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Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand #2801275
01/12/19 03:05 PM
01/12/19 03:05 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
Tyrone Slothrop Offline OP
Tyrone Slothrop  Offline OP


Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
Youtube copyright claims seem to be getting out of hand. From Internet pianist, Rousseau:
[Linked Image]

Some his performances cited as infringing are:




Some PW members have complained about this form of harassment of small independent musicians, including PW member johnlewisgrant here.


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
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Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801308
01/12/19 04:34 PM
01/12/19 04:34 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 744
Melville Saskatchewan
F
FrankCox Offline
500 Post Club Member
FrankCox  Offline
500 Post Club Member
F

Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 744
Melville Saskatchewan
I can see where this is annoying (and probably unfair) but if you're using Google's services then you have to follow Google's rules, for better or for worse.

And Google is such a huge outfit that they won't notice you complaining about unfair treatment. "Talk to the great white wall."

You may wish to consider setting up your own webpage where you will actually have some control.


If you're a zombie and you know it, bite your friend!
We got both kinds of music: Country and Western!
Casio Celviano AP-650
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801325
01/12/19 05:14 PM
01/12/19 05:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,936
In the Ozarks of Missouri
NobleHouse Offline
1000 Post Club Member
NobleHouse  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,936
In the Ozarks of Missouri


[Linked Image]
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801330
01/12/19 05:27 PM
01/12/19 05:27 PM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 96
Romania
M
Mosotti Offline
Full Member
Mosotti  Offline
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M

Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 96
Romania
Youtube is run by a bunch of idiots. And so is Facebook. I wanted to post my Bach prelude and I got a claim from Sony Music Entertainment (I'm a 1 year beginner, so maybe their musicians suck lol). I've written a very angry dispute calling them all the names I could in 250 characters. I had to way 8 days from 9 maximum to get the damn thing released.

Manual claims where you have to wait for ages to get a result for a dispute and completely retarded "artificial intelligence" claiming everything like there's no tomorrow... At least if those idiots from Youtube would have people managing with some priority these claims for large channels like Rousseau, they don't actually care, that's why monopoly is horrible.

Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801340
01/12/19 06:17 PM
01/12/19 06:17 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
Tyrone Slothrop Offline OP
Tyrone Slothrop  Offline OP


Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
It appears these "Believe Music" folks are copyright trolls making money by diverting Youtube ad revenue to themselves even for music which is outright public domain. This tale of woe is just outrageous.


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801365
01/12/19 07:32 PM
01/12/19 07:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,936
In the Ozarks of Missouri
NobleHouse Offline
1000 Post Club Member
NobleHouse  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,936
In the Ozarks of Missouri
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
It appears these "Believe Music" folks are copyright trolls making money by diverting Youtube ad revenue to themselves even for music which is outright public domain. This tale of woe is just outrageous.


It is a "legitimate" scam where GREED is the only matter. "It's Ours" until you can prove otherwise.


[Linked Image]
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801446
01/13/19 02:50 AM
01/13/19 02:50 AM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 82
Washington
vmishka Offline
Full Member
vmishka  Offline
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 82
Washington
I don't try to monetize my videos, after all, my channel receives dozens of views, not thousands or hundreds of thousands, and there really isn't any money to be made by anyone. However, every one of my videos has had an invalid copyright claim and I fight all of them just because I don't want to see the incorrect garbage that Google/YouTube adds to the description.

Once, my initial rebuttal was denied (by Sony) and I had to fight it a 2nd time before winning.

I have learned that you have to put in a lot of detail in the reply. Sometimes I tell them that it is flattering that they think that the performance is by whichever professional concert pianist they think is playing, but that I have the files to prove my claim. Eventually, I won the stubborn repeat claim from Sony, as well. Most of the claims are by unknown organizations who are obviously copyright trolls.

The algorithms Google uses are bad and err on the side of the people making the claim. If someone needs to make money through classical music on YouTube and this constantly happens to them, it is very unfortunate.

Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801655
01/13/19 06:58 PM
01/13/19 06:58 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
Tyrone Slothrop Offline OP
Tyrone Slothrop  Offline OP


Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
As an FYI, there is a huge discussion thread going on this situation over on Reddit's r/piano. Sifting past the posts of people reaching for pitchforks and torches, are a number of very good posts making good legal arguments, etc.


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801742
01/14/19 01:32 AM
01/14/19 01:32 AM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,004
W
Whizbang Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Whizbang  Offline
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W

Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,004
Note that if you perform modern works, where modern is later than 1923, you might be running afoul of copyright laws,

You will STILL get flagged on the other stuff, but it should get reversed on appeal. That whole first round is just a stupid computer flagging you.

The laws suck but they are not made for your benefit but for the benefit of relatively few media conglomerates.


Whizbang [Linked Image]
amateur ragtime pianist
https://www.youtube.com/user/Aeschala
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801799
01/14/19 08:06 AM
01/14/19 08:06 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,036
Germany
JoBert Offline
2000 Post Club Member
JoBert  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 2,036
Germany
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
As an FYI, there is a huge discussion thread going on this situation over on Reddit's r/piano. Sifting past the posts of people reaching for pitchforks and torches, are a number of very good posts making good legal arguments, etc.

Ouch. That Reddit thread is awful. TBH, I did not find any post that made "good legal arguments" (probably overlooked it). Most people there have no idea what they are talking about.
Anyway, I did find one useful bit, and that was the link to the following Reddit thread, which is an AMA by a person who actually knows how the YouTube copyright claim/counter-claim system works, and how to work with it:
https://www.reddit.com/r/AMA/comments/aeli5b/my_youtube_videos_have_been_hit_with_over_1000/

My own experience mirrors that of the person giving that AMA (on a much smaller scale). On my (totally amateur) channel I've had a number of copyright claims too. I let those stand where I was indeed playing music that is still under copyright (like a Queen song or so), and I've contested those where YouTube's automated content ID system confused my amateur recording of a long dead composer's piece with the (copyrighted) recording of some professional pianist. All of these incorrect claims were revoked without problems once I explained that no, this is not a recording of [insert famous pianist] playing the piece in question (I do feel a bit flattered though, when that happens wink - delusions of grandeur, surely!).

Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: NobleHouse] #2801804
01/14/19 08:17 AM
01/14/19 08:17 AM
Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 25
Y
ycdp88 Offline
Full Member
ycdp88  Offline
Full Member
Y

Joined: Jan 2019
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by NobleHouse
It is a "legitimate" scam where GREED is the only matter. "It's Ours" until you can prove otherwise.


+1

Life appears to be mostly motivated by "love of money" for many -- do believe this is NOT the best way to live.

Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: ycdp88] #2801815
01/14/19 08:52 AM
01/14/19 08:52 AM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,936
In the Ozarks of Missouri
NobleHouse Offline
1000 Post Club Member
NobleHouse  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,936
In the Ozarks of Missouri
Originally Posted by ycdp88
Originally Posted by NobleHouse
It is a "legitimate" scam where GREED is the only matter. "It's Ours" until you can prove otherwise.


+1

Life appears to be mostly motivated by "love of money" for many -- do believe this is NOT the best way to live.


Sadly, I believe you are correct.


[Linked Image]
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Whizbang] #2802073
01/14/19 07:21 PM
01/14/19 07:21 PM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 8
K
KE8JZL Offline
Junior Member
KE8JZL  Offline
Junior Member
K

Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 8
Originally Posted by Whizbang
Note that if you perform modern works, where modern is later than 1923, you might be running afoul of copyright laws,

You will STILL get flagged on the other stuff, but it should get reversed on appeal. That whole first round is just a stupid computer flagging you.

The laws suck but they are not made for your benefit but for the benefit of relatively few media conglomerates.


I'm not a copyright expert, but I agree with this. I posted some of my own playing to YouTube, and several of the videos got flagged. Most of them were for pieces clearly in the public domain, and YouTube just thought I was putting up someone else's performance. I disputed all of those and they got dropped. One of the videos that got flagged was my performance of music published in the 1940s, and the claim seemed like it could be legitimate. YouTube just asked that I allow them to monetize the video and pay the ad revenue to the copyright owner. I don't know for sure if the claim is legitimate, but I didn't figure it was worth disputing. I just looked at the video again and it has all of 14 views, so it's clearly not something I would spend too much time worrying about.

I would think that the Einaudi videos could have legitimate copyright disputes, even if it is the channel owner's own playing. And if legitimate claims are disputed multiple times, I would think that would be grounds for YouTube to delete that channel. Again, I don't know that much about copyright, and I would be interested to hear from someone who knows more about it than I do.

Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2802481
01/15/19 11:08 PM
01/15/19 11:08 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
Tyrone Slothrop Offline OP
Tyrone Slothrop  Offline OP


Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
It turns out that Rousseau even has the mechanical licenses for Einaudi, however, Youtube has rejected this claims twice already. Basically he is being run over and there is little he can do as an independent artist/content producer.


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2803151
01/17/19 02:27 PM
01/17/19 02:27 PM
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
Tyrone Slothrop Offline OP
Tyrone Slothrop  Offline OP


Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 3,199
It seems as the situation with Rousseau is resolving:
[Linked Image]


across the stone, deathless piano performances

"Discipline is more reliable than motivation." -by a contributor on Reddit r/piano
"Success is 10% inspiration, and 90% perspiration." -by some other wise person
Re: Youtube copyright claims getting out of hand [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2803174
01/17/19 03:30 PM
01/17/19 03:30 PM
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 388
Ireland
Sibylle Offline
Full Member
Sibylle  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 388
Ireland
That's good news, or at least hopeful. Maybe all's not lost in YouTube land.


Sibylle

My piano background

"Not a shred of evidence exists in favour of the idea that life is serious." -Brendan Gill

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