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"offending notes" in Pianoteq #2768351
09/29/18 10:25 AM
09/29/18 10:25 AM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 327
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Grazilerimba Offline OP
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Grazilerimba  Offline OP
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I have come to get used a little bit more to Pianoteq's sound (6.2), even though I still prefer sampled pianos. But playing around a bit with some of the presets, I can now finally see why people praise it for its playability. The expression I can put into it is really nice.

I have a strange issue though. Some notes will always sound off or bad. The higest A (the third white key from the right) will most often produce a harsh sound that hurts my ears when I listen to it in my headphones. The uppermost five or six or so key have this kind of quality to it, but that particular A Key really hurts in my ears, like a sting. This is the case throughout many of the presets. Most notably in the Steinway D, for example in the "Classical Recording BA" preset. The Steinway B doesn't hurt as much.

Switching the sound to Binaural alleviates it a lot, but then the sound is also very different.

Does anyone have the same experience, and perhaps a suggestion about what to do about this? I was thinking, perhaps it's a problem with my sound system, but other piano VSTs don't hurt when I play that A key.

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Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: Grazilerimba] #2768391
09/29/18 02:17 PM
09/29/18 02:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
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stamkorg Offline
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Yes me too, but not the same note.
The B5 sounds harsh to me.
It seems this is very personal.
There are some solutions that can help:
1. Use the EQ to slightly cut the specific frequency of this note
2. Slightly decrease the volume or detune the annoying notes (possible with the standard and pro version, not sure with the stage)
3. With the pro version there is a lot of parameters to tweak note by note to improve that.

Despite of this, Pianoteq still remains my favorite vst piano for all its the other advantages.

Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: stamkorg] #2768392
09/29/18 02:21 PM
09/29/18 02:21 PM
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stamkorg Offline
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Also, try the Bluthner, it sounds much more soft on the High register

Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: Grazilerimba] #2768402
09/29/18 02:55 PM
09/29/18 02:55 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 7,828
Northern England.
peterws Offline
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peterws  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 7,828
Northern England.
There we go again! Moddart's tryin' their very best to replicate a real piano with dodgy sounding notes and there are complaints, I've noticed these myself; it's a welcome, refreshing change from the clinical digital sound (88 note tuning? Why bother) which seems to be in vogue with the makers at least . . .De-tuning will even up things a little for you and sound even more authentic to boot.
What's not to like?


"I am not a man. I am a free number"

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Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: Grazilerimba] #2768447
09/29/18 07:40 PM
09/29/18 07:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 722
Atlanta, GA
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Jake Jackson Offline
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Jake Jackson  Offline
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Atlanta, GA
Could the problem be with your keyboard? The sensors are worn on those notes, or it just wasn't calibrated correctly? Have you tried switching it out with another MIDI keyboard? Seems very odd that it is always the same notes that offend.

Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: Grazilerimba] #2768574
09/30/18 12:48 PM
09/30/18 12:48 PM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 327
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Grazilerimba Offline OP
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Grazilerimba  Offline OP
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Hello,
just to be clear, this is not exactly a complaint thread... I think I have voiced my opinion on Pianoteq's sound here before, I personally prefer sampled pianos and rather dislike PIanoteq's sound which sounds artificial to me, but what I mean is that I can now finally appreciate Pianoteq's playability, and that lead to me spending more time with it, and that made me discover this note.

I don't mean that it just stands out or is harsh - several sampled VSTs have harsh notes that stand out, but none of them actually hurt my ears in the headphones. They're just louder and annoying. That one A key in Pianoteq actually hurts my ears, leading me to avoid playing it or trying to play it quieter. So much that, if I play for a bit and hit that key repeatedly, my ears keep hurting for a while after I am finished playing. That's what lead me to the suspicion that this could be caused by my sound system, but then - no other sampled VST does this.

One annoyance in Pianoteq which doesn't hurt my ears is that a couple of specific bass notes, I think it was one of the Cs, sound very metallic, as if they have a tin can sound quality to it. I read a couple of forum posts on here in which people complained about that as well, and someone suggested to make a change to the string length. I laughed at that, but then tried it myself, and in my disbelief, it actually changed the sound and made the metallic sound a lot weaker. Ivory II American Concert D has one such note, leading me to believe that for whatever reason, some Steinways might have one or several notes that have this kind of quality to them. But my point is, this didn't hurt my ears. Only my soul and my wallet crazy

The Bluethner has the same issue as the Steinway. The only thing that actually helped was to switch over to Binaural, that alleviated it a lot, but then it also sounds drastically different.

Re: Jake Jackson, I think this has nothing to do with my Keyboard. It's not just about a note velocity that's too high, but rather about notes having a certain quality to them that hurts my ears. This would also happen if I create a midi file inside my DAW without using my keyboard.

I'll try stamkorg's suggestions. I thought what he suggested was only possible with the Pro version which I don't own. I believe that the individual note volume is not possible to change with Standard. But I'll look. Despite its sound I'm actually looking forward to spending more time with Pianoteq now, if I can find a solution for this. Thank you


Last edited by Grazilerimba; 09/30/18 12:55 PM.
Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: Grazilerimba] #2768583
09/30/18 01:47 PM
09/30/18 01:47 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 96
Zurich
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Smaug Offline
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Smaug  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
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Zurich
If you can't alter the piano not-by-note and are using Pianoteq inside a DAW, just apply a notch eq filter to reduce the offending frequency band.

Update: sorry just saw this has been suggested already.

Last edited by Smaug; 09/30/18 01:48 PM.
Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: Grazilerimba] #2768696
10/01/18 03:56 AM
10/01/18 03:56 AM
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 550
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Beakybird Offline
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Beakybird  Offline
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Posts: 550
You can change individual volume of notes in standard. Right click volume? If not, read manual.


Roland FP-90; Pianoteq 6 + many add-ons; 2 Yamaha HS8s; ATH-M50X and Samson SR850 headphones; Xenyx Q802USB interface. 2; I make a living playing a Yamaha PSR-S970 with FBT Maxx 2a's, Crowne Headset Mic. I also play guitar.
Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: Beakybird] #2768752
10/01/18 09:28 AM
10/01/18 09:28 AM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 327
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Grazilerimba Offline OP
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Grazilerimba  Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Beakybird
You can change individual volume of notes in standard. Right click volume? If not, read manual.


Nice! I had no idea you could do this, but it worked. I was able to reduce the volume of the offending notes, and while they are not quieter, they don't sting in my ear anymore.
It looks like this is a Pro feature. In the FAQ it says:

"Is there a trial version of Pianoteq Pro?
The Pianoteq trial version is for evaluation of both Pianoteq Standard and Pianoteq Pro. In particular, volume and detune are editable note per note to demonstrate the possibilities of the Pro version."

So is this note per note editing just a demo functionality and will go away after 20 minutes or something? I'll see as I play the instrument more.

And thank you Smaug, I could indeed use an EQ inside a DAW. I don't have much knowledge about using these plugins but I'll start learning it.

Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: Grazilerimba] #2768793
10/01/18 12:30 PM
10/01/18 12:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 302
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stamkorg Offline
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Originally Posted by Grazilerimba

So is this note per note editing just a demo functionality and will go away after 20 minutes or something? I'll see as I play the instrument more.


Volume and Detune are the only 2 parameters that can be edited note by note in the Standard version.

To edit the other parameters note by note, the pro version is required

Re: "offending notes" in Pianoteq [Re: stamkorg] #2769013
10/02/18 09:19 AM
10/02/18 09:19 AM
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 327
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Grazilerimba Offline OP
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Grazilerimba  Offline OP
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 327
Originally Posted by stamkorg
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba

So is this note per note editing just a demo functionality and will go away after 20 minutes or something? I'll see as I play the instrument more.


Volume and Detune are the only 2 parameters that can be edited note by note in the Standard version.

To edit the other parameters note by note, the pro version is required


Thank you for clearing this up. Gotta say, the Note Edit Function looks very advanced. Reminds me of the edit window in the VSL Vienna Imperial and CFX pianos.


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