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Looking for the very best German Steinway D software #2749204
07/04/18 08:50 AM
07/04/18 08:50 AM
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lvercaut Offline OP
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Is it still Ivory 2 ? or Korg Kronos ? or …?
I want a German D, not interested in American D.
Thanks

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Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749207
07/04/18 09:08 AM
07/04/18 09:08 AM
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toddy Offline
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Look at Galaxy Vintage D (old but considered very good - even best available), Native Instruments The Grandeur (same technical team as above, but newer), Production Voices Concert Grand (new, full version is enormous but compact version available).

Not certain about the exact provenance of them, but they're all Steinway concert grands.


Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / Native Instruments K9 ult / ESQL MOR2 Symph Orchestra & Choirs / Lucato & Parravicini , trumpets & saxes / Garritan CFX lite / Production Voices C7 & Steinway D compact

Focusrite Saffire 24 / W7, i7 4770, 16GB / MXL V67g / Yamaha HS7s / HD598
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749221
07/04/18 10:45 AM
07/04/18 10:45 AM
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Galaxy Vintage D I would recommend.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: toddy] #2749222
07/04/18 10:46 AM
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Yes, that old Vintage D is very playable, but is it a German Hamburg D ?
PV is American D.
Thanks toddy.

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Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: -Jay-] #2749232
07/04/18 11:08 AM
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lvercaut Offline OP
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Thanks Jay017.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749238
07/04/18 11:13 AM
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lvercaut Offline OP
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Maybe it's not the very best library, i'm looking for that German D as in Korg Kronos and Grandstage...…..but in software for my iMac..Which comes closest ? or is better with the same tonal character ?
Vintage D is very editable ? Right ?

Last edited by lvercaut; 07/04/18 11:19 AM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749247
07/04/18 11:40 AM
07/04/18 11:40 AM
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The PianoTeq Steinway D is among their best pianos (my favourite of the PianoTeq menu). You can demo that for free.

The PianoTeq pro version does 192KHz internal processing; this is rare case where high-sampling rate MIGHT improve sound qualtiy for consumer (there is a thread at the PianoTeq forum with audio files of ONE note decaying). The thread's 192 wav note sounded much more natural than the lower sample rate note; but who knows if you will notice a difference playing. Or if the wav files were done incorrectly. Of if the processing will kill your laptop. You can't demo the Pro version so that would be an expensive trial indeed. Maybe your local music store has PianoTeq Pro running on display (mine does I think so I should try). . .

___

The Production Voices Steinway compact sounds superb overall, but is more of a beta release (in my view), so has a few issues to finalise. The upcoming Full versions will have more mics and hopefully the major issues ironed out. The Full comes in several flavours 16/44.1KHz will be rather large. Higher sample rate versions are huge and really designed for producers. There is a recent post here from Jason with estimated sizes and expected release this summer. This has a lot of potential. . .

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: newer player] #2749254
07/04/18 12:11 PM
07/04/18 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by newer player

The Production Voices Steinway compact sounds superb overall, but is more of a beta release (in my view), so has a few issues to finalise. The upcoming Full versions will have more mics and hopefully the major issues ironed out. The Full comes in several flavours 16/44.1KHz will be rather large. Higher sample rate versions are huge and really designed for producers. There is a recent post here from Jason with estimated sizes and expected release this summer. This has a lot of potential. . .


Just out of interest, what issues did you find with Production Voices Steinway Compact. Obviously one microphone perspective is going to limit the sound sonically but how good/bad was the playability and how close is it to CFX.

Last edited by Jay017; 07/04/18 12:13 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749260
07/04/18 12:27 PM
07/04/18 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by lvercaut
Maybe it's not the very best library, i'm looking for that German D as in Korg Kronos and Grandstage...…..but in software for my iMac..Which comes closest ? or is better with the same tonal character ?
Vintage D is very editable ? Right ?

You’re not going to find anything in the software world that sounds exactly the same as the Kronos German D. I know this because i own a Kronos since 2011 and i also happen to own or tried every single piano Vst in existence.

Is it the tone that you like in the Kronos piano or is it the “fullness” and body? I’m asking so i can help you find alternatives.

Last edited by tdwctdwc; 07/04/18 12:28 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: -Jay-] #2749261
07/04/18 12:28 PM
07/04/18 12:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Jay017
Just out of interest, what issues did you find with Production Voices Steinway Compact. Obviously one microphone perspective is going to limit the sound sonically but how good/bad was the playability and how close is it to CFX.


This thread provides a fair view from several members here:

http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2729689/1.html

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749266
07/04/18 12:58 PM
07/04/18 12:58 PM
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Vintage D is a Hamburg D. They say it right at the beginning of their video.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2749276
07/04/18 02:07 PM
07/04/18 02:07 PM
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Is it the tone that you like in the Kronos piano or is it the “fullness” and body? I’m asking so i can help you find alternatives.[/quote]

Yes indeed, it's that fullness and body i'm looking for and i also don't find this in my nordstage.

i really love my nordstage but if i compare that Kronos or Grandstage German grand with nord's Grand Lady D , the stage sound like a carton box (sorry nord , i love your products and owned them since the beginning and always will).

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749278
07/04/18 02:14 PM
07/04/18 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by lvercaut


Yes indeed, it's that fullness and body i'm looking for and i also don't find this in my nordstage.

i really love my nordstage but if i compare that Kronos or Grandstage German grand with nord's Grand Lady D , the stage sound like a carton box (sorry nord , i love your products and owned them since the beginning and always will).

Get Keyscape then. I know it’s not a Steinway but it’s the only one that will get you in that ballpark and then some more.

Last edited by tdwctdwc; 07/04/18 02:15 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749386
07/05/18 01:02 AM
07/05/18 01:02 AM
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MacMacMac Offline
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No, it's a New York Steinway from the 1920s.
Originally Posted by lvercaut
Yes, that old Vintage D is very playable, but is it a German Hamburg D ?

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: MacMacMac] #2749389
07/05/18 01:30 AM
07/05/18 01:30 AM
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Macy Offline
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Originally Posted by MacMacMac
No, it's a New York Steinway from the 1920s.
Originally Posted by lvercaut
Yes, that old Vintage D is very playable, but is it a German Hamburg D ?



Nope. From the Galaxy website:

"Bauer Studios' Steinway D grand piano was built in 1920 in Hamburg, the german factory
of Steinway & Sons. Over almost 90 years this instrument has achieved a
very deep and intimate timbre, thus providing an energetic personality and
a beautiful singing tone. Richie Beirach called it 'The best piano in the world’"

"Many pianists have used this particular grand piano during their recording sessions including Monty Alexander, George Gruntz, Joe Sample, Geri Allen, Kevin Hays, Wolfgang Schmid, Richie Beirach, Abdullah Ibrahim, Martin Schrack, Carla Bley, Simon Nabatov, Aki Takase, Rainer Brüninghaus, Oregon, John Taylor, Uri Cane, Kristjan Randalu, Olivia Trummer, Frank Chastenier, Ozone Makato, Ralph Towner, Chick Corea, Jörg Reiter, Florian Weber, Wolfgang Dauner, Guillermo and Gonzalo Rubalcaba, Aziza Mustafa Zadeh, Dieter Falk and Keith Jarrett."

"To keep and enhance the warm and lively character of the instrument, the VINTAGE D has been recorded with modern high-end microphones, but also with vintage tube mics, especially the legendary Neumann U47 and KM53. Center of the control room at Bauer Studios is an AMS Neve Console, which has been extensively in use for the recordings, supplemented by other special preamps like the very rare Telefunken V41. The resulting sound is a combination of different microphone levels, no compression or eq has been used within the mix: It's the 'real thing'"

I highly recommend it. It's my favorite sampled Steinway.


Macy

CVP-409GP, Garritan CFX, Vintage D, Ivory II GP's & American Concert D, Pianoteq, True Keys American D, Ravenscroft 275, Garritan Authorized Steinway, Alicia's Keys, EWQL Pianos, MainStage, iPad Pro/forScore/PageFlip Cicada, Custom Mac MIDI/Audio Software Design, Macs Everywhere
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749451
07/05/18 08:49 AM
07/05/18 08:49 AM
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MacMacMac Offline
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I guess my old memory needs as much regulation as that old Steinway did.
Originally Posted by Macy
"Bauer Studios' Steinway D grand piano was built in 1920 in Hamburg ...

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: MacMacMac] #2749508
07/05/18 12:26 PM
07/05/18 12:26 PM
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lvercaut Offline OP
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Originally Posted by MacMacMac
I guess my old memory needs as much regulation as that old Steinway did.
Originally Posted by Macy
"Bauer Studios' Steinway D grand piano was built in 1920 in Hamburg ...

Haha, no problem MacMacMac, any input is much appreciated !
This is a high quality forum and we learn from each other !

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749551
07/05/18 03:35 PM
07/05/18 03:35 PM
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I'm looking for to VSL's Synchron Steinway D. While VSL pianos are not without their problems, they are the only sampled pianos that feel alive to me. Pianoteq can feel great too, but it has a long way to go in terms of sound.

I don't know when VSL's Steinway will be released, and so far it has only been hinted at, but they did say they will be releasing more Synchron pianos. They have a Steinway D and an Imperial as well as the CFX which they have recently sampled.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749655
07/06/18 04:36 AM
07/06/18 04:36 AM
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I also think you should seriously consider Ivory II American Concert D. I'm so glad i didn't delete it from my SSD like i did with the rest of my piano libraries.

I re-visited it yesterday and played a little improv on it. I have to say that the dynamic range and response is bar none, even surpassing the playbality of Garritan CFX.

Sound wise, i've always had a beef with it for being a little pale, "silver" sounding and muddy but yesterday i finally found a trick for that. Turned out all i had to do was lower the volume of the "Key noise" in the settings. Somehow it was introducing woody artifacts to the sound that took away from the clarity.

This piano in my opinion is the best recording-ready Steinway sound on the market. It just sounds like a clean recorded Steinway should sound. It's also nowhere near thin-sounding like the Garritan CFX. It's fuller in my opinion.

I knew there was a reason why i didn't delete it because there's something special about it and the key was to find the sweet spot in the settings.

Here's the little jam i did last night with my new settings: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/ivory-ii-american-concert-d

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749695
07/06/18 08:51 AM
07/06/18 08:51 AM
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Maybe the HZP? I haven't tried it but looks good

https://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/hans-zimmer-piano/

(422 gb ssd required !!!)

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2749728
07/06/18 10:59 AM
07/06/18 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc


Here's the little jam i did last night with my new settings: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/ivory-ii-american-concert-d


Nice improvisation smile

I've always wanted to purchase Ivory II American Concert D to compare it to the Galaxy Pianos i have. Is ivory still iLok only?

Last edited by Jay017; 07/06/18 10:59 AM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749736
07/06/18 11:14 AM
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No : the iLok key is optional since the Ivory 2.5 player. See https://synthogy.com/index.php/products/software-products/ivory-2-american-concert-d

If you still have the 2.0 player, go here to download it : https://synthogy.com/index.php/support/updates (click on the PC or the Mac depending of your configuration).

(Note : I prefer to see my licences on a dongle. I suppose I have more risk of having a PC out of order than a dongle... and iLok can exchange a dongle and recover their activations after readind its serial number).

Last edited by Frédéric L; 07/06/18 11:19 AM.

Yamaha CLP150, Bechstein Digital Grand, Garritan CFX, Ivory II pianos, Galaxy pianos, EWQL Pianos, Native-Instrument The Definitive Piano Collection, Soniccouture Hammersmith, Truekeys, Pianoteq
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: -Jay-] #2749771
07/06/18 01:06 PM
07/06/18 01:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Jay017
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc


Here's the little jam i did last night with my new settings: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/ivory-ii-american-concert-d


Nice improvisation smile

I've always wanted to purchase Ivory II American Concert D to compare it to the Galaxy Pianos i have. Is ivory still iLok only?

Thanks Jay. Yes as Frédéric L said, with the 2.5 update you don't need a key anymore, you ilok account will sync to the machine id now.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2749780
07/06/18 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I also think you should seriously consider Ivory II American Concert D. I'm so glad i didn't delete it from my SSD like i did with the rest of my piano libraries.

I re-visited it yesterday and played a little improv on it. I have to say that the dynamic range and response is bar none, eve
n surpassing the playbality of Garritan CFX.

Sound wise, i've always had a beef with it for being a little pale, "silver" sounding and muddy but yesterday i finally found a trick for that. Turned out all i had to do was lower the volume of the "Key noise" in the settings. Somehow it was introducing woody artifacts to the sound that took away from the clarity.

This piano in my opinion is the best recording-ready Steinway sound on the market. It just sounds like a clean recorded Steinway should sound. It's also nowhere near thin-sounding like the Garritan CFX. It's fuller in my opinion.

I knew there was a reason why i didn't delete it because there's something special about it and the key was to find the sweet spot in the settings.

Here's the little jam i did last night with my new settings: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/ivory-ii-american-concert-d


It was a joy to listen to, you are very talented smile
Did you use a real acoustic in the previous tracks? They sound a bit bigger than the Ivory.

Last edited by pold; 07/06/18 01:56 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: pold] #2749782
07/06/18 02:11 PM
07/06/18 02:11 PM
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tdwctdwc Offline
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Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I also think you should seriously consider Ivory II American Concert D. I'm so glad i didn't delete it from my SSD like i did with the rest of my piano libraries.

I re-visited it yesterday and played a little improv on it. I have to say that the dynamic range and response is bar none, eve
n surpassing the playbality of Garritan CFX.

Sound wise, i've always had a beef with it for being a little pale, "silver" sounding and muddy but yesterday i finally found a trick for that. Turned out all i had to do was lower the volume of the "Key noise" in the settings. Somehow it was introducing woody artifacts to the sound that took away from the clarity.

This piano in my opinion is the best recording-ready Steinway sound on the market. It just sounds like a clean recorded Steinway should sound. It's also nowhere near thin-sounding like the Garritan CFX. It's fuller in my opinion.

I knew there was a reason why i didn't delete it because there's something special about it and the key was to find the sweet spot in the settings.

Here's the little jam i did last night with my new settings: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/ivory-ii-american-concert-d


It was a joy to listen to, you are very talented smile
Did you use a real acoustic in the previous tracks? They sound a bit bigger than the Ivory.


Thank you very much pold. If you’re talking about the tracks featured in my page’s “Spotlight’, that’s the Ravenscroft 275 ( audience perspective).

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: pold] #2749786
07/06/18 02:21 PM
07/06/18 02:21 PM
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Alexander Borro Offline
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Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I also think you should seriously consider Ivory II American Concert D. I'm so glad i didn't delete it from my SSD like i did with the rest of my piano libraries.

I re-visited it yesterday and played a little improv on it. I have to say that the dynamic range and response is bar none, eve
n surpassing the playbality of Garritan CFX.

Sound wise, i've always had a beef with it for being a little pale, "silver" sounding and muddy but yesterday i finally found a trick for that. Turned out all i had to do was lower the volume of the "Key noise" in the settings. Somehow it was introducing woody artifacts to the sound that took away from the clarity.

This piano in my opinion is the best recording-ready Steinway sound on the market. It just sounds like a clean recorded Steinway should sound. It's also nowhere near thin-sounding like the Garritan CFX. It's fuller in my opinion.

I knew there was a reason why i didn't delete it because there's something special about it and the key was to find the sweet spot in the settings.

Here's the little jam i did last night with my new settings: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/ivory-ii-american-concert-d


It was a joy to listen to, you are very talented smile
Did you use a real acoustic in the previous tracks? They sound a bit bigger than the Ivory.


tdwctdwc, nice to hear another lover of Ivory American D, and nice playing, it is still amongst one of my favourites,but I don't nearly own as many VST as some here. I use it more than CFX lite, which get so much praise. For me, as an allround package it feels and plays well for me, but I am not at the level of tdwctdwc.

These days, ACD doesn't get much mention anymore, but I am still very happy with it. The build in controls for shimmer and reverb are good too, though I use Valhalla room, the simpler ones in Ivory do the job fine too at a more basic level. One of the down sides for some perhaps, you don't get different mic perspectives, just the one. The lack of pedal down samples may bother some, but in turn, because of the modeling engine Ivory uses for that, it gives a very natural feel to partial pedal inputs as well I find.

Last edited by Alexander Borro; 07/06/18 02:22 PM.

Selftaught since June 2014.
Books: Barratt classic piano course bk 1,2,3. Humphries Piano handbook, various...
Kawai CA78, Casio AP450 & software pianos.
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My struggles: https://soundcloud.com/alexander-borro
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: Alexander Borro] #2749787
07/06/18 02:33 PM
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Thank You Alexander. I agree with you. I think the Ivory engine is very well thought of and programmed. It's also very responsive to the slightest tweaks, you will be very surprised with the results.

For example: Choose a different soundboard (medium resonant per say) and turn down the sustain resonance knob a bit instead of leaving it at default. Big difference.

Or turn up the sympathetic resonance around 4 db, the piano comes alive.

I also love that they let you choose at which velocity the silent key starts.

Very well thought of engine.

I'll put it this way: If Ivory is good enough for Chick Corea then it's good enough for me!

(Starting to sound like an Ivory salesman now lol)

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2749834
07/06/18 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I also think you should seriously consider Ivory II American Concert D. I'm so glad i didn't delete it from my SSD like i did with the rest of my piano libraries.

I re-visited it yesterday and played a little improv on it. I have to say that the dynamic range and response is bar none, eve
n surpassing the playbality of Garritan CFX.

Sound wise, i've always had a beef with it for being a little pale, "silver" sounding and muddy but yesterday i finally found a trick for that. Turned out all i had to do was lower the volume of the "Key noise" in the settings. Somehow it was introducing woody artifacts to the sound that took away from the clarity.

This piano in my opinion is the best recording-ready Steinway sound on the market. It just sounds like a clean recorded Steinway should sound. It's also nowhere near thin-sounding like the Garritan CFX. It's fuller in my opinion.

I knew there was a reason why i didn't delete it because there's something special about it and the key was to find the sweet spot in the settings.

Here's the little jam i did last night with my new settings: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/ivory-ii-american-concert-d


It was a joy to listen to, you are very talented smile
Did you use a real acoustic in the previous tracks? They sound a bit bigger than the Ivory.


Thank you very much pold. If you’re talking about the tracks featured in my page’s “Spotlight’, that’s the Ravenscroft 275 ( audience perspective).


I was talking about tracks like "Tell me why" and "Forever", was it the Ravenscroft VST? It sounds huge, but maybe it's just the first impression only because the volume is louder than the Ivory.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: pold] #2749838
07/06/18 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I also think you should seriously consider Ivory II American Concert D. I'm so glad i didn't delete it from my SSD like i did with the rest of my piano libraries.

I re-visited it yesterday and played a little improv on it. I have to say that the dynamic range and response is bar none, eve
n surpassing the playbality of Garritan CFX.

Sound wise, i've always had a beef with it for being a little pale, "silver" sounding and muddy but yesterday i finally found a trick for that. Turned out all i had to do was lower the volume of the "Key noise" in the settings. Somehow it was introducing woody artifacts to the sound that took away from the clarity.

This piano in my opinion is the best recording-ready Steinway sound on the market. It just sounds like a clean recorded Steinway should sound. It's also nowhere near thin-sounding like the Garritan CFX. It's fuller in my opinion.

I knew there was a reason why i didn't delete it because there's something special about it and the key was to find the sweet spot in the settings.

Here's the little jam i did last night with my new settings: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/ivory-ii-american-concert-d


It was a joy to listen to, you are very talented smile
Did you use a real acoustic in the previous tracks? They sound a bit bigger than the Ivory.


Thank you very much pold. If you’re talking about the tracks featured in my page’s “Spotlight’, that’s the Ravenscroft 275 ( audience perspective).


I was talking about tracks like "Tell me why" and "Forever", was it the Ravenscroft VST? It sounds huge, but maybe it's just the first impression only because the volume is louder than the Ivory.

Yes that's the Ravenscroft. But those tracks were mastered while the Ivory jam i posted was completely raw, didn't even touch the volume (left it at 0 with no clipping).

You're not the first who compliment me on that Ravenscroft sound. I guess that mic combination works well (Player + Side mics + stereo image switched to Audience).

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749898
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Thanks everyone, i gonna try American D one more time.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749902
07/07/18 01:54 AM
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Fantastic playing tdwctdwc !
Now, if i can dial out that muddy midrange around middle c and few notes up...
If not, i'll buy that 'vintage' Vintage D.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749908
07/07/18 03:26 AM
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Originally Posted by lvercaut
Thanks everyone, i gonna try American D one more time.

If you already play that piano and you dont like it, hardly to expect more. I have also that piano, I was try to put it back on the table many times and nothing. No emotion about it and finally delete it for good. Overall it is good digital piano, working good but sound is so unrealistic, nothing like acoustic piano when you play it. Too digital and process. Maybe it will working for you for the second time.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749912
07/07/18 04:16 AM
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Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by lvercaut
Thanks everyone, i gonna try American D one more time.

If you already play that piano and you don't like it, hardly to expect more. I have also that piano, I was try to put it back on the table many times and nothing. No emotion about it and finally delete it for good. Overall it is good digital piano, working good but sound is so unrealistic, nothing like acoustic piano when you play it. Too digital and process. Maybe it will working for you for the second time.


The recording by tdwctdwc of Ivory II American Concert D sounds far from unrealistic and nothing like an acoustic piano. But then again I think the Garritan CFX library is very overrated on here, well sonically. The playability is incredible but I never can get it to sound that inspiring and it always sound thin/soft to me with no weight to the mids/bass (almost like it needs to be run through some analogue processing plugins). In fact I think Galaxy Vintage D which is around 5 GB and a single mic perspective has much more character and translates much better on headphones in comparison to CFX. So it just goes to show how subjective piano libraries are.

Last edited by Jay017; 07/07/18 04:19 AM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: -Jay-] #2749922
07/07/18 05:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Jay017
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by lvercaut
Thanks everyone, i gonna try American D one more time.

If you already play that piano and you don't like it, hardly to expect more. I have also that piano, I was try to put it back on the table many times and nothing. No emotion about it and finally delete it for good. Overall it is good digital piano, working good but sound is so unrealistic, nothing like acoustic piano when you play it. Too digital and process. Maybe it will working for you for the second time.


The recording by tdwctdwc of Ivory II American Concert D sounds far from unrealistic and nothing like an acoustic piano. But then again I think the Garritan CFX library is very overrated on here, well sonically. The playability is incredible but I never can get it to sound that inspiring and it always sound thin/soft to me with no weight to the mids/bass (almost like it needs to be run through some analogue processing plugins). In fact I think Galaxy Vintage D which is around 5 GB and a single mic perspective has much more character and translates much better on headphones in comparison to CFX. So it just goes to show how subjective piano libraries are.

Yeah, I was thinking that too when I first heard that piano, it sounds good from distance, thats why I bought it, till I start playing, empty sound nowhere near acoustic sound and resonance. No inspiring at all. I love Garritan for the same reason like you and also find a little boring and thin. VSL CFX is more realistic, but overall Garritan is excellent library. Nobody here mention new Embertone Steinway D, and this is by far the best sounding Steinway D library at the moment. There is a thread here about it to not repeat myself. I agree about how subjective pianos libraries are.

Last edited by slobajudge; 07/07/18 05:27 AM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: slobajudge] #2749932
07/07/18 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by slobajudge

Yeah, I was thinking that too when I first heard that piano, it sounds good from distance, thats why I bought it, till I start playing, empty sound nowhere near acoustic sound and resonance.

Hi Slobajudge, I have disagree with you on that. The playability and feel of the American D is the best for me. The way Synthogy scripted the velocity layers is in my opinion the best in the business. You'll hear no gaps between velocities. On paper they say 20 layers, you'll get 20 layers scripted to perfection.

Funny story: Yesterday i played a Yamaha C7x acoustic grand, fantastic instrument to play (but that's another subject). I came back home, turned on my controller and played the American D: Of course there's nothing that replaces an acoustic piano but i can tell you that i felt very thankful for the technology we have today because the experience of playing the American D made me forgive myself that i don't have 200,000 $ for that C7x.

I don't know if you still have the American D, but try this:

- Regarding the resonance: You're right, the "clean soundboard" sounds dead but that's exactly why they gave you other soundboard options to play with. Try the "medium resonant" option and turn down the knob to around -2 db and see the difference. The piano will come alive.

- Regarding the boxy dead sound: Try turning down the key noise to around -10.5 db. This will remove all the woody mud present in the sound.



Last edited by tdwctdwc; 07/07/18 06:15 AM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2749943
07/07/18 08:13 AM
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Just for fun since the OP was initially asking about the Kronos pianos, here's a comparison of the Kronos pianos:


- Kronos Bechstein: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/kronos-bechstein



- Kronos Steinway: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/kronos-steinway



- Kronos Dark Steinway: https://soundcloud.com/rabih-rihana/kronos-steinway-dark



P:S: The silences in the Bechstein file are because it's a demo version i'm trying. The silences will go away when you buy it!

Also both Steinway were recorded in the Audience perspective (flipped stereo image), i like the sound better that way. The Bechstein was not, it was left on Player perspective.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2749954
07/07/18 09:00 AM
07/07/18 09:00 AM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Also both Steinway were recorded in the Audience perspective (flipped stereo image), i like the sound better that way. The Bechstein was not, it was left on Player perspective.


Interesting, I was a little distracted while listening (sorry for that) when I noticed something odd and they I realized bass was comming from the right (I am listening with the notebook's speakers - just enjoying the song). Stereo effect very noticeable even with poor speakers. Listening throught headphones now.

Nice playing, BTW.


Kawai ES8, Roland RD2000, Yamaha AG06 mixer, Presonus Eris E5 monitors, Sennheiser HD598SR phones.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2749999
07/07/18 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc

I don't know if you still have the American D, but try this:

- Regarding the resonance: You're right, the "clean soundboard" sounds dead but that's exactly why they gave you other soundboard options to play with. Try the "medium resonant" option and turn down the knob to around -2 db and see the difference. The piano will come alive.

- Regarding the boxy dead sound: Try turning down the key noise to around -10.5 db. This will remove all the woody mud present in the sound.

Thanks for the tips, I was try with different settings unfortunately doesn`t work for me like working for you. Now after Emberton there is no way to bring Ivory back, I already try that for at least 15 times in the last couple of years smile

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2750046
07/07/18 03:27 PM
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What about the imperfect samples steinway, I like the demos, I don't own it,

http://www.imperfectsamples.com/website/samples/steinwayconcertgrand/steinwaygrandpiano.php

Anyone owns it care to comment ?

I am suspicious because IMHO all of kontakt pianos are flawed and unreliable triggering unwanted notes too loud and some odd behaviour under half pedal/repedal conditions from time to time that can be frustrating, pianos like grandeur, maverick etc, though otherwise I like them for tone.

I haven't bought a VST piano in ages and a new i7 8700 bundle is coming on Monday to complete my new setup with the CA78. To treat myself I feel tempted buying another VST finally ... for a change . VSL CFX is strong on my radar, but that is OT, this thread about Steinways.


Selftaught since June 2014.
Books: Barratt classic piano course bk 1,2,3. Humphries Piano handbook, various...
Kawai CA78, Casio AP450 & software pianos.
[Linked Image] 12x ABF recitals.
My struggles: https://soundcloud.com/alexander-borro
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: EVC2017] #2750047
07/07/18 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by EVC2017
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Also both Steinway were recorded in the Audience perspective (flipped stereo image), i like the sound better that way. The Bechstein was not, it was left on Player perspective.


Interesting, I was a little distracted while listening (sorry for that) when I noticed something odd and they I realized bass was comming from the right (I am listening with the notebook's speakers - just enjoying the song). Stereo effect very noticeable even with poor speakers. Listening throught headphones now.

Nice playing, BTW.

Yes I agree, the panning is extreme in the recordings, but sometimes some like it for artistic licence ... as it were. nothing wrong with that IMO, to each their own, though I wouldn't do it myself. If there is quite a pronounced stereo spread, I never really enjoy the audience perspective for some reason, I am so used to the player one, so it feels odd.


Selftaught since June 2014.
Books: Barratt classic piano course bk 1,2,3. Humphries Piano handbook, various...
Kawai CA78, Casio AP450 & software pianos.
[Linked Image] 12x ABF recitals.
My struggles: https://soundcloud.com/alexander-borro
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: Alexander Borro] #2750055
07/07/18 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Alexander Borro
Originally Posted by EVC2017
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Also both Steinway were recorded in the Audience perspective (flipped stereo image), i like the sound better that way. The Bechstein was not, it was left on Player perspective.


Interesting, I was a little distracted while listening (sorry for that) when I noticed something odd and they I realized bass was comming from the right (I am listening with the notebook's speakers - just enjoying the song). Stereo effect very noticeable even with poor speakers. Listening throught headphones now.

Nice playing, BTW.

Yes I agree, the panning is extreme in the recordings, but sometimes some like it for artistic licence ... as it were. nothing wrong with that IMO, to each their own, though I wouldn't do it myself. If there is quite a pronounced stereo spread, I never really enjoy the audience perspective for some reason, I am so used to the player one, so it feels odd.

LOL yes you're both right, my apologies. I didn't know it was that wide until i listened to the files now. Usually i pan the audience image to around 60% to 75 %. I made my entire previous solo piano album with the audience perspective and i plan to do the next the same way. When i record though, it's always "player".

@Alexander Borro: I wouldn't jump so fast on the Walnut Steinway. I played it before, it has a lot of depth and body but the mechanical noises can be too distracting and i don't think you can get rid of them from what i remember. Also, not sure if the developer is still maintaining support (i wait to stand corrected) because i read that he's been having health problems for the past couple years.

Last edited by tdwctdwc; 07/07/18 04:31 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2750069
07/07/18 05:56 PM
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Very interesting thread. Just some random comments from me.
American Concert D is probably among the most playable VSTs out there, even more playable than the Garritan CFX in my book. It has a couple of problems though: No real resoances (not too many people feel bothered by that), some weird issues with decay of the modeled resonances when repedaling, and very short decay when compared to the German D from Ivory II. The issues in the second point are that sometimes when I repedal, there is a notable volume drop of the notes or chords that I try to repedal. It seems to me like a lot of piano VSTs have problems with this, most notably Hans Zimmer Piano where it is really extreme to the point where it takes away all enjoyment out of it. In the ACD it isn't as extreme, but still distracting. The third point that I mentioned is that both the note length as well as the modelled resonances decay a lot faster than in the German D. I have to crank up Shimmer super high and use reverb and extra resonant soundboard settings, and it will still not be satisfactory. I don't understand what the problem is because in the German D, the notes and the resonances are acceptably long (not as long as in VSTs that have real pedal down samples, mind you). I have the same issue with the Italian Grand, by the way.

As for the Imperfect Samples Walnut Grand, does anyone have the full/extreme version? I have forgotten the exact name of it. The only way to get it is via physical hard drive shipping, but apparently it has up to 100 velocity layers? That must be really intense to play. But I would agree that, since it is a Kontakt piano, it will certainly have other flaws.

I have already stated my opinion about the Embertone Walker Steinway, I don't like it. Repedaling is advertised but doesn't work at all and is among the harshest I have ever seen in a piano VST, and it has some notes that stick out really badly, and some noise in at least one sample that I found after a few minutes of playing. Looks like a lot of other posters in here like it very much though.

Grandeur could be great but it has a bunch of problems as well. Weird plucking string noises that come out of nowhere if you try to repedal when you have release samples and resonances enabled. If you disable release samples, it won't give you the option to configure the time after which a note stops playing (which the Vintage D allowed you to do; apparently it's from the same developer), leading to a weird kind of sensation (every note sounds the same, hard to describe). Vintage D on the other hand is also really nicely playable but I found that sometimes it has similar noises and flaws, I managed to get the same kind of repedal plucking string noise a few times (but not as often as with the Grandeur), also the samples aren't clean at all. I can sometimes hear noises while playing, which happens as the notes decay. Really weird. At least it will let you configure the time after which the note decays if you disable release samples.

Is the Hammersmith a German or a New York Steinway? Looks like not too many people like it here. It has a bunch of issues, also some noise in the samples (there's one note where you can basically hear a sharp string sound if you hit it hard enough) and I also can't play it for too long without getting a headache for some weird reason. The bass is muddier than a five year old pudding lol

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: Grazilerimba] #2750115
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Originally Posted by Grazilerimba

Grandeur could be great but it has a bunch of problems as well. Weird plucking string noises that come out of nowhere if you try to repedal when you have release samples and resonances enabled.

One issue I found on the Grandeur was that the volume on the repedal groups was set too high.There are two groups, loud and soft. They are both the same samples; soft just plays a little further in to the sample and is quieter. Depending on the timing from when you first hit a key with the pedal down and then repedal, it will pick one or the other group giving noticeably louder repedals if it picks the loud group. To solve this I simply went it and adjusted the volume on the two groups and the issue went away. It only took a second to do using the full version of Kontakt. Not sure if you can make this edit in the player version.

I have the Walnut Pro as well, but it is an old piano with some note to note tuning and timbre variances, but very realistic sounding. I don't recall that it has repedalling. It also randomly introduces noises to give a more "authentic" feel. By the way, the top version has 100 layers across 4 mics, so 25 layers per mic. It's not a real playable vst, but has that vintage charm and I use it in certain situations. Grandeur is still one of my favorites along with Ravenscroft and my customized Tru Keys Italian. Looking forward to the full version of the PV Steinway hopefully coming out this month.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: slobajudge] #2750436
07/09/18 01:24 PM
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Originally Posted by bsntn99

One issue I found on the Grandeur was that the volume on the repedal groups was set too high.There are two groups, loud and soft. They are both the same samples; soft just plays a little further in to the sample and is quieter. Depending on the timing from when you first hit a key with the pedal down and then repedal, it will pick one or the other group giving noticeably louder repedals if it picks the loud group. To solve this I simply went it and adjusted the volume on the two groups and the issue went away. It only took a second to do using the full version of Kontakt. Not sure if you can make this edit in the player version.


This is a major problem with the Granduer to the extent it is completely unplayable. If this fixes it then that is amazing. Will try the fix when I’m in the studio later. Thanks.

Originally Posted by slobajudge

Nobody here mention new Embertone Steinway D, and this is by far the best sounding Steinway D library at the moment. There is a thread here about it to not repeat myself. I agree about how subjective pianos libraries are.


Whilst I would like a newer more deeply sampled Steinway D piano library to replace Vintage D and no doubt sonically Embertone achieves that...... too many talented musicians have left criticism regarding the playability of the library. So I’m waiting to see how much better Embertone can make it via updates first. Embertone string/orchestral libraries are amazing so I’m hopeful. By that time the full version of the Production Voices Steinway should be out also which will be interesting.

For now, I’m getting Keyscape.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: -Jay-] #2750446
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For now, I’m getting Keyscape.


[/quote]

If Spectrasonics would sample a German D, i'll buy it in advance, unlistened, unplayed...

Last edited by lvercaut; 07/09/18 02:13 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2750449
07/09/18 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by lvercaut



If Spectrasonics would sample a German D, i'll buy it in advance, unlistened, unplayed...

Eric Persing is a genius in my opinion. The amount of love and time they put to tailor the felts of that C7 really shows. If i had to deduct a point from it though is that the bass is not crystal clear ala CFX or even other C7 libraries i played, which makes it less versatile for complex classical passages that focus on the bass registers. Other than that, i'ts the most inspiring piano software i have.

Last edited by tdwctdwc; 07/09/18 02:22 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: bsntn99] #2750820
07/11/18 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by bsntn99
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba

Grandeur could be great but it has a bunch of problems as well. Weird plucking string noises that come out of nowhere if you try to repedal when you have release samples and resonances enabled.

One issue I found on the Grandeur was that the volume on the repedal groups was set too high.There are two groups, loud and soft. They are both the same samples; soft just plays a little further in to the sample and is quieter. Depending on the timing from when you first hit a key with the pedal down and then repedal, it will pick one or the other group giving noticeably louder repedals if it picks the loud group. To solve this I simply went it and adjusted the volume on the two groups and the issue went away. It only took a second to do using the full version of Kontakt. Not sure if you can make this edit in the player version.

I have the Walnut Pro as well, but it is an old piano with some note to note tuning and timbre variances, but very realistic sounding. I don't recall that it has repedalling. It also randomly introduces noises to give a more "authentic" feel. By the way, the top version has 100 layers across 4 mics, so 25 layers per mic. It's not a real playable vst, but has that vintage charm and I use it in certain situations. Grandeur is still one of my favorites along with Ravenscroft and my customized Tru Keys Italian. Looking forward to the full version of the PV Steinway hopefully coming out this month.


Hello, thank you for this. I don't understand what you mean - I'm not proficient with Kontakt. Don't even know how to access the advanced features, just use it as a software that I have to use in order to load a VST. I think what you describe is just the volume of the release samples as well as the volume of the resonance. Both have a knob in the interface. But even if I adjust that, then there's the problem of 'phantom' sounds happening if I use the pedal in certain circumstances. Try this: hit a chord loudly including deep bass octave, instantly push the pedal down (so it's basically a 'repedal'), then lift your fingers from the keys, and then repedal (quickly pedal up -> pedal down) without hitting any other keys. You'll hear a sound as if the bass notes were being plucked. The only way I found to remove this is to disable resonance or release samples. But that takes away from the sound of the piano. I really wish they would fix it, because other than that, the Grandeur is a great instrument.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2750834
07/11/18 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by lvercaut

For now, I’m getting Keyscape.




]

Just be aware, AFAIK Keyscape does not support half-pedalling.


Bert
[Linked Image] [Linked Image] [Linked Image]
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: newbert] #2750845
07/11/18 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Grazilerimba


Hello, thank you for this. I don't understand what you mean - I'm not proficient with Kontakt. Don't even know how to access the advanced features, just use it as a software that I have to use in order to load a VST.


I think you have to own the full version of Kontakt (not the player version) then you can load the instrument mode which reveals the advanced settings. Then you go to the group editor page were you can control and edit the actual groups and see what effects are applied to each.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: newbert] #2750847
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Originally Posted by newbert

Just be aware, AFAIK Keyscape does not support half-pedalling.


Many thanks for mentioning this in the thread, it’s useful for people to know. It’s actually not that important for me. Galaxy Vintage D isn’t really great for half-pedalling either and the new Embertone library also doesn’t have it (as far as I know). If i need half-pedalling for classical then I have CFX. The reason I want Keyscape is for the Rhodes and duo presets both for music production and for blues/jazz improvisations.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2750875
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Hopefully not getting too much off topic, but here is a photo what I was talking about. I had to scale the picture down. So, hopefully it's not too blurry. This only works in the full Kontakt.

[Linked Image]

1. This is the wrench icon where you shift into edit mode.
2. Select Expert to see the sample groups. Note the top 0-87 are the normal sustains. Note not all the sustain groups are visible here. The special groups are at the bottom.
3. Select the Group Editor.
4. Select the Repedal Loud group.
5. Adjust the volume of the group to taste. It is set too high initially. So is the Repdal Soft group, but not as bad.
6. The Group Solo button can be used to isolate a particular group so you only hear that group as you make adjustments.
7. This shows which groups are playing. Here I hit C2, G2, C3 and then repedaled quickly. You can't see the sustain samples played as they are too far up the list to fit on the screen.
Save the adjusted instrument patch with a unique name so as to not overwrite the original.

With the Grandeur, the repedal groups are set high. If you hear artifacts with the repedal off, then it may be the release or resonance samples that need adjusting. The normal front panel controls let you do this, but you can make adjustments here as well. Similar adjustments can be made to Vintage D as Uli programmed both libraries.

Repedals on the Grandeur and Vintage D are most noticeable on the lower third of the key range, barely in the middle, and pretty much non-existent on the upper third. This has to do with volume of the samples which are separate groups. For the Garritan CFX as an example, the repedal notes don't tail off in volume as much going up the keyboard as they used the more common technique of fast forwarding into the sustain sample which therefore matches the volume on the regular samples. IMO, this more closely replicates an acoustic piano. Hope this helps and sorry again if too off topic.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2751019
07/12/18 03:30 PM
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Bought Ivory Grand Pianos II (the original not the studio grands). Will update my thoughts once finished downloading.

Tried it first on https://www.bestservice.com/try-sound.html . Horrible latency, i had to run a midi file.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2751034
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Bought Ivory Grand Pianos II (the original not the studio grands). Will update my thoughts once finished downloading.

Tried it first on https://www.bestservice.com/try-sound.html . Horrible latency, i had to run a midi file.


I tried to use that try-sound recently and just failed miserably lol The latency is bad enough when you get it working but I couldn't even get the software to connect since they changed the program/process.

I look forward to reading your review. Was there a reason you went with the original over the newer studio grands?

Last edited by Jay017; 07/12/18 04:36 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2751137
07/13/18 01:55 AM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Bought Ivory Grand Pianos II (the original not the studio grands). Will update my thoughts once finished downloading.

Tried it first on https://www.bestservice.com/try-sound.html . Horrible latency, i had to run a midi file.


Great, i'm very interested in your opinion …
Thanks.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2751149
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Originally Posted by Jay017
Was there a reason you went with the original over the newer studio grands?

Mainly because of the sonic options, plus there's a C7 in there so you know i'm in lol. Also i liked the sound of the Bosendorfer 290 more than the 225 that comes with the studio grands smile



Originally Posted by lvercaut
Great, i'm very interested in your opinion …
Thanks.

thumb

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2751388
07/14/18 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Jay017
I look forward to reading your review. Was there a reason you went with the original over the newer studio grands?


Originally Posted by lvercaut
Great, i'm very interested in your opinion …
Thanks.

Sterile and pale sounding. And only 16 velocity layers made the experience even worse.

Kudos to Sweetwater for accepting to refund me because otherwise those pianos may sit there smirking at my SSD space and my wallet hence i won't be using them

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2751391
07/14/18 06:05 AM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by Jay017
I look forward to reading your review. Was there a reason you went with the original over the newer studio grands?


Originally Posted by lvercaut
Great, i'm very interested in your opinion …
Thanks.

Sterile and pale sounding. And only 16 velocity layers made the experience even worse.

Kudos to Sweetwater for accepting to refund me because otherwise those pianos may sit there smirking at my SSD space and my wallet hence i won't be using them

Good for you they accept to refund. Frankly I don`t even know why you go for sterile Ivory pianos, but it`s gone now.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: slobajudge] #2751393
07/14/18 06:16 AM
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Originally Posted by slobajudge
Frankly I don`t even know why you go for sterile Ivory pianos, but it`s gone now.

Because i recently started to explore the Bosendorfer sound and i'm looking for good samples. I subscribed EWQL Composer Cloud last week and been playing their Bosendorfer and i have to say it sounds/plays nice.

Last edited by tdwctdwc; 07/14/18 06:19 AM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2751398
07/14/18 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Frankly I don`t even know why you go for sterile Ivory pianos, but it`s gone now.

Because i recently started to explore the Bosendorfer sound and i'm looking for good samples. I subscribed EWQL Composer Cloud last week and been playing their Bosendorfer and i have to say it sounds/plays nice.

Look no further then VSL Vienna imperial. It is the best bosendorfer sample piano and have excellent playability. No half pedal though, and there are some complaints about out of tune notes. For me its not the problem but for some its more then can handle. It is expensive unfortunately. You can try it in try-sound site.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2751401
07/14/18 07:13 AM
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Ivory II Grand pianos, sterile and pale sounding, you say tdwctdwc. I'm not overly surprised, opinions seem to differ quite a bit on Synthogy's pianos, some like them, some loathe them.

It got me thinking, however.

Why are we seeking libraries around the 100GB mark, let alone hundreds of gigabytes in size, when they are only marginally better, and in some cases not any better, or even inferior to libraries few gigabytes, and up to 40GB in size?


My YouTube channel

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Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: lvercaut] #2751402
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https://soundcloud.com/productionvoices/sets/concert-grand

I think we'll see the release of the full concert grand lite,gold and platinum (Steinway D) of Production voices real soon now...........

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: TheodorN] #2751403
07/14/18 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by TheodorN
Ivory II Grand pianos, sterile and pale sounding, you say tdwctdwc. I'm not overly surprised, opinions seem to differ quite a bit on Synthogy's pianos, some like them, some loathe them.

It got me thinking, however.

Why are we seeking libraries around the 100GB mark, let alone hundreds of gigabytes in size, when they are only marginally better, and in some cases not any better, or even inferior to libraries few gigabytes, and up to 40GB in size?

Good point TheodorN. I can only speak on my behalf: When i look to try a new library it's because of one single goal in mind: Exploration of different color palettes and seeking inspiration, because after all, the sound of a piano will inspire me to compose. And we're fortunate enough nowdays to be able to explore real-life grand pianos on our computers (even though half of them have playbality issues).

I don't look at the size at all when i seek a piano library, the only thing i care about is the velocity layers and the timbre. In fact, the less the size the better!

Biggest example is the 5 GB Ravenscroft 275 which is still until this very day my absolute favorite piano library to play and get inspired from when playing at the same time.

Exploring other options is simply out of curiosity and like i said: Looking for more inspiration.

Speaking of Ravenscroft, listen to this till the end. Pure Magic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvlFr7DFr3o

Last edited by tdwctdwc; 07/14/18 07:36 AM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: pianistje] #2751404
07/14/18 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by pianistje
https://soundcloud.com/productionvoices/sets/concert-grand

I think we'll see the release of the full concert grand lite,gold and platinum (Steinway D) of Production voices real soon now...........


I'm impressed with these demos. Even though the first song is LE version, it looks pretty good.


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Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2751538
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc

Biggest example is the 5 GB Ravenscroft 275 which is still until this very day my absolute favorite piano library to play


In fact it is so good that I had to ask you if you recorded the tracks using a real acoustic piano! I don't have Ravenscroft, but on this forum is too underrated.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: pold] #2751542
07/14/18 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc

Biggest example is the 5 GB Ravenscroft 275 which is still until this very day my absolute favorite piano library to play


In fact it is so good that I had to ask you if you recorded the tracks using a real acoustic piano! I don't have Ravenscroft, but on this forum is too underrated.


Yes, all VIlabs pianos are very underrated here! I missed VIlabs - True keys Pianos bundle incredible deal on VSTBuzz for 90USD and regret it very much! frown


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Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: pold] #2751544
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Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc

Biggest example is the 5 GB Ravenscroft 275 which is still until this very day my absolute favorite piano library to play


In fact it is so good that I had to ask you if you recorded the tracks using a real acoustic piano! I don't have Ravenscroft, but on this forum is too underrated.
I was just playing it now:) This and my Kronos Steinway D got me covered on a desert island. But like i said, we're too spoiled and there's nothing wrong in seeking other flavors to trigger new inspirations.

If you ever decide to buy the Ravenscroft, i'll send you the same exact settings i used in those demos:)

Last edited by tdwctdwc; 07/14/18 06:42 PM.
Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: Max_Forte] #2751546
07/14/18 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Max_Forte
Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc

Biggest example is the 5 GB Ravenscroft 275 which is still until this very day my absolute favorite piano library to play


In fact it is so good that I had to ask you if you recorded the tracks using a real acoustic piano! I don't have Ravenscroft, but on this forum is too underrated.


Yes, all VIlabs pianos are very underrated here! I missed VIlabs - True keys Pianos bundle incredible deal on VSTBuzz for 90USD and regret it very much! frown
Yes i remember that deal, i jumped on it right away. I should revisit this bundle tomorrow and play it for a good hour.

Re: Looking for the very best German Steinway D software [Re: tdwctdwc] #2751547
07/14/18 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pold
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc

Biggest example is the 5 GB Ravenscroft 275 which is still until this very day my absolute favorite piano library to play


In fact it is so good that I had to ask you if you recorded the tracks using a real acoustic piano! I don't have Ravenscroft, but on this forum is too underrated.
I was just playing it now:) This and my Kronos Steinway D got me covered on a desert island. But like i said, we're too spoiled and there's nothing wrong in seeking other flavors to trigger new inspirations.

If you ever decide to buy the Ravenscroft, i'll send you the same exact settings i used in those demos:)



Thank you, I will trust your ears and have no doubts about your good taste smile

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