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Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806097 01/24/19 03:37 PM
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Frédéric L Offline
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The damper pedal has been improved and it is like the N3X, although it was a differentiation between N1, N2 and N3. However it would be a pity to have such a pedal inferior than the one of some Clavinova on such a model.


Yamaha CLP150, Bechstein Digital Grand, Garritan CFX, Ivory II pianos, Galaxy pianos, EWQL Pianos, Native-Instrument The Definitive Piano Collection, Soniccouture Hammersmith, Truekeys, Pianoteq
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Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Frédéric L] #2806103 01/24/19 03:48 PM
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Tyrone Slothrop Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Frédéric L
The damper pedal has been improved and it is like the N3X, although it was a differentiation between N1, N2 and N3. However it would be a pity to have such a pedal inferior than the one of some Clavinova on such a model.

I'm looking at the specs and for the N1X, it says "GP Responsive Damper Pedal" but for the N3X, it says "Specialized Grand Piano Pedal".


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"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806124 01/24/19 04:32 PM
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arc7urus Offline
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Yamaha press release: "The hammers strike the “strings” (sensors) from below , allowing for precise weighting and adjustments to the hammers and escapement note by note."

Yamaha website: Hammer sensors: Non-contact optical fiber

Has Yamaha developed some optical sensors that manage to have contactless contact or did they just leave the marketing guys unattended for 5 seconds?

Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806132 01/24/19 04:49 PM
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Some remarks based on the website...
- Supports Bluetooth Audio in.
- MIDI over USB. No MIDI over Bluetooth.
- The Smart Pianist app requires an USB connection or Wi-Fi connection (with extra adapter).
- No USB-Audio (at least with the current firmware).

Feature-wise, the N1X seems to use the same samples and hardware as the NU1X. But I wonder why it does not ship with the same firmware version that added UBS-Audio support to the CLP-600 and NU1X. Also don't understand why it does not include the same set of voices/instruments as the CLP-685. Anyway, I am mostly curious to understand if the sensors were changed or not.

Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806133 01/24/19 04:50 PM
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lophiomys Offline
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Nice find.
Quote
The hammers strike the “strings” (sensors) from below

... would be a sentence I have only read in the context of the Alpha Piano, who do have a patent (IIRC) on a new type of sensor, which is hit by the felt hammer of a Renner action, as it would be the string in a real grand piano. see
http://www.alpha-pianos.com/printed...ption-of-alpha-pianos-sensor-technology/

Propably the marketing people of Yamaha want to lift the N1X up to the level of the Alpha piano by using a fuzzy description?
A shame that they do not offer any tech photos of the N1X action on their web site.

Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: arc7urus] #2806150 01/24/19 05:43 PM
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Originally Posted by arc7urus
Yamaha press release: "The hammers strike the “strings” (sensors) from below , allowing for precise weighting and adjustments to the hammers and escapement note by note."


It should have been "strike the strings" - badly placed quotes!

Osho


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Kawai Novus NV10 + VST. Current VST favorites (in the order of preference): VSL Synchron Concert D//Garritan CFX/Pianoteq 6/Embertone Walker D Full

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Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806151 01/24/19 05:44 PM
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Is there any information on whether N1X's action is identical to that of N1 or are there any improvements?

Osho


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Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806152 01/24/19 05:45 PM
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Time to trade in my CLP-685... or do I hold off for an acoustic grand. Argh...


Now learning: Chopin C# minor Nocturne (posth) and C minor Prelude (big chords), Mozart Sonata in C K. 545
Instruments: Yamaha N1X, Kawai ES110, Roland GO:PIANO
Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Chrispy] #2806154 01/24/19 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by squidbot
Time to trade in my CLP-685... or do I hold off for an acoustic grand. Argh...

I believe with Classic Pianos you should be able to take advantage of their generous Trade-Up policy... should be no problem jumping up to N1X (with full value trade-in) and holding the full trade up value for a grand later, right? laugh

Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Chrispy] #2806160 01/24/19 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by squidbot
Time to trade in my CLP-685... or do I hold off for an acoustic grand. Argh...

I thought you were happy with the CLP-685. Gear acquisition syndrome kicking in? smile

Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Chrispy] #2806162 01/24/19 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by squidbot
Time to trade in my CLP-685... or do I hold off for an acoustic grand. Argh...

Trade in smile. Real acoustic action will get you well prepped for the acoustic grand smile.


Osho


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Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806169 01/24/19 06:11 PM
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So, it looks like expected. A NU1X wrapped in the N1 case. I think i can live without an N1X. wink


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Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Osho] #2806181 01/24/19 06:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Osho
Originally Posted by arc7urus
Yamaha press release: "The hammers strike the “strings” (sensors) from below , allowing for precise weighting and adjustments to the hammers and escapement note by note."


It should have been "strike the strings" - badly placed quotes!

Osho

smile Maybe they have upgraded the action... we will need to wait a while to find that out...

Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: arc7urus] #2806194 01/24/19 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by arc7urus
Some remarks based on the website...
- Supports Bluetooth Audio in.
- MIDI over USB. No MIDI over Bluetooth.
- The Smart Pianist app requires an USB connection or Wi-Fi connection (with extra adapter).
- No USB-Audio (at least with the current firmware).

Feature-wise, the N1X seems to use the same samples and hardware as the NU1X. But I wonder why it does not ship with the same firmware version that added UBS-Audio support to the CLP-600 and NU1X. Also don't understand why it does not include the same set of voices/instruments as the CLP-685. Anyway, I am mostly curious to understand if the sensors were changed or not.


+1 on the missing audio interface.

Why does the NU1X have it, yet the N1/3X do not?
Could this have something to do with the multi-channel system on the N1/3X?
Might it be more “complicated” to implement this into a multi-channel (N1/3X)?

Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806196 01/24/19 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by navindra
I believe with Classic Pianos you should be able to take advantage of their generous Trade-Up policy... should be no problem jumping up to N1X (with full value trade-in) and holding the full trade up value for a grand later, right? laugh


Yes, with digitals it's a 2 year full trade window, so I have to pull the trigger before December. For acoustics, it's lifetime which is interesting, I can keep getting better pianos laugh One day that Bösendorfer will be mine!

Originally Posted by R111
I thought you were happy with the CLP-685. Gear acquisition syndrome kicking in? smile


Though I am, I preferred the N1 action but couldn't live with the 10 year old sound generator. In fact, I actually said I was going to do this smile

Last edited by squidbot; 01/24/19 07:13 PM.

Now learning: Chopin C# minor Nocturne (posth) and C minor Prelude (big chords), Mozart Sonata in C K. 545
Instruments: Yamaha N1X, Kawai ES110, Roland GO:PIANO
Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyr] #2806205 01/24/19 07:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyr
So, it looks like expected. A NU1X wrapped in the N1 case. I think i can live without an N1X. wink

Wait. The NU1X has the same action as the N1,N2,N3? I thought it has a different action?


[Linked Image]
across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806207 01/24/19 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Originally Posted by Tyr
So, it looks like expected. A NU1X wrapped in the N1 case. I think i can live without an N1X. wink

Wait. The NU1X has the same action as the N1,N2,N3? I thought it has a different action?


You're correct Tyrone, the NU1X has an upright action (that's the U in the name), where the N1X has a grand action. I did not care for the NU1X, it felt like, well, an upright, and that's not what I wanted. The N1 has a far superior action to the NU1X IMHO and I assume the N1X will be even more so as it sounds like they've made a few tweaks. Can't wait to try one.


Now learning: Chopin C# minor Nocturne (posth) and C minor Prelude (big chords), Mozart Sonata in C K. 545
Instruments: Yamaha N1X, Kawai ES110, Roland GO:PIANO
Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Chrispy] #2806209 01/24/19 07:37 PM
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Tyrone Slothrop Offline OP
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Originally Posted by squidbot
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Originally Posted by Tyr
So, it looks like expected. A NU1X wrapped in the N1 case. I think i can live without an N1X. wink

Wait. The NU1X has the same action as the N1,N2,N3? I thought it has a different action?


You're correct Tyrone, the NU1X has an upright action (that's the U in the name), where the N1X has a grand action. I did not care for the NU1X, it felt like, well, an upright, and that's not what I wanted. The N1 has a far superior action to the NU1X IMHO and I assume the N1X will be even more so as it sounds like they've made a few tweaks. Can't wait to try one.

OK. That's what I thought. smile Just startled by Tyr's comment about an NU1X in an N1 case, but I guess he was talking more 'holistically'.


[Linked Image]
across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2806356 01/25/19 03:10 AM
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Frédéric L Offline
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
I'm looking at the specs and for the N1X, it says "GP Responsive Damper Pedal" but for the N3X, it says "Specialized Grand Piano Pedal".

Yes, my mistake...

Interesting to see that Yamaha claims with the GP Responsive pedal that the force feedback is equal to a grand piano pedal with illustrative curves... and with the specialized GP pedal, we have two feedback curves - the pressing curve and the releasing curve.


Yamaha CLP150, Bechstein Digital Grand, Garritan CFX, Ivory II pianos, Galaxy pianos, EWQL Pianos, Native-Instrument The Definitive Piano Collection, Soniccouture Hammersmith, Truekeys, Pianoteq
Re: Yamaha N1X released at NAMM [Re: Pete14] #2806382 01/25/19 04:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Pete14
Originally Posted by arc7urus
Some remarks based on the website...
- Supports Bluetooth Audio in.
- MIDI over USB. No MIDI over Bluetooth.
- The Smart Pianist app requires an USB connection or Wi-Fi connection (with extra adapter).
- No USB-Audio (at least with the current firmware).

Feature-wise, the N1X seems to use the same samples and hardware as the NU1X. But I wonder why it does not ship with the same firmware version that added UBS-Audio support to the CLP-600 and NU1X. Also don't understand why it does not include the same set of voices/instruments as the CLP-685. Anyway, I am mostly curious to understand if the sensors were changed or not.


+1 on the missing audio interface.

Why does the NU1X have it, yet the N1/3X do not?


The N3X was released in the end of 2016. The CLP-600s in mid-2017 and the NU1X in the end of 2017. The NU1X and the CLP-600s (and other models) received in April 2018 the firmware update (2.0) that added bi-directional USB Audio support. The latest N3X firmware (2.0) was released in October 2018, i.e. after the other models, but did not include such upgrade. So, it may happen that N3X's hardware is a generation behind the latest models (NU1X, CLP-600s, ...) and cannot support USB Audio.

Note that the sensor technology used in the NU1X with upright piano action is not the same used in the N models with grand piano action. So, the models with the grand piano action models may use different hardware. This means the hardware in the N1X and N3X may be the same. If this is the case, it may not be possible to have the USB Audio upgrade on the N1X as well. Since Yamaha already upgraded the NU1X, I would say they would have done the same to the N1X/N3X if that was possible.

Quote
Could this have something to do with the multi-channel system on the N1/3X?
Might it be more “complicated” to implement this into a multi-channel (N1/3X)?

Nope. All you need is a digital audio stream, and all of these DPs are already able to record a stereo audio stream as a WAV to an USB device, regardless of the number of channels and other sound technologies. USB Audio is just a means to transmit that digital audio stream using a specific communication protocol. But the DP needs to have a USB controller that supports this. So, the limitation is related to the USB hardware and not to the sound engine.

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