Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
Find a Professional
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Advertise on Piano World

What's Hot!!
Welcome PianoTV members!
---------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Fall 2017
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


Who's Online Now
79 registered members (Bach_ingMaddie, alphonsus, akc42, Adypiano, ando, AndyP, 21 invisible), 986 guests, and 1 spider.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#2704579 - 01/13/18 11:43 AM Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD  
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 45
Vadesriux Offline
Full Member
Vadesriux  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 45
Sometimes when you want too much something things seem go the wrong way.
After much waiting and antecipation the Kawai ES8 made its way to my house. While I was unwraping it I noticed that the plastic film that protected it were already quite crumpled with two separated and tape glued parts protecting the sides. Also the styrofoam that protected the ES8 sides was broken in several places. Okay.. I assumed that due to the piano weight and transport it could break.
But as I have already some experience shopping online I decided to try the keys without even turning it on..
As I was playing key by key soon found out that one of the black keys made a strange noise when depressed. Tried a few more times and again the same thing. Took a good look at the piano and it seemed to be perfect on the outside. No scratches or dents whatsoever.

As the piano is supposedly new I decided to not even call for technical assistance and like so returned it to the shop.
All in all I got the feeling that a demo unit or a B-stock ES8 had been send to me... I did not buy a B-stock ES8.

My Christmas Yamaha Montage 6 (2600 euros) also came with broken styrofoam pads and 2 keys with defect. Back to the shop...

Getting to the point:
These are quite expensive products and brands MUST: 1) Make all efforts to ONLY let these keyboards be packed after intensive Quality Control checking, if needed fining local manufacturers for each product lefting with QC defects - and no, I am not being too radical; 2) Changing the packing materials radically. Styrofoam is not even near the correct material to pack such expensive items that travel thousands of miles and suffer bumps and falls on the way. If we pay a LOT for these itens they must be packed propperly. So YES Yamaha and Kawai, spend MORE packing your high precision keyboards.

After all my eBay sold items always travel to the buyer with trully sturdy and thick protection materials inside the box. If I can do it so Yamaha or Kaway can do it too.
The Montage 6, when I opened the box, only had two styrofoam side protectors plus a thin plastic sheet covering the keyboard. The whole space left inside the box had NONE protection at all besides the card of the box itself!!! And we are talking about a 2600 euros precision instrument. Almost 3 months of a not-so-bad sallary...!

So no I am not being too radical...


Last edited by Vadesriux; 01/13/18 12:41 PM.
(ad) ROLAND

Click Here

#2704608 - 01/13/18 01:35 PM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: Vadesriux]  
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 140
Granyala Online content
Full Member
Granyala  Online Content
Full Member

Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 140
Celestis
Yeah, packaging often sucks. I had ordered Hard disks and almost got a heart attack when opening the box and seeing the nonexistent protection.


The backbone of modern industrial society is, and for the foreseeable future will be, the use of electrical Power.
#2704629 - 01/13/18 02:32 PM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: Vadesriux]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 478
SoundThumb Offline
Full Member
SoundThumb  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 478
San Diego, CA
Vadsriux,

Sounds like you ran into two instances of bad luck right in a row. Sorry to hear that. I've also received a keyboard that was clearly previously opened and then put back and sold to me as new. Very frustrating.

But I wanted to respond to your description of the way keyboards are packaged. Packaging a keyboard with styrofoam only at the ends and and nothing in the middle is exactly the right way to package it. Think about the package laying on a table with about half of it sticking out over the edge and more packages piled on top of the end that is on the table. Now suppose something gets dropped on the end that is sticking out, or something bumps into that end. Some of the bump is absorbed by the styrofoam and the rest of the energy goes into crushing or deforming the box. But as long as the bump is not so violent that the box is completely crushed and the keyboard hits the table edge, the keyboard is well protected. Now think about the same experiment, but this time with additional styrofoam in the middle of the box. Now when the end of the box gets bumped, none of the energy goes into crushing the box. All of the energy of the bump goes into bending the keyboard. This can seem counterintuitive until you think through the physics of what actually happens. The purpose of packaging is to protect what is inside the box without depending upon the strength of the thing being packaged.

By the way, hope you are having so much fun making music with your new keyboards that the frustration is already disappearing in the past. Happy New Year!


[Linked Image]
#2704636 - 01/13/18 03:14 PM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: Vadesriux]  
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,593
David Farley Offline
1000 Post Club Member
David Farley  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,593
Chicago, Illinois
The two times I've purchased keyboards new they were double-boxed by the seller. Meaning, their box, with the manufacturer's box cushioned within.

(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#2704642 - 01/13/18 03:43 PM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: Vadesriux]  
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 6,691
peterws Offline
6000 Post Club Member
peterws  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 6,691
Northern England.
My DGX was double boxed. A pain to unpack, but Yamaha deemed this lowly instrument worthy of it. . . . . makes you wonder how their minds work. I guess they sell so many DGXs that they don't want returns and are willing to make darned sure of it.


"I am not a man. I am a free number"

"[Linked Image]"
#2704647 - 01/13/18 04:15 PM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: Vadesriux]  
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 45
Vadesriux Offline
Full Member
Vadesriux  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 45
Hi SoundThumb and all the guys here.

Only to put this subject a bit more in context - which by the way is in my opinion responsible for a LOT of trouble us clients go through when purchasing a digital piano with its delicate inner mechanisms -, I will tell you about when I bought a Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S61 MIDI controller. 690 euros, so considerable less than an MP11 (2200 euros), a ES8 (1450 euros), a FP90 (1700 euros), or a CA98 (3200 euros).

The KK61, which is German made and only weights 7kg, came boxed with a different kind of styrofoam - a black one -, which is considerable less prone to shattering like the white styrofoam does. As a matter of fact in order to break it you have to put quite a lot of effort. Also, besides the top ends of the keyboard, the middle part had a thick "Belt" of this same material protecting the keyboard. And all this to protect a 600 euros keyboard...

So this is just an example of being perfectly possible to use better materials to protect quite expensive keyboards and prevent us clients of going through the nightmare of returning - waiting for a new one - receiving it - checking everything again - NOT well.. - returning once more - cicle.

I leave a request to KAWAI James to pass this message through to KAWAI headquarters so they can start using better quality materials when shipping their quite expensive and heavy instruments. I am certain that this will be a good thing for everyone.

Thank you.


Eduardo
#2704676 - 01/13/18 06:37 PM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: peterws]  
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,593
David Farley Offline
1000 Post Club Member
David Farley  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,593
Chicago, Illinois
Originally Posted by peterws
My DGX was double boxed. A pain to unpack, but Yamaha deemed this lowly instrument worthy of it. . . . . makes you wonder how their minds work. I guess they sell so many DGXs that they don't want returns and are willing to make darned sure of it.


Now that you've said this, I guess the outer box on mine was also Yamaha's. I just assumed it had been repacked before shipping.

#2705720 - 01/17/18 11:41 AM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: Vadesriux]  
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 140
Granyala Online content
Full Member
Granyala  Online Content
Full Member

Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 140
Celestis
So, I am now member of the club.

My MP7-SE had 3 black keys that were completely stuck and one white key that made weird scratching noises.
Packaging seemed fine from the outside, but one of the end styrofoam pieces was broken.
My guess: the packaging dudes put the instrument on the side, despite the inscription stating otherwise.

I really hope the second one is intact, as I would like to enjoy it for more than 10 Minutes before repackaging and returning.

frown


The backbone of modern industrial society is, and for the foreseeable future will be, the use of electrical Power.
#2705733 - 01/17/18 12:38 PM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: Vadesriux]  
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,753
MacMacMac Offline
5000 Post Club Member
MacMacMac  Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,753
North Carolina
I'm concluding that I'll never want a piano shipped to me by a courier service.
Instead:
  • Buy it at the piano store.
  • Inspect before purchase.
  • Expect delivery by the store's transportation group.
  • Inspect upon delivery to the home.
  • Reject if not perfect.

#2705736 - 01/17/18 12:43 PM Re: Manufacturers PACKING quite expensive gear... BAD [Re: Vadesriux]  
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 140
Granyala Online content
Full Member
Granyala  Online Content
Full Member

Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 140
Celestis
If the second one has another defect, that is what I will be doing.


The backbone of modern industrial society is, and for the foreseeable future will be, the use of electrical Power.

Moderated by  Piano World 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
CLEARANCE SPECIALS!
Save Big In our online store now

In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World)
our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, Digital Piano Dolly, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping* on Jansen Artist Piano Benches, Cocoweb Piano Lamps, Hidrau Hydraulic Piano Benches
(*free shipping within contiguous U.S. only)
(ad)
SummerKeys
Maine Coast Music Vacation for Adults
(ad)
Pearl River & Ritmuller
Pearl River Pianos
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq 6 Out now
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Interesting eBay / CL finds
by Colin Dunn. 01/22/18 05:40 AM
Amateur piano competition
by Kenny Cheng. 01/21/18 10:22 PM
What's happening with Keith Jarrett?
by Dfrankjazz. 01/21/18 09:22 PM
What are some sites that sell used piano in europe?
by James Guo. 01/21/18 08:21 PM
Body movement at the piano
by chasingrainbows. 01/21/18 06:46 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics183,906
Posts2,689,372
Members89,491
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Click Here to
Explore The Rest of Piano World!!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2018 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0