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 A mute point
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Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 450
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OP
Full Member
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 450 |
Yes, mute and not moot. As a piano tech "noob" I am just starting to assemble needed tools and think it is best to purchase on an as needed basis. I'm looking for advice on two items:
1) Mutes. Which ones and how many of each? 2) Tuning fork. I have an old one somewhere but think it is an aluminum fork, which is Is not desirable apparently. I plan to purchase the Verituner (I know the owner) eventually.
TIA for the advice
Baldwin SF-10 Petrof III Chickering Console (1950s) Associate Member PTG (Chicago chapter)
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 Re: A mute point
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 108
Full Member
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Full Member
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 108 |
Here is my list of frequently used mutes:
Split Mute built from 2 Schaff #200 mutes, glued together with a 1/4 inch offset. See PTJ April 2003 tip from Mitch Kiel. (I've started carrying 2 of these, one without a wire handle.) I bend an offset into the wire handle for muting behind treble dampers.
2 rubber mutes with wire Pianotek MR-1W (Longer wire than the Schaff equivalent)
2 3" x 3/4" rubber wedge mutes Schaff 203-1/2
2 4 1/4" x 1/2" rubber wedge mutes Pianotek MR-1M
4 Felt Wedges, 2 of each size from Pianotek MF-2M and MF-2L or Schaff equivalent
1 Paps Spring Mute Pianotek MP-1 or or Schaff 207
I have a wooden mute Pianotek MJ-2 that I have only ever used on a birdcage piano.
I will often double up wedge mutes to mute a string next to a strut. The glued-together assembly mentioned above is also useful for this.
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 Re: A mute point
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,764
1000 Post Club Member
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1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,764 |
Yes, mute and not moot. As a piano tech "noob" I am just starting to assemble needed tools and think it is best to purchase on an as needed basis. I'm looking for advice on two items:
1) Mutes. Which ones and how many of each? 2) Tuning fork. I have an old one somewhere but think it is an aluminum fork, which is Is not desirable apparently. I plan to purchase the Verituner (I know the owner) eventually.
TIA for the advice [Emphasis added] I don't know what the objections others have to aluminum forks. But, I'll relate my experience using them. I started out back in the 1979. I loved using aluminum forks. But, I found I had to keep replacing them all the time. I didn't have an electronic reference. So, I would keep 3 forks on hand all the time. Every so often, I would test all 3 against each other. If any of them would start beating against the other two, I would replace it. As I remember, I was buying a new fork about every 3 or 4 months. They are wonderful for their long sustain, though.
Joe Gumbosky Piano Tuning & Repair www.morethanpianos.com (semi-retired) "The object in life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." -Marcus Aurelius
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 Re: A mute point
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 29,102
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
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Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 29,102 |
Aluminum forks are loud and the tone lasts a long time, but they are much more susceptible to changes in temperature than steel forks.
I use two sets of mutes, one for uprights and another for grands. I use thinner and softer felt mutes for grands and thicker, more firm for uprights, because there is often not much room behind the strings on uprights, so I need firmer felt to stick between the strings.
I use two different sizes of rubber mutes, Schaff #200 (2-9/16 x 1/4) and #203-1/2 (3 x 3/8). For uprights, I have handles, which are available at the grocery store. They are used for trussing poultry for cooking. These are light-weight, so their weight does not pull the mutes out from the strings. I tie a ribbon to them so if they do fall out, the ribbon gets caught on something before the mute falls in the string. I use two #200 mutes for the treble where there are dampers, one above the strike point and one below. I use one #203-1/2 where there are no dampers, below a #200, and in the bass.
I use one or two #203-1/2 mute on grands. I attach them to lanyards that I picked up going to conferences, to keep them from falling into the action if they pop out. You want a lanyard with only the metal clip on it, not a swivel or anything else that can rattle. Usually one mute is enough, but you need a second for Steinway-scale concert grands, which includes Yamahas and Baldwins, where they are needed for G and G# below middle C, and sometimes for the bass trichords.
Semipro Tech
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 Re: A mute point
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,764
1000 Post Club Member
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1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2009
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Sometimes, you can get lucky by just using a free app.
I use a cheap $50 smart phone. Just out of curiosity, i installed a free app called Diapason. When I used it to generate A4, it was right on the money with my Verituner.
Sometimes, you get lucky.
Edit: There are also electronic tuning forks out there. You can find one at the SAT website. There are others available for purchase online.
Last edited by daniokeeper; 03/28/17 02:26 AM.
Joe Gumbosky Piano Tuning & Repair www.morethanpianos.com (semi-retired) "The object in life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." -Marcus Aurelius
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 Re: A mute point
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,087
3000 Post Club Member
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3000 Post Club Member
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I recommend: 4 rubber wedge mutes 1/2" wide 4 rubber wedge mutes 1/4" wide 4 handled rubber mutes 2 Papp's mutes 3 mute strips 36" long x 1/8" thick Re:forks Even steel forks change with temperature. I've tested mine and it changes about 1.25 cents every 10 degrees. Unless you live in a temperate climate, this could create problems. I like using the fork but I check it with iStroboSoft, especially in winter or summer where outdoor temperature can be so different. It creates an extra problem, so for beginners, I would recommend an electronic source. Here's a video where I demonstrate the effect of cold on a fork and how I get it to read zero cents. https://youtu.be/CIXU4Y-E18U
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 Re: A mute point
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,376
6000 Post Club Member
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6000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,376 |
Using Verituner, tuning unisons as I go, and checking unisons and intervals by ear while using the program, I use:
on grands-- two regular felt mutes one large felt mute to check unisons as I go in the treble one large felt mute for the bass, which I only use on copper wound bass strings, to try and keep them clean (my mentor is OCD about keeping bass strings clean) I also use a wooden hammer shank shaped like a pick at the end for tuning the last 7-8 notes of the high treble cleanly
on verticals-- two long rubber mutes one smaller rubber mute with a handle to check unisons as I go, and for the bass one Papp's mute
If you're going to set the temperament by ear, instead of with the assistance of an ETD, you will need a strip or more mutes.
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 Re: A mute point
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 574
500 Post Club Member
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500 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 574 |
I am forever leaving my rubber mutes in the tuning pin area in grand pianos (how I fail to see them when replacing the music desk, I don't know!). So you might need 4-6 or more even though you only need two at a time. I also find the skinny wire-handled rubber mutes for uprights get worn and hard after a couple of years, so I've replaced them a couple of times over the past few years. If you get a Papps mute (which you definitely need for the treble area in uprights), make sure it's made of nylon and not plastic. I got a plastic one that broke the first time I used it. I've been using a couple of nylon ones for years and they are great.
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 Re: A mute point
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 29,102
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
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Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 29,102 |
Another reason for the ribbons and lanyards! Rubber mutes are cheap, and cheaper by the dozen, so I buy them that way. If you cannot afford a dozen, you are undercapitalized.
Semipro Tech
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