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Complaints and more complaints!!!
#2751060 07/12/18 05:45 PM
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Well I’ve never done this, quite like this before- but I’m going to now.
Hate being too tired to have time for myself, which means;
1. no piano practice
2. Sleep a lot
3. And get sinus infections a lot frown.
My job burns me out... [it has a high burnout rate].
And being 55, I just feel like this life-work situation is bad…,
SO, I’m taking work breaks, which is “money bad.”

But, on an up note I ‘m practicing to learn Swan Lake.
Just wanted to “vent” it somewhere.
Thanks for reading




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Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751062 07/12/18 06:02 PM
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I understand you. I'm often tired in the evening, not able to concentrate enough to practice efficiently. It is painful to me.

I'm trying to space out my vacation so I have time to recover. Ideal solution would be to work less, but this is easier said than done (I'm a little bit sick of working 45h/week).

Enjoy your break with plenty of piano! You deserve it!


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Started piano on February 2016.
Pieces I'm working on :
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Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751063 07/12/18 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by piano_primo_1
Well I’ve never done this, quite like this before- but I’m going to now.
Hate being too tired to have time for myself, which means;
1. no piano practice
2. Sleep a lot
3. And get sinus infections a lot frown.
My job burns me out... [it has a high burnout rate].


Having just returned from a conference all about about sleep disorders, I'd just caution against over-sleeping (7 - 8 hours is about right for an adult), which could make you feel even more tired and lower your resistance to infections.

You'd be better off sleeping your normal hours and playing the piano as an antidote against the stress of your job. Piano playing, BTW, is mine too. Plus travelling, which is when I leave any worries about anything work-related behind. (Leaving the thought of piano practicing behind too, though I wouldn't say no if I came across a piano on my travels - though I wouldn't be practicing. I'd be playing...... grin)

Incidentally, the job I'm in has one of the highest suicide rates of any, as well as one of the highest burnout rates.


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751069 07/12/18 06:34 PM
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Yeah,... well the sinus infections keep me tired, aside from shift work ,and working in a facility- -aka- " pathogenic microbial incubator", doesn't help .Maybe I just need a new job.....




Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751070 07/12/18 06:35 PM
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new normal people wouldn't hurt- smile too , ..I .guess I m stressed out.

Last edited by piano_primo_1; 07/12/18 06:37 PM.



Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751091 07/12/18 08:00 PM
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Thanks for the advice and the Very good PM advice. I think it is the sinus problem that is the more trying aspect of everything . So, with that said, glad I could express myself .




Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
bennevis #2751123 07/12/18 11:36 PM
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Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by piano_primo_1
Well I’ve never done this, quite like this before- but I’m going to now.
Hate being too tired to have time for myself, which means;
1. no piano practice
2. Sleep a lot
3. And get sinus infections a lot frown.
My job burns me out... [it has a high burnout rate].


Having just returned from a conference all about about sleep disorders, I'd just caution against over-sleeping (7 - 8 hours is about right for an adult), which could make you feel even more tired and lower your resistance to infections.

You'd be better off sleeping your normal hours.


Many people think 8 hours IS a lot... and their normal hours mean they are chronically sleep deprived.

BTW. From what I heard they still haven't actually ruled out that the correlation between sleeping a lot and health issues is caused by other factors rather than causality? Did they present some new research results?

If one suddenly needs to artificially restrict one's sleeping hours I would guess there is something more important to attend to that is at the root of the problem.

Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
bennevis #2751128 07/12/18 11:55 PM
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Originally Posted by bennevis
Having just returned from a conference all about about sleep disorders, I'd just caution against over-sleeping (7 - 8 hours is about right for an adult), which could make you feel even more tired and lower your resistance to infections.

I know I have some sort of disorder since I can't sleep more than 3.5-4.5 hours per night. I have a Fitbit watch to track my sleeping patterns and set a sleeping target of 6.5 hrs on the watch, however despite my best efforts, I can hit that only about once per month, and then usually only because I slept less than 3 hrs the prior night.

What are people like me supposed to do? It's not like I feel all energetic with less sleep. I don't feel energetic at all usually, especially at the end of the day. But I just can't sleep more that about 4.5 hrs usually. Is this a form of chronic insomnia? Any insights from your conference? Should I get a prescription of Ambien or similar? (I've tried self-hypnosis and autosuggestion, and both are a fail.)


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Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751129 07/13/18 12:07 AM
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I hate to say this but if your job requires you to sit on a desk with a computer or in meetings most of the day, playing the piano a lot may actually not be the best thing to counter the ill effects. What you need to do is get some nice relaxing exercise: walking, running, swimming... even a little bit every say is a step forward. And make sure you take the time to eat well.

We all have our limits. I am about your age. I had to drastically reduce my piano practice to take better care of my health issues. And I never found piano playing very relaxing, rather the opposite (which doesn't mean it's not enjoyable). It takes a lot of concentration and memory which are not my strong points. It also adds to my daily load of sitting which my defected back does not like. I am better now and decided that if I want to handle my job and retire in good condition one day, I will have to spend less time on the piano and devote more attention to my general well being now. When retired I can spend as much time as I want playing... if I am still around...

Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
outo #2751131 07/13/18 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by outo
I hate to say this but if your job requires you to sit on a desk with a computer or in meetings most of the day, playing the piano a lot may actually not be the best thing to counter the ill effects. What you need to do is get some nice relaxing exercise: walking, running, swimming... even a little bit every say is a step forward. And make sure you take the time to eat well.

We all have our limits. I am about your age. I had to drastically reduce my piano practice to take better care of my health issues.


I'm a healthcare provider -nurse and work shifts sporadically. Desk time is maybe a 1.5 stretch per shift.Night shifts are harder than they used to be because I'm older.
I think I'm really more worried about my sinuses ... It has to be the culprit..
Because I'm too tired to do anything "extra". I'll see my doc if it keeps up more than a couple days- from now .
.




Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751135 07/13/18 01:32 AM
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Originally Posted by piano_primo_1
Originally Posted by outo
I hate to say this but if your job requires you to sit on a desk with a computer or in meetings most of the day, playing the piano a lot may actually not be the best thing to counter the ill effects. What you need to do is get some nice relaxing exercise: walking, running, swimming... even a little bit every say is a step forward. And make sure you take the time to eat well.

We all have our limits. I am about your age. I had to drastically reduce my piano practice to take better care of my health issues.


I'm a healthcare provider -nurse and work shifts sporadically. Desk time is maybe a 1.5 stretch per shift.Night shifts are harder than they used to be because I'm older.
I think I'm really more worried about my sinuses ... It has to be the culprit..
Because I'm too tired to do anything "extra". I'll see my doc if it keeps up more than a couple days- from now .
.


You are not alone...there are so many health risks with a job like yours. I come from a family of health care professionals and I have seen what such a schedule can do when people age. I hope things get better soon!

Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
Tyrone Slothrop #2751142 07/13/18 02:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
[quote=bennevis....]I have a Fitbit watch to track my sleeping patterns and set a sleeping target of 6.5 hrs on the watch, however despite my best efforts, I can hit that only about once per month, and then usually only because I slept less than 3 hrs the prior night.


Do you think Fitbits are any good though ? My Charge2 is hopelessly inaccurate for both pulse and sleep. Funnily enough, my old Charge HR wasn't as bad but it broke. If you ask them questions about these things they won't give you answers. I shan't get another Fitbit after this one.

I can sympathise with the OP's nasal problems. A blocked nose drastically disrupts sleep. I get frequent allergic blockages and having polyps doesn't help. What I do when an attack occurs is use an immediate relief spray during the night, and at the same time introduce Alanase or similar twice a day before rebound congestion from the Otrivin has had a chance to start. I have the sequence down to a fine art now and haven't slept less than eight and a half hours a night for ages. If I do intense training I sometimes sleep nine hours or more.


"We shall always love the music of the masters, but they are all dead and now it's our turn." - Llewelyn Jones, my piano teacher
Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751147 07/13/18 03:20 AM
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The burnout rate in Healthcare is very, very high. It can be a frustrating, thankless job, especiaiallly as it is evolving in the US, with EMR and outside pressures everywhere, unreleastic expextations and an aging population with the expectation of immortality.

Sorry you're going through this; I think everyone in healthcare feels this way from time to time. For that matter, many people by their late 40s to 50s end up here sooner or later in general. A career is a long haul, and financial and family pressures can add to the burden. Sometimes a little perspective helps - we're all a lot better off now than we were decades ago, and certainly than we were over the course of history, with unprecedented freedoms, access to clean water and heating, safe homes, etc.

Maybe a little depression here also? Fatigue, burnout, sleep changes, etc. Might be worth exploring. Some exercise might be good as suggested, and a check up to make sure nothing else is going on. Thyroid? Good luck and feel better!

And btw, TS, stay away from Ambien. Bad news. Poor sleep quality, long term problems with confusion, behavior changes, etc.


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Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751161 07/13/18 05:30 AM
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My thoughts on this: stress is absolutely to be avoided, not simply because it is unpleasant but especially because it weakens the immune defense system and thereby increases vulnerability to infections. In my view it is of the highest importance to never feel like one is "behind" and trying to catch up. That state of mind is extremely draining and stressful. Sometimes the best approach is to simply loosen up the daily schedule and drop certain activities in order to have more time for relaxation. Sometimes the best approach is an attitude change, recognizing that certain things are not really as important as they seemed (it is surprising how much old baggage we run around with that we really, by all logical standards, should have dropped a long time ago).

Other than that I suggest:

  • Meditation, even if just for five minutes a day (but don't meditate if it stresses you out smile )
  • Moderate exercise (walking is good)
  • Supplementing with adaptogens in the morning (I would suggest cycling between a few different ones. Panax Ginseng, Rhodiola Rosea, Siberian Ginseng, Maca, and Cordyceps are good examples, but there are many others).
  • Echinacea for a few days whenever the sniffles have appeared.

Oh, and focus on the good stuff in life as much as possible. smile


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Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
Tyrone Slothrop #2751162 07/13/18 06:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
Originally Posted by bennevis
Having just returned from a conference all about about sleep disorders, I'd just caution against over-sleeping (7 - 8 hours is about right for an adult), which could make you feel even more tired and lower your resistance to infections.

I know I have some sort of disorder since I can't sleep more than 3.5-4.5 hours per night. I have a Fitbit watch to track my sleeping patterns and set a sleeping target of 6.5 hrs on the watch, however despite my best efforts, I can hit that only about once per month, and then usually only because I slept less than 3 hrs the prior night.

What are people like me supposed to do? It's not like I feel all energetic with less sleep. I don't feel energetic at all usually, especially at the end of the day. But I just can't sleep more that about 4.5 hrs usually. Is this a form of chronic insomnia? Any insights from your conference? Should I get a prescription of Ambien or similar? (I've tried self-hypnosis and autosuggestion, and both are a fail.)

If what you're getting is clearly insufficient for you, CBT-I (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy for Insomnia) may give you the best results in terms of long-lasting effects - which you won't get from prescription drugs.

Melatonin (which I believe is available without prescription in USA? - correct me if I'm wrong) is a natural 'sleep hormone' produced by the body in a circadian rhythm and is effective in promoting good sleep 'naturally' without the artificial agents like the Z drugs (zopiclone, zolpidem). It can 'reset the body clock' for those insomniacs whose own circadian rhythm has been disrupted.

BTW, if you haven't already practiced 'sleep hygiene', start straightaway. No blue lights (LEDs etc) prior to bed. Not even a clock with LED, otherwise you'll be clock-watching. The bedroom is only for sleep and s** wink , not for Facebook (or whatever people use these days). Going on social media while lying in bed is a sure way to get a sleepless night. Don't even read a book.

Exercise (no later than two hours before bedtime) has also been shown to be helpful in promoting good sleep. And don't forget that the effects of caffeine lasts for eight hours.

Also, chronic insomnia can lead to depression, as well as vice versa.......


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751165 07/13/18 06:34 AM
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Agree c Bennevis 100%. Big fan of CBT.

And yes, Melatonin is OTC here.


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Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751171 07/13/18 07:08 AM
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I've basically been semi retired since I left school. No money or security, but lots of time to persue what makes me happy (as long as it's inexpensive). The downside is that when I'm 70 I might end up living under a bridge.

Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751207 07/13/18 11:46 AM
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I suffered from insomnia for several years. What has helped me very much and what I have understood is that the best and most natural way to fall asleep is to really fatigue my brain. Activities that require high concentration and very intensive cognitive effort are helpful in that matter. Considering piano such activities include on-the-fly transposition of pieces and exercises, ear training using software, and intensive training for speed.

Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
piano_primo #2751210 07/13/18 11:52 AM
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piano_primo_1, as a husband of healthcare professional I understand you and sympathize with you very much. And I'm also very tired of infections that my wife brings home from the hospital.

Re: Complaints and more complaints!!!
cmb13 #2751219 07/13/18 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Ted
Originally Posted by Tyrone Slothrop
[quote=bennevis....]I have a Fitbit watch to track my sleeping patterns and set a sleeping target of 6.5 hrs on the watch, however despite my best efforts, I can hit that only about once per month, and then usually only because I slept less than 3 hrs the prior night.


Do you think Fitbits are any good though ? My Charge2 is hopelessly inaccurate for both pulse and sleep. Funnily enough, my old Charge HR wasn't as bad but it broke. If you ask them questions about these things they won't give you answers. I shan't get another Fitbit after this one.

I have Fitbit Versa, and the only reason I got it was for sleep tracking and for its O2 sensor (not yet supported by any software though). It appears to be accurate for this purpose to me. I don't check my pulse with it. I did have a Surge and a Flex before that, and I had gotten my daughter a Charge2, and neither of us had any complaints. You might have had a lemon.

Originally Posted by cmb13
And btw, TS, stay away from Ambien. Bad news. Poor sleep quality, long term problems with confusion, behavior changes, etc.

Yes, that's why I haven't gone for any. I feel like my problem is not severe enough yet. I am not falling asleep behind the wheel, and not yet completely depressed (but that might be because of the Lexapro 40mg po qd, which my psych has me on for OCD).

Originally Posted by bennevis
If what you're getting is clearly insufficient for you, CBT-I (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy for Insomnia) may give you the best results in terms of long-lasting effects - which you won't get from prescription drugs.

Originally Posted by cmb13
Agree c Bennevis 100%. Big fan of CBT.

I have to look up CBT-I. In general, I am negative on CBT since it has been completely and utterly useless for OCD. In fact I can't imagine a treatment so useless for OCD. It simply doesn't get to the heart of the issues in that case. Insomnia might be different. I will investigate.

Originally Posted by bennevis
Melatonin (which I believe is available without prescription in USA? - correct me if I'm wrong) is a natural 'sleep hormone' produced by the body in a circadian rhythm and is effective in promoting good sleep 'naturally' without the artificial agents like the Z drugs (zopiclone, zolpidem). It can 'reset the body clock' for those insomniacs whose own circadian rhythm has been disrupted.

I tried Melatonin years ago and it didn't work for me then, but that was before I was put on this monster Lexapro dosage. I wonder if it might work now just because of pharmacological interactions... and also I'm older now. LOL. I'm going to order some off of Amazon.com and see if it has any effect on me now. Thanks for the recommendation!

Originally Posted by bennevis
BTW, if you haven't already practiced 'sleep hygiene', start straightaway. No blue lights (LEDs etc) prior to bed. Not even a clock with LED, otherwise you'll be clock-watching. The bedroom is only for sleep and s** wink , not for Facebook (or whatever people use these days). Going on social media while lying in bed is a sure way to get a sleepless night. Don't even read a book.

I somewhat do that using a sleep mask and my Alexa to make pitter-patter sounds every night. I will try to impose a bit more sleep discipline than that as you suggest.

But I have a different form of insomnia than many sufferers, which is why I am still not sure this is insomnia. I go to sleep immediately, in 1 min or less. But then, I wake up after only 3.5-4.5 hours and am AWAKE. FULLY. frown

Originally Posted by bennevis
Exercise (no later than two hours before bedtime) has also been shown to be helpful in promoting good sleep. And don't forget that the effects of caffeine lasts for eight hours.

I don't exercise much at all these days. But I also don't think that would address my form of insomnia (see above).

Originally Posted by bennevis
Also, chronic insomnia can lead to depression, as well as vice versa.......

Yes, but because of Lexapro mentioned above, I no longer think I am capable of getting depressed. On the other hand, I am quite getting accustomed to having a flat affect and needing an hour for s**. LOL

BTW, do you think Lexapro might have a side-effect of insomnia?


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"Pianoteq manages to keep it all together yet simultaneously also go in all directions; like a quantum particle entangled with an unknown and spooky parallel universe simply waiting to be discovered." -by Pete14
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