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Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser #2799520
01/07/19 08:24 PM
01/07/19 08:24 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
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ElmerJFudd Offline OP
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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799530
01/07/19 09:26 PM
01/07/19 09:26 PM
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48-49 High Street (WI, USA)
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Oooo ... PX-170/370/570, perhaps?


Decent upright bassist, aspiring decent pianist
Casio PX-160, Casio CDP-130
Roland KC-80
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799537
01/07/19 09:52 PM
01/07/19 09:52 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 557
United Kingdom
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mwf Online sad
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Im hoping they update the gp "hybrid" range, but it looks doubtful i guess.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799547
01/07/19 10:26 PM
01/07/19 10:26 PM
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Ontario, Canada
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It has the bluetooths!



Yamaha P-125, Pianoteq 6, Ravenscroft 275 VST, Focusrite Scarlett 2i4
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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799559
01/07/19 11:11 PM
01/07/19 11:11 PM
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Boston/Cambridge
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Teeth?

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799590
01/08/19 02:19 AM
01/08/19 02:19 AM
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Bay Area CA
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Probably just me . . . but the sound of the instrument in this video seems mighty strange.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799591
01/08/19 02:46 AM
01/08/19 02:46 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,531
Sofia, Bulgaria
CyberGene Offline
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A bit Pianoteq-ish in the middle register, modeled?


Soundcloud Profile - solo piano compositions, arrangements, reharms
Currently: DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX, Yamaha NU1X
Previously: Kawai (ES7, MP6, CA63), Roland (RD-700SX, FP-5), Yamaha P90, Korg SP-200, Casio CDP-100
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799596
01/08/19 03:24 AM
01/08/19 03:24 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,498
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Online content
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Button-less (touch) control panel, a la Physis H3 (and Kawai DP1)?

James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799621
01/08/19 05:52 AM
01/08/19 05:52 AM
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 7,243
Raleigh, North Carolina
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Hi KJ. We've not heard from you in weeks. I presume you were away for the holidays? Welcome back.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799624
01/08/19 06:16 AM
01/08/19 06:16 AM
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,498
Hamamatsu, Japan
Kawai James Online content
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Hello Mac, thanks for the warm welcome. wink

Yes, I was out of the country for the holidays. wink

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799745
01/08/19 12:29 PM
01/08/19 12:29 PM
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A YouTube comment from Casio suggests a new hammer action.

(But no more details are available at the moment...)

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799747
01/08/19 12:30 PM
01/08/19 12:30 PM
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Thats one nice thing about the often dreadfull dive into the piano market. A year ago I would not care at all (and not even know) about something like the NAMM and now I am thrilled as heck, eagerly awaiting to see new stuff (that I may never buy, but who cares, I already spent so much time researching that I even consulted other customers in the store😅).

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799750
01/08/19 12:38 PM
01/08/19 12:38 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,531
Sofia, Bulgaria
CyberGene Offline
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Listening to this on my office HD-595s which are very detailed, I'd bet a beer it's a modeled piano sound. Might be wrong, so just a beer for now wink


Soundcloud Profile - solo piano compositions, arrangements, reharms
Currently: DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX, Yamaha NU1X
Previously: Kawai (ES7, MP6, CA63), Roland (RD-700SX, FP-5), Yamaha P90, Korg SP-200, Casio CDP-100
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799784
01/08/19 02:36 PM
01/08/19 02:36 PM
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Hanoi, Vietnam
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Casio always gives very good p/p, especially in the low price range, and they constantly upgrade their sound, but honestly, I'd want a better action from them, with let-off, less bouncy, quieter, something better than current "Tri-sensor Scaled bla bla bla" and really compete with other brand in mid-high price range


In 2 years: Casio AP250 - Kawai CN24 - Kawai CA65 - Kawai CA67
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: HoangCosmic] #2799787
01/08/19 03:04 PM
01/08/19 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by HoangCosmic
Casio always gives very good p/p, especially in the low price range, and they constantly upgrade their sound, but honestly, I'd want a better action from them, with let-off, less bouncy, quieter, something better than current "Tri-sensor Scaled bla bla bla" and really compete with other brand in mid-high price range
Agree. I had a px-860 and I thought the piano sound was great. The action was a bit bouncy, though, IMHO.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2799792
01/08/19 03:25 PM
01/08/19 03:25 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 594
Kitsap County, WA
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I will say, one area where Roland beats every other DP is interface. They have extremely good designers and I find their interfaces to be really usable as a musician and they just "feel good". I hope some of the other manufacturers take note. Knobs! smile



Currently learning: Beethoven "Easy" Sonata Op 49 No 2, JS Bach WTC Prelude No 2 in C minor, Grieg Lyric Pieces Book 1
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2800793
01/11/19 09:39 AM
01/11/19 09:39 AM
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Ontario, Canada
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Another Casio teaser video



Yamaha P-125, Pianoteq 6, Ravenscroft 275 VST, Focusrite Scarlett 2i4
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: halherta] #2800795
01/11/19 09:42 AM
01/11/19 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by halherta
Another Casio teaser video

Makes me think they are doing what Roland is doing in incorporating in Alexa into the piano...


across the stone, deathless piano performances
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2800801
01/11/19 10:01 AM
01/11/19 10:01 AM
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This piece has a tiny bit more information, or at least commentary: https://yamahamusicians.com/namm-2019-casio-pro-quality-pianos-once-again-raising-the-bar/

The author also claims here (https://yamahamusicians.com/forum/v...amp;sid=eefa9e73ad730039fae6b2ae42d0eda0) that they will be using a brand new action for this model or line.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2800807
01/11/19 10:28 AM
01/11/19 10:28 AM
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Sofia, Bulgaria
CyberGene Offline
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Two things that I noticed:
1. The piano is really small and compact which makes me think the key length isn't the greatest but who cares if it's very portable.
2. The bluetooth icon blinks with the notes being played. Unless that's just a marketing effect, it would mean Bluetooth MIDI which isn't such a big deal


Soundcloud Profile - solo piano compositions, arrangements, reharms
Currently: DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX, Yamaha NU1X
Previously: Kawai (ES7, MP6, CA63), Roland (RD-700SX, FP-5), Yamaha P90, Korg SP-200, Casio CDP-100
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Lazerlike42] #2800812
01/11/19 10:33 AM
01/11/19 10:33 AM
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Sofia, Bulgaria
CyberGene Offline
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Originally Posted by Lazerlike42
The author also claims here (https://yamahamusicians.com/forum/v...amp;sid=eefa9e73ad730039fae6b2ae42d0eda0) that they will be using a brand new action for this model or line.


He says:
Quote
From my perspective as an end user and prospective customer I have to say this is one of the most beautiful feeling keybeds I have ever rested my fingers on...and trust me, I am NOT easy to please!


Quote
I also could not believe the recommended retail price!


So, is this an AvantGrand and NV10 killer in a tiny stage piano package weighting 8kg and costing €499? laugh

Last edited by CyberGene; 01/11/19 10:34 AM.

Soundcloud Profile - solo piano compositions, arrangements, reharms
Currently: DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX, Yamaha NU1X
Previously: Kawai (ES7, MP6, CA63), Roland (RD-700SX, FP-5), Yamaha P90, Korg SP-200, Casio CDP-100
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2800881
01/11/19 01:39 PM
01/11/19 01:39 PM
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Quote
[...] brand new weighted mechanism [...] went through three months continuous testing [...] they checked to see if any wear occurred and where it was so they could finely tune the production process for maximum quality and durability."


Yay!

About time too to address the wear issues...

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2800945
01/11/19 04:35 PM
01/11/19 04:35 PM
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Murmansk, Russia
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Looks like this model is new: https://mospiano.ru/goods/Casio-CDP-S350BK?from=ZGMz&mod_id=170762887


"No succes of failure matters when it's about true vocation". Nicolás Gómez Dávila

Roland FP-90

YoutubeChannel
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: PianoStartsAt33] #2800949
01/11/19 04:42 PM
01/11/19 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Looks like this model is new: https://mospiano.ru/goods/Casio-CDP-S350BK?from=ZGMz&mod_id=170762887

In Russia piano is released before NAMM grin

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: jamiecw] #2800953
01/11/19 04:48 PM
01/11/19 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by jamiecw
Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Looks like this model is new: https://mospiano.ru/goods/Casio-CDP-S350BK?from=ZGMz&mod_id=170762887

In Russia piano is released before NAMM grin

Settle down there, Yakov Smirnoff ... wink


Decent upright bassist, aspiring decent pianist
Casio PX-160, Casio CDP-130
Roland KC-80
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: CyberGene] #2800955
01/11/19 04:48 PM
01/11/19 04:48 PM
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Ontario, Canada
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Originally Posted by CyberGene

So, is this an AvantGrand and NV10 killer in a tiny stage piano package weighting 8kg and costing €499? laugh


I highly doubt that. Still The Casio privia Series already pack a fairly decent action in a compact size at a low price. Any improvement to that action is welcome. Improvements in durability are great too. I personally wouldn't care much about the sounds, though I'm sure they're likely to improve on the existing sound samples as well.



Yamaha P-125, Pianoteq 6, Ravenscroft 275 VST, Focusrite Scarlett 2i4
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: jamiecw] #2800966
01/11/19 05:11 PM
01/11/19 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by jamiecw
Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Looks like this model is new: https://mospiano.ru/goods/Casio-CDP-S350BK?from=ZGMz&mod_id=170762887

In Russia piano is released before NAMM grin


Well, it's not surprising. Casios are everywhere here. The most popular brand without any questions. Due to the pricing first of all, I think.


"No succes of failure matters when it's about true vocation". Nicolás Gómez Dávila

Roland FP-90

YoutubeChannel
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: PianoStartsAt33] #2800969
01/11/19 05:17 PM
01/11/19 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Originally Posted by jamiecw
Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
Looks like this model is new: https://mospiano.ru/goods/Casio-CDP-S350BK?from=ZGMz&mod_id=170762887

In Russia piano is released before NAMM grin


Well, it's not surprising. Casios are everywhere here. The most popular brand without any questions. Due to the pricing first of all, I think.

Yes, here too - I had an AP-470 over the summer last year, for the price I really couldn’t fault it but discovered absolute control with midi controllers and PTQ shortly after that and it had to go to make way for them. For the price it was probably the best value for my buck period. Still though kudos to Casio for pushing the envelope I’m sure it’s the same for many more countries too.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: TheophilusCarter] #2801024
01/11/19 07:39 PM
01/11/19 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by TheophilusCarter
Oooo ... PX-170/370/570, perhaps?


See this post.


across the stone, deathless piano performances
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2801025
01/11/19 07:42 PM
01/11/19 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Originally Posted by TheophilusCarter
Oooo ... PX-170/370/570, perhaps?


See this post.

Yah, I've been seeing the price on the 160 dip on and off the last few months; I myself got it for $400. I wondered if that might indicate a new model, but even so, I'm glad I went ahead and bought it. I usually prefer to wait a year or two after new models come out anyway, just to see more user reviews, make sure there are no major problems, etc.


Decent upright bassist, aspiring decent pianist
Casio PX-160, Casio CDP-130
Roland KC-80
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801148
01/12/19 07:53 AM
01/12/19 07:53 AM
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There are some CDP-S100 videos on Casio Music Russia and Muzblock.ru YouTube channels:

https://www.youtube.com/user/casiomusicrussia/videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAiXw8prebs

No CDP-S350 yet, apparently...

But the User's Manuals are available from Casio for anyone wanting to take a peek at the details.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: clothearednincompo] #2801163
01/12/19 08:51 AM
01/12/19 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by clothearednincompo
There are some CDP-S100 videos on Casio Music Russia and Muzblock.ru YouTube channels:

https://www.youtube.com/user/casiomusicrussia/videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAiXw8prebs

No CDP-S350 yet, apparently...

But the User's Manuals are available from Casio for anyone wanting to take a peek at the details.

Thanks for the links. I checked out the user manuals for the s100, s150 and s350. Disappointed to see only 64 note polyphony.

https://support.casio.com/en/manual/manualresult.php?cid=008020&keyword=

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801232
01/12/19 12:25 PM
01/12/19 12:25 PM
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More info from the same guy I cited above:

"As far as I know there is not going to be an updated version of the PX560M. There is something coming later in the year that could be seen as a "replacement" for that keyboard but it is not an updated version of the same board. It is more a higher end version of the new Privia that is being announced on Monday. There are two new Privia's by the way. There is a mid-range version coming on Monday and the premium version to be announced nearer NAMM."

He is talking about Monday 1/14, by the way.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801244
01/12/19 12:55 PM
01/12/19 12:55 PM
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Interesting, thanks!


Decent upright bassist, aspiring decent pianist
Casio PX-160, Casio CDP-130
Roland KC-80
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801684
01/13/19 07:41 PM
01/13/19 07:41 PM
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Ontario, Canada
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CDP-S100 youtube video from casio Music UK



I think the Privia Keyboard will be revealed at NAMM



Yamaha P-125, Pianoteq 6, Ravenscroft 275 VST, Focusrite Scarlett 2i4
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: halherta] #2801687
01/13/19 07:48 PM
01/13/19 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by halherta
CDP-S100 youtube video from casio Music UK



I think the Privia Keyboard will be revealed at NAMM


Supposedly there will be a reveal of a new midrange Privia just before NAMM and later on this year the high end model will be announced and released.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801689
01/13/19 07:55 PM
01/13/19 07:55 PM
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Damn, now I want to replace my CDP-130 with a CDP-S100. But then I'll want to replace that with a PX-160. But then I'll want to replace that with whatever the new Privia is ... AAGGHH!!!!! laugh


Decent upright bassist, aspiring decent pianist
Casio PX-160, Casio CDP-130
Roland KC-80
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801762
01/14/19 03:49 AM
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I'm not impressed with the sound in that S100 clip - very percussive - not enough sustain. It almost sounds like it's completely lacking P samples!

Greg


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801806
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This is a nice alternative to Numa Compact 2. https://www.casio-music.com/euro/digitalpianos/compact/cdp-s350/

[Linked Image]


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Marko in Boston] #2801822
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Originally Posted by Marko in Boston
This is a nice alternative to Numa Compact 2. https://www.casio-music.com/euro/digitalpianos/compact/cdp-s350/

Pretty different, though. 50% heavier, no aftertouch, no mod control, no MIDI jacks, no multi-zone MIDI controller function. But it does have a hammer action, more total sounds, alternate temperaments, auto accompaniment and a recorder.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: anotherscott] #2801832
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Originally Posted by anotherscott
Originally Posted by Marko in Boston
This is a nice alternative to Numa Compact 2. https://www.casio-music.com/euro/digitalpianos/compact/cdp-s350/

Pretty different, though. 50% heavier, no aftertouch, no mod control, no MIDI jacks, no multi-zone MIDI controller function. But it does have a hammer action, more total sounds, alternate temperaments, auto accompaniment and a recorder.



Ah. All good points. Plus I did not catch the weight at 24.0 lbs. About the same a PX-160. I guess it just looks lighter because of its slim appearance. Numa was probably not the best comparison - my bad.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801847
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CDP-S100 demo.



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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Lazerlike42] #2801867
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Originally Posted by Lazerlike42
More info from the same guy I cited above:

"As far as I know there is not going to be an updated version of the PX560M. There is something coming later in the year that could be seen as a "replacement" for that keyboard but it is not an updated version of the same board. It is more a higher end version of the new Privia that is being announced on Monday. There are two new Privia's by the way. There is a mid-range version coming on Monday and the premium version to be announced nearer NAMM."

He is talking about Monday 1/14, by the way.


The PX560M is currently the "premium" version of the Privia range. Although the 560 did not fully replace the PX-5S, it is the most recent and most expensive stage piano in Casio's Privia range. These two models have an impressive set of features, especially for their price. But Casio quickly abandoned these models despite their (relative) success. We will have to wait and see if this time Casio starts taking their stage pianos seriously.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: arc7urus] #2801874
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Originally Posted by arc7urus
Originally Posted by Lazerlike42
More info from the same guy I cited above:

"As far as I know there is not going to be an updated version of the PX560M. There is something coming later in the year that could be seen as a "replacement" for that keyboard but it is not an updated version of the same board. It is more a higher end version of the new Privia that is being announced on Monday. There are two new Privia's by the way. There is a mid-range version coming on Monday and the premium version to be announced nearer NAMM."

He is talking about Monday 1/14, by the way.


The PX560M is currently the "premium" version of the Privia range. Although the 560 did not fully replace the PX-5S, it is the most recent and most expensive stage piano in Casio's Privia range. These two models have an impressive set of features, especially for their price. But Casio quickly abandoned these models despite their (relative) success. We will have to wait and see if this time Casio starts taking their stage pianos seriously.


Here is a comment from that page which delves a bit into what's going on here:

"Casio are refocusing more on "pianos" rather than synths. This is especially true since their collaboration with Bechstein. That has changed a lot of things. Also there is a new, young, dynamic team in place over in Japan now and their aim...as far as I know is to completely modernise everything and merge a lot of great tech with traditional quality keys to give you the best of both worlds whilst also keeping the price down.

That latest teaser video gives you some insight into the new approach. It is very different from previous Casio videos. The company are very keen to move away from their past image and I think they are definitely on track to do that."

Without just posting a bunch of quotes, the guy (who is some kind of insider, though I am not entirely sure of what sort) seems to be saying that Casio decided at some point since the release of the 560 to almost become more of a Kawai in terms of their approach to high end keyboards. They seem very much in the marketing they've done for this new CDP, and presumably with the new Privias, to want to appeal more to the classical/traditional piano crowd. Think more Yamaha Aria than CP. That seems to be why they have moved away from the 5x and 560, and based on what this guy says their internal department structure is the foundation of this new direction.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801906
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The "acoustic piano replacement" market is likely were most customers are and the money is. So, this strategy makes sense. However, Casio will have to significantly increase their reputation level in order to be able to compete directly with big names in the DP market. Unless Casio wants to continue focussing on budget DPs, but that does not go along with changing their reputation. And if they want to play in the upper-tier DP segment then they will have to demonstrate that their cooperation with Bechstein was more than a marketing stunt and that the GP range will not end in the pile of Casio's keyboard abandonware, since nothing has happened in their GP range for 4 years and these models always were very hard to find.

However, their "pro" stage-pianos (like the PX-5S and 560) offered a remarkable set of features and Casio could have easily become a reference in the synth/arranger/workstation arena if they developed these keyboards, which never happened. But trying to compete with the big names in the crowded "acoustic replacement" DP market is a gamble. Let's wait and see...

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801915
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I'm not so much interested in their cooperation with Bechstein ... or with any other firm.
I'm more interested in the results.
I tried the -400 (or was it the -500 ?) back in November at a local shop. I was underwhelmed.
(OTOH, I was very "whelmed" that same day by the Novus.)

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801916
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I could be way off base, but from the way this guy is talking about it I am wondering if it's going to feature a wooden keyboard, if not the mid-range version revealed at NAMM than the high end that is revealed in a few months.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2801975
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Well, the "hybrid" Casio GP already features a wooden keyboard as well as a shiny logo with the Bechstein name on it but these two features are unfortunately not enough to make them excellent DPs, especially when comparing them with other DPs in the same price range. And they can definitely continue using a plastic action and call it "natural wood". If their marketing department managed to turn the GP into an "hybrid" DP, creating wood out of plastic is much easier.

Anyway, if Casio decided to build a quality DP, packed with a good quiet action (their current action is ok-ish but doubles as a percussion instrument) and a bunch of features like the PX-560/5S/have and the competition does not have, these could become an alternative to the Roland FP90, Kawai MPs and Yamaha P515. But I have doubts that they will manage to do that and jump directly into the middle/top-tier DP market. I hope I am wrong because the big brands need competition to innovate.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: arc7urus] #2802209
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Originally Posted by arc7urus
And they can definitely continue using a plastic action and call it "natural wood". If their marketing department managed to turn the GP into an "hybrid" DP, creating wood out of plastic is much easier.


[Linked Image]

It is a wooden keyboard.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: arc7urus] #2802214
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Originally Posted by arc7urus
But Casio quickly abandoned these models despite their (relative) success. We will have to wait and see if this time Casio starts taking their stage pianos seriously.


Nothing about these products has been abandoned. Both have had numerous firmware updates and we are still releasing new sounds for these products as recently as yesterday.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Mike_Martin] #2802229
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Originally Posted by Mike_Martin
Originally Posted by arc7urus
And they can definitely continue using a plastic action and call it "natural wood". If their marketing department managed to turn the GP into an "hybrid" DP, creating wood out of plastic is much easier.


[Linked Image]

It is a wooden keyboard.


Which keyboard is that? Is this a released Casio piano?


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: CyberGene] #2802237
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
Originally Posted by Mike_Martin
Originally Posted by arc7urus
And they can definitely continue using a plastic action and call it "natural wood". If their marketing department managed to turn the GP into an "hybrid" DP, creating wood out of plastic is much easier.


[Linked Image]

It is a wooden keyboard.


Which keyboard is that? Is this a released Casio piano?


That is our Grand Hybrid action.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Mike_Martin] #2802238
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Originally Posted by Mike_Martin
Originally Posted by arc7urus
And they can definitely continue using a plastic action and call it "natural wood". If their marketing department managed to turn the GP into an "hybrid" DP, creating wood out of plastic is much easier.


It is a wooden keyboard.


No one is disputing that. My comment is due to the way Casio GPs are marketed. This sentence comes from the GP-500 page: "Full-length Austrian spruce piano keys, with a true grand piano hammer mechanism" (https://www.casiomusicgear.com/products/celviano-grand-hybrid-series/gp-500)

The *keysticks* on the GP are wooden piano keys, but the *action mechanism* is not a "true" grand piano mechanism. The way Casio describes the GP action leads to people believing that the Casio GP uses an adapted grand piano action, similar to the action on the Yamaha AvantGrand or Kawai Novus. But this is not the case at all. The action mechanism of the Casio GP is equivalent to Roland's PHA-50 or Kawai's GF-II, and none of these are adapted grand piano mechanisms. This is the misleading part I was referring to.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802245
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Ahh, I see now. I've seen a model of that keyboard (the ones with the translucent sides) in a store and indeed it has almost nothing to do with how grand piano action works, i.e. there's no jack, double repetition lever, etc. It was simply a plastic bit roughly resembling a hammer. And the hammer isn't detachable from the keyboard to be thrown on its own. That's a bit misleading.
[Linked Image]


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802251
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And, I hasten to add, this is why the Casio brand will never be taken seriously...this attempt at trying to look like a hybrid is very misleading not just a bit.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802330
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@CyberGene, yes that is exactly the point. The Grand Hybrid action is undoubtedly Casio's best hammer action. But while the keysticks are equivalent to those on an acoustic, the action mechanism is not similar to that of an acoustic. This mechanism is in the same category as many other actions, like the GF-II/C, PHA-50 and NWX. None of these actions is an adapted acoustic grand action as used in the AvantGrand or Novus. It would be good for the DP market if Casio continues improving their top-tier DPs, but if they want to stand out it should because of the quality of their products and not because of misleading marketing.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802365
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Casio GP action is far better than NWX and better than PHA50. IS it better than GF2? To some extent yesz it's extremely good action, but perhaps brand recognition and average sound compared to R/Y/K makes it feel worse than it is.

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: MrKaramba] #2802430
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Originally Posted by MrKaramba
Casio GP action is far better than NWX and better than PHA50. IS it better than GF2? To some extent yesz it's extremely good action, but perhaps brand recognition and average sound compared to R/Y/K makes it feel worse than it is.

I agree that it may be better than the NWX due to the longer pivot point. But I would never rank it above the GF-II or PHA-50 - and this is just from feeling the action without playing sound. The positive points of the Grand Hybrid are its long pivot point and the ability to easily play repeated notes. But that comes at the expense of feeling the hammer always connected to the key. And if you assess how the sensors, sound engine and Grand Hybrid action work together, then I guess it would be ranked below DPs with the NWX. But let's see if Casio decides to continue investing in the GP range...

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802762
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Originally Posted by Mike_Martin
Originally Posted by arc7urus
But Casio quickly abandoned these models despite their (relative) success. We will have to wait and see if this time Casio starts taking their stage pianos seriously.


Nothing about these products has been abandoned. Both have had numerous firmware updates and we are still releasing new sounds for these products as recently as yesterday.


Hi! I own a PX-560 and I am only aware of a total of 9 official sounds/registrations released bt Casio (all of them created/submitted by you). The latest one is from October 2016. I am also only aware of a total 3 firmware updates for the PX-560 since it was released in 2015. Am I missing something? I find the PX-560 to be a great, feature-packed keyboard, but my feeling is that it was never fully supported by Casio and that Casio just missed a huge opportunity.

Cheers!

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: CyberGene] #2802786
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
And the hammer isn't detachable from the keyboard to be thrown on its own. That's a bit misleading.
[Linked Image]


Is it? I only only reference the image provided, but it looks like there is a capstan on the keystick that allows free hammer (+mock whippen) movement, at least to a similar extent as on a GF/GF2 action. So while the hammer can't escape the whippen, the entire assembly could escape the key with enough force.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Gombessa] #2802795
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Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by CyberGene
And the hammer isn't detachable from the keyboard to be thrown on its own. That's a bit misleading.
[Linked Image]


Is it? I only only reference the image provided, but it looks like there is a capstan on the keystick that allows free hammer (+mock whippen) movement, at least to a similar extent as on a GF/GF2 action. So while the hammer can't escape the whippen, the entire assembly could escape the key with enough force.

You are right. I stand corrected. Unfortunately those translucent Casio models are rare and I haven’t seen one recently to check. Anyway, lack of escapement (jack and double repetition lever) changes the feel because there’s always the hammer weight through the knuckle lever that moves the key up whereas on a real piano the keys lighten up due to hammer being held by the backcheck.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: CyberGene] #2802800
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by CyberGene
And the hammer isn't detachable from the keyboard to be thrown on its own. That's a bit misleading.
[Linked Image]


Is it? I only only reference the image provided, but it looks like there is a capstan on the keystick that allows free hammer (+mock whippen) movement, at least to a similar extent as on a GF/GF2 action. So while the hammer can't escape the whippen, the entire assembly could escape the key with enough force.

You are right. I stand corrected. Unfortunately those translucent Casio models are rare and I haven’t seen one recently to check. Anyway, lack of escapement (jack and double repetition lever) changes the feel because there’s always the hammer weight through the knuckle lever that moves the key up whereas on a real piano the keys lighten up due to hammer being held by the backcheck.



We have a lot of uprights without double repetition at houses around here. Looka like Casio action is really close to them.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802802
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Upright pianos lack double repetition lever but they still have escapement through a jack. Also a backcheck to hold the hammer after it has bounced back from the string. I believe it’s these bounce movements that create a specific feeling through the keys on real upright and grand pianos.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802820
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Separating the key from the rest of the assembly is easily done on the GF2. But even if that is possible on this action then such separation is not felt on the key. It is very easy to do fast repetitions on this action, easier than on the GF2 or in any other DP hammer action I have tried, and that is likely because there is virtually no decoupling between the key and the remaining moving parts. When I tested this action it did not felt like an hammer action but instead as a very nice and heavy synth key action with an almost constant touchweight/pressure and a very fast return. It is almost the opposite of Yamaha's GrandTouch where there is a large pressure variation along the travel of the key.

These videos show the action in more detail:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Go2MX0L8PqU
https://youtu.be/omK58tFQTLc?t=410

Nevertheless, Casio states that the GPs with the Grand Hybrid are the "first DPs to include acoustic concert grand piano wooden keys and grand piano hammer mechanism": https://youtu.be/wne2ACFP1PM?t=17

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: PianoStartsAt33] #2802830
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Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
We have a lot of uprights without double repetition at houses around here. Looka like Casio action is really close to them.


Apart from the shape of the components, may I ask you what makes the mechanism of the Casio action so much different than GF2's and "really close" to that of an upright?

The red knuckle is a direct coupling between the black "wippen" and the "hammer". So, the whole assembly is a single system. Casio can put a dozen of coupled parts between the capstan and the hammer but that is irrelevant from a mechanical perspective. The way these parts decouple is exactly what makes an acoustic action behave like it does. And these parts do not decouple. Should we also start saying that the mechanism of the GF2 is "really close" to an acoustic action?

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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: arc7urus] #2803083
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Originally Posted by arc7urus

Hi! I own a PX-560 and I am only aware of a total of 9 official sounds/registrations released bt Casio (all of them created/submitted by you). The latest one is from October 2016. I am also only aware of a total 3 firmware updates for the PX-560 since it was released in 2015. Am I missing something? I find the PX-560 to be a great, feature-packed keyboard, but my feeling is that it was never fully supported by Casio and that Casio just missed a huge opportunity.

Cheers!


Actually one of the NAMM announcements is that we have licensed all of David Weiser's vintage keyboard presets that were originally created for the PX-5S and are converting them for the PX-560. It is a huge task but these will be released shortly after NAMM.


-Mike Martin
Casio America

Casio Music Forums
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2803125
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Kbeaumont Offline
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Dave Weiser sent me some presets for my SP-6, I use them all the time.


A long long time ago, I can still remember
How that music used to make me smile....
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Mike_Martin] #2803180
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arc7urus Offline
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Originally Posted by Mike_Martin
Originally Posted by arc7urus

Hi! I own a PX-560 and I am only aware of a total of 9 official sounds/registrations released bt Casio (all of them created/submitted by you). The latest one is from October 2016. I am also only aware of a total 3 firmware updates for the PX-560 since it was released in 2015. Am I missing something? I find the PX-560 to be a great, feature-packed keyboard, but my feeling is that it was never fully supported by Casio and that Casio just missed a huge opportunity.

Cheers!


Actually one of the NAMM announcements is that we have licensed all of David Weiser's vintage keyboard presets that were originally created for the PX-5S and are converting them for the PX-560. It is a huge task but these will be released shortly after NAMM.


Many thanks for the info and good news!

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Mike_Martin] #2803181
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Los Angeles, California
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Originally Posted by Mike_Martin

Actually one of the NAMM announcements is that we have licensed all of David Weiser's vintage keyboard presets that were originally created for the PX-5S and are converting them for the PX-560. It is a huge task but these will be released shortly after NAMM.

Excellent!


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