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Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: dewster] #2225845
02/04/14 04:08 PM
02/04/14 04:08 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 137
Long Island, NY
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Michael H Offline
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Originally Posted by dewster

And I wonder why I'm having trouble getting it up for the DPBSD project lately. It's this same old, same old grind of intentionally inferior products that never ends in this stupid market. Every NAMM is like a smack in the face. Beautiful CFX sample sets butchered down to <16MB (~1/1000 original size).


Amen. I had a P105 and after a few gigs I used it strictly as a controller. The sound drove me nuts, no life to it at all. All the manufacturers nickle and dime us to death it seems.

What I'd LIKE to see is a series of solid MIDI controller keyboards, preferably NOT made by Fatar, with space on top (or internally) to secure a computer, and enough controls to access important parameters easily. Different keyboards for different purposes, like 88 note and a 76 note fully weighted models, various size synth/organ semi-weighted models, standard MIDI plus USB to Host included, having more intelligent key ranges on the 76 note models (perhaps low C to C an octave below highest C). How useful does anyone really think a 73 note F-F keyboard is?

How many of us would move over to performing with computer software, like gigabytes-sized pianos and organs, if such controllers were available?

Is this going to happen anytime soon? yeah, RIGHT! But if some company were to manufacturer such controllers I expect many of us would buy them. I know I would.


2012 Solo Piano CD of original pieces, entitled 'Journeys'. You can listen to samples at:
https://www.cdbaby.com/cd/michaelhagglund/from/greatindiemusic
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Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: zerox61] #2225903
02/04/14 05:34 PM
02/04/14 05:34 PM
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toddy Offline
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Portugal
That sounds just like the Kawai VPC1 to me. Already on the market, taylored to this purpose with velocity curves for the best software pianos, designed in collaboration with those software companies. Top quality wooden keyboard, too.


Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / Native Instruments K9 ult / ESQL MOR2 Symph Orchestra & Choirs / Lucato & Parravicini , trumpets & saxes / Garritan CFX lite / Production Voices C7 & Steinway D compact

Focusrite Saffire 24 / W7, i7 4770, 16GB / MXL V67g / Yamaha HS7s / HD598
Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: zerox61] #2225910
02/04/14 05:38 PM
02/04/14 05:38 PM
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Portugal
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toddy Offline
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Or if you need a full MIDI controller, there are these.... surely they're not all FATAR?

Last edited by toddy; 02/04/14 05:38 PM.

Roland HP 302 / Samson Graphite 49 / Akai EWI

Reaper / Native Instruments K9 ult / ESQL MOR2 Symph Orchestra & Choirs / Lucato & Parravicini , trumpets & saxes / Garritan CFX lite / Production Voices C7 & Steinway D compact

Focusrite Saffire 24 / W7, i7 4770, 16GB / MXL V67g / Yamaha HS7s / HD598
Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: toddy] #2225928
02/04/14 06:05 PM
02/04/14 06:05 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 137
Long Island, NY
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Michael H Offline
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Originally Posted by toddy
That sounds just like the Kawai VPC1 to me. Already on the market, taylored to this purpose with velocity curves for the best software pianos, designed in collaboration with those software companies. Top quality wooden keyboard, too.


I'm sure the Kawai is very nice, but it's too big and heavy for performing live.


2012 Solo Piano CD of original pieces, entitled 'Journeys'. You can listen to samples at:
https://www.cdbaby.com/cd/michaelhagglund/from/greatindiemusic
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Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: toddy] #2225931
02/04/14 06:08 PM
02/04/14 06:08 PM
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,552
Melbourne, Australia
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ando Offline
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Originally Posted by toddy
Or if you need a full MIDI controller, there are these.... surely they're not all FATAR?


Apart from the big brands like Roland, Kawai etc, I think they probably are all Fatar... sad but true. Fatar is the action of choice for lazy companies.

Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: toddy] #2225944
02/04/14 06:31 PM
02/04/14 06:31 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 137
Long Island, NY
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Michael H Offline
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Originally Posted by toddy
Or if you need a full MIDI controller, there are these.... surely they're not all FATAR?


I was talking about a controller that has secure space for a computer, most likely on top. None of those keyboards have that and are good controllers as well. Unless I'm mistaken, there's nothing out there that covers ALL the bases I was talking about.


2012 Solo Piano CD of original pieces, entitled 'Journeys'. You can listen to samples at:
https://www.cdbaby.com/cd/michaelhagglund/from/greatindiemusic
Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: zerox61] #2245875
03/13/14 10:17 AM
03/13/14 10:17 AM
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 22
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Great pictures - we enjoyed seeing the inner-workings of the Yamaha P-105!

Thanks
http://www.digitalpianocompare.co.uk/yamaha-p-105-digital-piano-review

Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: zerox61] #2565880
08/25/16 06:06 AM
08/25/16 06:06 AM
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 3
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Muli Offline
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What a Fantastic informative post!
I got this problem on my Yamaha P105, and I was wondering if you had it too, that when I press 3 notes simultaneously I get a faulty extra note, which is entirely not conneted to what I pressed. It doesn't always happen, but at least 5 times in an hour of playing.
I went to a lab where they told me that the "Brain" of the piano needs to be replaced which will cost almost as a new piano!

I think that what they want to replace in the lab is the main card (The YD 880), please correct me if I'm wrong. Any idea where I can order it online, or whether it is a necessity?

Thanks a lot for your precious time,

Samuel

Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: dewster] #2565910
08/25/16 08:35 AM
08/25/16 08:35 AM
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 440
St Paul Minnesota USA
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Originally Posted by dewster
Originally Posted by gvfarns
Some day I'd like to have an actual digital piano designer/engineer answer these types of questions.

Same here. Though I wonder how many "actual digital piano designers/engineers" even exist anymore. The inmates (marketing types) are running the asylum.


I would guess, world wide, for all the manufacturers combined, there are less than 150 folks who actually design digital pianos. Electronics, keyboards, circuit boards, cases, sound samples, assembly. Then, coupled with a limited market, keeping internal costs low becomes a major factor in the design. Once a series exists (ex:CAx7), to completely redesign what works would never be a consideration. Incremental things, are accomplished, of course.

In reality, what an average person receives for even the under $1000 units is quite remarkable.

Here is a link to a young man that is constantly publishing new work on YouTube. On a lowly Yamaha DGX-650.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfWXf5EvbPUxrN7vFDspDQQ

I wonder if he wonders of fulcrum location, key weight or what chipset? He bought it to play, and imho, he does pretty well.


Jon ...

Kawai CA67
Sailor, Consultant, Gourmet, Dreamer
Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: zerox61] #2565919
08/25/16 09:04 AM
08/25/16 09:04 AM
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,046
Europe
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JoeT Offline
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Europe
So we are discussing a topic from 2014 again now? I might add my 2 cents, if nobody minds.


Kawai ES100 | Pianoteq 6 | Ivory II American Concert D | Steinberg UR22 | Sennheiser HD595
Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: dewster] #2725878
04/01/18 04:10 PM
04/01/18 04:10 PM
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 12
Oregon
Pallen Offline
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Pallen  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 12
Oregon
Quote
dewster For 16 bit stereo, 44.1k sample rate, this gives:
16MB / 2 bytes/sample / 2 stereo samples / 44100 samples/sec = 95 seconds of sample time. /88 = 1.08 seconds per note. To get any kind of realism out of it requires a stretching factor of at least 3x (and indeed there are 29 stretch groups on the P105 : 88/29=3.03).

. Due to affordability I am considering the YD P-115 which seems to have the same stretch issue as the P105 as referenced. The idea of the stretching does bother me, but is stretching for 3 notes that noticeable? Hey, if I could afford a Kawai ES110 I would just go for one. I have not found any ES110's used for any price and if I did, I know it would be for significantly more than than the $399 price that I can very regularly find a P-115 used for. Perhaps the fact that the P-45 and P-115 so often come up for sale as players move up the upgrade ladder is saying somthing about them (although many in that range would be piano students that just lose interest). Obviously players are hanging onto there ES110's though, and this is saying somthing about their quality. But should I really be worrying about the stretching issue so much? I know I sure notice my eMedia student KB sounds off and several along this thread have said stretching is noticeable and that gives me pause. I do find it interesting though that out of ALL the reviews for the P105 and P115 I have read NONE of them thought to mention note stretching comparisons with other DP's.

. I have read this through and thoroughly enjoyed its contents. I have also referenced back to it several times in my research of a DP. Thank you for all who have contributed to it.

Last edited by Pallen; 04/01/18 05:41 PM. Reason: clarity, and to get quote working

Using an eMeda 61 KB for dummies Yup, That's really what it's called. Can you blame for wanting to upgrade to an 88 key Digital Piano (ie. YDP115w). Yep, I've got the bug for digital sound and 88 keys. I am learning to play using PianoVideoLesson.com Year 1 Course, and am currently in Unit 3.
Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: McBuster] #2725898
04/01/18 05:48 PM
04/01/18 05:48 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 7,178
Northern England.
peterws Offline
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Joined: Jul 2012
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Northern England.
Originally Posted by McBuster

Here is a link to a young man that is constantly publishing new work on YouTube. On a lowly Yamaha DGX-650.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfWXf5EvbPUxrN7vFDspDQQ

I wonder if he wonders of fulcrum location, key weight or what chipset? He bought it to play, and imho, he does pretty well.



WHERE are all his videos? All there are here, are tutorials. I've listened to loads of his stuff, and excellent it is too. . . .


"I am not a man. I am a free number"

"[Linked Image]"
Re: Yamaha P105 teardown [Re: peterws] #2725922
04/01/18 09:09 PM
04/01/18 09:09 PM
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 155
USA
J
jarobi Online content
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Joined: Apr 2016
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USA
Originally Posted by peterws
Originally Posted by McBuster

Here is a link to a young man that is constantly publishing new work on YouTube. On a lowly Yamaha DGX-650.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfWXf5EvbPUxrN7vFDspDQQ

I wonder if he wonders of fulcrum location, key weight or what chipset? He bought it to play, and imho, he does pretty well.



WHERE are all his videos? All there are here, are tutorials. I've listened to loads of his stuff, and excellent it is too. . . .


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OmYxFWN5wU&list=PLqyczEJufNOUJ7xRd1EWSg2EuCpX1-O8F

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