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Originally Posted by Mooseknuckle
I find the commentary of Anderson and Roe, as well as their dynamic to be quite awkward.

It's apparent that Greg does most of the talking, and when Liz gets a rare chance to speak, it often feels contrived, and she quite often gets cut-off by Greg.

I really expected there to be much more synergy between the two of them. Yes I realize that they are not reporters/actors/speakers and that they are professional piano players, it's just that they don't seem to warm to each other.

Did anyone else notice that old lady backstage that grabs the competitors left arm and squeezes followed by a big pat on the back it each time a pianist is about to take the stage? I'm surprised that none of the pianists have shaken her off. With the amount of nerves they must be experiencing at that moment, I'm surprised they put up with all of that groping.


I did notice that Anderson finally stopped telling listeners Roe's name, and now she tells listeners her own name. She must have said something to him. He does talk way too much which is irritating, plus his arm gestures are so large they take over and are distracting. I don't find them awkward together, I just find him to be a larger and more assertive presence and probably clueless about how he comes across as larger and more assertive. It's hard to tell if she minds and is just being polite, or if she doesn't mind his over-assertiveness and just goes with the flow.

As for the Backstage Mom, you'll notice there's one pianist who doesn't "put up with all that groping." Favorin backstage is walking around and swinging his arms, which may be solely to dissipate nerves, to keep limber, but it also has the practical side effect of warding off any groping by anyone.

Clearly there are some pianists who don't mind being touched and prodded by Backstage Mom, but yeah, Backstage Mom has to give the pianists who want it their space.

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Originally Posted by Ralph
Originally Posted by Carey
Originally Posted by Ralph
Really, better than Semone Dinerstien?


Dinnerstein (who along with Yuja Wang, Valentina Lisitsa and Lang Lang) has somehow managed to have a viable career without ever participating (to the best of my knowledge) in any major piano competition.

Any thoughts on how these folks compare to this year's talent pool in the Cliburn ? smile



This begs an interesting question. Does one have to win a big competition to have a successful concert career or can it be done simple by word of mouth. I watched Lang Lang from the age of 14 at Curtis grow into the famous international concert pianist that he is today and I don't know how he did it. I literally sat 15 feet from him in Field Hall at Curtis almost every time he played for years. All of a sudden I'm paying $100 a ticket to see a guy play that I've been watching of years for free (well I did contribute to Curtis). I think when Gary Graffman is your teacher and he says book this guy, they book him. He took off like an ICBM and hasn't stopped yet. Having the Phiily orchestra on speed dial probably also helps.


Didn't Lang Lang have one of those serendipitous magical moments where he filled in for an ailing star and overnight became a sensation himself? Supposedly that's how Andre Watts' career started and a bunch of other famous names too.

As for Valentina Lisitsa I have never liked her, never warmed to her playing.

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There did appear to be one cute moment where Martin James Bartlett was pretending not to want to go onstage (if anyone has a natural stage presence, it's him) and Backstage Mom gave him a prolonged, large shove. In those moments I find the groping adorable. Obviously, you have to want to be groped. Uninvited groping = bad.

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Originally Posted by Eduard Hanslick
Didn't Lang Lang have one of those serendipitous magical moments where he filled in for an ailing star and overnight became a sensation himself? Supposedly that's how Andre Watts' career started and a bunch of other famous names too. .
Funny you should mention Andre Watts - as that's who Lang Lang substituted for back in 1999 grin


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Originally Posted by Ralph
Originally Posted by Carey
Originally Posted by Ralph
Really, better than Semone Dinerstien?
Dinnerstein (who along with Yuja Wang, Valentina Lisitsa and Lang Lang) has somehow managed to have a viable career without ever participating (to the best of my knowledge) in any major piano competition. Any thoughts on how these folks compare to this year's talent pool in the Cliburn ? smile
This begs an interesting question. Does one have to win a big competition to have a successful concert career or can it be done simple by word of mouth. I watched Lang Lang from the age of 14 at Curtis grow into the famous international concert pianist that he is today and I don't know how he did it. I literally sat 15 feet from him in Field Hall at Curtis almost every time he played for years. All of a sudden I'm paying $100 a ticket to see a guy play that I've been watching of years for free (well I did contribute to Curtis). I think when Gary Graffman is your teacher and he says book this guy, they book him. He took off like an ICBM and hasn't stopped yet. Having the Phiily orchestra on speed dial probably also helps.
Actually, both Yuja Wang and Lang Lang studied with Graffman - and he was quite influential in helping launch their careers. Dinnerstein and Lisitsa managed to gain recognition largely through creative self promotion.

Still wonder - how do Wang, Lang, Lisitsa and Dinnerstein compare to the best players in the current Cliburn competition - and does winning a big competition guarantee a successful concert career??


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Originally Posted by Carey
...and does winning a big competition guarantee a successful concert career??


Depends on what you think a successful concert career might be, I think. Does Kobrin have one, for example? I think some would say yes, and others would say no. How about Nakamatsu? Pedroni?

At any rate, the Cliburn is essentially a big splashy publicity event that functions as auditioning process for their concert management program - it's all about getting the winners into some sort of a concert career, if for no other reason than to keep the whole thing going. I don't think the other big competitions are organized in the same way, or with quite the same sort of primary motivation based on marketing potential after the competition is done.

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Originally Posted by wr
Originally Posted by Carey
...and does winning a big competition guarantee a successful concert career??


Depends on what you think a successful concert career might be, I think. Does Kobrin have one, for example? I think some would say yes, and others would say no. How about Nakamatsu? Pedroni?
All three have remained active as performers, however, from what I've read, Kobrin and Pedroni appear to have been more successful overall/high profile than Nakamatsu.
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At any rate, the Cliburn is essentially a big splashy publicity event that functions as auditioning process for their concert management program - it's all about getting the winners into some sort of a concert career, if for no other reason than to keep the whole thing going. I don't think the other big competitions are organized in the same way, or with quite the same sort of primary motivation based on marketing potential after the competition is done.
Interesting. smile


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Originally Posted by spins
Originally Posted by Brendan
Too much Schumann tonight, IMO. I respect both of their performances, but God, is this awful music.


Yes that sonata is not Schumann at his best, but let's be honest: It is much less awful than the layer upon layer of ugliness of the Hamelin Toccata.
Another piece I really don't like are the Rachmaninov Chopin variations. It does not surprise me that Hamelin thinks they need to be performed more (hopefully not too much Hamelin fanboys (do they still exist?) floating around hereabout).


I'm hardly a Hamelin fanboy. But, to be fair, not many pieces commissioned for competitions turn out to be the kind of good music that makes it very far in the world. And not only that, they usually are commissioned from professional composers for whom writing music is a career, not a sideline, as it seems to be for Hamelin. Out of the pieces the Cliburn has commissioned over the years, I can only think of one that I've seen turn up on a concert program - Corigliano's Fantasia on an Ostinato.

The Hamelin commission seems a lot like somebody's idea of a cool marketing gimmick to me. Regardless of what I might think of it as music (turgid and poorly organized), I think it did adequately do what competition commissions generally do, which is act like a kind of test piece that every competitor has to conquer/endure. But I imagine more than a few of the competitors have already permanently dropped it from their repertoires.

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2 young pianists come to mind who did not win a big name competition (Cliburn, Tchaikovsky, Rubenstein) would be Lisa d la Salle, a young French pianist, and Benjamin Grovsvenor, 24 year old British pianist. But they were noted child prodigies. And they both have established careers and recording contracts. Their playing reflects the maturity of seasoned concert performers and yes, to my ear they are far above the talent pool of competition performers. Igor Levit did take 2nd at the Rubenstein in 2005 and has gone onto a critically acclaimed career, superseding his fellow competitors.


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We're back tonight with Daniel Hsu and Dasol Kim. Both have lengthy Schubert selections (a sort-of-not-really suite and a sonata) - lets see how it compares to the last round of the quarterfinals with two lengthy Schumann works (a suite and a sonata). Other than that, it's Brahms-Handel, Mendelssohn Fantasy, and some Kapustin.

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...and also, I thought that Hamelin's piece was very clever and quite fun to listen to. It was by far the best and most pianistic commissioned piece they've had in a long time (maybe Liebermann's Three Impromptus comes close). There are plenty of pieces in my rep, new music and otherwise, that I've only played once and then let go (Petrushka is the first that comes to mind...NEVER again). I think people will be interested in playing this after the competition is done, it's far more approachable than his other piano works.

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So, are there any thoughts regarding best performance of the Hamelin? Worst performance?

Best is hard, but worst for me would probably be Grewe. Not to knock her, but it clearly wasn't a piece that was suited to her.

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Elizabeth looks beautiful tonight although she should have paired that outfit with deep red lipstick.

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Originally Posted by vers la flan
So, are there any thoughts regarding best performance of the Hamelin? Worst performance?

Best is hard, but worst for me would probably be Grewe. Not to knock her, but it clearly wasn't a piece that was suited to her.


Agreed. She just didn't make any sense of it at all. It came out as a jumble of notes.

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Hmm, seems like this is going to be a hyper romantic Schubert. Not really my thing, but let's see how it goes.

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Originally Posted by MikeN
Hmm, seems like this is going to be a hyper romantic Schubert. Not really my thing, but let's see how it goes.


Way too romantic.

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Originally Posted by Eduard Hanslick
Originally Posted by MikeN
Hmm, seems like this is going to be a hyper romantic Schubert. Not really my thing, but let's see how it goes.


Way too romantic.


Yea, I certainly question the wisdom of programming this set. Unless your a Radu Lupu or maybe a Zimmermann type of pianist, I really don't think it does any favors. *sigh* Well, this is only the first piece of the set. I'm hopeful.

Edit: It's not getting better. The romantic devices are disrupting the natural ebb and flow of the music. cry

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Not very successful so far - too syrupy and lacking crispness. Very "basic" conservatory conception.

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The rubato in #3 is driving me insane! It's even more distracting than what was going on in #2. Make it stop....groan....

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Wow. That was a good two seconds of lingering on the dominant before the recap. Too excessive, too melodramatic!

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