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A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR #2750154
07/08/18 02:43 AM
07/08/18 02:43 AM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada
V
Vladimir Dounin Offline OP
Junior Member
Vladimir Dounin  Offline OP
Junior Member
V
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada

A Musical Test for those who know how to identify Time Signature

A MUSICAL TEST FOR THOSE WHO CAN COUNT UP TO FOUR


I always say that a musician should be able to read sheet music and understand what is written by the composer.

But today people are laughing at such naive people, they say that it's much easier to take a recording of a celebrity and just copy by ear what sounds on celebrity's record.

Recently, five students decided to test me. They asked me to guess which of them had never looked at the notes of Schumann's famous short piece.

I listened to all five and guessed right away. I told this pianist: you played completely different music instead of what the composer wrote. Schumann wrote the Time Signature 4/4. This means that in each bar there should be a One-Two-Three-Four.

Instead, you have five quarters in one bar, six quarters in another bar, three in the next one and so on.

However, this pianist did not give up. He invited me along with him to listen to all the records of this piece on You Tube and find at least one with the right, genuine Schumann's Time Signature.

We listened for a long time, but not a single record without this annoying mistake was found. All the pianists played anything, but not the Time Signature 4/4 that Schumann wrote.


I invite everyone who loves music and knows how to count to four, to go through the same test and find a pianist who can not count among these five. And if someone knows the record of Traumerei with the correct Time Signature - please, let me know in the comments.

I will listen with a great interest and I thank you in advance!

Good luck to everyone in the test! And thanks for watching.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4VKU_bWjd0




For comparison, I invite you to listen to the same piece performed by famous pianists:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vajd0ypDYQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13g53OYFHyM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fhKaAX5dOc


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pgu5NdnkrZ0


Vladimir Dounin
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Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: Vladimir Dounin] #2750163
07/08/18 05:02 AM
07/08/18 05:02 AM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada
V
Vladimir Dounin Offline OP
Junior Member
Vladimir Dounin  Offline OP
Junior Member
V
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada

A MUSICAL TEST FOR THOSE WHO CAN IDENTIFY TIME SIGNATURE


I always say that a musician should be able to read sheet music and understand what is written by the composer.

But today people are laughing at such naive people, they say that it's much easier to take a recording of a celebrity and just copy by ear what sounds on celebrity's record.

Recently, five students decided to test me. They asked me to guess which of them had never looked at the notes of Schumann's famous short piece.

I listened to all five and guessed right away. I told this pianist: you played completely different music instead of what the composer wrote. Schumann wrote the Time Signature 4/4. This means that in each bar there should be a One-Two-Three-Four.

Instead, you have five quarters in one bar, six quarters in another bar, three in the next one and so on.


If we come up with some suitable words for 4/4, then they can be sung to this melody with the correct stressing. For example,

"One day brings opportUnity
and the dreamer is victorious and glOrious".


And with the fake, usually performed Time Signature, these words will have to be sung with a wrong stressing like this:

"One day brings opportunitY
and the dreamer is victorious and gloriOus".



However, this pianist did not give up. He invited me along with him to listen to all the records of this piece on You Tube and find at least one with the right, genuine Schumann's Time Signature.

We listened for a long time, but not a single record without this annoying mistake was found. All the pianists played anything, but not the Time Signature 4/4 that Schumann wrote.


I invite everyone who loves music and knows how to count to four, to go through the same test and find a pianist who can not count among these five. And if someone knows the record of Traumerei with the correct Time Signature - please, let me know in the comments.

I will listen with a great interest and I thank you in advance!

Good luck to everyone in the test! And thanks for watching.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4VKU_bWjd0




For comparison, I invite you to listen to the same piece performed by famous pianists:




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vajd0ypDYQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13g53OYFHyM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fhKaAX5dOc


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pgu5NdnkrZ0

Last edited by Vladimir Dounin; 07/08/18 05:05 AM.

Vladimir Dounin
Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: Vladimir Dounin] #2750641
07/10/18 05:52 PM
07/10/18 05:52 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,913
D
dolce sfogato Offline
2000 Post Club Member
dolce sfogato  Offline
2000 Post Club Member
D
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,913
Reminds me of the row between Chopin and Meyerbeer about the rhythm in Chopin's playing of one of his Mazurkas: Meyerbeer said:' you play 4/4 instead of 3/4', Chopin argued back that he didn't, who was right? "rubato"|is the magic word here..

Last edited by dolce sfogato; 07/10/18 05:54 PM.

Longtemps, je me suis couché de bonne heure, but not anymore!
Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: dolce sfogato] #2751133
07/13/18 12:54 AM
07/13/18 12:54 AM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada
V
Vladimir Dounin Offline OP
Junior Member
Vladimir Dounin  Offline OP
Junior Member
V
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada
Rubato is legal only to the extent after which the same music should already be or can be written down by a different kind of notes and Time Signature. When (If) it is possible - the performer is WRONG.[size:14pt][/size]

Last edited by Vladimir Dounin; 07/13/18 01:00 AM.

Vladimir Dounin
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Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: Vladimir Dounin] #2751136
07/13/18 01:44 AM
07/13/18 01:44 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 21,499
Victoria, BC
BruceD Offline
Gold Subscriber
BruceD  Offline
Gold Subscriber
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 21,499
Victoria, BC
Originally Posted by Vladimir Dounin
Rubato is legal only to the extent after which the same music should already be or can be written down by a different kind of notes and Time Signature. When (If) it is possible - the performer is WRONG.


Isn't that what you intended, Vladimir?

What has legality to do with the question of rubato?

I don't understand what you have written.

Regards,


BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190
Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: Vladimir Dounin] #2751218
07/13/18 12:20 PM
07/13/18 12:20 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada
V
Vladimir Dounin Offline OP
Junior Member
Vladimir Dounin  Offline OP
Junior Member
V
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada
If you undertake to perform good music and do it well, then you are a good person, doing a good deed for people. This is a perfectly legitimate activity in terms of human morality. In other words - it is absolutely legal.

If you undertake to perform good music, but at the same time make it ugly or even replace it with your own fictions, then you are a criminal. You steal good music from people, because they, believing your performance and thinking that the composer really wrote such filth, will never listen to this work again. They will consider this work and its composer as bad, will avoid them.

In this way you robbed the humankind of good music that makes humans better (when bad music makes them worse). It is a crime, it is illegal for any human with a conscience.


If the performer is not playing what is written in the notes, but something else instead that should be written by some other notes - he is a "music criminal", his activities are illegal.

Last edited by Vladimir Dounin; 07/13/18 12:24 PM.

Vladimir Dounin
Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: Vladimir Dounin] #2751221
07/13/18 12:31 PM
07/13/18 12:31 PM
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 92
R
RmntcPianoLvr Online content
Full Member
RmntcPianoLvr  Online Content
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Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 92
Music is music though, a pianist has the freedom to do whatever they want to do. In fact, staying 100% loyal to the script without your own inputs and variations would get quite boring; everyone would play the same thing and there wouldn't be personality. Personally speaking though, if you don't like the interpretations of a piece and you know how it "should be played" according to your standards, why not just play it yourself the way you believe sounds best? After all, "good and bad" are just opinions, and it's quite preposterous to just write off pianists as "criminals" simply because they didn't play it the way you like. Just my two cents. Peace.

Last edited by RmntcPianoLvr; 07/13/18 12:31 PM.
Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: RmntcPianoLvr] #2751238
07/13/18 02:45 PM
07/13/18 02:45 PM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 315
Z
Zaphod Online sad
Full Member
Zaphod  Online Sad
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Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 315
Originally Posted by RmntcPianoLvr
everyone would play the same thing and there wouldn't be personality.


I believe this is a myth, that I hear people say very often. It doesn't take into account that each person is different, has different physiology, strength, dexterity, etc.

If ten different people stuck to the score, it would sound ten different ways.

I say, stick to what the composer intended. Your "interpretation" will come out naturally. Don't force it or invent some kind of facsimile.

Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: Zaphod] #2751293
07/13/18 06:33 PM
07/13/18 06:33 PM
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 832
In the Ozarks of Missouri
NobleHouse Online content
500 Post Club Member
NobleHouse  Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 832
In the Ozarks of Missouri
Originally Posted by Zaphod
Originally Posted by RmntcPianoLvr
everyone would play the same thing and there wouldn't be personality.


I believe this is a myth, that I hear people say very often. It doesn't take into account that each person is different, has different physiology, strength, dexterity, etc.

If ten different people stuck to the score, it would sound ten different ways.

I say, stick to what the composer intended. Your "interpretation" will come out naturally. Don't force it or invent some kind of facsimile.


I must agree here. As said, listen to ANY famous piece by 10 renowned pianists who follow the score as religiously as possible. They will never sound the same.

Re: A Musical Test for those who can count up to FOUR [Re: Zaphod] #2751294
07/13/18 06:34 PM
07/13/18 06:34 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada
V
Vladimir Dounin Offline OP
Junior Member
Vladimir Dounin  Offline OP
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 13
Canada
100% true. I wanted to answer almost by the same words but you did it already. Thanks!


Vladimir Dounin

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