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Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget #2571424
09/15/16 12:26 AM
09/15/16 12:26 AM
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TLR0789 Offline OP
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Hi All,

First time poster here and was wondering about everyone's thoughts and opinions on the Casio AP 650? My budgets roughly $2,000 AUD and this fits just under that but I was also looking at several different models such as:

* Yamaha YDP 143 & 163
* Roland RP-401R

It seems like the Casio AP 650 has a lot of features that I'm not really to fussed on missing out on (functions, features, different sounds etc.). Having played on an acoustic piano all my life, I'm more after the feel and sound of the piano.

It's been a couple of years since I've played and it's something I want to get back into.

I know opinions can vary and it's all personal preference but I'd just like to get peoples thoughts and recommendations before biting the bullet!

Thanks all! smile

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Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571430
09/15/16 01:35 AM
09/15/16 01:35 AM
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Melville Saskatchewan
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FrankCox Offline
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I've got a Casio AP-650 last November and I like it rather a lot.

I rarely use any of the sounds and settings other than the default "Concert Grand", though some of the others are occasionally fun to fiddle around with as a late-night novelty sort of a thing. I did a split-keyboard with steel drums and an e-piano sound for the Little Drummer Boy a little while back and it was pretty cool, for example. The background accompaniments and such I never use at all; I do use the metronome occasionally.

I don't have a lot to compare it to, really, but I'm really happy with my AP-650.


If you're a zombie and you know it, bite your friend!
Currently playing both kinds of music: Country and Western!
Casio Celviano AP-650
Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571432
09/15/16 01:41 AM
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TLR0789 Offline OP
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Hi Frank,

Thanks for the reply!

I haven't gone in and played any of the models. Thought I'd do my research first to get my list down to a manageable size.

I'll be spending all weekend driving around and testing the model's I've mentioned and any others that do get mentioned later on.

I really don't want to be forking out more $$$ just for additional features that I probably won't use.

A random question regarding these digital piano's, I'm assuming they're all boxed up in a flat pack type thing that'll fit in the car? laugh lol

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571441
09/15/16 02:33 AM
09/15/16 02:33 AM
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Charles Cohen Offline
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Originally Posted by TLR0789
Hi All,

First time poster here and was wondering about everyone's thoughts and opinions on the Casio AP 650? My budgets roughly $2,000 AUD and this fits just under that but I was also looking at several different models such as:

* Yamaha YDP 143 & 163
* Roland RP-401R
. . .


FWIW (and not wanting to bias your search too much) --

The actions of the YDP 143 (GHS) and YDP 163 (GH3) are significantly different. I haven't played the GH3, but I've played the GH action on which it's based. [The GH action has two sensors, the GH3 has three sensors, like the Casio AP-650).

IMHO, the GH3 action is likely to feel closer to an acoustic piano, than the GHS action. I'm pretty sure that the GH is closer to an acoustic, than is the GHS, and I doubt that Yamaha messed it up when they added a third sensor.

If there are any acoustic pianos in the showroom, try going back and forth, between them and the DP's, to keep your finger-memory of what the DP's are trying to feel like.

The AP-650 has 60 watts, and two 6" woofers, which should sound pretty good. I imagine the others are competitive.

If you're going to practice with headphones, bring a pair along. DP's can sound quite different, through headphones and speakers.

Have fun, please report back --




. Charles
---------------------------
PX-350 / microKorg XL+ / Pianoteq / Lounge Lizard / Korg Wavedrum / EV ZXA1 speaker
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Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571444
09/15/16 02:51 AM
09/15/16 02:51 AM
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TLR0789 Offline OP
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Hi Charles,

Appreciate the feedback.

Yep, I'm already planning to bring my head phones with me.

If the YDP 163 and AP 650 feel similar especially with the three sensors, I might just save the extra $$$ and go for the YDP but then again, anything can happen as soon as I walk in and test.

I've found a show room pretty close to me with the models I'm after in stock and on display so I'm pretty keen for the weekend to come around!

I'll definitely report back

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571459
09/15/16 04:17 AM
09/15/16 04:17 AM
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FrankCox Offline
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My AP-650 came in one big cardboard box that contains the piano, the stand and pedals, and the stool. The actual piano part comes fully assembled, but you have to put some flat boards together to make the stand, then attach the pedals to the bottom and screw the legs onto the stool.

It took me about an hour to assemble the stand and the pedals, and a friend of mine helped me to lift the piano onto the stand after that. I don't think I could have done that final lift-and-assemble part by myself; too heavy and awkward to hold it and slip it into the notch that it goes into.

The box was delivered to me on a truck. I don't think you could fit it into a car.

You can download the user manual as a pdf.


If you're a zombie and you know it, bite your friend!
Currently playing both kinds of music: Country and Western!
Casio Celviano AP-650
Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571505
09/15/16 09:13 AM
09/15/16 09:13 AM
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Morodiene Offline
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Yamaha's GH action is decent for a two-sensor, so with 3 that really gives it a step up to help with trills and fast repeated notes. So my vote is for the YDP 163.

Regarding the AP-650, that is decent too, but I do think the Yamaha might have a better feel to it. Definitely try them out, though. I can't speak to the Roland. Have you any Kawais you can test as well? The actions of theirs I've played have been great.


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Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571508
09/15/16 09:24 AM
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TLR0789 Offline OP
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Thanks Moro and Frank.

I was leaning towards the 163 at first until I read up more on the different brands under $2k. By the looks of things, the 3 extra sensors and GH3 hammer action make it seem similar to the 650. 650 just adds more extra features i guess?

Unfortunately, none of the stores near by have any Kawais on display or stock sit hats pretty much dissolved :-(. Wasn't really comfortable going in blind and biting the bullet on something that I wasn't able to try.

In regards to the boxing, I was advised by several retailers that they come in flat packs and could fit in cars and that 9/10 of the people are successful with this lol. Let's hope I'm one of those on Saturday!

Last edited by TLR0789; 09/15/16 09:25 AM.
Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571520
09/15/16 09:59 AM
09/15/16 09:59 AM
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TLR0789 Offline OP
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I also forgot to mention theYamaha 525 if that's worth taking into consideration? It seems similar to the 163.

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571559
09/15/16 12:36 PM
09/15/16 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by TLR0789
......In regards to the boxing, I was advised by several retailers that they come in flat packs and could fit in cars and that 9/10 of the people are successful with this lol. Let's hope I'm one of those on Saturday!


Slabs with or without included wood/stand console pieces come in flat boxes that fit in many medium-sized cars especially cars with hatch back and fold-down rear seats. It would not hurt to confim, prior to purchase, the model you buy is shipped in one box or possibly two boxes - one for the slab and one for the stand pieces. Some people load the box so that it is placed in line from rear of car towards front. Some people without hatch back have success loading the box sideways across the back seats and have enough clearance for rear doors closing, perhaps snuggly but not crushing the box.

I hope you will have an opportunity to play/test some of the models on your list. The 163, 401R and 650 provide a pretty good variety of brands within your price range. Best of luck!

Last edited by drewr; 09/15/16 12:37 PM.

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Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571564
09/15/16 01:01 PM
09/15/16 01:01 PM
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Alexander Borro Offline
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If you are not interested in the extra features of the AP 650, granted it does have slightly more powerful speakers than the model I own ( 2 x 30 versus 2 x 20 W ), but aside from that, the AP 450 ( now replaced by the AP 460 ) has the same piano sound engine and same keyboard action at lower cost. I would consider getting that if you are going for a Casio, you'll save some money in the process.

It is the case with all the Privia and Celviano models, ( except for the new Hybrids which is a different beast altogether ) they all have the same keyboard action down to the cheapest PX 160 model in that line up.


Selftaught since June 2014.
Books: Barratt classic piano course bk 1,2,3. Humphries Piano handbook, various...
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Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571579
09/15/16 01:53 PM
09/15/16 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by TLR0789
I also forgot to mention theYamaha 525 if that's worth taking into consideration? It seems similar to the 163.


The 525 is more expensive but essentially the same as 163 except the 525 has a few cosmetic changes / options plus increased polyphony from 192 to 256.


- Kawai MP7 w/ MDR7506 phones and LSR308 monitors
- Roland HP-508
Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571649
09/15/16 09:18 PM
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TLR0789 Offline OP
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Thanks for the input guys.

Looks like I've narrowed it down to two:

* Yamaha 163
* Casio 460

They're roughly the same price from all the quotes I've been given but I'm leaning towards the Casio 460 due to the whole speaker and lid design and the function buttons seem to be laid out in front instead of on the side like the Yamaha.

Will definitely update everyone on what I've decided to get over the weekend smile.

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571709
09/16/16 08:15 AM
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Keep in mind that having the control panel on the side will allow you to be more immersed in your piano playing with less of a distraction than having buttons in front of you. I own both brands. I seem to favor the Yamaha.
Both are good units? best of luck!

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571861
09/17/16 01:26 AM
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TLR0789 Offline OP
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Hey guys,

This will probably shock all of you but I ended up going with the Kawai CN25 and paid only $1.4K AUD. I tried the 460 and the 163 and the feeling wasn't the same as the CN25 in terms of sound, I did also prefer the CN25 but it wasn't to different compared to the 163. The 460 was a disappoint me for. Since the feel and sound were a bit of a let down.

Funny how things can change once you try them out first hand!

At costco with the missus so I'm dying to get home now lol

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571870
09/17/16 03:23 AM
09/17/16 03:23 AM
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Congratulations for your new piano. I'm sure you'll have lots of fun with it. And no, not shocked. You are not the first who came here asking about some specific models and then ended up buying a totally different one after trying out the options. And not the first one either who ended up with a Kawai. smile

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: JoBert] #2571883
09/17/16 05:27 AM
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Originally Posted by JoBert
Congratulations for your new piano.


Thanks mate.

It's weird too cause I had to quickly look up the model and research it on the spot. I did read up on previously but I wasn't expecting them to have the model in stock and on display and when the guy mentioned that he had it, I gave it a shot and it shocked me from the start.

Thanks again for all the help and advise all smile

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571906
09/17/16 08:03 AM
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Congrats on your new purchase. Kawai is excellent too. Hope you enjoy! Sometimes a certain model just feels like the right one.

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571931
09/17/16 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by TLR0789
Hey guys,

This will probably shock all of you but I ended up going with the Kawai CN25 and paid only $1.4K AUD. I tried the 460 and the 163 and the feeling wasn't the same as the CN25 in terms of sound, I did also prefer the CN25 but it wasn't to different compared to the 163. The 460 was a disappoint me for. Since the feel and sound were a bit of a let down.

Funny how things can change once you try them out first hand!

At costco with the missus so I'm dying to get home now lol


Great choice, glad that became an option for you! smile


private piano/voice teacher FT

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Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571954
09/17/16 11:40 AM
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Congrats on your piano and have fun with it, hope it brings much pleasure smile

Originally Posted by TLR0789
Hey guys,
Funny how things can change once you try them out first hand!


That can happen.

Indeed when I started shopping for pianos I didn't even know Casio made pianos, I was sort of vaguely aware of names like Yamaha and Roland, so I started there, 3 weeks later after few visits in a number of shops I ended up with what I never would have thought I'd buy.

In part, for me opting for the Casio was the budget I had set myself, I wasn't sure how much I would enjoy it and stick with it. I had already stretched that budget by 150 GBP. When I did buy in the end I felt the Casio was the best bang for buck at the time given what my budget was back then.

Indeed I had also considered seriously stretching to the CN 24 by Kawai ( The CN 25 did not exist at the time ), but that was another 150 again which I just couldn't justify to myself. I didn't care too much for the sound engine in the Kawai CN24 when the salesman in the shop played it compared to the Casio for me especially given the price diff, it was roughly on par it seemed to me.

However, there was something about the keys that was indeed very alluring on the CN24, it felt better more solid than the Casio keybed, even though I couldn't play really, just touching it, it came across like that how the keys felt under the fingers, strange how we sense these things because I had no bias, I was not aware in anyway of the great reputation of the Kawai keybeds back then smile

In the end, had the piano sounds on the CN24 made more of a difference I may have jumped on it at the time, but they didn't win me over enough.

Two years on and a bit, and now I can play a little bit of stuff, I am still pretty happy with the Casio keys, it gets me by and still pretty happy with it.

For sure having tried a number of the newer more expensive models more recently as well, I can feel indeed they feel better to the touch, but there is no rush with an upgrade at this time for me. I still feel the Casio offers an extraordinary keybed at that price point in what it gives you and a very nice feeling pedal too on the console model I own.

Interestingly my views on the piano sounds I liked back then in as much as that is a personal preference thing, pretty much stood the test of time in some respects, in that the Kawai is not my first love sound engine I would pick today, even the higher end models, but neither is that what I hear in the Casio these days.

Of course I hear a lot more things now than when I started, but always listened to tonnes of classical piano music and music in general during my life anyway and played various instruments when younger.

The only thing that did change in that time since I started is the sound engine for me is done via computer nowadays. No longer or rarely do I use the Casio sounds anyway, that opened up a whole new world and bred more life into my instrument and joy to play it ever since.

I didn't even know that whole option existed until about 6 month later owning my piano and this forum. Should that happen to you and you wake up one day and think you'd like a more involving sound, that is always an option to consider in time.

Also, I must say, playing, I enjoy it as much now as I did when I started and some more, so have fun and enjoy smile

Last edited by Alexander Borro; 09/17/16 11:46 AM.

Selftaught since June 2014.
Books: Barratt classic piano course bk 1,2,3. Humphries Piano handbook, various...
Casio AP450 & software.
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Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: TLR0789] #2571956
09/17/16 11:53 AM
09/17/16 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by TLR0789
Originally Posted by JoBert
Congratulations for your new piano.


Thanks mate.

It's weird too cause I had to quickly look up the model and research it on the spot. I did read up on previously but I wasn't expecting them to have the model in stock and on display and when the guy mentioned that he had it, I gave it a shot and it shocked me from the start.

Thanks again for all the help and advise all smile


Did you noticed that they sound different in reality than on YouTube videos? And those ones which were your favorites on YouTube were not them in reality?

Re: Casio AP 650 or... ? $2k AUD budget [Re: kapelli] #2572085
09/17/16 07:12 PM
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TLR0789 Offline OP
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Thanks guys.

I guess it it'll be over time for me to know if I'd want the extra sounds and features but right now, I'm enjoying it a lot. I've started to relearn my old pieces from years ago (it's been about 13+ years since I played). Kinda annoying how you forget how to play :-(

Originally Posted by kapelli
Originally Posted by TLR0789
Originally Posted by JoBert
Congratulations for your new piano.


Thanks mate.

It's weird too cause I had to quickly look up the model and research it on the spot. I did read up on previously but I wasn't expecting them to have the model in stock and on display and when the guy mentioned that he had it, I gave it a shot and it shocked me from the start.

Thanks again for all the help and advise all smile


Did you noticed that they sound different in reality than on YouTube videos? And those ones which were your favorites on YouTube were not them in reality?


It was a bit hard to tell from YouTube videos. But the expectations were there especially coming from Yamaha or Casio. I was expecting a lot from Casio especially with the open lid feature but it's okay.

I also guess it comes down to personal preference. I was lucky enough I still knew how to play some pieces to really determine what to choose.



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