2017 was our 20th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
Who's Online Now
63 members (AaronSF, AntonAnton, c++, anotherscott, 36251, Bill McKaig,RPT, 13 invisible), 520 guests, and 475 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Re: Chopin's Prophet: The Life of Pianist Vladimir de Pachmann
pianoloverus #2580836 10/22/16 08:41 AM
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,754
N
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
N
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,754

Re: Chopin's Prophet: The Life of Pianist Vladimir de Pachmann
pianoloverus #2580865 10/22/16 10:33 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 23,001
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 23,001
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
If he recorded it late in life the evaluation of his technique is probably true. But for much of his life he had major virtuoso technique according to almost every review and the opinion of other pianists. In fact, early in his career, he modelled his playing after Tausig.

For the first 2/3 of his career, most reviews by critics and very important pianists of the day were highly complementary. The book I mentioned in my OP has hundreds of highly positive reviews. They often said something to the effect that "one can overlook his antics because his playing is so terrific"....

A teacher in the music department at my college (years ago) -- not a professional pianist but an excellent one, who played very much in this old old style (well-known guy -- OK, let's give him a name: Donald Grout) -- had heard Pachmann in his somewhat earlier years, and said much the same. I asked him particularly about Pachmann's technique because of what I had heard in the recordings and what I'd seen written about them.

Re: Chopin's Prophet: The Life of Pianist Vladimir de Pachmann
pianoloverus #2580875 10/22/16 11:48 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 599
A
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
A
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 599
I think it's important to keep in mind that DP's eccentric style was really not so eccentric, within the framework of his time. If you hear other early pianists, they all exhibit that extra degree of expressive playing and don't follow the rigorous, politically correct approach which began to be applied after WWII

Liszt himself said

"There is in art a pernicious offense, of which most of us are guilty through carelessness and fickleness; I would like to call it the Pilate offense, the Classical Way of doing and playing things, which have become the fashion in recent years, and which ON THE WHOLE may be regarded as an improvement of our musical state of things, hide many a one this fault, without eradicating it, more could be said on this point but it would be going too far"

He also hated Conservatories with a vengeance and would become visibly furious when he heard 'conservatory playing', probably because of the above reason.

So what to many people appears to be technical lacking or crazyness was probably just a combination of the much looser standards in terms of being 'politically correct', as I mentioned, and also the de facto effect that recording music has on the interpretation.. many fine details of the moods and meaning of the music are lost on all but the best music reproducers (recording equipment and stereos)

Last edited by acortot; 10/22/16 11:48 AM.

Max di Mario
Re: Chopin's Prophet: The Life of Pianist Vladimir de Pachmann
Mark_C #2580945 10/22/16 06:50 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 9,392
A
9000 Post Club Member
Offline
9000 Post Club Member
A
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 9,392
Originally Posted by Mark_C

A teacher in the music department at my college [...] well-known guy -- OK, let's give him a name: Donald Grout -- had heard Pachmann in his somewhat earlier years, and said much the same. I asked him particularly about Pachmann's technique because of what I had heard in the recordings and what I'd seen written about them.

WOW Mark, you knew Donald Grout! His 'History of Western Music' was -of course- a standard text book in the US, though even in my studies in the UK, we often consulted it for reference.


Jason
Re: Chopin's Prophet: The Life of Pianist Vladimir de Pachmann
argerichfan #2580951 10/22/16 08:10 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,279
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 10,279
Originally Posted by argerichfan
Originally Posted by Mark_C

A teacher in the music department at my college [...] well-known guy -- OK, let's give him a name: Donald Grout -- had heard Pachmann in his somewhat earlier years, and said much the same. I asked him particularly about Pachmann's technique because of what I had heard in the recordings and what I'd seen written about them.

WOW Mark, you knew Donald Grout! His 'History of Western Music' was -of course- a standard text book in the US, though even in my studies in the UK, we often consulted it for reference.
I read the entire book as an undergrad music history major and still refer to my highlighted copy from time to time. Certainly must have been interesting to have known Dr. Grout (but perhaps not quite as interesting as knowing Vladimir de Pachmann !!). grin


Mason and Hamlin BB - 91640
Kawai K-500 Upright
Kawai CA-65 Digital
YouTube channel - http://www.youtube.com/user/pianophilo
Re: Chopin's Prophet: The Life of Pianist Vladimir de Pachmann
argerichfan #2581125 10/23/16 05:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 124
E
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
E
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 124
I remember hearing the Brahms on the radio in Boston, a couple times, years ago. I just went looking for the recording online and couldn't find it, though I did find a reference to his performing it in 1900.





Page 2 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Brendan, Kreisler 

Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
What's Hot!!
News from the Piano World
Our October 2020 Free Piano Newsletter is Here!
---------------------
3,000,000+!
------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
New Topics - Multiple Forums
New DP under 3000 euros
by Pullman12 - 11/24/20 03:21 PM
Recording device - Recommendations
by Kinimod - 11/24/20 02:52 PM
Your opinions on my digital mixer setup
by Abdol - 11/24/20 02:37 PM
Thumb under for bluesy tunes
by AntonAnton - 11/24/20 12:45 PM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Forum Statistics
Forums41
Topics203,022
Posts3,026,755
Members99,360
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers


Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2020 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.4