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Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2705585 01/16/18 11:34 PM
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Thanks for the good wishes, Hector. I bet you'll knock 'em out this weekend!

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Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: MathGuy] #2706676 01/20/18 02:49 AM
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Originally Posted by MathGuy
Thanks for the good wishes, Hector. I bet you'll knock 'em out this weekend!

Go for gold, Hector!

I'm freaking out a bit about Sunday's recital. I can get through Requiebros at eighth note = 100 with no mistakes, from memory. But I know I'm going to get carried away and I tend to do that mostly at the end where it gets kind of hard. Also in the other hard bits. It's like this with all my new pieces. I really stress out beforehand. Oh well. Maybe I can score a beta-blocker from one of the other performers! yippie


SRF
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2706731 01/20/18 11:44 AM
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Thanks! I'm also freaking out about tomorrow, and it's not even a recital, just an amateur pianist group, only I haven't been there before, but I truly, truly do not enjoy public performance. I never liked it, but on my last piano camp, for some reason, my stage fright went through the roof and it's been an issue ever since then. It didn't help that later that year, my teacher signed me up to play at her college recital, a Mozart duet and a solo piece (memorized). It was postponed, so I forgot all about it, only to find out it was back on with just two weeks notice to prepare. The duet went well, but my solo piece fell apart halfway through, I had a total blank out and had no idea how to finish it. I'm not traumatized by it, nor am I upset at anybody or even at myself, but it's the first time I'll play for anybody since then. I see this as one more challenge to overcome. Never tried the beta blockers, will give them some thought but I'm concerned about interactions with other medications I'm on. In any case, this piece I'm planning for tomorrow is very familiar to me, and just in case I may play something easier instead. I'm also trying to do more video recordings, reviewing easy repertoire, just so I can get used to perform. So, Los Requiebros is on the back burner for now, I just play random, difficult fragments, hopefully this will marinade so I can tackle it later on.
I've seen you play in your videos at the Washington competition, you are very talented and I'm confident you'll do just fine. Hope you are feeling better, and best of luck for you tomorrow!
Hector

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: hbs60] #2710812 02/01/18 10:51 PM
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Originally Posted by hbs60
I'm also freaking out about tomorrow, . . . So, Los Requiebros is on the back burner for now, I just play random, difficult fragments, hopefully this will marinade so I can tackle it later on.

So how did it go in the end, Hector? Is Requiebros making its way back to the front of the stove?

My Requiebros had some gaffes, but I managed to convince some people in the audience whose opinions I respect that I can actually play it, so that's an accomplishment IMHO.

I got my Steinway back this week, so I decided to get another quick recording today. The piano hasn't been tuned since it was moved back and with new hammers there are a couple of voicing tweaks needed. As for the performance, well there's the usual stupid mistakes, but I'm trying to sing more with my own voice, to coin a metaphor; inject some personal touches that reflect my insights (which remain somewhat immature) while still remaining true to the text and not messing with the lines. In any event, this was the result:



At some point, when I can capture a rendering that is adequate, I should probably post it to member recordings, where it properly belongs.

Last edited by SiFi; 02/02/18 08:01 AM.

SRF
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2710932 02/02/18 11:19 AM
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Hi, SiFi! For me (for what it's worth), this is a marked improvement over your previous PW submission -- it's very clear to me that you now fully understand how you want the music to "move" from beginning to end, and as you're well aware, this is a BIG task indeed. All of that rich, fine detail can now be fully enjoyed as the piece progresses. I listened to this rendition on FB and provided an extended response regarding both Albeniz and Granados -- briefly put, this is now beginning to sound like a secure rendition of one of the more difficult Iberia pieces; i.e., a genuinely major accomplishment, in the same realm as a major Chopin or Liszt work. It's been great to follow the journey -- thanks for sharing this!

Last edited by Tim Adrianson; 02/02/18 11:19 AM.
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: Tim Adrianson] #2711091 02/03/18 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Tim Adrianson
Hi, SiFi! For me (for what it's worth), this is a marked improvement over your previous PW submission -- it's very clear to me that you now fully understand how you want the music to "move" from beginning to end, and as you're well aware, this is a BIG task indeed. All of that rich, fine detail can now be fully enjoyed as the piece progresses. I listened to this rendition on FB and provided an extended response regarding both Albeniz and Granados -- briefly put, this is now beginning to sound like a secure rendition of one of the more difficult Iberia pieces; i.e., a genuinely major accomplishment, in the same realm as a major Chopin or Liszt work. It's been great to follow the journey -- thanks for sharing this!

Tim, thank you so much. As a matter of fact, this is the piece that I want to use to as my method (for want of a better term) for getting to what bennevis would call the "professional" criterion: practicing until a mistake is impossible vs. until you can play without making a mistake. I hope to post a note-perfect rendition to member recordings in due course.


SRF
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711098 02/03/18 02:03 AM
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SiFi! Dude! That's a heck of good performance. Thank you so much for posting it! It's great to see you got your Steinway back too - must have been a happy reunion.

I enjoyed your performance not only because it's wonderful music-making, but because it's so much fun to see your solutions to all the same problems I've been working on. In many cases we've done pretty much the exact same thing, and in many others you've done something strikingly different, so it gives me a lot to think about.

I'm not sure, but it sounded like you may have reinstated the F natural in that one strange "almost B" chord. True? I've been leaning that way myself, since it does resolve to the F# a beat later.

You played those ascending double notes in m. 190 so cleanly! That's downright inspirational.

I also like how you handle the two big "sighs" in mm. 255-260 (you know, the part that requires three hands). It's so tricky to apportion everything in the left hand without slowing things down too much.

The coda sounds great - the excitement really builds towards the ending, but you don't let it get bombastic at all. Also a good lesson for me! By the way, I have a theory as to why Alicia played that unnotated Bb in the fifth measure from the end: it's to make the beginning and the end of the piece even more similar. With that one extra note, the first 5 and the last 5 measures are almost like a matching pair of bookends. (Or maybe she just played it because she thought it sounded cool that way.)

So yeah, awesome work, SiFi! I'm playing LR for a masterclass on Valentine's Day, and will be lucky to do it half as well. Meanwhile I'm practicing all the parts I find tricky (fun fact: if placed end to end, they comprise the entire piece) super-slow and hoping it all comes together!

Jim

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: MathGuy] #2711152 02/03/18 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by MathGuy
I'm not sure, but it sounded like you may have reinstated the F natural in that one strange "almost B" chord. True? I've been leaning that way myself, since it does resolve to the F# a beat later. . . .

You have keen ears! Yes, I have. And thanks to you for pointing it out in the first place. After a lot of thought, and some discussion with my teacher (who also had never noticed the F natural - F sharp thing), I figured it had to be thematic and intentional.

Originally Posted by MathGuy
. . . I'm playing LR for a masterclass on Valentine's Day, and will be lucky to do it half as well. Meanwhile I'm practicing all the parts I find tricky (fun fact: if placed end to end, they comprise the entire piece) super-slow and hoping it all comes together!

Good luck with the masterclass! thumb I'm also playing it in a masterclass with Santiago Rodriguez on March 8. Not feeling any pressure at all about that! ha

This has been quite a journey and it's still not over. So great to have you and Hector as fellow travelers! I truly believe we'll all reach our destination and be the better for it. smile


SRF
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711174 02/03/18 10:22 AM
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Hi, SiFi,

I'm listening to your latest video as I write this, I notice that your triplets are very nice and crisp, and I hear lots of nuances that you bring out very well. Overall, it feels very solid and secure, with little or no hesitancy. It does sound a bit too dry in places, not sure how much it has to do with the recording conditions.

As for me, Los Requiebros is not only pushed back on the back burner, but it's getting cold. You may recall that I was going to play Albeniz's El Albaicin, which is a very demanding piece, so I was able to pull it off by memory, which I was nervous about. I think it went better than I expected, but being that I suffer from stage fright, it was a very constricted performance. Then I was out of town and just got back, so I'm getting back into the swing of things. I have some unexpected performance opportunities coming up, people that want to hear me play, but because no way I can get Requiebros performance ready, I need to work on other, more accessible repertoire, thus pushing it even further on the background, but I'll work on at least a fragment at a time and see how that works out.

Overall, good job! You are not only so much ahead of me on this one, you have left me in the dust, but that's quite alright, I have plenty of time to work on this, and I'm deliberately taking a slow approach. I'm glad I have your recordings to serve me as a guide, as I am learning a lot from them.

Hector

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: hbs60] #2711323 02/04/18 01:35 AM
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Originally Posted by hbs60
You may recall that I was going to play Albeniz's El Albaicin, which is a very demanding piece, so I was able to pull it off by memory, which I was nervous about. I think it went better than I expected

Great. "Better than expected" usually means pretty good. My norm is worse than expected.

Do bring Requiebros back into your life when you're able. Well, look at me telling you what to practice! But I'm sure you know why I'm saying it. MathGuy, mp15, and I are all counting on you to see this project through to its successful conclusion.


SRF
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711338 02/04/18 02:36 AM
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Originally Posted by SiFi
....My norm is worse than expected...

No, you're thinking of some of the rest of us. grin

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711377 02/04/18 06:41 AM
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Thanks for the encouragement, as always, SiFi, you are so kind, I truly appreciate it.
My "expected" is a total disaster, so if I can get through the end of the piece, in my mind, that's better than expected. How good it is between the beginning and the end, however, is another matter. Seriously, though, although I wasn't happy with several things, I was pleased to see that I've been trying so many new practice strategies that they seem to be starting to pay off, like some wicked jumps I got almost right. My main problem seems my difficulty in relaxing when performing, it feels I'm trying to play in a straightjacket, my fingers, hands and arms get all stiff, which hampers a lot of my passagework.
As for Requiebros, have no fear, this is a long-term marathon, not a sprint, so even if it's in hibernation at the moment, it WILL reawaken. I've been struggling with Albaicin for 20 years and Requiebros is another long term commitment, but it competes with so many other interests, like several Iberia pieces, and El Pelele, of which I can only barely play a few measures. On top of all of that, I have another unexpected performance coming up. Several old high school classmates tracked me down and want to hear me play, so I'm trying to come up with a light program by April, I'll probably focus on PR and Cuban dances (Lecuona Afro-Cuban dances), a couple of tangos and whatever else I can fit in, so there's a lot of repertoire I need to revive, plus I'm polishing off a Mozart Sonata so I can play it on my newly found piano club at the end of this month. So much music, so little time, but it's kind of a nice problem to have...
Hector

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711455 02/04/18 01:39 PM
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¡Ay, Dios mío! Just getting all the notes, and memorizing them! ¡Ay, caramba! (Don't worry, Santiago will show you how to sing en español).


"I will hear in Heaven." Beethoven
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711493 02/04/18 04:15 PM
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"Ay Dios mio" is right, I have said aloud many, many other things in two languages, which I won't repeat here :-)

A little update: out of guilt, I tried playing it today. I have actually avoided it for about a month now, and I'm happy to report that it's (mostly) still in my fingers. Yes, I played it sloppily, some places I slowed down to a crawl, but at least I feel better that I won't have to re-learn the whole thing, so I can focus on polishing it. I think I'll try the "start at the end and work backwards" approach, since I play the first half much better than the second half.

SiFi, or Matt, where's that Fnatural "almost B" resolving to an F# you are talking about? Just curious. Which measure you're talking about? Thanks!

Hector

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: hbs60] #2711586 02/05/18 01:17 AM
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Originally Posted by hbs60
SiFi, or Matt, where's that Fnatural "almost B" resolving to an F# you are talking about? Just curious. Which measure you're talking about? Thanks!

I just counted and I think it's bar 91, a B major chord with an f natural instead of an f#.


SRF
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711615 02/05/18 06:57 AM
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Would it be THAT very awkward RH chord that also has a dissonant A sharp, marked "sans pedale"? If so, I never noticed that the f was natural, which is a bummer, because it's even harder for me to play that chord with the f natural, at least when I was playing it with an F# it was almost doable. My difficulty is in landing on this chord acurrately after the prior measure with the triplet on the last beat. BTW, on Alicia's score it's measure 93, just so I can be sure we are talking about the same place.
When trying to find the "almost b chord with f natural" chord, I thought I found another place, that would be on measure 131, marked "poco rall. e sub. a tempo", there is a triplet in thirds that on my Belwin Mills score has f natural but the bass on the first part of the beat, and the context suggests to me B major (or B7 because of the A on the left hand). In Alicia's edition, there is a sharp sign in parentheses in front of that f, and that seems to make more sense to me, I wonder if the same could be true on the earlier b chord and it's been overlooked, because B major (with f sharp) seems to make more sense to me, but I'm no expert on these harmonic issues...I just try to play an approximation of what's on the score, in the hopes that it's at least recognizable and acceptable. Then again, I'll look at that B chord and see if I can figure a way of landing correctly with an f natural.
Hector
PS-I re-started studying this, worked backwards from the end and focused on the last two pages. I think I'll be able to revive this a lot quicker than it took me to learn it.

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711717 02/05/18 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by hbs60
Would it be THAT very awkward RH chord that also has a dissonant A sharp, marked "sans pedale"? If so, I never noticed that the f was natural, which is a bummer, because it's even harder for me to play that chord with the f natural, at least when I was playing it with an F# it was almost doable. My difficulty is in landing on this chord acurrately after the prior measure with the triplet on the last beat. BTW, on Alicia's score it's measure 93, just so I can be sure we are talking about the same place.

That's the one, Hector. For what it's worth, I've been leaning towards arpeggiating that chord, partly to take the edge off the harmony and partly (read mostly) because it's easier that way. Also, measures 91 and 92 seem to me kind of like their own little episode, so it may be OK to pause ever so briefly before 93.

Originally Posted by hbs60
When trying to find the "almost b chord with f natural" chord, I thought I found another place, that would be on measure 131, marked "poco rall. e sub. a tempo", there is a triplet in thirds that on my Belwin Mills score has f natural but the bass on the first part of the beat, and the context suggests to me B major (or B7 because of the A on the left hand). In Alicia's edition, there is a sharp sign in parentheses in front of that f, and that seems to make more sense to me, I wonder if the same could be true on the earlier b chord and it's been overlooked, because B major (with f sharp) seems to make more sense to me, but I'm no expert on these harmonic issues...I just try to play an approximation of what's on the score, in the hopes that it's at least recognizable and acceptable. Then again, I'll look at that B chord and see if I can figure a way of landing correctly with an f natural.

Wow, good catch! I certainly never spotted the F natural in measure 131. But yeah, it sure sounds like it should be F#. Of course, the same could be said of the one in m. 93, but Alicia didn't amend or even comment on that one.

I'm glad you decided to revive LR, Hector. And SiFi, it'll be fascinating to hear what Santiago Rodriguez has to say next month; plenty of good things about your performance, I'm sure. As for me, the piece is royally falling apart, which is pretty much my m.o. in the lead-up to any sort of performance. Fingers crossed that the part where it comes together again at the last minute will also happen!

Jim

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: MathGuy] #2711951 02/06/18 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by MathGuy
For what it's worth, I've been leaning towards arpeggiating that chord [in bar 93], partly to take the edge off the harmony and partly (read mostly) because it's easier that way. Also, measures 91 and 92 seem to me kind of like their own little episode, so it may be OK to pause ever so briefly before 93.

I am now fully converted to the F natural camp, though I really think if that is the pitch he wanted he should have made it an E#. Also, Jim, I completely agree with you about bars 91 - 92 and the justification for some rubato/easing of the tempo right before our funny Bma7-with-an-F-natural chord. I'd even go further and suggest that the sans ped. indication is completely misplaced and belongs in bar 91. Everyone plays those two bars without pedal and everyone uses pedal in bar 93ff. The latter sounds stupid without pedal! Again, as with the F natural, no editorial comment from Alicia, despite the fact she plays it exactly as I just described.

Originally Posted by MathGuy
Originally Posted by hbs60
When trying to find the "almost b chord with f natural" chord, I thought I found another place, that would be on measure 131, marked "poco rall. e sub. a tempo", there is a triplet in thirds that on my Belwin Mills score has f natural but the bass on the first part of the beat, and the context suggests to me B major (or B7 because of the A on the left hand). In Alicia's edition, there is a sharp sign in parentheses in front of that f, and that seems to make more sense to me, I wonder if the same could be true on the earlier b chord and it's been overlooked, because B major (with f sharp) seems to make more sense to me, but I'm no expert on these harmonic issues...I just try to play an approximation of what's on the score, in the hopes that it's at least recognizable and acceptable. Then again, I'll look at that B chord and see if I can figure a way of landing correctly with an f natural.

Wow, good catch! I certainly never spotted the F natural in measure 131. But yeah, it sure sounds like it should be F#. Of course, the same could be said of the one in m. 93, but Alicia didn't amend or even comment on that one.

Yeah, great catch, Hector. The edition I learned from has the same. He must have meant F#. And what about the first LH note in bar 115, where Alicia adds a flat before the D, again with no editorial comment! No way can that really be D natural as it appears in my other edition.

So what perplexes me about all this sloppy editing (and I bet there's more of it that we just haven't noticed yet) is how it could have been mostly if not completely avoided if only the composer had used key signatures. I mean, this isn't all that chromatic, especially by the standards of music like Schoenberg's Verklarte Nacht and Ravel's Gaspard, so why create all that extra work and potential for error by painstakingly notating every single accidental? I don't get it. Was Enrique just trying to be a rebel?

Originally Posted by MathGuy
I'm glad you decided to revive LR, Hector. And SiFi, it'll be fascinating to hear what Santiago Rodriguez has to say next month; plenty of good things about your performance, I'm sure. As for me, the piece is royally falling apart, which is pretty much my m.o. in the lead-up to any sort of performance. Fingers crossed that the part where it comes together again at the last minute will also happen!

1. Me too, Hector. 2. I'll post a report after the master class. 3. I bet you'll be fine, Jim. When is the performance?


SRF
Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: SiFi] #2711967 02/06/18 12:58 PM
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Holy crackers! I never noticed the D natural that really should, must, no way it couldn't be anything other than D flat on bar 115! It's amazing how the brain fills in and makes subconscious corrections to what is clearly so wrong that we fail to even see it. I have no idea why he didn't use a key signature, but going through all that extra work, maybe OCD? Just speculating.
I never liked the "sans pedal" indication, it sounds so weird, but haven't thought about it being on the wrong place, will experiment with it and see what happens.
Hector

Re: Who Can Play Los Requiebros? [Re: hbs60] #2712037 02/06/18 03:35 PM
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There are little mistakes like that in a lot of music. Even Brahms, who was meticulous about his pieces, has one. Experienced musicians play them correctly, while inexperienced ones play them as written!


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