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Two Masters! #2682728
10/17/17 01:10 AM
10/17/17 01:10 AM
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Grand Junction CO
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DavidWB Offline OP
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Proms 2017 - Bach: The Well-Tempered Clavier, Book 1 [András Schiff]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNCuPAgG9eo&t=3469s

Piano tuner Ulrich Gerhartz tuning Andras Schiff’s Steinway Model D

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p05fhfwy

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2009/feb/23/ulrich-gerhartz-piano-tuning-brendel

Schiff is scheduled to play Book 2 of the WTC at the 2018 Proms.

Last edited by DavidWB; 10/17/17 09:54 AM.

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Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2682820
10/17/17 10:55 AM
10/17/17 10:55 AM
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I watched some of the tuning video, and thought how sad it is that he does not listen to all of the wonderful intervals that are involved in tuning a piano.


Semipro Tech
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2682824
10/17/17 11:15 AM
10/17/17 11:15 AM
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My impression was that the piano had already been well tuned utilizing all those "wonderful intervals", and this tuning was a refinement of the unisons with some confirmation of the previously set intervals.


David Bauguess
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2682831
10/17/17 11:31 AM
10/17/17 11:31 AM
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[quote=DavidWB]Proms 2017 - Bach: The Well-Tempered Clavier, Book 1 [András Schiff]
Piano tuner Ulrich Gerhartz tuning Andras Schiff’s Steinway Model D

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p05fhfwy
thanks David, it's very good video a work of a tuner about

Re: Two Masters! [Re: BDB] #2682846
10/17/17 12:30 PM
10/17/17 12:30 PM
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I listened to the recording of the Well Tempered Klavier that accompanied the video of Gerhartz's tuning video, and thought how wonderful the tuning was. I have heard Ulrich 's tuning and voicing on many classical piano recordings over the past 15 years or so. He is widely admired for his skills by a great many in our field. His position with Steinway is no accident, and reflects his success at working with the greatest and most demanding artists in the world.

BDB, your remarks say a lot about you and very little about him.


fine grand piano custom rebuilding, piano technician and tuner
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2682847
10/17/17 12:44 PM
10/17/17 12:44 PM
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Scotland
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I hope you all have a red hard hat in your kit smile

András playing was great. Thanks for the link.

Ian


I'm all keyed up
2016 Blüthner Model A
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2682943
10/17/17 06:05 PM
10/17/17 06:05 PM
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Lincoln, NE
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Now I know what I been a missin'. I need me one o' those nifty aprons he's wearin'... wink And that there red hard hat completes the ensemble. thumb


"That Tuning Guy"
Scott Kerns
Lincoln, NE
www.thattuningguy.com
Re: Two Masters! [Re: WilliamTruitt] #2682945
10/17/17 06:12 PM
10/17/17 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by WilliamTruitt
I listened to the recording of the Well Tempered Klavier that accompanied the video of Gerhartz's tuning video, and thought how wonderful the tuning was. I have heard Ulrich 's tuning and voicing on many classical piano recordings over the past 15 years or so. He is widely admired for his skills by a great many in our field. His position with Steinway is no accident, and reflects his success at working with the greatest and most demanding artists in the world.

BDB, your remarks say a lot about you and very little about him.


Yes, it does. It says why I enjoy tuning, and how much I would like to make everyone appreciate it.


Semipro Tech
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2682948
10/17/17 06:18 PM
10/17/17 06:18 PM
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Sorry, couldn't resist joking around a bit. Seriously though, thanks for sharing the link. How often do we get to see another piano tuner working?


"That Tuning Guy"
Scott Kerns
Lincoln, NE
www.thattuningguy.com
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2683933
10/21/17 07:16 PM
10/21/17 07:16 PM
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London
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I was at this concert! In the front row standing, extreme right - my favourite position. A great privilege to be present at this.

Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2683995
10/22/17 01:53 AM
10/22/17 01:53 AM
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Originally Posted by DavidWB
My impression was that the piano had already been well tuned utilizing all those "wonderful intervals", and this tuning was a refinement of the unisons with some confirmation of the previously set intervals.

[quote=DavidWB]

Yes, absolutely correct. That piano would have been tuned at least once in the preceding 20 hours. Probably in a different location, maybe backstage or even another town by a highly competent staff tuner. We can tell by the nature of the intervals that are checked that those that aren’t can safely be assumed. The 3-4 intervals that usually suffer almost imperceptibly over a few hours on that make and model are corrected and checked a little more thoroughly as we heard.

What else can we learn? No whining of overdrawn strings, (turning without flexing). no jabbing at or pounding of keys, everything done at the tuning pin. Patience, even though time is severely limited, listening long and deep into the notes, minimal tuning lever movement, lever under ultimate control at all times......feel free to add your own observations.

Time and efficiency are of the essence and we can all hear the supreme importance assigned to unisons, octaves and the nature of their sustain simply by the proportion of time spent on them. When 99 percent of your work is on one make and model and the top flight artists that choose to play it, levels of expertise are attained that are a complete mystery to others.

We join the clip of the maintenance process twenty minutes in, assuming the maintenance window to be an hour and everything running on schedule, so the whole tuning and the instrument in general would have been already checked.
The room was most likely used for an orchestra rehearsal that morning and will be used for another in the afternoon. Tuning windows are a precious commodity in a busy festival with 3-4-5 different concerts, rehearsals or lectures every day.

A huge bin of hi viz hard hats would have been supplied to the hall for the season and handed out when overhead lights and other TV equipment, etc are being set up. As for the apron, don’t you wear one when you have to alternately work and then maybe interact socially in a dressier situation? The pockets for small tools are handy. Should I suspect the professionalism and possibly finer skills of those who don’t understand this?, and their level of experience?
This piano will have a further hours’ service immediately before the concert. Ulrich would be available during the artists’ rehearsals and concert.

A valuable insight as to how things are done at the highest level by a consummate technician and perfect gentleman who doesn’t actively seek the spotlight. Thank you for posting.


Amanda Reckonwith
Concert & Recording tuner-tech, London, England.
"in theory, practice and theory are the same thing. In practice, they're not." - Lawrence P. 'Yogi' Berra.


Re: Two Masters! [Re: rXd] #2684043
10/22/17 09:21 AM
10/22/17 09:21 AM
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Posts: 159
Grand Junction CO
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Thank you for sharing these insights!


David Bauguess
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2684097
10/22/17 01:50 PM
10/22/17 01:50 PM
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Lincoln, NE
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Quote
As for the apron, don’t you wear one when you have to alternately work and then maybe interact socially in a dressier situation? The pockets for small tools are handy. Should I suspect the professionalism and possibly finer skills of those who don’t understand this?, and their level of experience?


If you want to...I get the impression that you wear the apron to protect the piano. If I were to wear one it would be to protect me from the filthy piano. Got a mouse out of one yesterday... wink

Yes, this is a whole other universe from what I do. Don't get me wrong, I tune some very nice pianos but not in those kind of situations. I don't need and can't handle the stress. When I started in this business all I had in mind to do was go into peoples homes and tune their spinet piano. I've found my niche mainly there and I'm okay with that. Along the way, as my skills and reputation have increased, I've been tuning for more serious venues, but not seeking them out. Been tuning a Sauter 275 at a church for a few years now and I'm not impressed. A really overpriced piano, but hey, I get paid to tune it once a month.

Professionalism...What an interesting word. What image does that bring up in your mind? Different things for all of us I suppose. My basic uniform is a black t-shirt and jeans. I try to tune the pianos as best I can, given what I have to work with, and be kind and honest with my customers. Am I unprofessional? Here in Lincoln, NE, people seem to be okay with that. Where this guy is tuning, probably not...As Popeye said, "I am what I am!".


"That Tuning Guy"
Scott Kerns
Lincoln, NE
www.thattuningguy.com
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2684113
10/22/17 03:04 PM
10/22/17 03:04 PM
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I feel I should apologize for my comments about Ulrich. It was very kind, not to mention, vulnerable of him to allow himself to be recorded. I have great respect for what he does.

I know, for my part, that I tend to make fun of things or people I don't understand or agree with and that's wrong. I don't like it in other people and I don't like it in myself.


"That Tuning Guy"
Scott Kerns
Lincoln, NE
www.thattuningguy.com
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2684358
10/23/17 10:32 AM
10/23/17 10:32 AM
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 128
Athens Greece
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Amazing. But whatever happened to Stefan Knüpfer (Mr. Pianomania)???


We meet upon the level, and..you don't fear someone whose story you know!
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2684482
10/23/17 05:39 PM
10/23/17 05:39 PM
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Europe
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Ulrich is using some kind of a jerking movement while tuning. Do you think that the pin moves a tiny bit or is it just changing the amount of tension to the NSL?

Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2684498
10/23/17 06:43 PM
10/23/17 06:43 PM
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Your n. 2, Tony.

With that "movement" the pin does not move at its foot, but the tension of the NSL changes, together with some inconvenient CW pin bending and torsion.

Last edited by alfredo capurso; 10/23/17 06:45 PM.

alfredo
Re: Two Masters! [Re: DavidWB] #2685263
10/27/17 12:32 AM
10/27/17 12:32 AM
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Thank you Amanda, for sharing out of your vast experience!

I got very encouraged watching this video - I follow the same approach in the concert grands I maintain. I keep them close all the time, and thus close to the concert I hardly, if ever (save brand new strings) twist the bottom of the pin.

I also like that he tunes the whole piano, even if a much smaller range is going to be utilized in the WTC I. Added stability, added resonance in the high end, and a safeguard should there be an encore where a more modern piece is performed.


Patrick Wingren, RPT
Wingren Pianistik
https://facebook.com/wingrenpianistik
Concert Tuner at Schauman Hall, Jakobstad, Finland
Musician, arranger, composer

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Dedicated to learning the craft of tuning. Getting better.
Re: Two Masters! [Re: pppat] #2685273
10/27/17 02:13 AM
10/27/17 02:13 AM
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Would you ever not tune the all of the piano? I would only consider it if I were desperately short of time.


Semipro Tech
Re: Two Masters! [Re: alfredo capurso] #2685481
10/27/17 08:09 PM
10/27/17 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by alfredo capurso
Your n. 2, Tony.

With that "movement" the pin does not move at its foot, but the tension of the NSL changes, together with some inconvenient CW pin bending and torsion.


Well, it depends how tight the tuning pins are. I can get pins to turn with hammer movements like that - but I can also just change the string.




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