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Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691391
11/22/17 10:57 PM
11/22/17 10:57 PM
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 306
Maryland, USA
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Davdoc Offline
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Originally Posted by 7naturals
Correct , as I understood it that treble bell is to stabilize that part of the plate. Interesting to note, If you spray painted that bell black it would look exactly like the one on the Steinway B right next to it.. It also looked like they might be interchangeable.

...


The Steinway B next to this BP 211 appeared to be the newer (2016? and later) production NY B with wooden rim veneer. I have tried some of these but, again, I didn't crawl underneath to look at the treble bell. An internal presentation shared by my local Steinway dealer showed that treble bells out of NY factory's new production are bronzed instead of painted black.

My NY A (2013) has a bronzed bell, consistent with what Steinway's presentation said. My Hamburg B (rebuilt 1969) has a painted black one.

Last edited by Davdoc; 11/22/17 10:58 PM. Reason: typo

1969 Hamburg Steinway B, rebuilt by PianoCraft in 2017
2013 New York Steinway A
Kawai MP11

Previously: 2005 Yamaha GB1, 1992 Yamaha C5
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Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691392
11/22/17 11:03 PM
11/22/17 11:03 PM
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 450
Chicago
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Esteemed gentlemen,

This is a Baldwin thread. Take your Mason & Hamlin paternity dispute to a new thread.

This isn’t the Maury show

Peace and harmony . . .


Baldwin SF-10
Petrof III
Chickering Console (1950s)
Associate Member PTG (Chicago chapter)
Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: Duke of Dunning] #2691394
11/22/17 11:13 PM
11/22/17 11:13 PM
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 1,090
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huaidongxi Offline
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your grace, on this topic, have the post-Burgett era mason & hamlins retained the unique characteristics of the pre-1940 instruments, or, have they also gone the route of going after steinway characteristics and market share ? have zero experience with the newer generation of pianos, from any of the manufacturers, except for yamaha. peace for you and yours as well for the days to share thanks.

Last edited by huaidongxi; 11/22/17 11:15 PM.
Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: Davdoc] #2691404
11/23/17 12:14 AM
11/23/17 12:14 AM
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Posts: 27
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7naturals Offline OP
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Hello Davdoc,
The treble bell I saw on the Steinway was a black one. I will try to go back and get some more pictures hopefully soon of the 211 action, and the B with the black bell and put it in the gallery. I edited my post until then..
They have a lot of rebuilt Steinways there so maybe that would explain it.
Thank you for sharing

Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691447
11/23/17 07:38 AM
11/23/17 07:38 AM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 239
CT
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Gentlemen,

I am grateful to have owned and performed on many wonderful vintage and modern era Baldwin, Yamaha and Mason & Hamlin grand pianos over the years, as well as having performed on some memorable and not so memorable examples of the above makes as well as vintage and new NY and Hamburg Steinways, Fazioli, Bosendorfers, Bluthners, Bechsteins, Grotrians, Chickerings, Knabes, Schimmels, Estonia, and Shigeru/Kawai. I never had the privilege of playing a Steingraeber & Sohne, Forster or Petrof. In each case, the memorable ones had good bones, and had been worked on by some wonderfully skilled concert voicing technician or rebuilder. Despite much of the tiring and needless venting that often gets posted here, the biggest secrets to wonderful Golden Age instruments were good bones, attention to detail in quality assembly, material selection and prep (hammers, plate/capo bar, belly details & soundboard crown), and especially the amount of time spent on voicing and regulation at the factories in this era - often up to 2 years.

Many of our vaunted and favorite manufacturers have evolved their designs over time and continue to do so. Some of these changes are for the good: diaphragmatic soundboards, accelerated actions, carbon fiber / composite WNG or Millenium actions, cold-pressed Weickert or Wurzen felt hammers; some are debatable: carbon fiber vs white spruce vs Sitka spruce soundboards, vacuum cast or full perimeter / cast iron plates, inner & outer rims not immediately joined to install a tension resonator, etc. and others have just been bad decisions: Teflon bushings, hot-pressed, hard & heavy hammers for producibility/durability (harsh metallic sound), etc.

In my opinion, the loss of the wonderful Baldwin Artist scale designs- and especially the introduction of a totally new Parsons design that retains NONE of the characteristics of the great vintage Baldwin grands is the true loss here and cannot be compared to whether or not one agrees with the evolution of a given manufacturer’s character over time. Why couldn’t Gibson and Parsons just manufacture an updated SF-10 or SD-10 design? Thanks to Dr. Laul, Estonias are wonderful instruments now. Thanks to Yamaha’s purchase of Bosendorfer, the CFX and CX series are beautiful instruments now. And thanks to the Burgetts and Bruce Clark, we still have Mason & Hamlin with a truly world-class WNG action (thanks be to God NOT the pre-Burgett sluggish wooden action!) that despite what my dear friend Karl declares from every mountain top, is still built in the spirit of the Richard Gertz designs, and as one would expect of a world class manufacturer - key features of Golden Age belly and scale designs are still being researched, prototyped and evaluated. So William Truitt - you are so right in your description! I also know this, because I’ve had the privilege of ENJOYABLY discussing, playing and evaluating new Masons for the past few years now with Bruce Clark and their entire final voicing and quality team... Don’t we wish we could still do that with Baldwin via a Frank Emerson or Del Fandrich? We can at least do it via Cunningham Piano and Charles Walther! Instead we have a Baldwin stencil piano, no matter how great Gibson and Parsons make it.

Conversely, the new M&H instruments continue to improve and respect their history and DNA. I’m proud to own one and developed a close working relationship to their former Chief Voicer and current consultant Boaz Kirschenbaum. With each successive visit, my new BB with WNG action matures and produces so many wonderful new tonal shadings. I truly look forward to playing it each evening. Doesn’t that count for something? And so does my older Yamaha C3 with WNG and Abel Natural Hammers... more like a new C3x due to the work of a truly great tech and application of hammer felt material improvements that emulate the past. Just my (more than) two cents!

Have a blessed Thanksgiving one and all!


Jason Solomonides
Mason & Hamlin 7' BB 93623
Yamaha 6'1" C3 (w/WNG) D3010008
My Piano Recordings:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7aJcfJZZvg&list=PLkP65I5BsNirTcv-nAHm4BXXsCbB_EbAJ
Mason & Hamlin Artist
Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691450
11/23/17 07:55 AM
11/23/17 07:55 AM
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 621
New Hampshire
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The bell choice is a bit of an odd one, in that Parsons (or whomever in China built the piano) did not reproduce the so called Cupola plate construction of Steinway. My understanding is that the bell was put in place by Steinway way back when to compensate for the casting on the hitch pin plate side being too thin and "lossy" of energy. That begs the question, "If the plate is too thin there, why not modify it and make the casting thicker?" To make matters worse, the bell replaces what preceded it in the B, which was a very substantial beam that ran from the curved side to the belly rail. That beam also served to stiffen the belly rail, which has the structural disadvantage of being a cantilever and not being as massive as some other top grade pianos. To make matters worse still, the removal of the beam leaves the belly rail fully unsupported by a beam for a length of almost 3 feet. (I am disregarding that silly thin strip that Steinway runs from the top of the belly rail to the edge of the rim). I guess calling it The Bell makes up for all that bad design.

Due to Steinway's God-like status, other makers imitate this "feature". Of course, when one looks at the pictures of the plate casting of the BP-211, one sees that the casting is quite substantial in that same treble region, which obviates the need for the bell in the first place. So why not put the beam back in the BP-211 to adequately support the belly rail in the treble, and run a nosebolt up through the soundboard and secure it to the plate to further stiffen it?

When I rebuild Steinway grands, I paint the bell a very nice color of gold, because of the profound effect it has on the tone. :-)

One of the things I found notable in the later Baldwins (the ones that Harold Conklin designed, the SF-10 and the SD-10) was that the treble has greater sustain and volume than the Steinway, which makes the treble of the Baldwin more of an equal partner to the rest of the instrument. It also has a beam in that area of the piano.

It seems to me that marketing is now fully in charge of designing pianos. Sigh....


fine grand piano custom rebuilding, piano technician and tuner
Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691460
11/23/17 10:11 AM
11/23/17 10:11 AM
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I have wondered lately what it would take to have an "angel" buy Baldwin from Gibson and resurrect the old designs, possibly even with some improvements. Not exactly what the Burgetts have done with Mason & Hamlin, but along those lines. They could limit production but tout American designs and American production. Would there be a market for such a piano? I would think that would be more appealing than the Chinese-made Baldwins, as good as they might be for the price-point. I believe the Baldwin legacy deserves a chance at such a resurrection.

Last edited by violarules; 11/23/17 10:12 AM.
Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691484
11/23/17 12:24 PM
11/23/17 12:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 5,072
Seattle, WA USA
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Ed McMorrow, RPT Online content
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For me, what is sad about the contemporary piano industry is the death of the impulses for innovation that a careful student of piano scale history can see trying to come into existence in the USA during the twentieth century. The investigations started by Joseph Hoffman, (Great 20th century Pianist and Engineer by schooling), working with Steinway that led to the Accelerated Action have not been followed to their logical conclusion.

The proper understanding of proportion and architecture of a pianos scale, and even more importantly using a more sophisticated understanding of the tone regulation process to guide the design and manufacturing methods employed, would lead to pianos with more dynamic range and color that also were far more durable.

The more German scale style of wide and heavy pianos that has swept the industry in Japan, Korea, China and everywhere else is killing tone.

Will Truitt, the first Steinway A's had no treble beam or bell.

Last edited by Ed McMorrow, RPT; 11/23/17 12:26 PM. Reason: finish uncompleted sentence.

In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible.
According to NASA, 93% of the earth like planets possible in the known universe have yet to be formed.
Contact: Ed@LightHammerpiano.com
Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: Ed McMorrow, RPT] #2691496
11/23/17 01:02 PM
11/23/17 01:02 PM
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violarules Offline
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Originally Posted by Ed McMorrow, RPT
For me, what is sad about the contemporary piano industry is the death of the impulses for innovation that a careful student of piano scale history can see trying to come into existence in the USA during the twentieth century. The investigations started by Joseph Hoffman, (Great 20th century Pianist and Engineer by schooling), working with Steinway that led to the Accelerated Action have not been followed to their logical conclusion.

The proper understanding of proportion and architecture of a pianos scale, and even more importantly using a more sophisticated understanding of the tone regulation process to guide the design and manufacturing methods employed, would lead to pianos with more dynamic range and color that also were far more durable.

The more German scale style of wide and heavy pianos that has swept the industry in Japan, Korea, China and everywhere else is killing tone.

Will Truitt, the first Steinway A's had no treble beam or bell.


Ed, not to get too far off topic, but I wonder if the march toward brighter, louder pianos with less variation in tonal color and nuance can be attributed to multi-track recording that began in the middle of the 20th century. To "come forward" in a mix dense with other instruments, a piano has to be voiced brighter. Nuance is not desired in such a situation, sadly. However, solo piano artists should know and appreciate the magic a wide tonal palette can afford.

Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691501
11/23/17 01:11 PM
11/23/17 01:11 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 10,963
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Steve Cohen Offline
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I received out BP-211 about two months ago. It is a wonderful piano and sounds very "Baldwinesque" - a robust, full-bodiededed bass and lower-mid range with a treble that brightens as you play up the compass.

Parsons is doing a great job. Their grands come in well regulated and well voiced.

In our showroom it is next to a Yamaha C6 and a JP Pramberger 208. The Baldwin wins....hands down!


Piano Industry Consultant- http://www.linkedin.com/pub/steve-cohen/6/b92/b80

Consultant & Contributing Editor - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.
Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: Steve Cohen] #2691601
11/24/17 03:21 AM
11/24/17 03:21 AM
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Posts: 27
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7naturals Offline OP
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Hello Steve,
Thanks for posting . That is great you have one at your store. Maybe you can get some better pictures than I did and post it here. I was also going to go back and try to get some pictures of the action and a recording, but I may not be able to do that for a while. Hopefully you can if you have time.
Also, did you just get the one, or did you get two as well. The second one was sold before it was delivered at the dealer here, and the 6'3" went quick too.....

Last edited by 7naturals; 11/24/17 03:23 AM.
Re: New Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: violarules] #2691689
11/24/17 12:09 PM
11/24/17 12:09 PM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 5,072
Seattle, WA USA
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Ed McMorrow, RPT Online content
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Violarules,
The modern piano sound of heavy, dense felt hammers does not make instruments that sound clearer to the audience. Noise is not music. The composers in general want to convey emotional information that presents intelligibly to the human ear in aural analogues representative of the finest human voice. The human ear is capable of judging voice quality with great alacrity and sensitivity. We recognize known individual voices with great ease.

Multi track recording does make it easier to balance various musical voices in an ensemble, but a noisy, bright piano will still garble the clarity of voices in the ensemble.

Dynamic range is not sacrificed to color, clarity or definition; all these qualities can be developed concurrently if a piano is properly configured and tone regulated. Plus the action can be made more responsive, less tiring, and far more durable. It all starts with understanding how the hammer produces tone and the human controls it with the action.


In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible.
According to NASA, 93% of the earth like planets possible in the known universe have yet to be formed.
Contact: Ed@LightHammerpiano.com
Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691746
11/24/17 03:30 PM
11/24/17 03:30 PM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,433
Surrey, B.C.
Norbert Offline
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Quote
The modern piano sound of heavy, dense felt hammers does not make instruments that sound clearer to the audience. Noise is not music.


Ed, don't you think yours is a bit of jaded opinion to say the least? Which would mean that 99% of the performing artists today are not playing on musical instruments but noise makers.

No offense, but one has to admire your gall to even post something like that on this Forum. Hope you realize you're insulting the majority of owners here.

On other hand it's always nice to ready something that's truly laughable...

Norbert laugh

Last edited by Norbert; 11/24/17 03:36 PM.

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Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691778
11/24/17 06:03 PM
11/24/17 06:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 12,203
Georgia, USA
Rickster Offline
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Originally Posted by Norbert
Originally Posted by Ed McMorrow RPT
The modern piano sound of heavy, dense felt hammers does not make instruments that sound clearer to the audience. Noise is not music.

Ed, don't you think yours is a bit of jaded opinion to say the least? Which would mean that 99% of the performing artists today are not playing on musical instruments but noise makers.

No offense, but one has to admire your gall to even post something like that on this Forum. Hope you realize you're insulting the majority of owners here.

On other hand it's always nice to ready something that's truly laughable...

Norbert laugh

Norbert, the way I see it, Ed is just being Ed. He's passionate about his thoughts, ideas, and experiences he's had during a long career of rebuilding pianos the way he thinks they should be built. I don't see where Ed is insulting anyone about noise makers; if that is how he feels about it, then so be it.

In fact, not to be contrary, but I don't see where Ed is any more passionate about what he thinks or believes regarding all things pianos than you are about your thoughts ideas and experiences. Almost every post you have ever posted here on Piano World promoted the piano brands you sell in some form or fashion, whether blatant or subtle. So, who's the more passionate about what they believe here, you or Ed?

Back on topic, I see the Baldwin saga a bit like Charles Dickens "A Christmas Carol". The ghost of Baldwin past is the older Baldwin pianos that were designed and built by the old Baldwin USA (now deceased). The ghost of Baldwin present are the new Chinese built Baldwins that are pretty much akin to the old Baldwins in name only. Yea, they're likely nice pianos, but not the Baldwins of days gone by (ghosts of pianos past). The future of Baldwin (ghost of Baldwin future) will likely remain as it is now, with the new Chinese made Baldwins sharing little or no DNA with the older ones. The older Baldwins will still be around for decades to come, and many will likely be rebuilt, and some perhaps by Ed. smile

All the best,

Rick


Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel
Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691823
11/24/17 09:38 PM
11/24/17 09:38 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 27
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7naturals Offline OP
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OK .folks.. Back to topic..here are some specifications from the dealer to compare with between the new Chinese Baldwin, and the Steinway. I tried to post it side by side but the forums wouldn't take that. So it is listed [and hand typed ] length wise. The forum also would not let me put a space between the specification and the information. it all ran together . So try to decipher best you can .. Have fun.


Baldwin

Length 4' 10", 5' 0", 5' 5", 5' 10", 6' 3", 7' 0", 9' 0" (7 Sizes)
Scale Design Baldwin
Scale Type Duplex scale
Scale Tension Low-tension
Classification Full-featured
Construction 90% Handcrafted
Warranty 10 years

Cabinet
Case design Baldwin
Panel stock Quarter-sawn poplar corewood crossbanded and face veneer
Top Lid Maple veneer
Lid Material Maple veneer
Soft-close lid Yes, Hydraulic soft-close lid on 3 models

Music desk design Baldwin
Inner-rim material Mahogany
Castors Solid brass, polished and lacquered
Soft-close Fallboard Yes, Hydraulic
Leg style Straight leg, brass ferrule
Prop stick 2 position
Plate process Wet Cast
Plate drilling CNC milled
Plate color Sealed, bronzed, lacquered Gold
Hardware Solid brass, polished and lacquered or chrome or nickel plated

Interior
Soundboard material Alaskan Sitka (Solid quarter-sawn)
Soundboard material grade AAAA grade
Soundboard design Solid Spruce, tapered
Rib design Matched angle notched ribs
Bridge design Vertically laminated maple w/ maple cap
Bridge notching Hand-notched
Bridge pins Nickel
Bass strings, copper Baldwin design, all Roslau, hand-wrapped
Strings, steel Roslau, Germany

Rim
Rim construction Continuously bent inner and outer rim
Rim design Wide-tail design
Rim material (Outer) Hard-rock maple
Rim material (Inner) Hard-rock maple
Plate mounting 2 Dowels
Pin Block 17 ply Hard-rock maple
Tuning pins German, cut thread, nickel plated
Under-bracing material Maple
Underbracing design Glued, mortised, and doweled
Treble Bell Model 211

Keys
Key sticks Spruce keys, hardwood buttons
Keys, white White acrylic
Keys, sharps Solid ebony-wood sharps on all models
Key frame Spruce with hardwood inserts
Key frame glide buttons Hardwood (Maple)
Key bed material 21 ply laminated hardwood

Action
Action style Dual-spring repetition (Erard)
Action parts Maple action parts
Action rails Extruded aluminum
Hammers Abel hammerfelt, Germany, Renner hammers on the 7' '0
Hammer shanks Hornbeam, tapered
Hammer moldings Maple
Pedals Solid brass
Sostenuto pedal Full sustenuto
Action brackets 5 brackets
Seasoned for destination Yes


Steinway

Length 5' 1", 5' 7", 5' 10 3/4", 6' 2", 6' 11", 8' 11 3,4" (6 Sizes)
Scale Design Steinway
Scale Type Duplex scale
Scale Tension Low-tension
Classification Full-featured
Construction 90% Handcrafted
Warranty 5 years

Cabinet
Case design Steinway
Panel stock Quarter-sawn poplar corewood crossbanded and face veneer
Top Lid Maple veneer
Lid Material Maple veneer
Soft-close lid no
Music desk design Steinway
Iner-rim material Mahogany
Castors Solid brass, polished and lacquered
Soft-close Fallboard no
Leg style Flare leg, no brass ferrule
Prop stick 2 position
Plate process Wet Cast
Plate drilling CNC milled
Plate color Sealed, bronzed, lacquered Gold
Hardware Solid brass, polished and lacquered or chrome or nickel plated

Interior
Soundboard material Alaskan Sitka (Solid quarter-sawn)
Soundboard material grade AAAA grade
Soundboard design Solid Spruce, tapered
Rib design Matched angle notched ribs
Bridge design Vertically laminated maple w/ maple cap
Bridge notching Hand-notched
Bridge pins Nickel
Bass strings, Mapes copper bass strings, hand-wrapped
Strings, steel Mapes wire

Rim
Rim construction Continuously bent inner and outer rim
Rim design Wide-tail design
Rim material (Outer) Hard-rock maple
Rim material (Inner) Hard-rock maple
Plate mounting 2 Dowels
Pin Block 7 ply Maple
Under-bracing material Maple
Underbracing design Glued, mortised, and doweled
Treble Bell Model A, B, D


Keys
Key sticks Spruce keys, hardwood buttons
Keys, white White acrylic
Keys, sharps Wooden sharps, painted black
Key frame Spruce with hardwood inserts
Key frame glide buttons Hardwood (Maple)
Key bed material Quarter-sawn spruce planks

Action
Action style Dual-spring repetition (Erard)
Action parts Maple action parts
Action rails Cast brass, cast iron
Hammers Steinway made
Hammer shanks Maple
Hammer moldings Maple
Pedals Solid brass
Sostenuto pedal Full sustenuto
Action brackets 5 brackets
Shipping preparation
Seasoned for destination Yes

Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691825
11/24/17 10:08 PM
11/24/17 10:08 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,755
Georgia, USA
terminaldegree Offline
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Georgia, USA
Suddenly I feel like I'm reading an advertisement. Perhaps more than one...

Are you trying to suggest that a new Baldwin grand is equivalent to a new Steinway grand based on a spec sheet?


Pianist, teacher, apprentice technician, internet addict.
Piano Review Editor - Acoustic and Digital Piano Buyer
Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: Norbert] #2691832
11/25/17 12:07 AM
11/25/17 12:07 AM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 5,072
Seattle, WA USA
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Ed McMorrow, RPT Online content
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The difference with me and you Norbert is I actually can work on pianos and have done real research to discover how to solve problems that pianists tell me about. I am a professional. I represent my clients interests. The only thing you and I share is an interest in pianos.

You seem to resent my expertise, that is your problem, not mine!


In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible.
According to NASA, 93% of the earth like planets possible in the known universe have yet to be formed.
Contact: Ed@LightHammerpiano.com
Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691834
11/25/17 12:22 AM
11/25/17 12:22 AM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 27
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7naturals Offline OP
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Hello terminaldegree,
No, I am not suggesting or advertising anything. Just posted some pictures and information I found on a new piano that recently came out.
Maybe there is more on this model that you know of and would like to share..

Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: 7naturals] #2691839
11/25/17 01:15 AM
11/25/17 01:15 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,755
Georgia, USA
terminaldegree Offline
4000 Post Club Member
terminaldegree  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,755
Georgia, USA
Hi 7naturals,

I just find terms like "Full featured" and "90% handmade", and even "low tension" (is this applied to every model in the range, and what's the point of demarcation between "low tension" and "high tension", anyway?) to be basically useless information. That both piano brands have "hand notched bridges" is hardly a feature. I can point to many lower-cost pianos (and even some expensive rebuilds) that have iffy looking hand-notched and pinned bridges, and a few high-end ones that do a good job of it; there are times where mass-production/automated processes are perhaps a more reliable solution during certain aspects of piano building-- wouldn't you agree?

I do have an affinity for the Parsons-built grand pianos made in recent years as solid performers for new pianos at their price, and have had mostly good experiences playing the BP 190 at dealers and trade shows. I look forward to trying the BP 211 sometime.


Pianist, teacher, apprentice technician, internet addict.
Piano Review Editor - Acoustic and Digital Piano Buyer
Re: New Chinese made Baldwin 7 foot grand [Re: Norbert] #2691847
11/25/17 02:07 AM
11/25/17 02:07 AM
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,082
California, USA
M
musicpassion Offline
2000 Post Club Member
musicpassion  Offline
2000 Post Club Member
M

Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,082
California, USA
Originally Posted by Norbert
Ed, don't you think yours is a bit of jaded opinion to say the least? Which would mean that 99% of the performing artists today are not playing on musical instruments but noise makers.

No offense, but one has to admire your gall to even post something like that on this Forum. Hope you realize you're insulting the majority of owners here.

On other hand it's always nice to ready something that's truly laughable...

Norbert laugh
Norbert, I think a forum works best when we are repectful of another's opinion in their posts. You don't have to agree, but especially when a post is from an experienced and well established professional it makes you look rude and troll-like to call someone's post "laughable".

Putting away soapbox now, but still wishing for a kinder world...


Pianist and Piano Teacher
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