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Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tech-key] #2803969
01/19/19 01:23 PM
01/19/19 01:23 PM
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Portland, OR
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Quote
I have the music-theory app, but didn't use it much after the initial days. Mostly because, I read somewhere that identifying intervals is more important while sight-reading. But now I see that you guys are working on note recognition too. A little confused now.. Which one (intervals/note-identification) helps when? Or do they somehow work together in synergy?

That’s the kind of taking forum posts as gospel that gets beginners in trouble. You need to be able to do both, and then combine the two when doing sight reading as strictly defined, i.e. reading unfamiliar music at tempo (not relevant to beginners in their first method book). If you’re still doing “E... B... G...” and memorizing, you definitely need technological (or flash card) intervention.

Last edited by tangleweeds; 01/19/19 01:24 PM.

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Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...] #2804225
01/20/19 01:45 AM
01/20/19 01:45 AM
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But what I had originally come here for was to share this:


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Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Progman] #2804311
01/20/19 10:49 AM
01/20/19 10:49 AM
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Progman,
I sometimes do the EXACT same thing, and the results invariably suffer. I tend to skip counting pretty early on, in pieces with lyrics. And recently have noticed that leads to some shoddy rhythm. Don't worry. You are definitely not alone in this. Good luck on your counting spree! Let us know how it works out.. Working on the book now, or some other stuff?

Mrshaund,
Thanks for your support! Misery loves company smile


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2804321
01/20/19 11:34 AM
01/20/19 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Give Tenuto a try. After all, you must have even purchased it (since it isn't free). It is really a power-app for music theory, and in this case, recognition of various sorts. Give it a try in the simplest note recognition mode.

I remember getting Tenuto for ear training. It was heavily recommended everywhere. But I failed the tests spectacularly. Also realised that its a newer version of the MusicTheory app, with a slicker UI and some added exercises. I will use it for Note Recognition now, and think of Ear Training later. Trying too many things at a time, gets a little overwhelming for me. Baby steps.. Thanks for bringing this app to our notice!

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

Well, it did win the National Book Award here in the States and almost 5 decades later, it perennially appears in lists of the top 100 novels of all time. However, along the lines of your Pulitzer quote (which was just mean spirited), I loved reading this 'meta-'review of the novel! grin Anyways, I'm sure Pynchon just laughs all the way to the bank about this sort of snarky crapola. I love many of his other novels, and my other favorites include Mason & Dixon & The Crying of Lot 49

Didn't mean to sound mean and all. Was just having fun! This Tyron guy seems like quite a colourful character. I read the hilarious reviews you attached. You also mentioned two other books; one of which again makes an appearance in the Time's 100 list. I gather his books are rather cerebral? So I may start with this one, as it's shorter, and will probably be a nice introduction to Pynchon's works.

Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop

My piano has been keeping me from stuff too. A good friend gave me a Playstation VR headset for Christmas. Sadly, four weeks later, it is still in its box unopened, something I feel guilty about since they are hardly a cheap present. But the piano gives me little time for anything else consuming (and gaming is a bit consuming).

Haha.. Gaming can sure get very addictive. My husband is not a gamer per se, but he plays PubG all the time. I keep telling him, "If you practiced piano for all those hours, you'd be a virtuoso by now." Most likely, his fingers would fall off. But let the man dream..

And play your video games once in a while. No need to ditch old loves for new ones.. Be promiscuous like your namesake cool


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: tangleweeds] #2804325
01/20/19 11:42 AM
01/20/19 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by tangleweeds

sight reading as strictly defined, i.e. reading unfamiliar music at tempo.

This! Thank you tangleweeds for the on-point definition. Will definitely try to get add some genuine 'sight reading' in my practise routine. I just learn some new pieces half bakedly, and think I'm on top of my "reading" game.

Originally Posted by tangleweeds

If you’re still doing “E... B... G...” and memorizing, you definitely need technological (or flash card) intervention.

Needed to hear this to step out of the comfort zone.


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tech-key] #2804333
01/20/19 12:16 PM
01/20/19 12:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Tech-key
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
However, along the lines of your Pulitzer quote (which was just mean spirited)

Didn't mean to sound mean and all. Was just having fun!

Oops. I didn't mean to imply you were being mean spirited! You pulling that quote was fun smile I meant the Pulitzer reviewers who originated the quote were nasty grouches. wink


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Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2804340
01/20/19 12:32 PM
01/20/19 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Oops. I didn't mean to imply you were being mean spirited! You pulling that quote was fun smile I meant the Pulitzer reviewers who originated the quote were nasty grouches. wink


Ohh, now I see what you meant! My friends don't call me a tubelight for no reason.


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tech-key] #2804417
01/20/19 04:16 PM
01/20/19 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Tech-key
Progman,
I sometimes do the EXACT same thing, and the results invariably suffer. I tend to skip counting pretty early on, in pieces with lyrics. And recently have noticed that leads to some shoddy rhythm. Don't worry. You are definitely not alone in this. Good luck on your counting spree! Let us know how it works out.. Working on the book now, or some other stuff?



Thanks Tech-key. I am utterly convinced this is a critical skill. I've noticed the last few days there are some common things that throw me off while counting. The most obvious one is when you see a finger number on a measure and I pick up that number instead of the beat count. The other thing I notice is that certain note configurations are hard for me to count with a constant beat. An example is an eighth note followed by dotted note - for some reason it throws off my beat count. So I just do it real slow and repeat it so it will eventually be more natural for me.

I am putting aside my 2 outside method book songs temporarily while I work on this. In the method book I am doing Blues for Wynton Marsalis, Can-can and Marines Hymn. Just started doing RH on Why am I Blue.

BTW - I think we were both working on the lead sheet version of We wish you a Merry Christmas - was that you? I think that is a valuable exercise because you have to learn way more chords and you have to get better at moving you hands around and finding those keys smoothly. I will get back to that after I get better on counting out loud....


Progman
Baldwin Console + Kawai ES100
Alfreds bk 1 + Teacher
Long Live ELP
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Progman] #2804568
01/21/19 02:52 AM
01/21/19 02:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Progman

I've noticed the last few days there are some common things that throw me off while counting. The most obvious one is when you see a finger number on a measure and I pick up that number instead of the beat count.

I do this too. LOL.. It's like the opposite of "Great minds think alike" for the two of us smile. I also get a little disconcerted, when a phrase doesn't start on the first beat.

Like you, I am also concentrating on Alfred's this week. The little break I had, increased my appreciation for this book.

Originally Posted by Progman

BTW - I think we were both working on the lead sheet version of We wish you a Merry Christmas - was that you? I think that is a valuable exercise because you have to learn way more chords and you have to get better at moving you hands around and finding those keys smoothly. I will get back to that after I get better on counting out loud....

Yeah, it was me. That was fun and not very difficult because I struck off some of the chords in the sheet. I'm taking all kinds of short cuts.. I have started paying some attention to the PianoForAll course, as it teaches some accompaniment patterns. This may or may not help with lead sheets. Will let you know, if it does. I absolutely need to get better at playing from those, as there aren't many easy sheets available for the popular songs of my country; especially for the ones that I like. So I will mostly have to create my own simple lead sheets with the notes I can find on the internet.

But all this will happen way in the future. I am trying to be patient after a short pep talk from my husband last night. I was ranting about my slow progress and stuff. Then he said something of this nature- "Continue your lessons for the next 2-3 years, without worrying about constant improvement. Just keep doing the right things". It helped mostly because.. it took a lot of pressure off. If no-one expects us to get better quickly, we can enjoy the journey more.


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tech-key] #2804666
01/21/19 11:18 AM
01/21/19 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Tech-key
[quote=Progman]

But all this will happen way in the future. I am trying to be patient after a short pep talk from my husband last night. I was ranting about my slow progress and stuff. Then he said something of this nature- "Continue your lessons for the next 2-3 years, without worrying about constant improvement. Just keep doing the right things". It helped mostly because.. it took a lot of pressure off. If no-one expects us to get better quickly, we can enjoy the journey more.



Your husband is right, I am now thinking the first 2 years is like kindergarten. Part of enjoying the journey for me is to not get mad at mistakes but treat them like my body is telling me something and I need to consider that more carefully. This attitude is helping me become more attuned to what exactly what/where my mistakes are and I can think about why that happens and how to fix it. It's like the counting thing I mentioned earlier, I have identified 3 specific mistakes that happen and now that I am fully aware of what those are it is easier to address each of them. I got this process from the book 'The Perfect Wrong Note' that I am reading which came recommended by senior members here. Patience is key with this approach - not my strong-suit - but I believe this makes sense and going to stick to this.


Progman
Baldwin Console + Kawai ES100
Alfreds bk 1 + Teacher
Long Live ELP
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Progman] #2804687
01/21/19 12:53 PM
01/21/19 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Progman
Part of enjoying the journey for me is to not get mad at mistakes but treat them like my body is telling me something and I need to consider that more carefully. This attitude is helping me become more attuned to what exactly what/where my mistakes are and I can think about why that happens and how to fix it. It's like the counting thing I mentioned earlier, I have identified 3 specific mistakes that happen and now that I am fully aware of what those are it is easier to address each of them.


May I ask what the other 2 mistakes are? I can bet, I'm making them all. After you mentioned the counting thing yesterday, I put in a lot of effort into doing it correctly today. Also after so many people suggested to start note-reading, I got some of that done too. After many days, I'm feeling I practised somewhat properly today. So maybe your other mistakes.. strike that.. other realisations may help us too!

I will start with my big 3. There are several many, but these came to my mind first.

1) Getting cocky too early, and ditching counting as soon as I get a semblance of the rhythm.
2) Giving into the temptation to play through the whole piece. I do start slowly, going measure by measure. But as soon as I get comfortable with the notes, I start playing the whole thing together. Over and over..
3) I don't know how to explain this. But my left and right hands sometimes don't land on the keys together. There is a split second gap. I don't know how to solve it yet. But I think slow practise may do the trick.


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tech-key] #2804957
01/22/19 09:29 AM
01/22/19 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Tech-key


May I ask what the other 2 mistakes are? I can bet, I'm making them all. After you mentioned the counting thing yesterday, I put in a lot of effort into doing it correctly today. Also after so many people suggested to start note-reading, I got some of that done too. After many days, I'm feeling I practised somewhat properly today. So maybe your other mistakes.. strike that.. other realisations may help us too!

I will start with my big 3. There are several many, but these came to my mind first.

1) Getting cocky too early, and ditching counting as soon as I get a semblance of the rhythm.
2) Giving into the temptation to play through the whole piece. I do start slowly, going measure by measure. But as soon as I get comfortable with the notes, I start playing the whole thing together. Over and over..
3) I don't know how to explain this. But my left and right hands sometimes don't land on the keys together. There is a split second gap. I don't know how to solve it yet. But I think slow practise may do the trick.



The 3 mistakes I mentioned previously were all types of mistakes I make while counting out loud:
1) while counting i come across a finger number notation on the score and instead of saying the beat number I say the finger number...then when i get to the end of the measure (for 4/4) i am no longer saying 4 is the last beat but something else.
2) while counting i will instead of saying 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 i will say 1 & 2 & 1 & 2.....this happens when there is symmetry in the melody
3) while counting i will no longer have a uniform counting beat when I run across certain note configurations....like an eighth note followed by a dotted note.

And then last night I ran across a new one....different than 3) above I found myself counting with an irregular beat. I had a different pause on either side of the &.....so it was 1& 2&, that pause between the & 2 was bigger than the pause between 1&.

Jeez, I sound like a basket case! I am actually getting better, just now I am spending more time thinking/understanding my errors and I think that helps me correct them. This is about training my brain to be metronome - not being effected by all the other stuff going on.

For the 3 you mentioned - I think 1 and 2 are really strategies while 3 is more like a technical error. I did the #1 and that is why I have not become very good at counting. This is what I intend to stop doing. I do the #2 also. What i am trying to do now is recognize early on what measure(s) give a problem and then work on those (my teacher is really good at this). What I think I am discovering is that I am not consistently looking ahead while playing to be prepared for what's next. For your #3, your diagnosis sounds reasonable if this happens all the time. If it only happens occasionally, it might do to look at what specific notes you are playing or where you are in measure when it happens.

On with the journey!


Progman
Baldwin Console + Kawai ES100
Alfreds bk 1 + Teacher
Long Live ELP
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...] #2804967
01/22/19 10:12 AM
01/22/19 10:12 AM
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It's good that you are identifying the mistakes well.

I was having some problem with Got Those Blues. This tutorial helped me loads in getting the swing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwTUi5pPcRY

I realised today while working with the metronome on this piece, that I was stretching the long-short notes for too long. If that makes any sense.. What I mean is, the long-short notes together were taking more time than the assigned one beat. Happy I caught that early, as I'm diligent this week. Normally, the metronome comes out on the eve of my lessons.

Hopefully, you'll turn into a human metronome soon enough! Keep ticking smile


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tech-key] #2805162
01/22/19 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Tech-key

I was having some problem with Got Those Blues. This tutorial helped me loads in getting the swing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwTUi5pPcRY

A bit OT but - her piano sounds quite harsh to my untrained ears on some keys, is that a sign of maybe needing a tune? or is it a youtube audio artifact?


They say extra practice can make up for modesty of talent (up to a point) - I sure hope so...
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: gerhard_k] #2805287
01/23/19 03:03 AM
01/23/19 03:03 AM
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Originally Posted by gerhard_k
Originally Posted by Tech-key

I was having some problem with Got Those Blues. This tutorial helped me loads in getting the swing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwTUi5pPcRY

A bit OT but - her piano sounds quite harsh to my untrained ears on some keys, is that a sign of maybe needing a tune? or is it a youtube audio artifact?


If you are working from this book, and curious about how this piece sounds on a really high end instrument, check this out:


Sadly, my ears are as untrained as yours. Can't tell whether either pianos are in tune or not.


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tech-key] #2805553
01/23/19 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Tech-key
Originally Posted by gerhard_k
Originally Posted by Tech-key

I was having some problem with Got Those Blues. This tutorial helped me loads in getting the swing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwTUi5pPcRY

A bit OT but - her piano sounds quite harsh to my untrained ears on some keys, is that a sign of maybe needing a tune? or is it a youtube audio artifact?


If you are working from this book, and curious about how this piece sounds on a really high end instrument, check this out:


Sadly, my ears are as untrained as yours. Can't tell whether either pianos are in tune or not.


Well, Tech-key, that second version sounds a lot more pleasant to my ears. The first one sounds almost like one of those bar-room pianos in an old Western film!

Anyone else feel like chiming in?


They say extra practice can make up for modesty of talent (up to a point) - I sure hope so...
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...] #2809673
02/01/19 10:42 PM
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Time for an update. I have slowed down the last couple of weeks but getting back at it more diligently now. I knocked out 'Can-Can' and 'Why Am I Blue' at lesson this week - I performed well enough that she jumped me into the A-minor Key section. She's starting me with 'Greensleeves' and 'Go Down Moses'. I haven't touched 'What a Wonderful World' in almost 2 weeks and get back to it tomorrow. It's a bit challenging with the counting so I have focused on that the last 2 weeks and am now a better counter. I am hoping to make that piece really musical and keep it for awhile.

There's a really good thread on ABF 'Holly's Diary' which is appropriate for us as the discussion is about details of practicing. She's about a year ahead of us. She mentioned she spends only 10-15 minutes per piece each session. Kelso ('nothing is too easy') piped in that one can just do the 10-15 minutes every other day and learn faster (he has this cup analogy that I think is true). Interesting stuff!

Last edited by Progman; 02/01/19 10:45 PM.

Progman
Baldwin Console + Kawai ES100
Alfreds bk 1 + Teacher
Long Live ELP
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...] #2810204
02/03/19 01:01 PM
02/03/19 01:01 PM
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I too didn't update here as I missed my lessons last week, and spent my time working on other stuff. This week we started on Chiapanecas. As you can see, we skipped quite a few. I'm finding this one rather tricky, especially the different repeats in both parts. Good thing is I really like this piece. And all the ones that follow from here, give or take a couple. But there is this guilt, for I see I've jumped exactly 8 pieces!

The concept of 10-15 minutes every alternate day is interesting. By accident I've already experienced this in the past. And I can vouch for the fact that it works just fine. I've never tried to follow this in a systematic manner though. I'll try this in the coming weeks with the skipped ones I mentioned above, as I can't think of any other way of getting these done in a timely fashion.

Good to hear that your counting has got better! The hard work paid off smile


Think Twice, Play Once
Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Mark...] #2810220
02/03/19 01:48 PM
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Just a couple of comments on things I've read here. First, while the fingering recommendations are a good guide they should not be considered gospel. Some people may have difficulty with a particular sequence of changes. If something else works better for you go for it. As long as you can hit the correct notes in the right sequence and timing you are doing it correctly. Second some instruments have different tones and different people will react differently to them. One of our friends has a Yamaha baby grand that she loves and keeps tuned religiously. Yet to me it sounds harsh and I dislike it. Go figure!


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A lack of talent does not stop you from learning piano. It just takes longer and you have to work harder.

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Re: Alfred's Basic and ALL in One Adult Piano Course Book #1 [Re: Tech-key] #2810313
02/03/19 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Tech-key
Played absolutely horribly in my lessons today. And I really practised this time (I swear!). The piece was the Schumann Landler I mentioned last time.
Currently, I'm playing on weighted keys at home, and today I got the un-weighted keyboard at my lesson.
>> The keys were also a lot smaller in size. <<
There is just one DP in the studio, and whoever is having a "lucky day", gets it. So I need to play equally well on both weighted and un-weighted keys.


I was just reading through this thread. The >> << quote above really struck me, and I'm surprised nobody else picked up on that. Am I reading correctly that your teacher expects you to jump from full-size keys to under-size, just like that? No wonder your fingers can't hit the right notes, they're not where you've been practicing all this time for them to be !!

I would think that the key size is much more of a problem than the weighted vs. un-weighted issue.

My first advice would be for you to find a different teaching studio, that is just inexcusable to have keyboards with under-size keys. Those lessons must be really cheap to put up with such a compromise !


They say extra practice can make up for modesty of talent (up to a point) - I sure hope so...
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What to look for in a teacher
by ChiralSpiral. 07/15/19 03:49 PM
Kawai RX-1A vs Kawai GL20
by Rstles. 07/15/19 10:49 AM
Advice needed: make Schimmel sp182t silent?
by pianogabe. 07/15/19 09:41 AM
I didn't know that I play too slow and hesitate too.
by PianoWVBob. 07/15/19 08:09 AM
What's Hot!!
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