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Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757936
08/12/18 02:42 PM
08/12/18 02:42 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,340
Urbandale, Iowa
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Steve Chandler Offline
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Urbandale, Iowa
Originally Posted by Matt1224
Originally Posted by Steve Chandler
I realize English is not your native language, but the description you offer brings many thoughts into my mind. So let me see if I have your story straight. You consider yourself a serious musician and music served your emotions well over many years. You searched long and hard for the perfect instrument which your father purchased for you. This instrument is very valuable and occupies a special place in your home (one that's dehumidified). Half a month after this instrument was delivered to your home your mother and brother had the temerity to stop by your home unannounced while you were elsewhere (IIRC, you were at mother's house, did they sneak out while you were there?) to tidy up and see the fine instrument your father had graced you with. You became livid at this intrusion and your musical sensibilities abandoned you and the emotional trauma of the intrusion continues to hamper your artistic advancement as a pianist. You ask if we can understand and appreciate your emotional injury and offer condolences and guidance on how to move forward. Does this accurately describe your experience?

Whether it does or does not matters little to me. What I realize is that if I ever choose to compose an opera I have a fabulous plot. My only question is how does the story end? I sincerely hope you will keep us informed of your progress.

Yes. This does accurately describe my experience. Exactly. And adding that also because of my adaptation period of getting a new grand(from Yamaha upright to a grand piano). It was only half a month. After that half, this unpleasant event occurred, and it is nearly a month until now. I am wondering and worrying if this unpleasant thing will have a bad impact on my musical and technical development, especially when I have ''accumulated" skills and imagination of the touch of a grand from an upright piano from a long period of time since I played, and I suddenly pour it all into my new grand, if I didn't describe it too ''abstractly'' and hope you understand.

Thank you for confirming that my impression of the situation is correct. Now allow me to speculate what your mother's, brother's and the rest of your family's intention may have been. In fact everything I'm about to write is SPECULATION. Your father spent a significant amount of money on one of his sons, did you think your brother didn't notice? A precedent has been set, your father is willing to invest a large sum in his progeny. Your brother in the short term may be snarky and comment that this was not a wise decision, but his long term interest would be better served if the investment in you proves successful. Otherwise dear father may not be inclined to invest in him a similar amount in the future. In my experience a significant negative emotional reaction to a situation where no physical harm is done to either person nor property is a sign of insecurity. Why might you feel insecure? I'm sure there are many reasons, but one that might be most relevant here could be that you've found your new Steinway A difficult to control. That's why you mention the adjustment period from your Yamaha upright. When you consider that professional pianists need to adjust almost instantaneously to the instrument in front of them, half a month for you should be plenty of time to adjust to a piano as fine as your Steinway.

So you are now indulging in feeling like an aggrieved artiste because your mother and brother invaded your privacy just to see your new piano and in the process they kindly tidied up a bit. An argument could be made that the piano doesn't even belong to you because your father paid for it. In the interest of giving you an opportunity to get out of your emotional funk I'm going to (proverbially) whack you upside da head. I have received many doses of "humble pie" in my life and usually they were richly deserved. My perception is that you would benefit from a serving of such now. My advice is not only to "get over it" but to beg your mother's and brother's forgiveness for being such an ungrateful child. The world can be a cruel place and there are multitudes of people in the world who would give their left testicle (or ovary) to be in your exact position. Stop whining about your artistry and how aggrieved you are and get back to the hard work of building your skills. Make yourself worthy of your father's generosity, practice until you deem yourself worthy of the fine instrument you've been given. Realize that your family (brother and mother included) only want you to be successful (sibling rivalry not withstanding) so invite them into your process of becoming a better pianist by playing for them regularly. I have three brothers so I know what sibling rivalry is about, but it's been four decades since it was in any way an issue in my life. Music is a hard business in which to be successful, you can't afford the luxury of being immature emotionally and you'll need every ally you can possibly find. Emotional immaturity may have been accepted from skilled musicians in the past, but no longer. I don't care who you are, what family you're from, what you've accomplished nor even how good you are, if you're a difficult person to deal with because of emotions most people and businesses will choose to take their business and patronage elsewhere.

As I said at the beginning, this is all speculation, I could be way off the mark. I'm sincerely trying to be constructive, but sometimes blunt language is necessary to make a point. I may be totally wrong, in which case I'm sure you'll correct me. I honestly believe your family would be very impressed if you asked their forgiveness for this lapse in maturity and if you expressed that you're trying to learn from the experience to be a better person and artist.

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Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: BDB] #2757942
08/12/18 03:37 PM
08/12/18 03:37 PM
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,314
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Sir Lurksalot Offline
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Originally Posted by BDB
In any case, it is not about the piano. It is a psychological tale. I do not think it is appropriate for this forum.


Exactly. This is a place to discuss pianos. You wouldn't ask a plumber for gardening tips. Why ask a piano community for family counseling advice?

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: ando] #2757946
08/12/18 03:58 PM
08/12/18 03:58 PM
Joined: Aug 2018
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Matt1224 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by David-G
I recently bought two pianos which were very special. I only wish my mother were alive so she could have seen these instruments - but if she were, and if she and my brother had looked at the pianos themselves without my being there to show them, I might have been disappointed, but I would not have been mortified and my delight in music would not have been affected. I am not saying you are wrong to feel as you do - only that people are different. That you and I would have quite different reactions in this circumstance says to me that the difficulty arises not from the piano, but from your reaction to the circumstances. And so I doubt that people who know about pianos can help - whereas people who understand human reactions might be able to help. I think that this is what DDobs was getting at with his suggestion - I don't think he meant it offensively. You might find that such a route would help you to get to the heart of the problem. Family is one of the most important things in life, perhaps the most important - and for you to split the family over this is a terrible step, which you may come to regret later.


Okay. I see. Thank you.
I just feel the Steinway was taken advantage of, since they just looked at it out of curiosity.....
Originally Posted by dogperson
If music is your heart, let your music be your center through tough times in your life: Not only with your family right now, but all the future things that will happen. What I would suggest that you do, is that you play every day and you will find that your skills and your heart have not been affected, music forms a protective covering. Let the piano be your solstice

I did not play for many decades, and when I returned to playing again it felt like I had found a long lost lover that I still loved deeply in my heart. Don’t let that happen to you. .... go play the music you love and wrap yourself IN THE MUSIC not your turmoil with your family

I do strongly agree not to let this break your family apart..... when I started playing again, I was deeply grieved that my father was not there to hear me play. Start with the music and heal your heart and then forgive your family and MoveOn

Okay. Thank you. Much blessing to you.
Originally Posted by dogperson
Originally Posted by Retsacnal
Oh, you poor thing! For catharsis, perhaps you could burn down the whole house, piano included. Then demand that your daddy buy you another. After all, this is all his fault anyway. Holding your breath may help to convince him.


Just a rhetorical question: did you even consider not hitting the ‘send’ button after you wrote this?

Thank you. I always think westerners are more cultivated, and willing to stand up for justice.
Originally Posted by DDobs
Please do not be offended when someone suggests you might benefit from seeing a therapist. A good therapist is an expert at helping one understand his or her emotions and make positive choices in response those emotions. You came here expressing severe distress and suggesting you might take extreme steps that could adversely affect you and your loved ones.

Okay. Just to clarify... I felt what you meant at the beginning anyway



Originally Posted by ando
It's easy to dismiss this incident as ridiculous and blown completely out of proportion, but this is clearly about far more than the here and now. It's a culmination of all that has occurred in this young man's family to this point. I think he deserves our support and some empathy rather than insults. I don't think we can necessarily do anything to help this situation, but we can be understanding that his pain is real and immense, and that he feels like he has lost his music - which is something that would distress all of us here.

Matt, I'm sorry you are hurting so badly. I understand that you have had some some painful experiences in your family life and that you feel a sense of not being respected, taken seriously, not being valued. This is very hard to accept, and now it is affecting your relationship with music. I believe the members here who have suggested you get some professional help were not being unkind or disrespectful, but they really want to help you. If you can't work this out with your family, it's best if you can work through some of this without them. Professional counsellors are very helpful because they are supportive and also unbiased. They can help you to find a way to deal with your feelings so you can feel more secure and regain what you feel you have lost. I have been to counsellors before during tough times. I don't consider it to be a weakness at all! I'm quite proud of myself that I needed some support and I went to get it. It is a sign of strength when you are willing to confront your problems, not a sign of weakness when you have problems. It's all the more important in the modern world because we don't have the same access to elderly wisdom and guidance that we might have had in the past.

I can only hope that you can begin to see that this is not about your piano or your music, it is about your unprocessed feelings about your family. You have not been able to express your feelings to them, and you feel very affected by things they do that feel invasive and disrespectful of your boundaries. It is only a sad coincidence that your piano became involved in this. But it is nothing to do with your piano. You must allow your piano and your music to return to your life and to provide you with the support that you need. You must deal with your underlying feelings separately - they are not about music, and making it about music and the piano is only making things even more confusing and painful. Think carefully about the real problems in your family and why you are feeling this way - it has nothing to do with your piano. Set your piano free, allow it to take its rightful place in your life. Find another way to deal with your family issues.

Best of luck.

Okay...I thought you got everything I wanted to know. Frankly speaking, I got issues with my family..."underlying" as you said. I think I would deal with that... Also not only my family issue but my past growing experiences. Like I said my piano and music keeps me company from started, it means my inner world. Like what you said they have invaded my "boundaries", so I burst out my emotion in a sudden...and feel like they have peeped at them and I lost "everything". I am kind of person who need personal space and boundaries...so that I can think myself solely, and they were like broke it all and I felt extremely uncomfortable. After all, you said it's not about piano and music hit the crux of my confusion... I was thinking about my music(especially sad pieces) sometimes come from my emotion generated from my past unpleasant experiences. If I lose those emotions/feelings, I lose my music... I surely want some clarification here and you surely did it. Thank you so much.

Originally Posted by ando
Originally Posted by dogperson
Originally Posted by Snail

That is why my previous comment. C'mon guys it so evident he is fake
.

‘Evident’? Did you consider he might possibly be young?????

I agree, I think Matt is quite young. His emotions are real and painful. It's disappointing the lack of compassion that is being shown here by some. How soon we forget what it's like to be young and feel everything so intensely...

I am wondering what is the average age in this forum?

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757961
08/12/18 05:03 PM
08/12/18 05:03 PM
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Posts: 1,528
New Hampshire
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P W Grey Offline
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He said he is in his twenties.

Pwg


Peter W. Grey, RPT
New Hampshire Seacoast
www.seacoastpianodoctor.com
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
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Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Sir Lurksalot] #2757964
08/12/18 05:26 PM
08/12/18 05:26 PM
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 3,336
Florida
dogperson Offline
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Originally Posted by Sir Lurksalot
Originally Posted by BDB
In any case, it is not about the piano. It is a psychological tale. I do not think it is appropriate for this forum.


Exactly. This is a place to discuss pianos. You wouldn't ask a plumber for gardening tips. Why ask a piano community for family counseling advice?

Originally Posted by Sir Lurksalot
[quote=BDB]In any case, it is not about the piano. It is a psychological tale. I do not think it is appropriate for this forum.


Really guys? We have had heartfelt posts here from PW members who recently experienced a death in the family as well as from those that were only able to resume playing 20 years after the death of a child...,, just do a search of the forum

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757968
08/12/18 05:45 PM
08/12/18 05:45 PM
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 26
North Vancouver
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Lady Bird Online content
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Well Snail if he is a young ,confused or disturbed
person who is perhaps worried that his mother and brother dissaproves of his father's gift to him then I am sure he is more confused now .Perhaps you should see a tharapist as well !

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757970
08/12/18 05:52 PM
08/12/18 05:52 PM
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USA
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jarobi Online content
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Trolling, trolling, trolling ........

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757971
08/12/18 06:22 PM
08/12/18 06:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,622
Philadelphia area
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Dave B Offline
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Philadelphia area
I do know a women who stopped singing after her husband’s death. These circumstances are much much different.

And every culture is different, but some things are universal: “An insult is like an arrow that lands at our feet. It is our decision to pick up the arrow and stab ourselves with it.”


"Imagine it in all its primatic colorings, its counterpart in our souls - our souls that are great pianos whose strings, of honey and of steel, the divisions of the rainbow set twanging, loosing on the air great novels of adventure!" - William Carlos Williams
Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757977
08/12/18 06:55 PM
08/12/18 06:55 PM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,528
New Hampshire
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P W Grey Offline
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Asian families often have societal norms that westerners find extremely strange (also true of other areas of the world). And, they are not immune from the psychological trauma that afflicts MANY families throughout the world.

Matt1224,

On the assumption that you are for real I will ask a few more questions:

1) Why were you so concerned about the piano being looked at, but seem to have no concern whatsoever about changing the fish tank water and cleaning the place up a bit?

2) On that note, why can't you change your own fish tank water?

3) Would you be willing to admit that you are still dependent on your mother for stuff that (at your age) you should be doing yourself?

4) Would you be able to admit that your mother may have mis-undestood and took the fact that you gave her a key to your place as being essentially permission to "take a peek" at the piano?

5) Can you adjust your emotions to admit that this is "just" a piano...a thing...an object which is not sacred, though capable of making beautiful music under your control?

6) Are you capable of simply "letting it go"..."rewind back to before the incident"? I am not talking about forgiveness. Just letting go of the antagonistic feelings.

7) Finally, is there something (or has there been something) that has occurred that is too difficult to talk about, and frankly inappropriate to discuss on a public forum, that could have some bearing on this whole matter? (Yes or no is fine but we won't go any further here if it's yes).

Pwg


Peter W. Grey, RPT
New Hampshire Seacoast
www.seacoastpianodoctor.com
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
(Best way to contact me privately)
Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757985
08/12/18 07:47 PM
08/12/18 07:47 PM
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LKI Offline
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Dear Matt

I read your post and I sympathise with you. Regardless of what others may say the distress that you feel by the intrusion of you family is very real. It may seem like a trivial thing to an outsider but to you it has caused a great suffering.

Your Steinway has not changed in any way by your mother's intrusion. However, the way you feel about it and the "perceived perfection" of it may have changed which is bothering you so much.

If I may voice an opinion I think the best way forward for you is to talk about this to a therapist as some have suggested.

Talking therapy will help you understand the deep emotions that have caused you to feel this way.

Your reaction to what seems like an innocent action by your mother and brother is disproportionate and may be influenced by previous difficult life experiences that were outside your control and were unacceptable to you. I say this as a doctor and not just someone who plays the piano.

Kind Regards

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757987
08/12/18 07:51 PM
08/12/18 07:51 PM
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Posts: 140
Canada
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Matt1224,

It is often that people we love, family and friends do not act exactly as expected.

Your view of the situation and the others view of the same situation may well be totally different. Is it possible that no disrespect was intended?

Perhaps your family was just interested in seeing the piano as they know it is very important to you. If I had a grand piano, and a Steinway at that, I would love my family to come and see it. Yes, I could see that you would like them to seek your permission first, but perhaps that was implied when you handed the keys over. It sounds as if you have had a very supportive
family that must some understanding of the importance of music to you.

You love music, and you can still love music and create beautiful music. Someone looking at your piano should not affect your enjoyment of the Steinway, but that is totally up to you.

Don't let this incredible gift go wasted. We choose how we react to situations. Have you found yourself in similar "misunderstandings" in the past with others? Often when I have a disagreement with others I think about whether or not there may be another way to look at the situation. Could I be mistaken? Could I have misread the intent? What would others think of this situation, other people that I admire, and I think act logically and with maturity. It quite often turns out that I am wrong just as much as I am right. Can you step back from the situation and compartmentalize this, and carry on? I hope you choose to. Enjoy your Steinway, please. This type of question also might require a different type of professional advice, perhaps you have someone you admire that could provide you with advice. Your love of music is evident share that Steinway with others, let them listen to it and bring your family and friends to hear you. Good luck!

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: ando] #2757994
08/12/18 08:06 PM
08/12/18 08:06 PM
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Originally Posted by DDobs
Please do not be offended when someone suggests you might benefit from seeing a therapist. A good therapist is an expert at helping one understand his or her emotions and make positive choices in response those emotions. You came here expressing severe distress and suggesting you might take extreme steps that could adversely affect you and your loved ones.

Originally Posted by ando
Matt, I'm sorry you are hurting so badly. I understand that you have had some some painful experiences in your family life and that you feel a sense of not being respected, taken seriously, not being valued. This is very hard to accept, and now it is affecting your relationship with music. I believe the members here who have suggested you get some professional help were not being unkind or disrespectful, but they really want to help you. If you can't work this out with your family, it's best if you can work through some of this without them. Professional counsellors are very helpful because they are supportive and also unbiased. They can help you to find a way to deal with your feelings so you can feel more secure and regain what you feel you have lost.


Matt - Your dealer can't help you - neither can a group of strangers on the internet who are "senior players." You are very conflicted and obviously unable to let "whatever is bothering you" go. Your best bet is to work through your issues during sessions with a professional counselor. That said, I'm not completely convinced that you aren't pulling our legs. smile


Mason and Hamlin BB - 91640
Kawai K-500 Upright
Kawai CA-65 Digital
YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo
Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2757997
08/12/18 08:21 PM
08/12/18 08:21 PM
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Maryland, USA
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To OP (Matt1224),

The following words may sound harsh, but I am dead serious.

1. If having someone(s), in your family, peeking your piano disturbed you so much, the fact that the piano was seen is not the problem. You are the problem; you need help from a counselor, psychiatrist, therapeutic, or any resources you can find there.

2. True pianists are not that obsessed with their own pianos. It's a delight to have decent instruments readily available at home, but professional pianists have to deal with pianos in all kinds of conditions. Have you ever heard about PSO, piano-shaped objects? Pros often have to cope with those. Plenty of professional pianists have beat-up instrument at home.

Last edited by Davdoc; 08/12/18 08:25 PM.

1969 Hamburg Steinway B, rebuilt by PianoCraft in 2017
2013 New York Steinway A
Kawai MP11

Previously: 2005 Yamaha GB1, 1992 Yamaha C5
Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758005
08/12/18 08:54 PM
08/12/18 08:54 PM
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Lady Bird Online content
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Inviting your family to your home and playing to them is a wonderful idea . Just play that wonderful piano !

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Lady Bird] #2758008
08/12/18 09:18 PM
08/12/18 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Lady Bird
Inviting your family to your home and playing to them is a wonderful idea . Just play that wonderful piano !

With all due respect, I doubt inviting the family into the OP's inner sanctum to hear the piano is going to solve the problem...….

Originally Posted by Matt1224
"Piano is my good friend. When I feel sad, I play piano; when I feel happy, I play piano. I can always talk to piano whenever I want to. When I was in secondary school, I went through a very unhappy period. Music has stayed with me. My music and piano has been keeping me company for my life. It grows together with me. It is part of me. It is inside me. However, after my mom and brother disrespectfully walked inside, I feel my music is completely vanished. Every time I walk into my room and play my Steinway, I conceive that "they have walked inside". It triggers a lot of bad emotion inside of me, and I just cannot play. I just cannot play. I feel like my music has totally gone away. Totally gone away. The room means my everything. It means my heart. It means my soul. It means me. It means my past. It means my growth experience. It means my sadness. It means my happiness. It means my friends. It means my enemies. It means my good memories. It means my bad memories. It is literally my sacred place, my own place. It is my own space, which cannot be invaded. Any disrespect is not tolerated. It is my way to communicate to my "god". It is. Also, I feel like they have "trampled" on my Steinway. As we know, Steinway is a "high treasure" (sorry for my bad English) in music realm. It means to be respected. There behaviour has totally disrespected it. I feel furious about it. I feel like I cannot forgive them. I feel painful. I feel angry. I feel furious. I feel hatred. When they stepped into my room, I feel like my music has all gone away. It is like some invaders have invade my heart inside. They took all my music away. I feel like I cannot play and actually I cannot play piano now, to a certain degree. I feel my music has changed because of them. My music contains hatred inside now, because of them. Even if I play happy piece of Chopin, Schumann, whatsoever, I feel anger inside my music. I cannot play anymore. They have taken everything away from me. My music is vanished because of them. Literally my most important thing in my life. It is gone."


Mason and Hamlin BB - 91640
Kawai K-500 Upright
Kawai CA-65 Digital
YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo
Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758011
08/12/18 09:44 PM
08/12/18 09:44 PM
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We try and give hope .There is always someone who may come to our home ,our inner sanctum to help in a case of despair . What would you suggest ?

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758016
08/12/18 10:15 PM
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Maybe it's just a family thing that can be mended , therapist yes ,but suggesting contact with family could help .

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758043
08/13/18 01:18 AM
08/13/18 01:18 AM
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Matt, you said you would welcome positive and constructive comments.

I'm sorry, but I must admonish you for your spoilt behaviour. Here are some issues I take offense with:
- You are angry with your brother for topping up your fish tank with water. However, I believe that this is something you should do yourself. I think your brother did you a favour because he cares about you.
- Your mother sneaked a peek at your piano. I would certainly think she has the right, seeing as your father just forked out large sums of money to buy it for you. Do you know how much of a sacrifice it would have been to afford that instrument? I saved for several years to buy my own piano. Unlike you, I proudly bought what I could afford with my own savings.

Finally, if something as simple as annoyance with your family can destroy your love of music, I think you need to see a shrink. You should also pay for these sessions yourself instead of spooning off your parents in your mid-twenties. Also, with that attitude I presume you don't have a job. If I was your father, I would sell off the piano and kick you out of home to teach you a lesson.

John.

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758091
08/13/18 07:45 AM
08/13/18 07:45 AM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,544
Pennsylvania
Ken Knapp Offline

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Ken Knapp  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,544
Pennsylvania
I had locked this topic because I had received moderator reports that replies were unkind toward the OP. When I investigated, I saw it was true.

HOWEVER, I have since received a PM from the OP. The OP advised me that he is not offended and requested that the topic be reopened. I have decided to grant his request.

This can be a lesson. Often times I receive moderator reports from concerned members advising me that a post is unkind to someone. It may indeed appear to be so. But just because a post appears to be unkind to us does not mean that the person it is directed towards considers it to be offensive.

Last edited by Ken Knapp; 08/13/18 11:51 AM.

Ken

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Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758194
08/13/18 04:10 PM
08/13/18 04:10 PM
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GC13 Offline
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Posts: 444
Matt1224 -

Most of us here on PW are from the Western World. All of us here hold the piano as an instrument in high regard. We often refer to their beauty and musical characteristics as a piano's "soul" or "personality". We can get deeply emotional about a piano that really "grabs" our attention and touches our hearts with heavenly sounds, and we express that in very "spiritual" terms. However, in our cultures, inanimate objects like the piano do not have a "spirit" of any kind. We highly value them, and when we have one or access to one that really "speaks" to us musically, we are very protective of them. I recently bought my own "used" Steinway Model B. My wife now jokingly tells people that it's like having another child, when talking about controlling the temperature and humidity in our house. I don't want anyone (family or not) to do anything to damage our piano, but I do not value it more than I value my family and friends. We even sometimes say that we "love" our pianos. When really we can't love objects. We can ENJOY them, meaning they provide us experiences that bring us JOY, but we can't love them. We can only love other people and God (if you believe in Him).

I say this to explain some of the reactions you might have received. I know that in other cultures, there are different "spiritual" belief systems involved that westerners (like most of us here on PW) probably don't understand. We also very different family structures regarding our inter-personal relationships and the way we show respect for each other. If that's the case, you might not get the responses from us that you might expect from other "piano-lovers".

The fact that your mother and your brother looked at your Steinway without your being there is unfortunate because it meant so much to you. If you had told them that before, they would have probably respected your wishes. But if your mother goes to your house regularly when you are not there, she probably didn't think anything about going and taking your brother. In my mind, they did not "disrespect" the Steinway. They didn't do anything to damage it. Did they every play a not?

Everything else aside. I say with with the utmost respect and care for you. The fact that they saw the piano has not affected your music. The piano has not changed and nothing in your house has changed. What is affecting your music is how you feel about these events. It has affected your emotions and your mindset toward music and your family. That is our perspective from the western mindset. This thing has gotten in your head. It's on your mind constantly. You can't look at the piano or your mother or brother without getting upset over it. In our world view -- the way we see life, the universe, people, things, and God, that's how we see it. Much like a bad football game will get in a Quarterback's head and he then repeats the same behavior and fails in the same way over and over again.

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Ken Knapp] #2758195
08/13/18 04:13 PM
08/13/18 04:13 PM
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
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Matt1224 Offline OP
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Matt1224  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
Originally Posted by Steve Chandler
Originally Posted by Matt1224
Originally Posted by Steve Chandler
I realize English is not your native language, but the description you offer brings many thoughts into my mind. So let me see if I have your story straight. You consider yourself a serious musician and music served your emotions well over many years. You searched long and hard for the perfect instrument which your father purchased for you. This instrument is very valuable and occupies a special place in your home (one that's dehumidified). Half a month after this instrument was delivered to your home your mother and brother had the temerity to stop by your home unannounced while you were elsewhere (IIRC, you were at mother's house, did they sneak out while you were there?) to tidy up and see the fine instrument your father had graced you with. You became livid at this intrusion and your musical sensibilities abandoned you and the emotional trauma of the intrusion continues to hamper your artistic advancement as a pianist. You ask if we can understand and appreciate your emotional injury and offer condolences and guidance on how to move forward. Does this accurately describe your experience?

Whether it does or does not matters little to me. What I realize is that if I ever choose to compose an opera I have a fabulous plot. My only question is how does the story end? I sincerely hope you will keep us informed of your progress.

Yes. This does accurately describe my experience. Exactly. And adding that also because of my adaptation period of getting a new grand(from Yamaha upright to a grand piano). It was only half a month. After that half, this unpleasant event occurred, and it is nearly a month until now. I am wondering and worrying if this unpleasant thing will have a bad impact on my musical and technical development, especially when I have ''accumulated" skills and imagination of the touch of a grand from an upright piano from a long period of time since I played, and I suddenly pour it all into my new grand, if I didn't describe it too ''abstractly'' and hope you understand.

Thank you for confirming that my impression of the situation is correct. Now allow me to speculate what your mother's, brother's and the rest of your family's intention may have been. In fact everything I'm about to write is SPECULATION. Your father spent a significant amount of money on one of his sons, did you think your brother didn't notice? A precedent has been set, your father is willing to invest a large sum in his progeny. Your brother in the short term may be snarky and comment that this was not a wise decision, but his long term interest would be better served if the investment in you proves successful. Otherwise dear father may not be inclined to invest in him a similar amount in the future. In my experience a significant negative emotional reaction to a situation where no physical harm is done to either person nor property is a sign of insecurity. Why might you feel insecure? I'm sure there are many reasons, but one that might be most relevant here could be that you've found your new Steinway A difficult to control. That's why you mention the adjustment period from your Yamaha upright. When you consider that professional pianists need to adjust almost instantaneously to the instrument in front of them, half a month for you should be plenty of time to adjust to a piano as fine as your Steinway.

So you are now indulging in feeling like an aggrieved artiste because your mother and brother invaded your privacy just to see your new piano and in the process they kindly tidied up a bit. An argument could be made that the piano doesn't even belong to you because your father paid for it. In the interest of giving you an opportunity to get out of your emotional funk I'm going to (proverbially) whack you upside da head. I have received many doses of "humble pie" in my life and usually they were richly deserved. My perception is that you would benefit from a serving of such now. My advice is not only to "get over it" but to beg your mother's and brother's forgiveness for being such an ungrateful child. The world can be a cruel place and there are multitudes of people in the world who would give their left testicle (or ovary) to be in your exact position. Stop whining about your artistry and how aggrieved you are and get back to the hard work of building your skills. Make yourself worthy of your father's generosity, practice until you deem yourself worthy of the fine instrument you've been given. Realize that your family (brother and mother included) only want you to be successful (sibling rivalry not withstanding) so invite them into your process of becoming a better pianist by playing for them regularly. I have three brothers so I know what sibling rivalry is about, but it's been four decades since it was in any way an issue in my life. Music is a hard business in which to be successful, you can't afford the luxury of being immature emotionally and you'll need every ally you can possibly find. Emotional immaturity may have been accepted from skilled musicians in the past, but no longer. I don't care who you are, what family you're from, what you've accomplished nor even how good you are, if you're a difficult person to deal with because of emotions most people and businesses will choose to take their business and patronage elsewhere.

As I said at the beginning, this is all speculation, I could be way off the mark. I'm sincerely trying to be constructive, but sometimes blunt language is necessary to make a point. I may be totally wrong, in which case I'm sure you'll correct me. I honestly believe your family would be very impressed if you asked their forgiveness for this lapse in maturity and if you expressed that you're trying to learn from the experience to be a better person and artist.

No my father didn't really ''invest'' me for this, but ''expect'' me to be in a correct path, to say accurately. My brother doesn't have any comment on it(the piano, not my father's expectation even when he doesn't know what his expectation is).

Insecurity...yeah maybe, but not about the controllability of my Steinway A. It feels good. That's why I am saying I am ''adapting'' to it, which means that I am working on my skills on it. When I said adaptation, I didn't mean I cannot play on it. I meant those skills accumulated from my Yamaha upright, have to ''pour'' into my grand. It should be a smooth process, without disturbing(as I don't like disturbance), so that it can be developed "naturally", like a seedling naturally grows into a big tree. Half a month is merely adequate, and a bit rush. A month is "enough", but not strong enough. Two month would be sufficient, but can be even stronger. I feel like half a year is plentiful. When I said adaptation, I really meant to "bring out" those Steinway sounds. I don't really mean just to play it technically, if you get what I am describing...I really mean to play professionally, to bring out the sound from the Steinway, to "sing out" the potential of a Steinway. That's my confusion, whether their invasion thus influence will affect my adaptation to a Steinway.....

No my piano belongs exactly to me, as he paid for me and it's mine now. Undeniable.
I see your points made in the second paragraph. That's why I am struggling. I just played the Steinway one hour ago. I felt my "magic" was gone. No passion. It's different from before. I don't know if it is related to their invasion or what....That's why I am struggling. As you said, I have to be mature. That's the plight I am at right now. It is because my music was ''nurtured'' since I played 15 years ago. My musical sense was nurtured and develop since then. It is a feeling. It is a spirit. It is an ability. But after their invasion, I found it lost.....Here's the fork: whether I should break with their relationship(as many don't suggest so and I am hesitated) in order to preserve my "pure" musical sense (also because I want to retain those pure, innocent, plain emotion from my childhood since I started playing piano, throughout my entire life, even I would change by our society when I get older, even I will face any adversity in my life, I want to preserve that. I think that the most natural thing is the most beautiful. The same as my musical sense. Also, I think this emotion(as in my music) is precious. If it is vanished, it can no longer be found back.), or I should become mature, hence my music will change because of my emotion changes. Hope I didn't describe it too ''abstractly''. It feels like their invasion really triggered some "unsolved"(or I don't know how to describe.....raw?) emotions or issues from myself. Maybe it is because the room is my personal space, very very personal one, and important one. But for whatever reasons, it feels like that. Should I preserve it? Or "evolve" from it.....? As I said, I really cherish those "raw" emotions from my childhood. They feel ''real'' to me, thus ''real'' to my music, natural to my music.....
As you said, "my perception is that you would benefit from a serving of such now". I totally agree. It feels like this world is telling me to be mature, so this universe is giving me this invasion, like even hitting on my deepest spot(my room) as music is being the most important to me, in order for me to grow. I believe in spirituality, if it doesn't offend against your belief. So the struggle really goes between whether I should "preserve", or to "go"..... I cannot decide. I also cannot discern what this universe is telling me...what it means... and I don't know what to do.....If I preserve, I got what I deem as the most natural thing, hence the most beautiful; if I go, the music would change into another form.....more artificial if I describe accurately.
"Practice until you deem yourself worthy of the fine instrument you've been given", that's why I play it very often. That's why I am working on it. That's why I am struggling. That's why I am struggling and ask for opinions, and concerning about the adaptation period.....

Originally Posted by P W Grey
Asian families often have societal norms that westerners find extremely strange (also true of other areas of the world). And, they are not immune from the psychological trauma that afflicts MANY families throughout the world.

Matt1224,

On the assumption that you are for real I will ask a few more questions:

1) Why were you so concerned about the piano being looked at, but seem to have no concern whatsoever about changing the fish tank water and cleaning the place up a bit?

2) On that note, why can't you change your own fish tank water?

3) Would you be willing to admit that you are still dependent on your mother for stuff that (at your age) you should be doing yourself?

4) Would you be able to admit that your mother may have mis-undestood and took the fact that you gave her a key to your place as being essentially permission to "take a peek" at the piano?

5) Can you adjust your emotions to admit that this is "just" a piano...a thing...an object which is not sacred, though capable of making beautiful music under your control?

6) Are you capable of simply "letting it go"..."rewind back to before the incident"? I am not talking about forgiveness. Just letting go of the antagonistic feelings.

7) Finally, is there something (or has there been something) that has occurred that is too difficult to talk about, and frankly inappropriate to discuss on a public forum, that could have some bearing on this whole matter? (Yes or no is fine but we won't go any further here if it's yes).

Pwg


1) It is my new house. I don't often go there. It is quite empty. I don't live there. Therefore, I created a sacred place there, where I can go there and play alone and "communicate with my god". Therefore I was so concerned about the piano being looked at because their behaviour were "too" disrespectful. I concern about changing water and tidying. That's why I put the disassembled bed in the living room but my mom considered herself(without asking me) and moved it into other place where she thought it was unobstructed in order to change the tank water from the tank to the toilet, making the path from the tank to the toilet "clear". I always concern about changing the tank water that's why I change it every week or two weeks but my mother sometimes go to my house to change for me and at the same time strolls around where my house located at because it is quite beautiful around and she just wants to wander around.

2) I always change it myself.

3) No I do stuff that should be doing myself at my age. I change my tank, I buy my things, I change my bed sheet. After all, I have lived my independent university life for 4 years. Even if I am "dependent" on my mom, I am not "dependent" as you described.

4) No. I gave her a year ago lol. Just because of contingency.

5) No..... I/people assign meanings to things.....

6) No. I thought they have disrespected it. As a Steinway owner(not to be proud but just mechanically speaking), I cannot tolerate such thing happened.....

7) Yes.

Originally Posted by LKI
Dear Matt

I read your post and I sympathise with you. Regardless of what others may say the distress that you feel by the intrusion of you family is very real. It may seem like a trivial thing to an outsider but to you it has caused a great suffering.

Your Steinway has not changed in any way by your mother's intrusion. However, the way you feel about it and the "perceived perfection" of it may have changed which is bothering you so much.

If I may voice an opinion I think the best way forward for you is to talk about this to a therapist as some have suggested.

Talking therapy will help you understand the deep emotions that have caused you to feel this way.

Your reaction to what seems like an innocent action by your mother and brother is disproportionate and may be influenced by previous difficult life experiences that were outside your control and were unacceptable to you. I say this as a doctor and not just someone who plays the piano.

Kind Regards


You are some sensible one here. I got what you meant...but those experiences may just be some of the reasons. As I replied above to P W Grey, as a Steinway owner, I cannot tolerate such thing happened. This maybe one of the bigger reasons I guess.....I am not sure if it is all about life experiences. Other reasons maybe like this Steinway is very very expensive, I am very disheartened by their intrusion and disrespect..... I deem this Steinway as "alive". I cannot tolerate any disrespect to her. I am like protecting her, and the "esteem" of Steinway as an intangible conscious ideological existence and the Steinway circle. Other reason maybe that they have invaded my boundaries as the house is mine, especially the piano room as I view it as my sanctum.
Originally Posted by Lady Bird
Inviting your family to your home and playing to them is a wonderful idea . Just play that wonderful piano !

Originally Posted by Carey
Originally Posted by Lady Bird
Inviting your family to your home and playing to them is a wonderful idea . Just play that wonderful piano !

With all due respect, I doubt inviting the family into the OP's inner sanctum to hear the piano is going to solve the problem...….

Originally Posted by Matt1224
"Piano is my good friend. When I feel sad, I play piano; when I feel happy, I play piano. I can always talk to piano whenever I want to. When I was in secondary school, I went through a very unhappy period. Music has stayed with me. My music and piano has been keeping me company for my life. It grows together with me. It is part of me. It is inside me. However, after my mom and brother disrespectfully walked inside, I feel my music is completely vanished. Every time I walk into my room and play my Steinway, I conceive that "they have walked inside". It triggers a lot of bad emotion inside of me, and I just cannot play. I just cannot play. I feel like my music has totally gone away. Totally gone away. The room means my everything. It means my heart. It means my soul. It means me. It means my past. It means my growth experience. It means my sadness. It means my happiness. It means my friends. It means my enemies. It means my good memories. It means my bad memories. It is literally my sacred place, my own place. It is my own space, which cannot be invaded. Any disrespect is not tolerated. It is my way to communicate to my "god". It is. Also, I feel like they have "trampled" on my Steinway. As we know, Steinway is a "high treasure" (sorry for my bad English) in music realm. It means to be respected. There behaviour has totally disrespected it. I feel furious about it. I feel like I cannot forgive them. I feel painful. I feel angry. I feel furious. I feel hatred. When they stepped into my room, I feel like my music has all gone away. It is like some invaders have invade my heart inside. They took all my music away. I feel like I cannot play and actually I cannot play piano now, to a certain degree. I feel my music has changed because of them. My music contains hatred inside now, because of them. Even if I play happy piece of Chopin, Schumann, whatsoever, I feel anger inside my music. I cannot play anymore. They have taken everything away from me. My music is vanished because of them. Literally my most important thing in my life. It is gone."




Thank you two for suggesting. But I am afraid inviting them to listen to my playing may aggravate my emotion.....It is because I feel like I will lose my self esteem if I do so.....I am thinking like "why should I invite them to go here, but not them initiatively request me to have a look". I have thought about if they could initiatively request me to go to have a look and listen to it(including my mom and brother), things would be amended, but not beneficial as -1+1=0... But I don't think it is possible.....
Thanks for Carey offering the word "sanctum". I have been finding it for a long time!
Originally Posted by parnassus
Matt, you said you would welcome positive and constructive comments.

I'm sorry, but I must admonish you for your spoilt behaviour. Here are some issues I take offense with:
- You are angry with your brother for topping up your fish tank with water. However, I believe that this is something you should do yourself. I think your brother did you a favour because he cares about you.
- Your mother sneaked a peek at your piano. I would certainly think she has the right, seeing as your father just forked out large sums of money to buy it for you. Do you know how much of a sacrifice it would have been to afford that instrument? I saved for several years to buy my own piano. Unlike you, I proudly bought what I could afford with my own savings.

Finally, if something as simple as annoyance with your family can destroy your love of music, I think you need to see a shrink. You should also pay for these sessions yourself instead of spooning off your parents in your mid-twenties. Also, with that attitude I presume you don't have a job. If I was your father, I would sell off the piano and kick you out of home to teach you a lesson.

John.




Nope. My mother changes my tank water sometimes because she likes to have a walk around my house area because it is beautiful and simultaneously go to my house and changes water as I have replied to P W Grey above. That doesn't mean that I won't do it myself. They also moved around my disassemble bed without my permission first, which triggered my rage. I didn't appreciated it even they "thought" they helped me but instead I blamed them for their disrespect and thinking themselves as helping me a lot.
My mother certainly has not the right to sneak a peek at my piano. As I said, it is my own house. Anyone wants to go in surely have to ask me first. Second, the door of my piano room is closed due to dehumidification. She and my brother crudely opened it and walked into it and have a look at it just because of curiosity totally disrespected me and my piano. Also, this is my sanctum, I don't allow such disrespect. My father formed out large sums of money to buy it for me doesn't necessarily mean she has the right to sneak a peek at my piano. My father formed out large sums of money to buy it for me, that means it's mine.
Finally, something as simple as annoyance with my family doesn't destroy my love of music; but just the opposite, it's because I love my music SO much, I do not tolerate any retrogression of my music. Therefore, I care about it so much and come here wanting for clarification of my stuff. Seemingly, you do not quite understand what my situation is yet.....Look at the reply above to Steve and you may find out more
Originally Posted by LearnEveryDay
Matt1224: People, esp. family, are MORE valuable than any property. Your mom and your brother are MORE precious than your piano, even if that is a very expensive Steinway piano! Besides, you did not buy that piano, your father bought it for you...! So, why feeling so possessive about it? It is actually a family's property, just happened that you have the privilege to place it in your house... Your mom and your brother and your father.... all should be able to view it any time they want to. Yes, they should have asked before they came in, but it seems like your mom, in your story, simply misunderstood your reply and viewed it when you were not there! And what was wrong with what your mom and your brother did? NOTHING! They only looked at it, they did not even touch it.... So, why "making a hill out of a mole"?

Your father spoils you with a very expensive piano! You are very lucky to have a big house and a big room for that expensive piano at the age of twenty-something... ! Your mom and older brother spoils you with taking care of your place! Yes, everyone in your family spoils you, and instead of being grateful to them, you think you are the center of the universe! Either you may need the service of a very experienced family therapist, or you need a dose of real life reality....! Life does not revolve around you, young fellow, nor does it around your Steinway piano! Get out and see real life out there! See the working-class families; see the homeless people; see the war-torn countries... and then you will understand why it's not a big deal at all that you mom happened to look at your Steinway piano!

You can't play music smoothly now because music must come from the harmony of a soul. If your soul is soaked up with pettiness, your music expression will suffer.... Doesn't matter how many years you have played on any pianos, music is meant to be the expression of a pure heart - and not of a heart full of anger!

Matt1224, young fellow, before you can become a "senior pianist" or "senior player" (or whatever you call it), you must first GROW UP!!






I don't think you understood my situation quite yet
Originally Posted by Ken Knapp
I had locked this topic because I had received moderator reports that replies were unkind toward the OP. When I investigated, I saw it was true.

HOWEVER, I have since received a PM from the OP. The OP advised me that he is not offended and requested that the topic be reopened. I have decided to grant his request.

This can be a lesson. Often times I receive moderator reports from concerned members advising me that a post is unkind to someone. It may indeed appear to be so. But just because a post appears to be unkind to us does not mean that the person it is directed towards considers it to be offensive.

Thank you for standing up for me. It is not a lesson at all as you did nothing wrong. It is right to stop those unkindness if you see it. I didn't mean they are not offensive, actually they are, but I am just not so reactive to that.....
There are more love than hate in this post. I can feel that. And discussions are valuable. That's why I requested you to reopen it.

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758197
08/13/18 04:32 PM
08/13/18 04:32 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 140
Canada
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Spuds Offline
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Hi Matt1224,

I hope I did not say anything in my previous post that you might find offensive. In my profession I work with individuals who at times think in black and white, "all or nothing" terms. I am not certain whether or not you would agree that this applies to you or not, and I don't know you at all, but perhaps you could consider some potentially helpful questions you might ask yourself. Such as: Is there anything good or positive about this situation? Is there any other way one could look at a situation? Could I replace thoughts such as, "this has ruined my Steinway experience" ( I am paraphrasing here),with, "this wasn't expected but I am strong enough to handle it"? Would you be able to step outside of yourself and look at the situation from the point of view of another person? Not trying to diminish your anger, feeling are what they are. You say your friends have given their opinion about the situation. Do you feel your friends have your best interest at heart? You appear to have a great affiliation for music and a strong emotional response to your instrument. Your relationship with music and your piano need not be changed. If you had similar issues in the past how did you resolve them? I would guess that an awful lot of musicians feel more inclined to practice on some days rather than others. Your piano will be ready for you when you are. I bet you will have many splendid years together. Good luck.

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758248
08/13/18 07:55 PM
08/13/18 07:55 PM
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 997
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huaidongxi Online content
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Beethoven's father had grand musical ambitions for him, and contributed by securing or engaging excellent tutors and mentors. but it was his mother who gave him the inner fortitude to overcome setbacks and challenges. Beethoven constantly kept in his heart his mother's advice, there cannot be great accomplishments without great struggle. [women who've birthed children probably understand this viscerally more than most men]. if playing piano is essential for you, you must find a way to overcome the negativity. it is not necessarily required that you intellectually or emotionally sort out whether the negativity comes from your attitude or sensitivity, or from your family - - you have the option of simply resolving that playing piano is more important to you than any bad memories or grudges or interpersonal transgressions, and make yourself do it. your inner conflicts will probably take a lifetime to sort out, if it ever takes place, so you might lose a lifetime if you're convinced that resolution of all your conflicts has to come before you recreate music at the piano.

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758360
08/14/18 08:20 AM
08/14/18 08:20 AM
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 446
Montreal, Canada
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guyl Offline
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Montreal, Canada
In the western world most of us are in, spiritual and/or emotional attachements to inanimate objects is perceived as unusual and somewhat inappropriate, so you can understand some of the reactions you will read here. We will also usually make a distinction between happiness vs joy and pleasure. We generally consider happiness to be a long term basic, inner sentiment of well being that reaches our soul, while joy and pleasure are a more immediate sense of "fun" brought about by something we do or experience at that moment. We will generally consider that an object like a piano can bring joy and pleasure (and maybe a temporary sense of happiness), while more basic things like family relationships, romance and things like personal success can contribute to long term happiness.

Now bear in mind that much of this might be cultural and seem "natural" to us in our western culture. My point is: most of our advice will sound to be along the lines of "don't sacrifice a family relationship over single incident like this". An additional complication for us is that the notion of "respect", as you've brought up many times, can be quite different in how it's perceived through words and actions. We might never really be able to grasp the true meaning that this has for you vs us. My only advice, if we can call it that, would be to have a nice calm discussion with your mother and brother as to how this incident made you feel, and hopefully to feel understood.


What do snowflakes and Chickerings have in common? There are no two exactly alike!
Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758368
08/14/18 08:51 AM
08/14/18 08:51 AM
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,895
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Rank Piano Amateur Offline
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I agree with the earlier responses to the OP that include the advice that the OP consult a therapist or, in the alternative, find a site designed to provide psychiatric or emotional support and/or advice. Perhaps a site devoted to anxiety might help. This is a forum devoted to pianos. As far as I can tell, the issues raised by the OP are not really related to pianos as pianos at all. The piano just got caught in the larger set of issues that the OP seems to have. I encourage the OP to get help for those larger issues, but a piano forum is surely not the right place.

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758370
08/14/18 08:56 AM
08/14/18 08:56 AM
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Why don't you invite a priest of whatever religion you are closest to, to perform a blessing ceremony on your room and on your piano. Even if you are an atheist, it might just be a nice ritual to perform to give you and your music room a new start, like a naming ceremony or baptising of a baby.

You can work out your issues with your family with a therapist or friends, or perhaps private message people on here you trust in the meantime.

Families are always difficult, and it sounds like this is much deeper than your mother and brother simply looking at the piano.

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758385
08/14/18 10:22 AM
08/14/18 10:22 AM
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 1,528
New Hampshire
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P W Grey Offline
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New Hampshire
The only caveat I would put on the family thing is that sometimes certain family members prove to be "toxic", and no amount of trying to make it better works...ever...because they will not allow it.

It is impossible to know if that type of situation exists here with the OP himself or with one or more family members. I agree that competent psychological counseling would be beneficial and recommended. We are not in a position to advise anything beyond the musical and technical.

Matt1224,

Don't forget that your Steinway needs much more regular attention from a competent technician in the first few years of its life. Make sure you get it tuned at least 4 times the first year, and ask the tech to do some voicing as needed to gradually bring out its true voice. This actually takes some time as the instrument matures. It us, in fact much like a person in many ways, so your feelings are not out of line (perhaps a little extreme though).

I hope you have the services of a good tech at your disposal.

Pwg


Peter W. Grey, RPT
New Hampshire Seacoast
www.seacoastpianodoctor.com
pianodoctor57@gmail.com
(Best way to contact me privately)
Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: joe80] #2758399
08/14/18 12:11 PM
08/14/18 12:11 PM
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
M
Matt1224 Offline OP
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Matt1224  Offline OP
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Posts: 12
Originally Posted by xxx
Matt1224 -

Most of us here on PW are from the Western World. All of us here hold the piano as an instrument in high regard. We often refer to their beauty and musical characteristics as a piano's "soul" or "personality". We can get deeply emotional about a piano that really "grabs" our attention and touches our hearts with heavenly sounds, and we express that in very "spiritual" terms. However, in our cultures, inanimate objects like the piano do not have a "spirit" of any kind. We highly value them, and when we have one or access to one that really "speaks" to us musically, we are very protective of them. I recently bought my own "used" Steinway Model B. My wife now jokingly tells people that it's like having another child, when talking about controlling the temperature and humidity in our house. I don't want anyone (family or not) to do anything to damage our piano, but I do not value it more than I value my family and friends. We even sometimes say that we "love" our pianos. When really we can't love objects. We can ENJOY them, meaning they provide us experiences that bring us JOY, but we can't love them. We can only love other people and God (if you believe in Him).

I say this to explain some of the reactions you might have received. I know that in other cultures, there are different "spiritual" belief systems involved that westerners (like most of us here on PW) probably don't understand. We also very different family structures regarding our inter-personal relationships and the way we show respect for each other. If that's the case, you might not get the responses from us that you might expect from other "piano-lovers".

The fact that your mother and your brother looked at your Steinway without your being there is unfortunate because it meant so much to you. If you had told them that before, they would have probably respected your wishes. But if your mother goes to your house regularly when you are not there, she probably didn't think anything about going and taking your brother. In my mind, they did not "disrespect" the Steinway. They didn't do anything to damage it. Did they every play a not?

Everything else aside. I say with with the utmost respect and care for you. The fact that they saw the piano has not affected your music. The piano has not changed and nothing in your house has changed. What is affecting your music is how you feel about these events. It has affected your emotions and your mindset toward music and your family. That is our perspective from the western mindset. This thing has gotten in your head. It's on your mind constantly. You can't look at the piano or your mother or brother without getting upset over it. In our world view -- the way we see life, the universe, people, things, and God, that's how we see it. Much like a bad football game will get in a Quarterback's head and he then repeats the same behavior and fails in the same way over and over again.

"Most of us here on PW are from the Western World", yeah, I know. That's why I come here because I would love to listen to views from the western. It is more solid.
" If that's the case, you might not get the responses from us that you might expect from other "piano-lovers".", no, I didn't expect something as you implied between your words.....I actually found valuable comments here, and some views are of precious as I think.....and understandable and being quite conforming to what was said from my friends here..... The comments are okay.
They didn't play a note. They didn't intend to disrespect it, but in my perspective, they have come in, which triggers my emotion and discomfort, which affects my music especially when "I" am in "the room" to play.....I don't really don't know that they didn't intend to but they "actually" disrespected it and things happened and it is not about forgiveness(as I have already mentioned in the first post) but rather my feeling when I am in the room.....That said I understood totally what their incentives and thinkings are but the problem lies in how I feel about it when I am in the room..... I don't want any impurity in my music and I deem even "forgiving them" or "letting go" or whatsoever as impurity because it will change my music to other "stuff".....rather than retaining it from my pure, natural heart from my childhood.
It's good to receive clarification that they saw the piano has not affected my music. I know it is how I feel about these events affected my music and affected my emotions and my mindset toward music. Actually we (I?) think that way too but the problem is how to get rid of it..... I don't want any imperfection in my "music history"..... I am afraid that it would retain in my memory and affect my music forever as I was(am) really furious and raged about it.....
Originally Posted by Spuds
Hi Matt1224,

I hope I did not say anything in my previous post that you might find offensive. In my profession I work with individuals who at times think in black and white, "all or nothing" terms. I am not certain whether or not you would agree that this applies to you or not, and I don't know you at all, but perhaps you could consider some potentially helpful questions you might ask yourself. Such as: Is there anything good or positive about this situation? Is there any other way one could look at a situation? Could I replace thoughts such as, "this has ruined my Steinway experience" ( I am paraphrasing here),with, "this wasn't expected but I am strong enough to handle it"? Would you be able to step outside of yourself and look at the situation from the point of view of another person? Not trying to diminish your anger, feeling are what they are. You say your friends have given their opinion about the situation. Do you feel your friends have your best interest at heart? You appear to have a great affiliation for music and a strong emotional response to your instrument. Your relationship with music and your piano need not be changed. If you had similar issues in the past how did you resolve them? I would guess that an awful lot of musicians feel more inclined to practice on some days rather than others. Your piano will be ready for you when you are. I bet you will have many splendid years together. Good luck.

"I hope I did not say anything in my previous post that you might find offensive." Nope.
Those questions are really useful and valuable. Thank you very much. And the paraphrase really accurate described what my situation is. Good paraphrase that I am looking for~
"You say your friends have given their opinion about the situation. Do you feel your friends have your best interest at heart?" Yeah but they don't know or play music so it was not persuasive.
Actually I deem the room as where I can be with myself quietly and solely, so such intrusion is not allowed.....I don't know how to resolve this...But your advice is worthwhile to think about. Thank you.
Originally Posted by huaidongxi
Beethoven's father had grand musical ambitions for him, and contributed by securing or engaging excellent tutors and mentors. but it was his mother who gave him the inner fortitude to overcome setbacks and challenges. Beethoven constantly kept in his heart his mother's advice, there cannot be great accomplishments without great struggle. [women who've birthed children probably understand this viscerally more than most men]. if playing piano is essential for you, you must find a way to overcome the negativity. it is not necessarily required that you intellectually or emotionally sort out whether the negativity comes from your attitude or sensitivity, or from your family - - you have the option of simply resolving that playing piano is more important to you than any bad memories or grudges or interpersonal transgressions, and make yourself do it. your inner conflicts will probably take a lifetime to sort out, if it ever takes place, so you might lose a lifetime if you're convinced that resolution of all your conflicts has to come before you recreate music at the piano.

So that's why I am struggling because if I think like that, I feel my music changes to other "impure" form.....It is "unnatural". But thank you.

Originally Posted by guyl
In the western world most of us are in, spiritual and/or emotional attachements to inanimate objects is perceived as unusual and somewhat inappropriate, so you can understand some of the reactions you will read here. We will also usually make a distinction between happiness vs joy and pleasure. We generally consider happiness to be a long term basic, inner sentiment of well being that reaches our soul, while joy and pleasure are a more immediate sense of "fun" brought about by something we do or experience at that moment. We will generally consider that an object like a piano can bring joy and pleasure (and maybe a temporary sense of happiness), while more basic things like family relationships, romance and things like personal success can contribute to long term happiness.

Now bear in mind that much of this might be cultural and seem "natural" to us in our western culture. My point is: most of our advice will sound to be along the lines of "don't sacrifice a family relationship over single incident like this". An additional complication for us is that the notion of "respect", as you've brought up many times, can be quite different in how it's perceived through words and actions. We might never really be able to grasp the true meaning that this has for you vs us. My only advice, if we can call it that, would be to have a nice calm discussion with your mother and brother as to how this incident made you feel, and hopefully to feel understood.

Actually, I don't see my piano as a god, but because when I play piano, I connect to my inner heart, which means I am connecting and communicating with my god, so that I think my piano room is a sacred place, especially giving me chances to communicate with my god. But thanks for the explanation of that cultural thing. When I said "respect", I meant they didn't ask me to walk into my house, and move my thing, and the most crucially, didn't ask me beforehand to open the door and walk into my room.


Originally Posted by Rank Piano Amateur
I agree with the earlier responses to the OP that include the advice that the OP consult a therapist or, in the alternative, find a site designed to provide psychiatric or emotional support and/or advice. Perhaps a site devoted to anxiety might help. This is a forum devoted to pianos. As far as I can tell, the issues raised by the OP are not really related to pianos as pianos at all. The piano just got caught in the larger set of issues that the OP seems to have. I encourage the OP to get help for those larger issues, but a piano forum is surely not the right place.

The post has everything to do with piano and music. Since I have bought a Steinway(which means much to me), and such event happened and made me feel I have lost my music, I need help from here.


Originally Posted by joe80
Why don't you invite a priest of whatever religion you are closest to, to perform a blessing ceremony on your room and on your piano. Even if you are an atheist, it might just be a nice ritual to perform to give you and your music room a new start, like a naming ceremony or baptising of a baby.

You can work out your issues with your family with a therapist or friends, or perhaps private message people on here you trust in the meantime.

Families are always difficult, and it sounds like this is much deeper than your mother and brother simply looking at the piano.

I have said I don't mean "god" exists in my room, or in my piano. What I mean is that when I am playing piano, I communicate with my inner heart, thus communicating and connecting with god. That's why I think my piano room as "sacred".





One very important thing I have omitted is that this piano room is somewhere I can be quiet and alone and communicate with myself through music. Therefore, I do not allow any disturbance and bad things happen there. I am afraid that this unpleasant experience may cause me bad memory thus emotion, so my music would be influenced forever. That's why I wanted to(but not sure right now after listening to you guys) break my relationship with them because I would feel better thus my music would not be disturbed.....

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758407
08/14/18 12:35 PM
08/14/18 12:35 PM
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
M
Matt1224 Offline OP
Junior Member
Matt1224  Offline OP
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
Oh yeah, and also that I found this Steinway can easily play out of one's heart, which means it can "know" what your heart is "playing", and makes music out of what your heart is thinking, so that's why I am very reactive and concerned about how the trivial emotion brought by this event can impact my music on my Steinway(because I sense that before and after this event, the music played out by the Steinway is somewhat different). Which means I want my "pure" music, and "pure" room, that's why.....I don't want any disturbance.....That's why I wanted(not sure now after you guys' opinion) to break relation with them.....in order to regain my "pure" music.....

Re: Steinway's lament. Needs help. [Re: Matt1224] #2758412
08/14/18 12:48 PM
08/14/18 12:48 PM
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 3,336
Florida
dogperson Offline
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dogperson  Offline
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Florida
Matt
I would advise that breaking with your family may not give you a ‘pure’ heart.... but a troubled one, please take the step to talk to a counselor regarding the relationship with your family.


"Music, rich, full of feeling, not soulless, is like a crystal on which the sun falls and brings forth from it a whole rainbow" - F. Chopin
" I never dreamt with my own two hands I could touch the sky" - Sappho
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