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Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? #2770367
10/07/18 07:15 PM
10/07/18 07:15 PM
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Pianoguy_SWE Offline OP
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I recently decided to buy a really good digital piano for myself.
I did an awful lot of research: I dived headfirst into endless youtube reviews, I studied the specs on a number of pianos, and ended up choosing beteween Yamaha´s Avant Grand N1/N2 and their new CLP-695GP.
I had the opportunity to play both these instruments in the local store and make a direct comparison between the two.

1) The action:
*I really liked the action on the N1: it's pretty hard to beat, since the piano actually contains all the mechanical components of an acoustic grand.
*The action in the CLP-695GP, on the other hand, is called "grand touch". It's not a hybrid piano like the N1, but the keys have counterweights to give the action a lighter touch, among other things. It doesnt beat the N1, but it is nevertheless a very pleasant action compared to Yamaha's other digital pianos, and in terms of playability, it's not far behind the N1. I doubt that most casual players would even notice the subtle difference. Someone aspiring to be a concert pianist might notice, though.

2) The sound quality
This is where the CLP-695GP won. When I made a direct comparison, there was no doubt whatsoever that the the newer set of samplings of the CLP held a higher quality. The sound of the N1 felt thin and slightly synthetic in a direct comparison.
The N1 came out in 2009, and hasn't received any updates at all in almost ten years time and is IMHO beginning to show its age: it sounded pretty much like a medium-priced digital piano from around 2008-2010.
The CLP-695 on the other hand, hit the stores in May 2018 here in Europe.
The CLP has - as far as I can tell - both higher quality sampling sets and a considerably more impressive speaker system. The two concert grand samplings: Bösendorfer and Yamaha CFX, are the best I've heard in any digital piano.

3) The form factor
Here we have a tight race between the two: both pianos are very beautiful. The N1 offers a more minimalistic and clean design, perfect if you have less space available. The CLP-695GP looks... well, beautiful.

It was a pretty tight race between these two: i concluded that the N1 had a better action, but the CLP-695GP offered better sound, and an action I could probably get along nicely with anyway, so in the end I went with the CLP. Good choice, bad choice? I appreciate comments & opinions!

All in all: the digital pianos have become really good. They cant mimic the real thing fully just yet, but the are getting very, very close to the original.

P.S. English is not my first language: I apologize for possible errors.

[img]https://photos.app.goo.gl/G7C3Pxc42od6S1s47[/img]

[img]https://photos.app.goo.gl/TCdYqVUPyqZP5Tbf6[/img]

[img]https://photos.app.goo.gl/TwkMnjEsff7NgZFB9[/img]

Last edited by Finurliig; 10/07/18 07:24 PM.

Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
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Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2770388
10/07/18 09:14 PM
10/07/18 09:14 PM
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It's surprising to find someone who actually praised the Bösendorfer sampling in the Clavinova. Most reviews I've read about it tend to be negative.

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2770398
10/07/18 10:13 PM
10/07/18 10:13 PM
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Finurliig, welcome to the forum, thank you for sharing your shopping experiences, and congrats on your new piano - it looks great.

Am I correct in thinking that you did not play-test the Avantgrand N3X?
This model features the same keyboard action as the N1/N2, while also using the superior sound engine of the latest Clavinova models. The N1/N2 are certainly due an update - perhaps this will happen before the end of the year?

Kind regards,
James
x

ps.Your English is excellent! wink


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

"I agree that the User Manual is very good." - arc7urus, March 2019
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2770426
10/08/18 12:29 AM
10/08/18 12:29 AM
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I'd also point out that the CLP-685 is pretty much exactly the same as the CLP-695GP except for the form factor (there is a very marketing buzzwordy speaker enclosure thing they added, but otherwise the specs are identical). I've played both (and own the 685) and wouldn't spend the extra on the 695.

That said, I'm hoping that Yamaha brings out an "N1X" (not the recently updated upright, I want the grand action in the N1) in the very near future that will have the hybrid action with the new sound engine. If it does, I would trade in my 685 immediately. The keyboard is really quite amazing, however I just can't deal with the 10(?) year old sound engine and didn't want to have a computer hanging off my piano in the living room for running a VST.


𝒀𝒂𝒎𝒂𝒉𝒂 𝑨𝒗𝒂𝒏𝒕 𝑮𝒓𝒂𝒏𝒅 𝑵1𝑿
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Kawai James] #2770467
10/08/18 06:07 AM
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No I didn't. The N3X wasn't available in the store. it would have been interesting to try it though.

I also considered an acoustic grand with Yamahas "silent" technology, but I ruled that option out because I live in a condo and would like to avoid any friction with the neighbours. It had to be digital.

The thing is: if I were to put up the kind of money that Yamaha wants for the N3X, I think I would have preferred to purchase an acoustic grand anyway: as pretty as these digital pianos are, they are still not "the real thing".
I also think the N3X seems to be heavily overpriced: can someone explain why on earth they are asking 2,5 times the price of the N1, when the tech inside is quite similar?


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2770472
10/08/18 06:43 AM
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Because there is no competition in this price range.


Current: Yamaha NU1X | Roland FP-30 with Garritan CFX Full & Pianoteq 6
Past: Yamaha: P-115, YDP-163, CLP-545, CLP-685 | Kawai: CA-98, Novus NV10
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Tyr] #2770479
10/08/18 07:52 AM
10/08/18 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Tyr
Because there is no competition in this price range.

And of course the N3X has the newer sound engine from last year, not the one from 9+ years ago like the N1. That should take care of 0.5 (or so) of that 2.5 factor. wink

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Beowulf] #2770604
10/08/18 03:05 PM
10/08/18 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Beowulf
It's surprising to find someone who actually praised the Bösendorfer sampling in the Clavinova. Most reviews I've read about it tend to be negative.

I listened to these samples through quality headphones and I would not say they are so bad, for many pieces (especially classical) I would prefer them over Yamaha's CFX, I just think they are not what we would expect from Bösendorfer samples made by Yamaha. The expectations were too high.

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2845911
05/06/19 10:04 PM
05/06/19 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Finurliig
I recently decided to buy a really good digital piano for myself.
I did an awful lot of research: I dived headfirst into endless youtube reviews, I studied the specs on a number of pianos, and ended up choosing beteween Yamaha´s Avant Grand N1/N2 and their new CLP-695GP.
I had the opportunity to play both these instruments in the local store and make a direct comparison between the two.

1) The action:
*I really liked the action on the N1: it's pretty hard to beat, since the piano actually contains all the mechanical components of an acoustic grand.
*The action in the CLP-695GP, on the other hand, is called "grand touch". It's not a hybrid piano like the N1, but the keys have counterweights to give the action a lighter touch, among other things. It doesnt beat the N1, but it is nevertheless a very pleasant action compared to Yamaha's other digital pianos, and in terms of playability, it's not far behind the N1. I doubt that most casual players would even notice the subtle difference. Someone aspiring to be a concert pianist might notice, though.

2) The sound quality
This is where the CLP-695GP won. When I made a direct comparison, there was no doubt whatsoever that the the newer set of samplings of the CLP held a higher quality. The sound of the N1 felt thin and slightly synthetic in a direct comparison.
The N1 came out in 2009, and hasn't received any updates at all in almost ten years time and is IMHO beginning to show its age: it sounded pretty much like a medium-priced digital piano from around 2008-2010.
The CLP-695 on the other hand, hit the stores in May 2018 here in Europe.
The CLP has - as far as I can tell - both higher quality sampling sets and a considerably more impressive speaker system. The two concert grand samplings: Bösendorfer and Yamaha CFX, are the best I've heard in any digital piano.

3) The form factor
Here we have a tight race between the two: both pianos are very beautiful. The N1 offers a more minimalistic and clean design, perfect if you have less space available. The CLP-695GP looks... well, beautiful.

It was a pretty tight race between these two: i concluded that the N1 had a better action, but the CLP-695GP offered better sound, and an action I could probably get along nicely with anyway, so in the end I went with the CLP. Good choice, bad choice? I appreciate comments & opinions!

All in all: the digital pianos have become really good. They cant mimic the real thing fully just yet, but the are getting very, very close to the original.

P.S. English is not my first language: I apologize for possible errors.

[img]https://photos.app.goo.gl/G7C3Pxc42od6S1s47[/img]

[img]https://photos.app.goo.gl/TCdYqVUPyqZP5Tbf6[/img]

[img]https://photos.app.goo.gl/TwkMnjEsff7NgZFB9[/img]



Hello, Finurliig! Could you give us an update on your CLP-695? Do you still like it? Thanks for all the helpful info.


Yamaha AvantGrand N3X
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2845917
05/06/19 10:39 PM
05/06/19 10:39 PM
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I wouldn't hold out much hope for a reply.
Finurliig has only made two posts on the board. Those were in last October of last year.
And he hasn't logged in for two months.

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: vara411] #2847525
05/12/19 11:47 AM
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Sorry for the late answer: have been quite busy lately. Update? Still like it? Yes, I’m happy as a clown.

An evaluation six months after purchase might actually be worth the effort, so here it is: (in a separate post)


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847541
05/12/19 12:46 PM
05/12/19 12:46 PM
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As I've been using the CLP-695GP the past 6 months or so, I've been digging deeper into the settings menu and I've been experimenting a bit with the sound settings and the Yamaha "smart pianist" app. The app is not just a gimmick; but actually very useful:

First: the app and some of it’s features:

[img]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/x...fu8bIUOQ2OI4wY93JYu2eLT_k=w2388-h1668-no[/img]

I went to the store and picked up one of these little gizmos: a Wifi-adapter. With this, you can connect your piano to the local network, which in turn allows you to connect the piano to your Ipad.

[img]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/t...5x_nov1Y2TKZR_l4bXtDNNP1Y=w2702-h2028-no[/img]

The Yamaha ”smart pianist” app has a ton of features, but I will just mention the ones I’m using every day.


Sound settings page: touch curve

This setting allows you to set how the force you use when pressing down a key will correlate to an increase in sound volume.
*setting it to”soft” will make even small variations in pressure from your fingers stand out as unevenness in your play.
I find this quite useful when I’m practising scales and arpeggios, I can clearly hear even the slightest unevenness in my play, and correct it faster.

[img]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/8...O0fZkiBY3bqQocJS6-hmOUEmU=w2388-h1668-no[/img]

Sound settings page: Environment

Setting the amount of reverb, essentially. Recommend low setting, or sound will quickly become muddy. I like to raise it slightly though.

[img]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/P...rXp4TvZewtdRkWLaPgRsY9S4c=w2388-h1668-no[/img]

Sound settings page: damper resonance, aliquot resonance, body resonance and ”key off sampling”
A number of settings for resonance effects from the strings, mechanics and cabinet of an acoustic grand piano. They are a number of rather discrete but interesting effects:
*Be careful with ”damper resonance”: setting it too high will give the sound an unpleasant dissonant singing tone: recommend low setting here.
*The others however, can even be set to maximum without disadvantage.
I don’t know the physics behind these functions, but I really like them; it makes the piano produce a ”richer” sound than you can normally hear from a digital piano. Can’t put my finger on it, but it sounds really nice. =)

Environment settings:

Choose between the acoustic environment of a cathedral, concert hall, club, smaller recital hall, of chamber. Best setting depends on what you are playing for the moment.
I usually stay with ”Chamber” or ”recital”: reverb gets a shorter duration, best for most classical pieces.

[img]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/N...xyU2IGgjxLKp74cC8kr1FT9Bk=w2388-h1668-no[/img]

Bösendorfer VS Yamaha CFX, and ”binaural sound” : is it any good?

There are a number of sampled pianos in the sound bank, but these two are supposed to be the best. There is an excellent harpsichord voice that I sometimes use when playing Bach, but otherwise I stick with the CFX.
Bösendorfer and CFX both sound great through the speakers: but only the CFX has the ”binaural” effect: simply meaning that when you play with earphones, it’s supposed to sound just like when you sit in front of an acoustic piano.

Let me elaborate on that: using earphones – even good ones- usually means that it will sound a little bit like listening to a piano performance through a hole in a wall: you lose the sense of spatial orientation – i.e. where in the room the sound comes from.
Not so here: the sound produced in your earphones is almost indistinguishable from sitting in front of an acoustic piano. You can hear the bass strings growling slightly downwards to the left, the middle register right in front of you, and so on.
The yamaha engineers have done a really good job with this. So good in fact, that I rarely use the Bösendorfer voice when I play with earphones.
Instead I prefer to go to the sound settings page: and change the ”brightness” of the CFX voice to make it sound more mellow. Good for Beethoven pieces, I think.

[img]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/S...8pG7wmmyLGYHQn5CMcWAe3uYY=w2388-h1668-no[/img]

Final verdict 6 months post purchase:

[img]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/P...naEsg2-bPNIzM7CFywIifgYsY=w2702-h2028-no[/img]

I’ve already commented on the ”Grand touch” mechanics in this piano and the CLP-685, and my initial opinion stills stands: I liked it then, and I still like it now. I’ve been sitting in front of a couple of good acoustic grands since I bought mine, and I honestly have a really hard time telling a difference. There is one clear advantage with the digital piano though: It’s always perfectly regulated, unlike most acoustic grands. Options to play around with various environments and tonal qualities are very nice too.
The dynamic range of a really good acoustic grand can’t be beaten by any digital piano, ever, but you can’t have it all. For a digital piano though, it has an impressive sound: the best I’ve heard so far.

My local piano store has got the new Yamaha NX-1 in store: I think I will go there and try it out some day this week: it might be interesting to compare these two again.


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847560
05/12/19 02:06 PM
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Very interesting read Finurliig!

I’m also getting a Yamaha, although, I’m likely getting the CLP-685/785 (if it’s released in the near future).

Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847564
05/12/19 02:23 PM
05/12/19 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Finurliig
_

My local piano store has got the new Yamaha NX-1 in store: I think I will go there and try it out some day this week: it might be interesting to compare these two again.



Sounds like an expensive trip coming up . . .

Last edited by peterws; 05/12/19 02:26 PM.

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Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: peterws] #2847589
05/12/19 04:40 PM
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LOL! laugh I hope not. Why, is it THAT good?


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847610
05/12/19 06:59 PM
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Interesting points. BTW isn't the key-front-to-pivot distance on the CLP685 longer than it is on AvantGrand? I thought I read somewhere that it was the longest in the business. The relevance of this varies amongst pianists.

Anyway, having a grand action in a piano isn't necessarily an advantage for everyone. For me the important thing is having an action that has the responsiveness of a grand, and also having an action that requires no particular adjustment when playing an acoustic grand, or at least no more than it would coming form another acoustic grand.

Other than that, whether it feels exactly like an acoustic action or not, I don't really care.

Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847613
05/12/19 07:33 PM
05/12/19 07:33 PM
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PS, I can't imagine any situation where having a real grand action is a disadvantage, just that when choosing a DP. the most realistic action may not be the one I like best. For my purposes, I'm hoping the new Roland action (the hybrid action that isn't really) will be perfect for me. If not, I'll probably buy a Yamaha CLP-685, N1X, or NV10 in the future.

Last edited by johnstaf; 05/12/19 07:33 PM.
Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847648
05/13/19 01:18 AM
05/13/19 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Finurliig
LOL! laugh I hope not. Why, is it THAT good?


Maybe. The N1 wasn't brilliant to my old ears, lacked depth and still I never sounded digital, but played wonderfully well. I can only accommodate a small piano, so I don't dwell on anything bigger which is probably why I never found it's hidden treasures!


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Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: johnstaf] #2847850
05/13/19 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by johnstaf
Interesting points. BTW isn't the key-front-to-pivot distance on the CLP685 longer than it is on AvantGrand? I thought I read somewhere that it was the longest in the business. The relevance of this varies amongst pianists.


Roughly comparable, I'd say. Yamaha did say the GrandTouch has the "longest support [pivot] length of any DP," but that was before the NV-10 was released and it's not clear whether it includes the hybrids to begin with.

From (http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2734488/all/naked-pics-of-grandtouch-action.html), the GrandTouch pivot is roughly 24cm (9.5"), which is similar to the Kawai Grand Feel/Grand Feel II and also similar to the AvantGrand. IIRC, the NV-10's is well over 10". Also, Roland's "Hybrid Grand" action with longer pivot length was released recently too, I'm not sure how it compares with the GrandTouch.

The takeaway is that nearly all the high end digital consoles nowadays have extremely respectable pivot lengths (comparable to 5-6' grands). Who has the absolute longest doesn't matter too much (arguably? :D)


Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11 || Kawai NV-10
Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847856
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In my personal opinion, that doesn't matter a lick, the action on the AG is so much better than the CLP-685. It's an apple and oranges comparison. I didn't mind the CLP, but now that I have the AG there's no going back ever...


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Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847857
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I would argue that it does matter who has the absolute longest! For one thing, there are records to be broken and there is no room for shorties.

Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pete14] #2847860
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Originally Posted by Pete14
I would argue that it does matter who has the absolute longest! For one thing, there are records to be broken and there is no room for shorties.


Sorry, I was specifically saying it's not worth comparing the pivot length of the CLP to the AG, not for DP's in general where it does really matter (and I realize you're being somewhat tongue in cheek but I realized what I said could be taken as a generalization.)


𝒀𝒂𝒎𝒂𝒉𝒂 𝑨𝒗𝒂𝒏𝒕 𝑮𝒓𝒂𝒏𝒅 𝑵1𝑿
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847863
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Apology accepted, but I was responding to Gombessa’s ‘takeaway’, and my post came in a bit late (after yours instead of Gombessa’s) smile

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847882
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Size matters.
No, it doesn't.
Yes, it does.
frown

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: MacMacMac] #2847891
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Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Size matters.
No, it doesn't.
Yes, it does.
frown

When threading thread through a needle you are right size matters smile


All these years playing and I still consider myself a novice.
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: johnstaf] #2847900
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Originally Posted by johnstaf
PS, I can't imagine any situation where having a real grand action is a disadvantage, just that when choosing a DP. the most realistic action may not be the one I like best. For my purposes, I'm hoping the new Roland action (the hybrid action that isn't really) will be perfect for me. If not, I'll probably buy a Yamaha CLP-685, N1X, or NV10 in the future.

Are you talking about the Roland LX706/LX708 actions? I have compared them to the N1 and NV10 back in December and there is no comparison really. The N1 and NV10 are much better. I will likely buy an N1X or NV10 this week. The store with the N1X also has a CLP685 and the LX708. I didn't try the CLP685 when I was there last, but will compare all three of LX708, CLP685, and N1X side-by-side this week, before I go to another store to try again the NV10. (I decided I just try one last time before buying.)


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Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: EPW] #2847903
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Originally Posted by EPW
Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Size matters.
No, it doesn't.
Yes, it does.
frown

When threading thread through a needle you are right size matters smile


The size of this thread also matters. smile


Yamaha N1X, P-515. Garritan CFX. Genelec 8331 monitors.
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2847977
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The 695 is a nice piano. But it seems odd to compare it with the Avant Grands. The 695 has neither the upright action of the N1 nor the grand action of the N3.

Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Chrispy] #2847979
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Originally Posted by Chrispy
In my personal opinion, that doesn't matter a lick, the action on the AG is so much better than the CLP-685. It's an apple and oranges comparison. I didn't mind the CLP, but now that I have the AG there's no going back ever...


I spent well oven an hour in the music store, going back and forth between the AvantGrand N1 and the CLP-695 before I made my desicion. My findings:

1) Force required to press down a key the same beteween the two, at least I couldn't tell the difference.
2) When the keys are pressed down, there is no discernable difference in the "feel" as the key reaches the bottom position.
3) With both pianos, there is a discrete, but clear "escapement" feel as you press down a key: therefore no difference in how quickly you can repeat the same note (I can manage about 7-8 times/second on my piano, and I don't know if it is the piano or my brain that sets that limit. I suspect my brain is the culprint, since the piano is specified for 13, I think)
4) Both pianos require the same pressure to press dow a key down near the rear end of the key: this is why the length of the key (e.g. distance between pivot point and finger) is important: if the pivot is too close to the finger, the key requires greater force to be pressed down, making it more difficult to play well. As you guys discussed above. This was previously a main weakness of digital pianos, but with the grand touch keyboard, Yamaha seems to have taken care of that issue.
5) I could not detect any difference in "pressure curve" -e.g. resistance from the key as the key was going up or down from the bottom position of the keybed. Same feel in both pianos.

I thought long and carefully about this, because it was a vital part of my purchase desicion, and my question was this:

If I cannot detect any difference whatsoever in the properties or playability of the mechanics even after careful testing for more than an hour: how can I then motivate the purchase of a hybrid piano with traditional mechanics?


To begin with, the AvantGrand N1 had less powerful speakers and a less appealing overall sound than the 695GP. Second, the mechanics of the AG is more complex, with wooden parts and felt components bound to be in need of service, just like with an acoustic grand. This is bound to cost me money further down the road, as the warranty runs out in 5 years.

My question to the quoted poster above is: if you experienced the AG as "so much better" the the grand touch keyboard: what specific properties where you referring to, of the above mentioned points 1 to 5? Were there other significant properties not mentioned above?

Let me emphasize: this is not a "AG vs CLP fight". I'm honestly interested in your experience, and how you feel that the properties of the keybeds differ.



Last edited by Finurliig; 05/14/19 04:29 AM.

Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: MacMacMac] #2847990
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Originally Posted by MacMacMac
The 695 is a nice piano. But it seems odd to compare it with the Avant Grands. The 695 has neither the upright action of the N1 nor the grand action of the N3.


1) The N1, N2 and N3 all have the same grand piano action: read the specs on the Yamaha website. You're thinkting about the NU1X, with an upright action.
2) Comparison irrelevant? I must beg to differ; this is a highly relevant question for a vast number of piano buyers:

Have the mechanics of digital pianos finally reached a level of technical refinement that makes them roughly equal to pianos with traditional mechanics, in terms of opportunities for musical expression?

Ten years ago, I would have answered "no" to that question. Today, with this grand touch action, I'm not so sure.

Yamaha's competitors have also presented similar improvements, so we can assume this is a general trend with digital pianos: the piano manufacturers are striving to make digital pianos that are serious competitors to the best acoustic pianos in terms of playability and the mechanics.
The only remaining advantage with a traditional acoustic grand today would be the sound they produce: even with high quality speakers, it's simply not possible to get the same dynamic range or "living" sound out of the speaker cones of a digital piano as the real acoustic thing.

And if this is the case, how is it possible to still motivate the purchase of an Avant Grand with.......loudspeakers?


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2848004
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I have not played the GrandTouch; however, I own a P-515 (NWX), and it’s fantastic. I’ve been playing on 3-sensor actions for a while, and honestly I never noticed that much of an improvement over the 2-sensor actions in terms of repetition and overall playability until I played the P-515 (paired to Pianoteq). And yes, I now wonder how much of an advantage the ‘real thing’ used in the hybrids offer in practical terms. I used to ‘hate’ folded actions and believed these could never come close to a Kawai-type action. I now prefer this action (NWX) to the Kawai RM3, GF, etc...

No doubt that the action in these hybrids is the absolute-entry-level in every sense of the word and that must be taken into consideration. Also, I do feel that there’s a predisposition: ‘the grand action has to be better because..........’ and one cannot deny that this will have an influence in players’ perspectives before they even play/compare these actions. So I say, at least have an open mind and do not dismiss at a glance.
I’ve played the N2 and I cannot say that it’s hands-down better than my current setup. On the other hand, the last time I played a Steinway (M) even playing a scale was a momentous experience compared to any digital. Perhaps this has to do with how the action connects to the sound in a full-blown acoustic, but the N2 simply did not come close to recreating a similar experience.

Of course, this is just Pete14’s opinion. I watched a video where the reviewer stated that the NWX was ‘too sensitive and unlike any acoustic action;’ for me it’s that sensitivity and trigger-happy aspect that allows for everything from dynamics, articulation, repetition, etc.. to simply feel right.
Does it feel/play like the Steinway? Perhaps not, but it feels like a ‘real’ action and not like a botched mutation.

Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2849756
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Thanks for sharing your update Pianoguy SWE! I sold my CLP-465 about a month

ago with intentions to upgrade to this model, but I was unable to find a

floor model to try so I have been relying heavily on reviews the past few

months. I just recently put 1k down on the CLP-695 and have another

month before it arrives to the store for pick up. I did end up putting the

$ down before trying it, but have since found a store that had a floor

model and was able to sample it for about an hour. I gotta be honest here

and say I wasn't super impressed with sound or action of the CLP-695, and

was getting nervous that I made a hasty decision. IMO the clp-695

sounded MORE digital than the CLP-465 which really surprised me considering

the new samples/ higher wattage speakers in the 695 model. The action did

feel more realistic in the 695 to me, but also seemed a lot heavier than

what I had been playing on.

With that said, I am self taught on the piano, and have only really learned to

play using my clp-465, and part of me thinks that I am just so use to the

GH3 action on the 465 that anything else just doesn't feel or sound

natural to me. I never learned on a real piano so it is hard for me to

discern what to look for in terms of playability. I am mainly into

Classical piano and am really wanting to push myself to learn some of the more advanced stuff.
I am hoping the 695 won't be a challenge to learn some of the

faster/more advanced classical pieces considering the heavier action that

it has.(Hopefully you can comfort me in regards to this concern).

Either way, this is the piano I am sticking with because the hybrids are

above my price range, and I need to be able to separate left and right

channels to learn the music by ear.

Really appreciate the update you gave, because there is not much out

there on this specific piano. I think I may do my own in depth review and post to

youtube once I get the clp-695 myself .

I will see if this link works, but here is a sample of the CLP-465 that I just sold.

Is it possible that the new sound samples are actually worse or am I crazy?



https://www.facebook.com/john.frederick.967/videos/2081324031923068/



https://youtu.be/VrI_lDzRnGM

Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: johnfred] #2849846
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Well, I believe that 695 is a very very good purchase. It does not sound "more digital" than older Yamaha piano, probably you are stuck with old piano you played for years, so maybe you did not expect a different, newer performances. Heavier action is bettere for classical music pianist. Don't worry, you will be happy with your new piano. Let us know.

Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: johnfred] #2850571
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Originally Posted by johnfred

Is it possible that the new sound samples are actually worse or am I crazy?


I’ll can record the sound of the CFX and the Bösendorfer and post a link to it here. It might take a couple of days for me to get around to it though: I have a lot to do right now.
When I listen to your recording, my answer would be no, the 695 does not sound more ”synthetic”, but I’ll try and make a sample for you and let you hear for yourself.


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2850603
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I can't get my head around the CLP's actions, both low and high end models. And it annoys me, 'cause I like how they sound. For me they're just too "blocky", they're not gradual enough. Remind me of an upright, but not in a good way - and my education has been 100% on uprights, so stuff like NU1X is totally ok for me.

For my fingers, N series is a different planet, especially N1X (likely N3X, too, but I can't remember how it feels). Do I think the musical result achievable on an N1 is significantly better than a high-end CLP? No, unless maybe you're a piano demi-god.

Re: The Yamaha CLP-695GP, six months later: [Re: Hecarim] #2850661
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Originally Posted by Hecarim
I can't get my head around the CLP's actions, both low and high end models. And it annoys me, 'cause I like how they sound. For me they're just too "blocky", they're not gradual enough. Remind me of an upright, but not in a good way - and my education has been 100% on uprights, so stuff like NU1X is totally ok for me.


It's probably the most divisive action that's come on the market in quite a while. Some people love it, and others say it feels too weird. It's an interesting situation. The version in the CLP-675 is missing the counterweights that are in the 685 and 695. That strikes me as really weird. It's like a broken version as opposed to a lower end alternative.

Last edited by johnstaf; 05/21/19 08:59 AM.
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2850668
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Ok: I got half an hour to spare this afternoon, so I made a simple soundcheck recording of the 695 with my iPhone.

The iPhone mic can't capture the higher notes adequately: it sounds quite terrible on the recording. In real life the higher notes of the CFX voice has a nice crystalline quality I really like. The bass is captured somewhat better.

I'll go to the music store and pick up a decent recording mic sometime next week, but this will have to do for now. Hope you fint this one useful in the meantime, Johnfred.

https://youtu.be/bL3hZgYMFw0


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: johnstaf] #2850720
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Originally Posted by johnstaf

It's probably the most divisive action that's come on the market in quite a while. Some people love it, and others say it feels too weird. It's an interesting situation. The version in the CLP-675 is missing the counterweights that are in the 685 and 695. That strikes me as really weird. It's like a broken version as opposed to a lower end alternative.


Anything that tries to artificially reproduce "the real thing" is going to be polarizing. For my part, I finally had the chance to play a CLP-695GP at my local store for about an hour and must say - I came away quite impressed with the action. It's probably the best out of anything I've tried in the Clavinova line - far superior to the mushy action on the entry-level CLP-665GP (the speakers were also far louder and fuller).

The two criticisms of the 695's action being too loud and heavy: I went back and forth between the 695 and 665, banging away at both keybeds and the difference in loudness is pretty small. As for heaviness, yes at first I felt a slight resistance at the beginning of the key travel. There's also a "notchiness" about it which if I'm being picky isn't the most natural sensation at first - but I got used to it quickly. Everything from fast runs/trills to slow expressive pieces felt extremely rewarding to play. IMHO I'd say the action even rivals the hybrid action of the Casio Celvianos I've played.

Last edited by vara411; 05/21/19 11:56 AM.

Yamaha AvantGrand N3X
Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2850805
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Thanks for uploading that video!

I actually prefer the piano being recorded with a phone or microphone vs using direct feed. You Most videos ( including mine) are recorded live and then synced up with the midi file which produces a nice clean sound, but the raw feel and power is somewhat lost.

After listening to that much appreciated demo video, I must say that low end is awesome. It does sound Way better than what I had been playing on and it gives me better confidence after listening to it. The high end is pretty nice too, and I do understand that a phone recording can only do so much justice to replicate what you are hearing while you play. The only negative I noticed while listening to the tone was the Mid- high keys on the piano. I also noticed this when I sampled the piano myself a few weeks ago. IMO they sound digital to me only in this specific Mid-high range, but After listening to the sound produced by the 465, and then watching your video , It is clear that the 695 Clp has more realistic tone in its overall quality.

Keep the videos coming pianoguy swe ! I wouldn’t mind hearing a classical piece played as I wait 3-4 weeks before I receive my piano.

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: johnstaf] #2850898
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It's probably the most divisive action that's come on the market in quite a while. Some people love it, and others say it feels too weird. It's an interesting situation. The version in the CLP-675 is missing the counterweights that are in the 685 and 695. That strikes me as really weird. It's like a broken version as opposed to a lower end alternative.
[/quote]


I think they released the Grand Turd action in the Clp 675, and then when it was not well received, they quickly threw some counterweights on it, and called it good, thus leading to the 685. I have not played the 675, but everything I’ve read says to stay away.

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2850917
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Haven't tried a 675.
Have heard that it's not good.
Call it a Grand Turd.

Brilliant analysis.

Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: johnfred] #2850965
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Originally Posted by johnfred


It's probably the most divisive action that's come on the market in quite a while. Some people love it, and others say it feels too weird. It's an interesting situation. The version in the CLP-675 is missing the counterweights that are in the 685 and 695. That strikes me as really weird. It's like a broken version as opposed to a lower end alternative.



I think they released the Grand Turd action in the Clp 675, and then when it was not well received, they quickly threw some counterweights on it, and called it good, thus leading to the 685. I have not played the 675, but everything I’ve read says to stay away.[/quote]

The exact opposite of what I am my dealer find when actually playing them. So I think the 685 is the Grand Turd. Certainly the strangest action that I have ever encountered in 70 years!


Roland LX7

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I tested the 675 for about 20 minutes and it made my hands hurt it was that bad. Bears no relation to any acoustic piano I've ever played, and it's a huge shame because as others have said the sound is pretty good (especially the Bosendorfer).


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Re: Comparison between Yamaha CLP-695GP and Yamaha N series? [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2851068
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Sounds like I offended some 675 owners. Sorry, that was not my intention. I really just wanted to somehow work “ Grand Turd” into the conversation. I’m sure the action is just fine in this model. Counterweights. were just added to make it better smile

Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2851198
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I measured the weight of the keys at the low and high ends of the keyboard using a few nuts, brackets and bolts I had weighed in at my digital houshold scale. Result:

*Downweight (the weight required to press down a key) = 73 grams for lower keys, and 62 for the high
*Upweight (the weight required to prevent the key from going up from a depressed state) = 56 grams for the lower keys, and 35 grams for the higher keys

An Avant Grand has a downweight of approximately 60-70 grams, so in terms of ligth/heavy action, they seem to be approximately similar to the Grand Touch action of the 685/695. Yamaha’s acoustic grands are reported to be roughly equal to the Avant Grands.

Steinways, on the other hand, are extremely light compared to most other pianos: they can have a downweight as low as 48-54 grams and an upweight of 20-30.

So in conclusion, do the 685/695 have a heavy action compared to acoustic pianos and other digital pianos? That depends of what you are comparing with: they seem to be somewhat similar to Yamaha AG and other Yamaha acoustic grands but, like most other pianos, they are heavier than an average Steinway.

Is a heavier action a downside? Not necessarily: it depends much on your own taste and style. Many piano teachers recommend heavier actions to their students because that will help the student to strengthen his fingers.
Personally, I grew up with a Schimmel acoustic grand piano at home: an instrument with a fantastic tone, but the action was heavy as a Soviet tractor.
To me, the action on the CLP-695GP feels light in comparison, so I don’t mind it at all. Someone who grew up with a Stein in the livingroom might have another opinion, though.

A webpage discussing this and other aspects of piano actions in more detail:

http://www.pianofinders.com/educational/touchweight.htm

Last edited by Pianoguy_SWE; 05/22/19 03:18 PM.

Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Colin Miles] #2851206
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Quote

I think they released the Grand Turd action in the Clp 675, and then when it was not well received, they quickly threw some counterweights on it, and called it good, thus leading to the 685. I have not played the 675, but everything I’ve read says to stay away.


Interesting theory. But iirc the CLP-685 and 675 were released at the same time, as Yamaha always does with their CLP lineup. There was no attempt at a "quick fix" and no indication that Yamaha sees anything wrong with the GrandTouch action.

Plus, the previous generation, the CLP-575, which shares the NWX action with the CLP-585, also lacks counterweights that the latter has. It's simply how Yamaha has historically differentiated the actions between their best and next-best offerings in the line.

BTW Colin, may want to edit your post as it seems like you make the above quote smile


Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11 || Kawai NV-10
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Gombessa] #2851232
05/22/19 05:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Gombessa


BTW Colin, may want to edit your post as it seems like you make the above quote smile

Can't edit it. Yes - we found the 685 very 'strange' not the 675. A bit like wading through treacle and not like any acoustic I have ever played. But it seems some people experience the exact opposite! There you go.


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Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2851667
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I tried the CLP 695 yesterday. I wasn't impressed by both the CFX and Bosendorfer sounds at all. The CFX was better but still sounded lacking.

Action wise, it felt "mushy", which is a word i've seen here before when the Kawai GF action gets mentioned as well.

Tomorrow i'm going to test the CA78 which has the GFII action and hopefully that will give me an idea of what the MP11SE action is like...because i'm shopping for one!

Last edited by RobR; 05/24/19 06:14 AM.
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: RobR] #2851775
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Well, here is an actual comparison of the sound of the MP11 (using the same sound engine as the C78, I beleive?) and the Yamaha CLP 685. It's the guy from Bonners music store again.



The Kawai actions are somewhat lighter, while it seems that Yamaha is aiming to build actions somewhat heavier in both their digital and their acoustic product lines. Maybe this is what you tried to describe when you wrote about the "mushy" quality you felt?
I'm also not quite sure what "mushy" actually means in terms of measurable physical properties? It would be interesting to see you elaborate on that.


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2851778
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My version of "mushy" : Light, passive resistance on rebound (applies only to the 695), soft, tender. Of all the P-series and the CLP i tried yesterday, all of their actions were too light for my tastes. I guess that sums it up that i will NEVER be friends with the action that Yamaha uses on their digitals.

On the other hand, i really liked the action on the ES8. If the GF action is as heavy as the ES8 action, i'm sold. Tomorrow i will find out (trying the CA78).

Last edited by RobR; 05/24/19 12:22 PM.
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: RobR] #2851783
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Well, in the video linked above, the guy from Bonners music store measures the touchweight of both the Kawai and the Yamaha, and it turns out that the Kawai had a "lighter" action? -Look at around 4:30 in the video above.

Please report back tomorrow when you've tried it: it would interesting to hear what you think. A friend of mine is planning to buy a DP for himself, and he wants to know a little more about the new Kawai models. Your input would be appreciated =)


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2851808
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Originally Posted by Pianoguy_SWE
Well, here is an actual comparison of the sound of the MP11 (using the same sound engine as the C78, I beleive?) and the Yamaha CLP 685.


IIRC, the CA-78 includes the sound engine of the MP11 (for the EX Concert Grand) as well as the MP11SE (for the SK-EX and SK-5), but it also has Kawai's latest "SK-EX Rendering/Pianist Mode" rendering engine with 88-key resonances. So assuming Bonners tested with the default sound, the CA-78 should be 2 generations ahead of the MP11.


Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11 || Kawai NV-10
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Gombessa] #2851854
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Ok, and this "SK/EX Rendering/Pianist mode" is something similar to Yamahas "Virtual resonance modeling", simulating string and cabinet resonance, I assume?


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2851922
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You must have hands made of concrete. Yamaha digitals are known to be heavy. Some say too heavy.

If you find them too light then I doubt you'll ever find a suitable digital.

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: MacMacMac] #2851934
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”Hands made of concrete”?

A short reminder to put things into perspective:

1) Yamaha is the worlds biggest manufacturer of digital pianos. For a number of good reasons. All the millions of people who appreciate them don’t do so because they have ”hands made of concrete”.
2) I didn’t say I find them too light: I wrote that I find the action light compared to the, very heavy, Schimmel grand I played on as a kid. This action feels just right for me. Of course, or I wouldnt have bought it.
3) Roughly 10 grams of downweight seems to be the difference Between a Kawai and a Yamaha action: this is a matter of personal preference that has little or nothing to do with actual playability.
Personally I dislike the light actions: they tend to give the pianist less control. Other prefer the light actions because they make it easier to play fast passages. what people prefer depends on finger strength and personal taste.

I think making these comparisons and diving into the specs of different pianos are rather interesting, as long as people just describe the sound and mechanical properties of their instruments.
If we all do, threads like this may actually guide someone to a better piano purchase, suited to their personal need.

But these ”clever” comments, like the one above, or various emotional outbursts don’t provide any useful information for anyone else, and is best avoided. Please?

......but sure, I can see where this thread is going...... 🙄

Last edited by Pianoguy_SWE; 05/24/19 10:14 PM.

Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2852222
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Still waiting for that Classical piece Pianoguy SWE. I have not been able to find any classical pieces being demonstrated on the 695, and from some of your previous posts, it seems like you might be familiar with a few classical songs. I have viewed every video on YouTube, and I am a little disappointed with the lack of selection on Clp 695 . The dealer I am purchasing through did say I could swap to a different piano if I wasn’t fully satisfied, but what a headache it would be to load it up and return it to a store over an hour away. It is unfortunate that you can not sample all these pianos in one place, and it is nearly impossible to find any of the digital baby grands in any store near me. Reviews/ videos is sometimes all we have to make a decision.

Thanks for all the data you have given so far. Interesting with your findings in key weight.
The difference of 10 grams in weight really seems insignificant in terms of playability. Time will tell, but someone mentioned heavy key action is better for Classical playing anyways. I have not heard that before.

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: johnfred] #2852233
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Originally Posted by johnfred
Still waiting for that Classical piece Pianoguy SWE. I have not been able to find any classical pieces being demonstrated on the 695, and from some of your previous posts, it seems like you might be familiar with a few classical songs. I have viewed every video on YouTube, and I am a little disappointed with the lack of selection on Clp 695 .


I’ve played the piano since i was 6 years old. Time flies. But I’m just another amateur who enjoys playing at home, and I don’t think I’m good enough to start publishing ”performances”. Maybe I’ll change my mind about that some day, but not today.

The dealer at the music shop told me that there aren’t too many of these instruments around: he said that only 5-10 of these pianos were shipped to Europe last year. I presume he got that figure from Yamaha’s people.
That should account for the lack of YouTube videos: I’ve seen some stuff being published by a guy named ”from rubbish to Rachmaninoff”, playing Für Elise and some Bach. Except for that, some promo material and NAMM videos seems to be the only thing out there.

The lack of material was the very reason I started this thread to begin with: I’ve been trying to fill the gaps, so to speak. 😊

Last edited by Pianoguy_SWE; 05/25/19 11:41 PM.

Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2859957
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Finally received my Clp 695 and have been playing it for only about 5 days at this point.

It is a little early to give a full on review, but my first impressions would agree with Pianoguys review.

The action is pretty solid considering it is artificial in nature, and it is by far the best of the Clavinova series. As some have pointed out, it is slightly heavier than the real grands I have played on, but this should not be a deal breaker as my fingers are already adjusting. I can already tell in the short amount of time that I have practiced, that I am able to play with more feeling and emotion than was ever possible on my old CLP 465. The noticed the keys themselves have a lot better grip and my ability to play fast and more accurately has increased dramatically . Yamaha has built a really fine instrument, and I am finally relieved to know I made a good decision.


At the price point of the 695, I would say it is a good middle ground for those wanting a realistic grand piano without paying the $14000 price tag on the Avantgrand series. I have played the N3x and it is definitely better in feel and sound, but I could not justify paying $9000 more for maybe 20% better quality. Maybe the next upgrade for me!

Thanks for all the info Pianoguy swe, and if anyone has a question about this particular piano, I would love to help you out. I would also be able to post a video if anyone was interested in seeing or hearing the piano in action.

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: johnfred] #2859963
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Originally Posted by johnfred
I would love to help you out. I would also be able to post a video if anyone was interested in seeing or hearing the piano in action.


Yes please!

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: johnfred] #2859964
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Congrats on the new piano! Hope it brings you years of joy.

Originally Posted by johnfred

At the price point of the 695, I would say it is a good middle ground for those wanting a realistic grand piano without paying the $14000 price tag on the Avantgrand series. I have played the N3x and it is definitely better in feel and sound, but I could not justify paying $9000 more for maybe 20% better quality. Maybe the next upgrade for me!


One small correction to this. The AG series actually starts around $8000 (for the older N2), and $8500 for the new N1X. Technically speaking, the NU1X is now also an AvantGrand, and is significantly cheaper (though it has an upright action rather than a grand).


Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11 || Kawai NV-10
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2859979
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Is your new piano nicely placed in a room worthy of photos? I ask because it's not often we get to see a grand-look digital piano.

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Gombessa] #2860022
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I was specifically speaking about the N3x. as it is comparable in size. My dealer quoted me $13000-14000 for that piano. I suppose there are other options in the Avantgrand series, but for someone who is keen on the baby grand look, those were my 2 options. I could not see how someone could justify spending the extra on the N3x unless money was not an issue to them. The CLP 695 is Real Real Real close to the N3x. The added functions of the CLP make it a wash in terms of small quality difference. I would say you get way more value out of you dollar with the clavinova series, but again I paid only $ 5000 for the CLP 695. I suppose if I had to pay the MSRP $8500 for the Clp, it could be a bit tempting to get the N3x. IMO- still not worth the price difference though.

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: johnstaf] #2860025
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Originally Posted by johnstaf
Originally Posted by johnfred
I would love to help you out. I would also be able to post a video if anyone was interested in seeing or hearing the piano in action.


Yes please!



Would you prefer direct feed sound or basic live camera sound.

BTW ... I will need a few days to get something posted.

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2860033
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So you got your CLP 695 for about $5,000? Don't forget to update the prices paid thread too, please.

If you could do the down weight and up weight measurements like David B did of his N1X at middle "C", I would appreciate that! I am in the market right now for a practice piano and will need to know those two measurements for my hand's benefit.

Yes, please post pics and/or a video! Would love to see the shinning wood on top.


Nord Grand, Kawai MP11 (v1), iMac 2017, Yamaha HS8's, Sennheiser 650, Focusrite 2i4, Pianoteq 6.4.0, Steinway Model A, Mason and Hamlin Model AA, Piano Marvel: 3B
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: HwyStar] #2860047
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Originally Posted by HwyStar
So you got your CLP 695 for about $5,000? Don't forget to update the prices paid thread too, please.

If you could do the down weight and up weight measurements like David B did of his N1X at middle "C", I would appreciate that! I am in the market right now for a practice piano and will need to know those two measurements for my hand's benefit.

Yes, please post pics and/or a video! Would love to see the shinning wood on top.





Yes . $4800 plus tax.

I’m pretty sure Pianoguy Swe already posted some down weight/ up weight measurements in an above post.

I am new to the forum and was unaware of a “price paid”. forum. I will look into that.

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2860057
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Thanks JohnFred. I will scope that out.

The prices paid is at the top of the DP forum thread as a stickey.


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Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: johnfred] #2860061
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Originally Posted by johnfred


Yes . $4800 plus tax.

I’m pretty sure Pianoguy Swe already posted some down weight/ up weight measurements in an above post.

I am new to the forum and was unaware of a “price paid”. forum. I will look into that.


Woah! That is the cheapest price I’ve seen by far. I was negotiating for a friend and they wouldn’t go lower than $6400 for the CLP695GP, but they gave me pretty good deals on two other pianos I’d bought from them. Weird.

Congrats on a steal of a price, though! Yes, pictures and video would be awesome. Anything you can share would be appreciated.


Yamaha AvantGrand N3X
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Here is a video of a quick review I put together last night. I really only had an hour before my kids got home so please don’t criticize me for not being more prepared in my presentation. If I had more time I could put something a little more informative together, but this at least puts something out there for people to review.


https://youtu.be/UzrbV2Xu8Ng

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2860396
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Thanks John for that. I'm glad you are enjoying it!

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: johnfred] #2860400
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Originally Posted by johnfred
Here is a video of a quick review I put together last night. I really only had an hour before my kids got home so please don’t criticize me for not being more prepared in my presentation. If I had more time I could put something a little more informative together, but this at least puts something out there for people to review.


https://youtu.be/UzrbV2Xu8Ng


Very nice review, John! thumb


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Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Tyrone Slothrop] #2860487
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...and very good pianist, too! Congrats John, particularly for a very well played Debussy. Because a nice piano does not play on its own!

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Nice video John!

Congrats on the new piano!

James
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It’s nice to hear that you are happy with it, Johnfred. Nice review!

It’s a little daring to buy an instrument when you haven’t had a chance to try it properly, but I’m glad it turned out well for you.
I think you will be happy with it; I adapted to the action completely in less than a week, and if you come from another Yamaha piano, you shouldn’t have any problems with it.

BTW, I felt I had to pick up the glove you threw at me before, so I’ve just started practising a new piece I really like:

https://music.apple.com/se/album/en...wv-807-1-prelude/1452167957?i=1452168164

I’m thinking I should make this a challenge for the next few months: learn this and make a passable YouTube performance of it. No guarantees that I will succed in playing this well enough to be published, but I will try my best. I just hope I will get enough time for it. =)


Yamaha CLP-695GP at home.

Composers: Bach, Chopin, Liszt, Rachmaninoff, Mendelssohn.

Performers: David Fray, Jean Rondeau, Glenn Gould, Evgeny Kissin, Daniel Barenboim
Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianoguy_SWE] #2864522
06/30/19 10:05 PM
06/30/19 10:05 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 17
Watertown, Wi
J
johnfred Offline
Junior Member
johnfred  Offline
Junior Member
J

Joined: May 2019
Posts: 17
Watertown, Wi
Originally Posted by Pianoguy_SWE
It’s nice to hear that you are happy with it, Johnfred. Nice review!

It’s a little daring to buy an instrument when you haven’t had a chance to try it properly, but I’m glad it turned out well for you.
I think you will be happy with it; I adapted to the action completely in less than a week, and if you come from another Yamaha piano, you shouldn’t have any problems with it.

BTW, I felt I had to pick up the glove you threw at me before, so I’ve just started practising a new piece I really like:

https://music.apple.com/se/album/en...wv-807-1-prelude/1452167957?i=1452168164

I’m thinking I should make this a challenge for the next few months: learn this and make a passable YouTube performance of it. No guarantees that I will succed in playing this well enough to be published, but I will try my best. I just hope I will get enough time for it. =)




I’ve found that I really have to Love the piece if I am going to spend 50+ hours learning to play it.
There is no doubt in my mind that you can learn that Bach piece with enough practice.

I think I have 60+ hours learning Claire De lune, and at times I certainly wanted to give up. I mentioned this before, but I learn with the aid of decreasing tempo, and separating the left/ right parts which allows me to learn by ear. I think it may take me a bit longer this way, but I have no interest in learning to read music , and feel it may be a step backwards at this point in my life. Super thankful for technology!

I firmly believe you can do anything you put your mind to, so I will be looking forward to hearing the English Suite after you have mastered it!

Re: Comment on light VS heavy actions: [Re: Pianofortissimo] #2864523
06/30/19 10:07 PM
06/30/19 10:07 PM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 17
Watertown, Wi
J
johnfred Offline
Junior Member
johnfred  Offline
Junior Member
J

Joined: May 2019
Posts: 17
Watertown, Wi
Originally Posted by Pianofortissimo
...and very good pianist, too! Congrats John, particularly for a very well played Debussy. Because a nice piano does not play on its own!



Much Appreciated.

Thank you

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