 |
Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments. Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers
(it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!
|
|
83 members (axomas, accordeur, Calavera, 80k, BillS728, Brendan, brennbaer, 19 invisible),
2,574
guests, and
338
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 832
500 Post Club Member
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 832 |
Yeah I mean I'm a massive fan of Krystian Zimerman, as people on here have probably noticed by now. Primarily for his out of tune humming, but aside from that, he's also quite a good piano player.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 25
Full Member
|
Full Member
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 25 |
Whatever facial ticks, choreography, flat fingers or curved, emotive gyrations, clothing, jewelry, humming, conducting or any other actions the pianist takes to play musically is fine with me. +1As all of this really has NOTHING to do with the sounds / music -- being produced by the player. 
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 32,639
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
|
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 32,639 |
Whatever facial ticks, choreography, flat fingers or curved, emotive gyrations, clothing, jewelry, humming, conducting or any other actions the pianist takes to play musically is fine with me. +1As all of this really has NOTHING to do with the sounds / music -- being produced by the player.  But it is related to the visual aspect of the performance which is relevant if not the most critical part.
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 6,177
6000 Post Club Member
|
OP
6000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 6,177 |
Whatever facial ticks, choreography, flat fingers or curved, emotive gyrations, clothing, jewelry, humming, conducting or any other actions the pianist takes to play musically is fine with me. +1As all of this really has NOTHING to do with the sounds / music -- being produced by the player.  But it is related to the visual aspect of the performance which is relevant if not the most critical part. It's not the most important part, but easily 50%.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,328
9000 Post Club Member
|
9000 Post Club Member
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 9,328 |
Whatever facial ticks, choreography, flat fingers or curved, emotive gyrations, clothing, jewelry, humming, conducting or any other actions the pianist takes to play musically is fine with me. +1As all of this really has NOTHING to do with the sounds / music -- being produced by the player.  But it is related to the visual aspect of the performance which is relevant if not the most critical part. It's not the most important part, but easily 50%. This is some nonsense right here.
Regards,
Polyphonist
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,430
2000 Post Club Member
|
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,430 |
Whatever facial ticks, choreography, flat fingers or curved, emotive gyrations, clothing, jewelry, humming, conducting or any other actions the pianist takes to play musically is fine with me. +1As all of this really has NOTHING to do with the sounds / music -- being produced by the player.  But it is related to the visual aspect of the performance which is relevant if not the most critical part. It's not the most important part, but easily 50%. Agree.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 2,566
2000 Post Club Member
|
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 2,566 |
Before Christmas I was at a church service. And a man played "O Holy Night" with his body swinging gently L & R like a pendulum. I assumed this is what "flowing" in the tempo description means... your body flows with the music. Didn't look distracting from the audience although wouldn't make a difference to the sound.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917
500 Post Club Member
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917 |
What a ridiculous comment I wouldn't pay to see a robot, but an emotional pianist is just fine. You need to get over that.
Last edited by Lakeviewsteve; 01/22/19 09:49 PM.
Bösendorfer 170
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917
500 Post Club Member
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917 |
I thought she played wonderful. It was a very strange recording though because I heard crickets as though the orchestra was out in the woods or something.
Bösendorfer 170
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917
500 Post Club Member
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917 |
The piano player416:
Actually moving the body back and fourth, or even slightly doing so is something my master piano instructor insists on. He is also an orthopedic surgeon. It's all part of relaxing and flowing with the music. If you feel stiff while playing it is because you are not moving and just want to stiffen up instead. There is a big big difference in how the music sounds, much better when relaxed and swaying than when stiff and rigid.
Steve
Bösendorfer 170
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,878
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
|
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,878 |
Before Christmas I was at a church service. And a man played "O Holy Night" with his body swinging gently L & R like a pendulum. [...] Then there's Stevie Wonder! Talk about swaying back and forth! Regards,
BruceD - - - - - Estonia 190
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,272
6000 Post Club Member
|
6000 Post Club Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 6,272 |
Actually moving the body back and fourth, or even slightly doing so is something my master piano instructor insists on. He is also an orthopedic surgeon. It's all part of relaxing and flowing with the music. I have a guess -- and your instructor may be the perfect person to determine if this is reasonable: I think that moving may recalibrate your proprioception. If you sit still, your brain is stuck with stale data from when you last moved your muscles.
-- J.S. ![[Linked Image]](http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/gallery/42/thumbs/7589.jpg) Knabe Grand # 10927 Yamaha CP33 Kawai FS690
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 32,639
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
|
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 32,639 |
Actually moving the body back and fourth, or even slightly doing so is something my master piano instructor insists on. He is also an orthopedic surgeon. It's all part of relaxing and flowing with the music. If you feel stiff while playing it is because you are not moving and just want to stiffen up instead. There is a big big difference in how the music sounds, much better when relaxed and swaying than when stiff and rigid.
But some of the greatest pianists in history have been basically motionless with their bodies. This does mean I think this is the best way of playing as other great pianists have moved quite a bit while playing. I do not think non swaying automatically means stiff.
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,878
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
|
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 25,878 |
[...] I do not think non swaying automatically means stiff.
I agree. One can be perfectly relaxed while sitting quite still. Regards,
BruceD - - - - - Estonia 190
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917
500 Post Club Member
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917 |
Actually moving the body back and fourth, or even slightly doing so is something my master piano instructor insists on. He is also an orthopedic surgeon. It's all part of relaxing and flowing with the music. If you feel stiff while playing it is because you are not moving and just want to stiffen up instead. There is a big big difference in how the music sounds, much better when relaxed and swaying than when stiff and rigid.
But some of the greatest pianists in history have been basically motionless with their bodies. This does mean I think this is the best way of playing as other great pianists have moved quite a bit while playing. I do not think non swaying automatically means stiff. I agree with you but never said not moving automatically means stiff. Horowitz is an example. When you see videos of him, he is pretty still but seems to have a deep innate feeling of relaxation about him.
Bösendorfer 170
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 32,639
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
|
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 32,639 |
Actually moving the body back and fourth, or even slightly doing so is something my master piano instructor insists on. He is also an orthopedic surgeon. It's all part of relaxing and flowing with the music. If you feel stiff while playing it is because you are not moving and just want to stiffen up instead. There is a big big difference in how the music sounds, much better when relaxed and swaying than when stiff and rigid.
But some of the greatest pianists in history have been basically motionless with their bodies. This does mean I think this is the best way of playing as other great pianists have moved quite a bit while playing. I do not think non swaying automatically means stiff. I agree with you but never said not moving automatically means stiff. Horowitz is an example. When you see videos of him, he is pretty still but seems to have a deep innate feeling of relaxation about him. But you did say that your instructor insists on moving your body back and forth. Why insist on that if not doing it is not detrimental, i.e. does not cause stiffness? You also contrasted swaying and relaxed with stiff and rigid.
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,430
2000 Post Club Member
|
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 2,430 |
Actually moving the body back and fourth, or even slightly doing so is something my master piano instructor insists on. He is also an orthopedic surgeon. It's all part of relaxing and flowing with the music. If you feel stiff while playing it is because you are not moving and just want to stiffen up instead. There is a big big difference in how the music sounds, much better when relaxed and swaying than when stiff and rigid.
But some of the greatest pianists in history have been basically motionless with their bodies. This does mean I think this is the best way of playing as other great pianists have moved quite a bit while playing. I do not think non swaying automatically means stiff. I agree with you but never said not moving automatically means stiff. Horowitz is an example. When you see videos of him, he is pretty still but seems to have a deep innate feeling of relaxation about him. But you did say that your instructor insists on moving your body back and forth. Why insist on that if not doing it is not detrimental, i.e. does not cause stiffness? You also contrasted swaying and relaxed with stiff and rigid. Swaying is a way to overcome stiffness (in other words, tension) in the body for those who have it. For those who have not it's not necessary.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 878
500 Post Club Member
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 878 |
I have a vague memory of being told that traditionally (going a long way back, I suppose) people were taught to play with a coin on the back of each hand - if it fell off, the pupil had poor technique. Perhaps (if this true) they were aiming for elegance and, of course, the dreaded using fingers like hammers technique. Certainly a far cry from today's performers - and was it John Field who commented that Liszt played like an animal?
regards Pete
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917
500 Post Club Member
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 917 |
Actually moving the body back and fourth, or even slightly doing so is something my master piano instructor insists on. He is also an orthopedic surgeon. It's all part of relaxing and flowing with the music. If you feel stiff while playing it is because you are not moving and just want to stiffen up instead. There is a big big difference in how the music sounds, much better when relaxed and swaying than when stiff and rigid.
But some of the greatest pianists in history have been basically motionless with their bodies. This does mean I think this is the best way of playing as other great pianists have moved quite a bit while playing. I do not think non swaying automatically means stiff. I agree with you but never said not moving automatically means stiff. Horowitz is an example. When you see videos of him, he is pretty still but seems to have a deep innate feeling of relaxation about him. But you did say that your instructor insists on moving your body back and forth. Why insist on that if not doing it is not detrimental, i.e. does not cause stiffness? You also contrasted swaying and relaxed with stiff and rigid. pianoloverus: I give up with you again.
Last edited by Lakeviewsteve; 01/23/19 08:12 PM.
Bösendorfer 170
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 832
500 Post Club Member
|
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 832 |
I think the important thing here is to maintain an ergonomic and relaxed demeanor.
If, like me, you are a fairly static player in terms of bodily movement then so be it. If you are a "swaying" player then so be it.
However, I can't understand this advice to try and encourage people to move more or move less. If you encourage a swayer to sit still, you're restricting them, and if you encourage a static to sway more you're just encouraging a contrived movement. I don't think teachers should be doing this.
There are maybe certain things to advise, for example, one must lean when playing for ergonomic reasons, both to the left and right, and forwards and backwards. Also, one cannot move so much that one is affecting the accuracy of one's playing.
As for describing static players as "robots" - ridiculous IMHO. That's just complaining that there's not enough bread and circus accompanying the performance. There's a certain intensity that goes with a static player that IMHO can amplify one's concentration on the music. Rubenstein, Hamelin, Petrov, Horowitz. Don't see too many complaints about those guys.
Static or swaying - both are ok in my book. I pay to hear the music and watch the hands. I don't care what the performer does with their body.
|
|
|
Forums43
Topics213,679
Posts3,203,396
Members105,650
|
Most Online15,252 Mar 21st, 2010
|
|
|
|
|
|