Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.7 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Find a Professional
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Advertise on Piano World

(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Who's Online Now
106 registered members (604Rakuda, AB99, Arty Movie, Brendan, accordeur, 36251, astrotoy, ando, 23 invisible), 1,515 guests, and 6 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Tool for making sheets of random music #2805354
01/23/19 07:34 AM
01/23/19 07:34 AM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 19
Finland
J
Juke Offline OP
Junior Member
Juke  Offline OP
Junior Member
J

Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 19
Finland
Greetings

I have had some extra time in my hands, so I decided to make me a tool to make random piano scores to practice sight reading. Initial idea was to make sheets from random triads to practice pattern recognition. Then it came to my mind that someone else also might need that kind of tool. So I made it available into Internet.

Here it is:

http://cmajor.fi/MusicRandomizer.html

I'd recommend using it making sheet from one type of practice data (e.g. only harmonic triads) and practicing them one hand at time.
When you have created sheet, you can print it, or play it from screen if you have tablet. Hide options button hides everything else but the sheet from screen.

About features and restrictions:
* Any modern browser should be supported. No support for IE. Also some browsers from old phones might not work.
* Page uses HTML5 and Javascript features, so Javascript needs to be enabled from browser. No plugins or other programs needed
* Page supports two clefs, both can be set up independently
* Resulted sheets are totally random. They doesn't make musical sense
* If you want only one clef, select None to clef 2
* Sheet width is fitted to page width automatically
* Printing scores from browser should work fine; pages should change between score's rows
* Scores should work fine also from tablets
* Hide options hides everything else but the score. You need to reload page to get options back
* Page remembers selections of you last sheet. Reset button empties sheet and restores selections to default values.
* No support for different keys
* Only quarter notes
* Clef heights doesn't scale: Notes that goes too far above or below clef are cut

Some features I'd like to implement, if there are interest for this tool or features (just ideas, no promises smile )
* More practice types. e.g. seventh chords
* Support for different keys
* Support for different length notes
* Possibility make "real" music. Things like music that has harmonies in left hand and melody in right hand and it makes at least some musical sense. Or counterpoint, e.g.
* Redesign user interface to make it look more appealing
* Resizing clefs vertically to fit all notes below and above clef regardless how far they are from clef

Feel free to try this. Post a message here if you have questions, problems or ideas about features you'd like to see


Music randomizer:
http://cmajor.fi
(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805356
01/23/19 07:46 AM
01/23/19 07:46 AM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 687
Sweden
Animisha Offline
500 Post Club Member
Animisha  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 687
Sweden
Thank you! It works well. I find these kind of sheets better for reading notes - i.e. play one note at the time and simultaneously say its name, than for practising sight reading, because due to the randomness of the notes, you don't hear it if you make a mistake.


Playing the piano is learning to create, playfully and deeply seriously, our own music in the world.
*
... feeling like the pianist on the Titanic ...
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805368
01/23/19 08:25 AM
01/23/19 08:25 AM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 424
Udachny, North-East Siberia
P
PianoStartsAt33 Offline
Full Member
PianoStartsAt33  Offline
Full Member
P

Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 424
Udachny, North-East Siberia
Cool!
But.... how can Cmajor be changed for another key?


"No succes of failure matters when it's about true vocation". Nicolás Gómez Dávila
“The goal of music is to help people live”. Francis Bebey

Roland LX-706

YoutubeChannel
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: PianoStartsAt33] #2805371
01/23/19 08:34 AM
01/23/19 08:34 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 2,585
In the Ozarks of Missouri
NobleHouse Offline
2000 Post Club Member
NobleHouse  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 2,585
In the Ozarks of Missouri
Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Cool!
But.... how can Cmajor be changed for another key?

Yes, how do you change keys?


[Linked Image]
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805374
01/23/19 08:41 AM
01/23/19 08:41 AM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 687
Sweden
Animisha Offline
500 Post Club Member
Animisha  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 687
Sweden
Read the first post! smile

Originally Posted by Juke


About features and restrictions:
*
*
* No support for different keys


Playing the piano is learning to create, playfully and deeply seriously, our own music in the world.
*
... feeling like the pianist on the Titanic ...
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Animisha] #2805386
01/23/19 08:52 AM
01/23/19 08:52 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 2,585
In the Ozarks of Missouri
NobleHouse Offline
2000 Post Club Member
NobleHouse  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 2,585
In the Ozarks of Missouri
Originally Posted by Animisha
Read the first post! smile

Originally Posted by Juke


About features and restrictions:
*
*
* No support for different keys



Oops!


[Linked Image]
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805404
01/23/19 09:36 AM
01/23/19 09:36 AM
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 2,216
Scotland
Beemer Offline
Bronze Subscriber
Beemer  Offline
Bronze Subscriber
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2013
Posts: 2,216
Scotland
After hiding the options how do you restore them?

Ian


I'm all keyed up
2016 Blüthner Model A
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: NobleHouse] #2805427
01/23/19 10:46 AM
01/23/19 10:46 AM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,262
Reseda, California
J
JohnSprung Offline
Unobtanium Subscriber
JohnSprung  Offline
Unobtanium Subscriber
6000 Post Club Member
J

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,262
Reseda, California
Originally Posted by NobleHouse
Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Cool!
But.... how can Cmajor be changed for another key?

Yes, how do you change keys?


If it could be made to output .MXL or.MCSZ files, you could transpose in MuseScore or another notation editor.


-- J.S.

[Linked Image] [Linked Image]

Knabe Grand # 10927
Yamaha CP33
Kawai FS690
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: JohnSprung] #2805458
01/23/19 11:53 AM
01/23/19 11:53 AM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 687
Sweden
Animisha Offline
500 Post Club Member
Animisha  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 687
Sweden
Originally Posted by JohnSprung
If it could be made to output .MXL or.MCSZ files, you could transpose in MuseScore or another notation editor.


That would be a great feature. Then we can transpose the notes to other keys in MuseScore. smile


Playing the piano is learning to create, playfully and deeply seriously, our own music in the world.
*
... feeling like the pianist on the Titanic ...
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: JohnSprung] #2805459
01/23/19 11:58 AM
01/23/19 11:58 AM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 5,442
Tyrone Slothrop Online content
Tyrone Slothrop  Online Content

5000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 5,442
Originally Posted by JohnSprung
Originally Posted by NobleHouse
Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Cool!
But.... how can Cmajor be changed for another key?

Yes, how do you change keys?

If it could be made to output .MXL or.MCSZ files, you could transpose in MuseScore or another notation editor.

But transpositions between major and minor keys is just a shift of all notes by an equal number of half-steps, and is therefore only a few lines of code (including using for example, a lookup table for remapping accidentals). It hardly merits the additional mechanics of converting in and out of Musescore. Even transposition between between major and minor keys can be done through a single lookup table. The UI to handle multiple keys would be more complicated that the actual transposition algorithm.


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805463
01/23/19 12:04 PM
01/23/19 12:04 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,262
Reseda, California
J
JohnSprung Offline
Unobtanium Subscriber
JohnSprung  Offline
Unobtanium Subscriber
6000 Post Club Member
J

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,262
Reseda, California

Get it into MuseScore and you have not just transposition, but the whole feature set of the editor available to customize what you see.


-- J.S.

[Linked Image] [Linked Image]

Knabe Grand # 10927
Yamaha CP33
Kawai FS690
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805490
01/23/19 12:59 PM
01/23/19 12:59 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 1,654
Warsaw, Poland
Qazsedcft Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Qazsedcft  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 1,654
Warsaw, Poland
Doesn't work on my iPad, which is where I would normally want to use it. The buttons don't seem to do anything.


[Linked Image]
Working on:
Mozart Sonata in G major, K. 283
Moszkowski Etude op. 91 no. 18
Chopin Nocturne in C-sharp minor, op. posth.
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805523
01/23/19 02:36 PM
01/23/19 02:36 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,482
New York City
pianoloverus Online content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
pianoloverus  Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,482
New York City
Originally Posted by Juke
I have had some extra time in my hands, so I decided to make me a tool to make random piano scores to practice sight reading. Initial idea was to make sheets from random triads to practice pattern recognition. Then it came to my mind that someone else also might need that kind of tool. So I made it available into Internet.
While I think it's kind of you to make this available, I think it's more likely people will want to practice sight reading if they read works by great composers as opposed to random music or chords. Most of the best sight readers never 'practiced" sight reading. They just read through tons of scores by the greatest composers because it was so interesting and pleasurable.

Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Qazsedcft] #2805526
01/23/19 02:49 PM
01/23/19 02:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 19
Finland
J
Juke Offline OP
Junior Member
Juke  Offline OP
Junior Member
J

Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 19
Finland
Originally Posted by Beemer
After hiding the options how do you restore them?

Ian

You need to refresh / reload page. There is no other way currently restoring options. I should make that feature; It shouldn't take long to implement.

Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Cool!
But.... how can Cmajor be changed for another key?

Sorry, no different keys yet. For now it probably would be enough to just slap a time signature to start of every row and it should work fine for now.

Originally Posted by JohnSprung
Originally Posted by NobleHouse
Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Cool!
But.... how can Cmajor be changed for another key?

Yes, how do you change keys?

If it could be made to output .MXL or.MCSZ files, you could transpose in MuseScore or another notation editor.

I maybe could do different export options for music. Exporting for MusicXML I need to research how standard works and what data must be in file for it to work. And also learn some more about JavaScript and how it should be done

Originally Posted by Qazsedcft

Doesn't work on my iPad, which is where I would normally want to use it. The buttons don't seem to do anything.

Looks like iPad's browser doesn't support something. I can't test on iPad because I don't have one. Can you try with another browser?


Music randomizer:
http://cmajor.fi
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: pianoloverus] #2805530
01/23/19 02:58 PM
01/23/19 02:58 PM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 19
Finland
J
Juke Offline OP
Junior Member
Juke  Offline OP
Junior Member
J

Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 19
Finland
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Juke
I have had some extra time in my hands, so I decided to make me a tool to make random piano scores to practice sight reading. Initial idea was to make sheets from random triads to practice pattern recognition. Then it came to my mind that someone else also might need that kind of tool. So I made it available into Internet.
While I think it's kind of you to make this available, I think it's more likely people will want to practice sight reading if they read works by great composers as opposed to random music or chords. Most of the best sight readers never 'practiced" sight reading. They just read through tons of scores by the greatest composers because it was so interesting and pleasurable.

That's is true, but not everyone is in level where they can just pick a score and start playing. This can help familiarize oneself with staffs and learn to recognize more common patterns. Of course that kind of practice doesn't sound good and isn't fun, but everything can't be fun smile


Music randomizer:
http://cmajor.fi
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805555
01/23/19 03:54 PM
01/23/19 03:54 PM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 74
Left Coast of US
D
Docbop Offline
Full Member
Docbop  Offline
Full Member
D

Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 74
Left Coast of US
Back in music school when working on sightreading and wanting more they say just turn what your have upside down and read it. Who cares what it sounds like you're working on your eyes and seeing rhythms, melodic fragments, chords. Also to further help eyes read measure in diagonally across and down the page. Be creative.

Learning to sight read is learning to train eyes to see groups of rhythms and groups of notes so your read like you read words in this post. Goal is to be able to read ahead of where your playing anywhere from a two measure to some can read a line at a time. Main thing is seeing rhythmic pattern and just know what are that as fast as seeing the word "dog" or "piano". We had tools to display two beats for a second or two then disappear and show the next two beats. Forcing you to see rhythmic patterns, as time went on it would start showing a measure then make it disappear. Sightreading is like learning to read and speak a spoken/written language you see or hear and instantly know what it means or sounds like.

Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Docbop] #2805609
01/23/19 05:50 PM
01/23/19 05:50 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,482
New York City
pianoloverus Online content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
pianoloverus  Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,482
New York City
Originally Posted by Docbop
Back in music school when working on sightreading and wanting more they say just turn what your have upside down and read it. Who cares what it sounds like you're working on your eyes and seeing rhythms, melodic fragments, chords. Also to further help eyes read measure in diagonally across and down the page. Be creative.
That sounds like a terrible idea, and I frankly find it hard to believe that any serious music school or teacher could make such a recommendation.

I think 99+% would be far more motivated by reading real music, especially of the highest quality, rather than the near gibberish obtained by turning music upside down. Not only that, but the "music" one would be reading would not be like real music so practice would be close to useless.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 01/23/19 05:51 PM.
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805611
01/23/19 05:53 PM
01/23/19 05:53 PM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 19
Finland
J
Juke Offline OP
Junior Member
Juke  Offline OP
Junior Member
J

Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 19
Finland
Small update to Music randomizer:
* Key signature can now be selected
* Clicking "Random score" header hides and shows options


Music randomizer:
http://cmajor.fi
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805627
01/23/19 06:39 PM
01/23/19 06:39 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,262
Reseda, California
J
JohnSprung Offline
Unobtanium Subscriber
JohnSprung  Offline
Unobtanium Subscriber
6000 Post Club Member
J

Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,262
Reseda, California

Come to think of it, if the score is random, the key signature could also just be random....


-- J.S.

[Linked Image] [Linked Image]

Knabe Grand # 10927
Yamaha CP33
Kawai FS690
Re: Tool for making sheets of random music [Re: Juke] #2805726
01/24/19 01:45 AM
01/24/19 01:45 AM
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 395
India
Tech-key Offline
Full Member
Tech-key  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 395
India
Randomising key signatures by default can be a little daunting for newish students. But an option to randomise can be added in the “Key Signature” drop-down.

Congrats Juke, your tool works!
Maybe you can add levels like easy, medium, hard, etc. I see that these levels can still be simulated to some extent, by playing around with the UI options. But it would be nice, if some combinations were bundled together into levels. It will make it accessible to a big bunch of people right away.

Originally Posted by Juke
Possibility make "real" music. Things like music that has harmonies in left hand and melody in right hand and it makes at least some musical sense. Or counterpoint, e.g.

This future feature sounds promising. So are the two clefs completely independent of each other currently? Or you have already linked them together to some extent?


Think Twice, Play Once
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  BB Player 

(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq Bechstein
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Rare condition makes music painful for pianist
by FrankCox. 08/17/19 06:47 PM
Rare condition makes music painful for pianist
by FrankCox. 08/17/19 06:46 PM
What brand of hammers are these from the 80's?
by Piano Danno. 08/17/19 06:23 PM
Finally accepting reality
by KevinM. 08/17/19 04:59 PM
Looking at fingers or the music score
by Moo :). 08/17/19 04:08 PM
What's Hot!!
PIANO TEACHERS Please read this!
-------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
Forum Statistics
Forums41
Topics193,586
Posts2,859,787
Members94,172
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers


Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2019 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1