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Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757420
08/10/18 02:12 PM
08/10/18 02:12 PM
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JoeT Offline
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Originally Posted by Gandhi
I took very fast decission because there was no option left for me as Distributor of Kawai told me to comfirm order within 24 hours than only it will possible for them to include My CA 78 in Shipment which Will start from Japan on 20th Aug so there is no time left..

That is clever sale tactics and they sadly work more often than not.

Never make purchase decisions based on time pressure. Always test display models and sleep a night over it. If they still look and sound good at the next day, take them home.


Kawai ES100 | Steinberg UR22 | Sony MDR-7605
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Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757426
08/10/18 02:19 PM
08/10/18 02:19 PM
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Posts: 200
Sydney, Australia
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ArtlessArt Offline
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I don't think OP was able to find a place to test digital pianos in his country.

Regardless, congrats on your purchase. It's a very good choice you made. May I ask which finish you chose? Personally, I went with the Rosewood.


Kawai CA78 | Kawai ES110 | Kawai Upright | Alexander Herrmann Upright (Sold) | Korg SP170 (Sold) | JBL LSR305 // Pianoteq Stage // CFX Lite
Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757440
08/10/18 02:42 PM
08/10/18 02:42 PM
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Posts: 7,245
Raleigh, North Carolina
MacMacMac Offline
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Good point Joe.

"Ya gotta buy now because <insert-BS-excuse-here>" smile

I could write a whole book titled "Words that a salesman inserts into the phrase Ya gotta buy now because <insert-BS-excuse-here>".

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757454
08/10/18 03:00 PM
08/10/18 03:00 PM
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mcoll Offline
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JoeT - in my country there's no place where I could test the CA line for instance. And testing Yamaha is a lot easier, too bad I was never too convinced by their mid-tier products. Thankfully in this particular instance, the product chosen is one of the best on the market as far as standalone DPs go, so hopefully there's nothing wrong with such a choice.

And one more thing, sales tactic or not, lately I find it more and more difficult to have access to good quality services, workmanship, etc. So you end up paying whatever and crossing your fingers that the result will be what it should be. You don't even bother neggociating anymore. Just go with the expensive option in the hopes that it will live up to the price.

Last edited by mcoll; 08/10/18 03:02 PM.
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Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: JoeT] #2757574
08/11/18 01:13 AM
08/11/18 01:13 AM
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 93
INDIA
G
Gandhi Offline OP
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INDIA
Originally Posted by JoeT
Originally Posted by Gandhi
I took very fast decission because there was no option left for me as Distributor of Kawai told me to comfirm order within 24 hours than only it will possible for them to include My CA 78 in Shipment which Will start from Japan on 20th Aug so there is no time left..

That is clever sale tactics and they sadly work more often than not.

Never make purchase decisions based on time pressure. Always test display models and sleep a night over it. If they still look and sound good at the next day, take them home.

Hi ..
You are right but here my story is somewhat diffrent...
Importer of Kawai Piano here in India is my friend So there was no clever sale tactics involved... according to my knowledge...

Let me explain....

I took decission for buying Digital Piano on 12th June (almost 1 month now) for Me & my Grand daughter, she is just 4 years & 6 month old & she will start her lesson after 2 months..

Started all works for finding reasonably good in Touch & sound close to acoustic Piano ofcourse latest model with some advance features which will atleast last with us for 7 to 10 years ..

I saw many Demo videos of mostly midium range & above All DP on youtube, reads all commant under those videos & check many Thread on this PW Forum....

Than decided for Kawai CA series & Yamaha Clp 600 series both are latest & New..

Selected CA 78 & Yamaha Clp 645 for their Wooden Keys Touch/Sound..

I only find Kawai CA 48 & Yamaha Clp 645 models here in India..

Demo is possible only for CA 48 which is presently only in stock.

CA 56 is out of stock...More are already on
the way but will reach India mid september.

Now for CA 78 & 98, it will come to India by confirm order only...

NOW THIS IS ANSWER TO YOUR REPLY..

I contacted Kawai People on 10th August , told them i want to buy CA 78...

Then they advice me to pls first I must do my homework before placing order re CA 78,Take enough time to take decission as CA 78 is high end & expensive model also no demo.
They gave me details of upcoming shipments shedules of 4 months.
They also advice me not to hurry & worry about delivery as each month they have shipments from Kawai...
They said After Confirmation of order my CA78 i will receive delivery apx after 40 days.
So i ask them for this month shedule,after checking they gave me date 18th Aug..
I ask them to include my Piano in this shipment if possible...

They sent Email to Kawai if this is possible..

After 12 hour we recived Email from Kawai stating that they have only 24 hours in hands to include CA 78 In this shipment...

So i requested them to include my Piano in this shipment only..
it will reach India 2nd week.

Otherwise in 2nd shipment is in end of september so i will get my Piano in end of October..

2 months waiting.....

So it was only my decission & no Pressure from them....

And Lastly, After confirming order,To my great Surprise they gave me best possible offer which made my decission of buying CA 78 most Perfect & i am so happy with deal..

SORRY for long Reply...
Thank you...

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: ArtlessArt] #2757578
08/11/18 01:41 AM
08/11/18 01:41 AM
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Posts: 93
INDIA
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Gandhi Offline OP
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Originally Posted by ArtlessArt
I don't think OP was able to find a place to test digital pianos in his country.

Regardless, congrats on your purchase. It's a very good choice you made. May I ask which finish you chose? Personally, I went with the Rosewood.

Hi ArtlessArt...
Thank you for kind words..you are right i can't take demo because this is First CA 78 in India which i order..

I Prefer & selected Premium Rosewood Finish which go well with my home Furniture ..

Now humble request to you dear, (I have already sent you personal mesg before 2 days)

You already own CA 78 now for more than 3 months & Acoustic Piano also..

So Your finding about this Piano is most important to me..

Pls share your feelings views about this in detail so it will help me lot..

You can send me pm.& do check my also..

Again Thanx n waiting for your input..

Regards
Gandhi

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: MacMacMac] #2757579
08/11/18 01:46 AM
08/11/18 01:46 AM
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Posts: 93
INDIA
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Gandhi Offline OP
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INDIA
Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Good point Joe.

"Ya gotta buy now because <insert-BS-excuse-here>" smile

I could write a whole book titled "Words that a salesman inserts into the phrase Ya gotta buy now because <insert-BS-excuse-here>".

Thank you for your comment...

Answer & Clarification is already i posted for Joe is same for you i think..

If i am wrong pls correct me...

Regards
Gandhi

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757580
08/11/18 01:52 AM
08/11/18 01:52 AM
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Posts: 93
INDIA
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Gandhi Offline OP
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Originally Posted by mcoll
JoeT - in my country there's no place where I could test the CA line for instance. And testing Yamaha is a lot easier, too bad I was never too convinced by their mid-tier products. Thankfully in this particular instance, the product chosen is one of the best on the market as far as standalone DPs go, so hopefully there's nothing wrong with such a choice.

And one more thing, sales tactic or not, lately I find it more and more difficult to have access to good quality services, workmanship, etc. So you end up paying whatever and crossing your fingers that the result will be what it should be. You don't even bother neggociating anymore. Just go with the expensive option in the hopes that it will live up to the price.

Agreed...

Thank you for your input... I realy apriciate it.
Gandhi..

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757587
08/11/18 04:39 AM
08/11/18 04:39 AM
Joined: Jul 2014
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JoeT Offline
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Originally Posted by Gandhi

I saw many Demo videos of mostly midium range & above All DP on youtube, reads all commant under those videos & check many Thread on this PW Forum....

Once upon a time I did this too. My choice would have been Casio Privia or Yamaha P-255, if had gone through with it.

Instead I physically stumbled over Kawai's cheapest model ES100, was impressed and got that. Now I was ready to prepare myself for the real search. Finding out which budget I really need, which kind of piano (acoustic or digital) I need and what I like and what I don't like about a piano. This was four years ago, because the ES100 turned out to be not just a stopgap solution, but a nifty digital piano on its own. So I have no pressure to find something quick. If some salesman tries to pressure me with "you need to buy this now, because tomorrow its gone", I just tell him, that my ES100 still works just fine tomorrow.

Spending 3000 € on a piano based on YouTube comments would be a ridiculous proposition for me. If I had to do that, I would add a plane ticket on top of that budget to visit the instrument in person, before risking making the wrong choice.


Kawai ES100 | Steinberg UR22 | Sony MDR-7605
Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757590
08/11/18 04:59 AM
08/11/18 04:59 AM
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 200
Sydney, Australia
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ArtlessArt Offline
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Sydney, Australia
Originally Posted by Gandhi

Hi ArtlessArt...
Thank you for kind words..you are right i can't take demo because this is First CA 78 in India which i order..

I Prefer & selected Premium Rosewood Finish which go well with my home Furniture ..

Now humble request to you dear, (I have already sent you personal mesg before 2 days)

You already own CA 78 now for more than 3 months & Acoustic Piano also..

So Your finding about this Piano is most important to me..

Pls share your feelings views about this in detail so it will help me lot..

You can send me pm.& do check my also..

Again Thanx n waiting for your input..

Regards
Gandhi



Hi Gandhi, just checked I did not receive any messages in the inbox. Sorry if I've missed any messages, lately time has not been my ally. I've had some problems with my CA78 which are detailed in my other threads, namely, speaker buzz, and technician problems. But all seem to be working fine for now apart from a couple minor annoyances. I still enjoy the CA78 very much, especially the touch.

I prefer the touch of the CA78 to the (upright) acoustic as it is smoother and more "buttery" (not sure the right word lol) and I can repeat notes quicker than the upright. As for the sound, I think I prefer the acoustic as nothing that's sampled can beat the nuances of the hammer hitting the string(s). With that said, I still really enjoy the Pianist Mode and find it more voluminous and realistic compared to the sound mode (although you can play around with VT to make it sound more to your preferences). If there's anything specific you'd like to know, I'd be happy to respond.

Cheers Art


Kawai CA78 | Kawai ES110 | Kawai Upright | Alexander Herrmann Upright (Sold) | Korg SP170 (Sold) | JBL LSR305 // Pianoteq Stage // CFX Lite
Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: JoeT] #2757600
08/11/18 06:09 AM
08/11/18 06:09 AM
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Posts: 93
INDIA
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Gandhi Offline OP
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INDIA
Originally Posted by JoeT
Originally Posted by Gandhi

I saw many Demo videos of mostly midium range & above All DP on youtube, reads all commant under those videos & check many Thread on this PW Forum....

Once upon a time I did this too. My choice would have been Casio Privia or Yamaha P-255, if had gone through with it.

Instead I physically stumbled over Kawai's cheapest model ES100, was impressed and got that. Now I was ready to prepare myself for the real search. Finding out which budget I really need, which kind of piano (acoustic or digital) I need and what I like and what I don't like about a piano. This was four years ago, because the ES100 turned out to be not just a stopgap solution, but a nifty digital piano on its own. So I have no pressure to find something quick. If some salesman tries to pressure me with "you need to buy this now, because tomorrow its gone", I just tell him, that my ES100 still works just fine tomorrow.

Spending 3000 € on a piano based on YouTube comments would be a ridiculous proposition for me. If I had to do that, I would add a plane ticket on top of that budget to visit the instrument in person, before risking making the wrong choice.

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757601
08/11/18 06:15 AM
08/11/18 06:15 AM
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Posts: 93
INDIA
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Gandhi Offline OP
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INDIA
Originally Posted by JoeT
Originally Posted by Gandhi

I saw many Demo videos of mostly midium range & above All DP on youtube, reads all commant under those videos & check many Thread on this PW Forum....

Once upon a time I did this too. My choice would have been Casio Privia or Yamaha P-255, if had gone through with it.

Instead I physically stumbled over Kawai's cheapest model ES100, was impressed and got that. Now I was ready to prepare myself for the real search. Finding out which budget I really need, which kind of piano (acoustic or digital) I need and what I like and what I don't like about a piano. This was four years ago, because the ES100 turned out to be not just a stopgap solution, but a nifty digital piano on its own. So I have no pressure to find something quick. If some salesman tries to pressure me with "you need to buy this now, because tomorrow its gone", I just tell him, that my ES100 still works just fine tomorrow.

Spending 3000 € on a piano based on YouTube comments would be a ridiculous proposition for me. If I had to do that, I would add a plane ticket on top of that budget to visit the instrument in person, before risking making the wrong choice.

You are Right...
Thank you for input...
Gandhi

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757610
08/11/18 07:18 AM
08/11/18 07:18 AM
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Germany
JoBert Offline
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Hi Ghandi,

I think you made a great choice and that you'll really love the piano once you get it.

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: JoBert] #2757651
08/11/18 11:11 AM
08/11/18 11:11 AM
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Gandhi Offline OP
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Originally Posted by JoBert
Hi Ghandi,

I think you made a great choice and that you'll really love the piano once you get it.


Thank you very much for your Kind encouraging words & all your input...

I am just on Intermediate level of Piano Playing & Starting again after so many years at the age of 64 years with my grand daughter..

So i decided to buy atleast considerably good Piano if not the BEST....

Whatever advice n guidence i recieved on this great forum i found most helpful to me.

I am greatful to you all..

Gandhi

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757670
08/11/18 01:40 PM
08/11/18 01:40 PM
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Posts: 1,338
UK
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Alexander Borro Offline
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UK
Late to the party, herewith my 2 non expert cents:

Gandhi, first of all, enjoy the CA78. I've enjoyed mine and have it for about 6 weeks now. I think either would have been a good choice for different reasons.

Me personally, all IMHO of course, my opinion hasn't changed from my initial impressions trying them in the shop and it still stands.

Sound: I actually prefer the yamaha CFX sample ( and bosendorfer), which seems to be rather underrated here as far as I am concerned, in particular over headphones, the binaural ( CFX only ) samples especially have the edge over Kawai, regardless of all the headphone features the Kawai comes with. Of course others will feel different on that aspect, all subjective but that is how it is for me.

I also find the timbre more pleasant on the yamaha, it has a fuller musical tone ( not easy to hear on demos but when you play it with the build in yamaha sound system it becomes a lot more obvious to me). The newer resonance engine in the kawai is probably a little more advanced (pianist mode), but in terms of raw tone the yamaha wins out for me. The Kawai timbrel characteristics I find okay(ish), but not something I am really enthused about around the middle registers or so mainly . Having tried it of course I knew this before buying it, since one can also use computer software to replace sounds, and this is how I use it mostly, so it wasn't that important to me. overall, the kawai still has an enjoyable enough sound for me.

Action : it is the main reason I bought mine, and to that end I have no regrets at all. The kawai was the winner for the actual keyboard, and it was my main buying criterion. Ultimately the action/keyboard cannot be replaced, the sounds can be easily replaced ( with a PC or MAC).

Overall. I'll admit had I been in the position to not use software at all, I would actually have bought a yamaha CLP685, the same sound engine is in the CLP 645 IIRC. No problem admitting that being a kawai owner, I felt like that before buying and still feel like that today.

Finally, I also hope you do not get struck by the Kawai curse ( which came in the form a of heatwave in the UK) , as soon as I got mine I had all sorts of bad luck since I bought computer upgrades to go with it, and the following happened in the space of a month owning it.

- a failed router, no internet for a week ,thanks virgin media, and a first ever home router failure.

- one hard drive failure, first ever for me on a home computer also, but it was my fault, I dropped it.

- a failing PC power supply, admittedly it was an old one.

- The kawai would not work reliably over midi on some rare occasions whereas my old casio worked flawlessly over midi in that same time, now resolved I believe (needs a few more days of testing) the kawai has been rock solid now for 4 days with the new power supply.

- I experienced some very soft crackling over the headphones once or twice shortly after switching it on, but subsides after a minute when it happens, not too worried about that in the scheme of things. I have full warranty.

besides all that, all is fine and dandy laugh

Last edited by Alexander Borro; 08/11/18 01:44 PM.

Selftaught since June 2014.
Books: Barratt classic piano course bk 1,2,3. Humphries Piano handbook, various...
Kawai CA78, Casio AP450 & software pianos.
[Linked Image] 12x ABF recitals.
My struggles: https://soundcloud.com/alexander-borro
Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2757682
08/11/18 02:11 PM
08/11/18 02:11 PM
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 93
INDIA
G
Gandhi Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 93
INDIA
Originally Posted by Alexander Borro
Late to the party, herewith my 2 non expert cents:

Gandhi, first of all, enjoy the CA78. I've enjoyed mine and have it for about 6 weeks now. I think either would have been a good choice for different reasons.

Me personally, all IMHO of course, my opinion hasn't changed from my initial impressions trying them in the shop and it still stands.

Sound: I actually prefer the yamaha CFX sample ( and bosendorfer), which seems to be rather underrated here as far as I am concerned, in particular over headphones, the binaural ( CFX only ) samples especially have the edge over Kawai, regardless of all the headphone features the Kawai comes with. Of course others will feel different on that aspect, all subjective but that is how it is for me.

I also find the timbre more pleasant on the yamaha, it has a fuller musical tone ( not easy to hear on demos but when you play it with the build in yamaha sound system it becomes a lot more obvious to me). The newer resonance engine in the kawai is probably a little more advanced (pianist mode), but in terms of raw tone the yamaha wins out for me. The Kawai timbrel characteristics I find okay(ish), but not something I am really enthused about around the middle registers or so mainly . Having tried it of course I knew this before buying it, since one can also use computer software to replace sounds, and this is how I use it mostly, so it wasn't that important to me. overall, the kawai still has an enjoyable enough sound for me.

Action : it is the main reason I bought mine, and to that end I have no regrets at all. The kawai was the winner for the actual keyboard, and it was my main buying criterion. Ultimately the action/keyboard cannot be replaced, the sounds can be easily replaced ( with a PC or MAC).

Overall. I'll admit had I been in the position to not use software at all, I would actually have bought a yamaha CLP685, the same sound engine is in the CLP 645 IIRC. No problem admitting that being a kawai owner, I felt like that before buying and still feel like that today.

Finally, I also hope you do not get struck by the Kawai curse ( which came in the form a of heatwave in the UK) , as soon as I got mine I had all sorts of bad luck since I bought computer upgrades to go with it, and the following happened in the space of a month owning it.

- a failed router, no internet for a week ,thanks virgin media, and a first ever home router failure.

- one hard drive failure, first ever for me on a home computer also, but it was my fault, I dropped it.

- a failing PC power supply, admittedly it was an old one.

- The kawai would not work reliably over midi on some rare occasions whereas my old casio worked flawlessly over midi in that same time, now resolved I believe (needs a few more days of testing) the kawai has been rock solid now for 4 days with the new power supply.

- I experienced some very soft crackling over the headphones once or twice shortly after switching it on, but subsides after a minute when it happens, not too worried about that in the scheme of things. I have full warranty.

besides all that, all is fine and dandy laugh

First let me Thank you for your detail explanation & input..
I have also selected CA 78 for It's Key Touch which is very closed to Aclustic as per information i received from our Distributor of Kawai.. Sound can be possible to add or Change with VST..
I took demo of Clp 645 & i admit that sound is very good but overall Kawai winner in all category for me..
I apreciate your input..
Gandhi.

Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2758795
08/16/18 03:09 AM
08/16/18 03:09 AM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 35
India
vkhandelwal Offline
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Posts: 35
India
Originally Posted by Gandhi
Hi....
Well i have already ordered KAWAI 78....

I took very fast decission because there was no option left for me as Distributor of Kawai told me to comfirm order within 24 hours than only it will possible for them to include My CA 78 in Shipment which Will start from Japan on 20th Aug so there is no time left..
According to Distributor If i opt for next shipment which will be in October than i will receive my Piano in End of November which is 3 month waiting Period which i wanted to avoid...
so i place order immedietly..

Now i will receive Piano 1st Week of September.

Well it was very difficult decission for me to decide so fast & without Personal demo,

But in the end everything is fine now(hopefully)....

SO I would like to THANK you all
Dear JoBert Jitin ArtlessArt Mcoll Tyr rolex67 & Kawai James..
This became possible only because of guidence & advice i received from this forum & yes videos on youtube..

Regards
Gandhi




























.


well I am too from India and waiting for delivery of CA78 which will come in the same shipment .
I had to order without demo but I think both of us will be happy when we receive it.

Nice to see that your are revisiting your piano passion after so many years. wishing you many happy moments with your new piano

Congratulations !

Last edited by vkhandelwal; 08/16/18 03:09 AM.

Korg Kronos, Kawai CA78, Korg PA700, logic studio ,Fender Strat, Epiphone hummingbird,Korg wavedrum , fender mustang,


Re: KAWAI CA 78 Vs YAMAHA CLP645 [Re: Gandhi] #2758876
08/16/18 09:59 AM
08/16/18 09:59 AM
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 93
INDIA
G
Gandhi Offline OP
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Originally Posted by vkhandelwal
Originally Posted by Gandhi
Hi....
Well i have already ordered KAWAI 78....

I took very fast decission because there was no option left for me as Distributor of Kawai told me to comfirm order within 24 hours than only it will possible for them to include My CA 78 in Shipment which Will start from Japan on 20th Aug so there is no time left..
According to Distributor If i opt for next shipment which will be in October than i will receive my Piano in End of November which is 3 month waiting Period which i wanted to avoid...
so i place order immedietly..

Now i will receive Piano 1st Week of September.

Well it was very difficult decission for me to decide so fast & without Personal demo,

But in the end everything is fine now(hopefully)....

SO I would like to THANK you all
Dear JoBert Jitin ArtlessArt Mcoll Tyr rolex67 & Kawai James..
This became possible only because of guidence & advice i received from this forum & yes videos on youtube..

Regards
Gandhi





























.


well I am too from India and waiting for delivery of CA78 which will come in the same shipment .
I had to order without demo but I think both of us will be happy when we receive it.

Nice to see that your are revisiting your piano passion after so many years. wishing you many happy moments with your new piano

Congratulations !


Thank you for your Kind word & Input..

I am from Mumbai

You are Vikasji Khandelwal from Indore?

I am aware of your order & Congratulations to you also.

I have already commented on your Thread.

I already have sent you a PM one week back but think you have not recd?

I am trying to contact you through my relatives in Indore??


If you agree than we can talk on phone.

Wish you also all the very best with your New Piano..

I actualy bought this for my Lovely Granddaughter she is just
4 Years & 6 months old & She will start her lessons next month.
So Pls bless her..
Regard
Gandhi



Last edited by Gandhi; 08/16/18 10:03 AM.
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