and the balance of sound between the fingers (voicing). That's it. The hammer is projected towards the strings by how quickly we start it, and once it's on it's way we have no more control over the result than throwing a brick out a winder and thinking we can mentally change the path or result of the brick falling.


That is my belief too.
I suspect less than 1% of piano players understand or believe this.


+2
I also don't believe we control the "tone". Having a relaxed hand and body is good. Tension leads to pain and injury. If your student prefers the tone when he has a relaxed hand, maybe it's because he's feeling better when he's relaxed.


Musician / tuner

Moderated by  platuser 

Link Copied to Clipboard
What's Hot!!
Piano World Has Been Sold!
--------------------
Forums RULES, Terms of Service & HELP
(updated 06/06/2022)
---------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
(ad)
(ad)
New Topics - Multiple Forums
How Much to Sell For?
by TexasMom1 - 04/15/24 10:23 PM
Song lyrics have become simpler and more repetitive
by FrankCox - 04/15/24 07:42 PM
New bass strings sound tubby
by Emery Wang - 04/15/24 06:54 PM
Pianodisc PDS-128+ calibration
by Dalem01 - 04/15/24 04:50 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums43
Topics223,384
Posts3,349,178
Members111,631
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010

Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations |

Advertise on Piano World
| Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map


Copyright © VerticalScope Inc. All Rights Reserved.
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community.