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I think it is really unfair to assume that any music professional is 'being paid off' in his/her preference for pianos. preference(s) for brand, age does not necessarily mean any type of kickback. If I ask my tech or my piano teacher what they prefer, I get different responses, but does that mean they get money for that opinion? Nope.

Just look at the responses to 'what brand of piano should I buy on this forum'? Non-dealer pianists all have their favorite brands. .. often wildly different from each other. Even dealers have their 'favorite' brands, even though they may sell very many brands of pianos.

Not sure if they're specifically from China, but among new Asian pianos, the Del Fandrich designed Webers are at a pretty attractive price/performance point. Here's what their 5 ft. sounds like:

http://livingpianos.com/pianos/new-white-weber-w150-baby-grand-piano-hg0110965/

http://livingpianos.com/pianos/new-weber-baby-grand-stunning-walnut-finish/

http://livingpianos.com/pianos/new-weber-black-baby-grand-with-pianodisc-wireless-player-system/

Thanks guys,
my frustrating decision making process is over and I wanted to share my experience with everyone else. some things are more clear to me than before
After much research and trials I ended up selling my old junkie piano and ended up with a Hailun upright piano. My piano is a hailun HU5 that won the award of the dealer choise. I tried almost every piano available in vancouver and Hailun won my heart. funny thing is my teacher said go buy a Yamaha. my tech said buy a hailun. I choose Hailun not just because there are tons of good reviews online but because the tone. it was warm, harmonic and uplifting. When i played on the Yamaha I experienced nothing as close to as what I did while I played on the Hailun. I tried kawai as well. ok pianos but didn't come close to Hailun at all.

So my decision is mine. The piano I bought sounded great to my ear. My recommendation to other fellow consumers out there is that listen to your heart and see which piano sounds the best to your ear. Quality is important but sound is even more. My teacher loves her Yamaha because that is what she loves and that is what sounds good to her ear. out of curiosity she did come by and tried my Hailun she loved the tone and sound. But guess what she will still recommend a Yamaha until the day she buys another brand.

Put it this way, as a driving instructor who owns a BMW, you can't drive a BMW and call yourself the best driver and give an advise to your friend to buy an Mercedes because if you do they will say then how come you haven't bought a Mercedes yet!

So the answer is... research... play... choose what sounds the best to you. If you think a Rittmuler sounds the best to your ear then buy it and if Hailun sounds the best to your ear then choose Hailun. if you think Yamaha sounds the best then go for it. What's the worst that can happen if you have problems in future! trade it with another piano. Talking about trade... Hailun had a 15 year warranty with a great trade in for 15 years. anyhow I just wanted to help the readers find the answer to the same dilemma I had while ago. Technicians are perhaps the better option for seeking out opinions as the know the piano inside out and they don't show off their piano at home unlike teachers.

Now I am in the process of helping my teacher buy a Hailun :))) hahaaaa

Best Chinese pianos?

Piano Buyer puts Brodmann, Hailun and Ritmuller Premium in same league.
Brodmann, grands have the edge over their uprights [until now was told]: we only sell their grands.
Ritmuller makes great pianos both uprights and grands.
Doing extremely well either way, especially the truly awesome 52" upright

Another good piano is Hailun, Baldwin and Perzina.
Hailun, from our experience has slightly variable models with some being notably better than others.
The 178 grand and their 50" upright H5 have always been my favorite pianos. This despite other, larger models introduced to line later. Unfortunately incredible, recent prices increases have made the make IMHO significantly less competitive. Still very good piano.

Same may be true - if perhaps to a lesser extent - for Baldwin.
A make that's selling well due to brand recognition.
Again, there the largest models seemed to shine the most.
[As tested in Seattle]

Perzina always made great uprights.
Their grands have always been less impressive but this may have changed, not sure.
The 123 upright IMHO rivaled some of world's best.
Several local dealers had the make but seemed to drop it for reasons unknown.

My 2 cents and own experience.

Norbert

This is generally good advice although the piano's touch should definitely be an additional criterion.

OTOH I think many piano buyers would benefit from advice from pianists or technicians who may be more knowledgeable about tone/touch than the average pianist. A relative novice(the majority of pianists) may not understand some of the qualities that are "generally" considered desirable for good tone.

The same is true even for more advanced pianists if they have limited experience playing on different pianos. Consider that a busy tech may listen to more pianos in a week than almost all buyers will play during their piano search or play in their lifetime. After discussion with an "expert" if someone still prefers another piano, I think then they should purchase the one they prefer. But my point is just using one's ears and fingers if one is relatively inexperienced can be a mistake.

Piano Buyer gives Baldwin the same rating.


They are selling well because they are a lot of piano for the money, not simply on their brand recognition.

[/quote]

I like my Hailun 178!

You know I can consider myself a decent player so I did try out different pianos before I picked mine.

I did try the Hailun 178 as well and it sounded amazing. my hair spiked up when I was playing it. It has to do with their sound board I guess.

Anyhow, I am rich enough to have a big house to fit that piano in yet. So I bought the Hailun Hu5 and I am loving it right now. Actually for my size of space it's perfect. To be honest I think it's even a better choice than grand because my living room is very small so the sound is just enough.

Thank you for your feedback btw.

I mentioned earlier that any player should choose the piano that sounds the best to their ear but I should correct myself and inform I picked Hailun for the following reasons:
- the sales person pulled the piano forward and showed me the back of the piano. I have done a lot of wood working and I can tell when I see good quality materials and craftsmanship. This was one of the key winners.
- Their black keys are ebony wood. so my fingers didn't slip off of them like they did on other brands. other brands have plastic on top of the black keys and I didn't like them.
- soft close fall board, some brands had it and some didn't. not a big deal but good to have it.
- touch: as I said earlier sound is everything. but I left out craftsmanship and touch. Since I have done woodworking I give Hailun A+ for craftsmanship among all other brands made in Asia. Quality of wood used was premium. the touch was also an important factor in helping me decide. Not too light like japanes and not too heavy like most other Asian brands. Some brands have a horrible touch. I don't want to name them because I don't want to upset other retails in this thread who are advertising their brands. Yes, I agree that you can have a technician work on the touch to improve it. but I believe that you should have spend that money to improve it already and don't wait for the customer to buy it then improve it. Hailun had a great touch. very responsive and even tone.
- paint: hailun had painted the inside of the piano the same way as they did the outside unlike other Asian brands. kind of like Sauter uprights which btw was Crème brûlée... but out of my budget for sure.
- Keybed: my piano has a metal/aluminum frame under the action as the keybed. unlike all brands mentioned here. I did some research on this keybed and it is amazing. it keeps the action in a very firm place specially during piano moves. it's designed by Hailun. other pianos use MDF. this was one of the other factors that helped me choose my piano.
- Duplex: yes! believe or not. I knew and found out what they are and only grand pianos had them. Hailun HU5 had duplex scaling system inside the piano. to those who don't know what they... they improve the sound and add more harmonics to the tone. Grand pianos over 6' use them. although all Hailun grands starting at 5' had them as well. SO that was a + over yamaha.
- last but not least.. pricing was very reasonable for the quality. Yes I could have got a cheaper piano like other brands advertised here in this thread by other store owners but their quality just wasn't the same. Yes the piano buyer does say they are in the same league but same league means what! range of 2 points 3 points! there is always a range. If you consider the extra features that you get with Hailun then you know that it's not in the same level or league as other brands.

No wonder it wont the award. I started my search for Steigerman premiums pianos. Thanks to Norbert who had mentioned that they are great pianos. I found that they are discontinued but then I found out that Hailun had been making them and there was never a steigerman factory. So I researched Hailun.

I want to thank Norbert for being an active forum member. I wish you had Hailun so that I could buy it from you.

Congratulations on your new piano and your choice (I like the HU5 and 178 as well), and I can certainly understand your enthusiasm.

I don't understand how we get to the soundboard of the 178 as the sole reason the piano "sounded amazing", though... Have you read the Del Fandrich article in the Piano Buyer about soundboards, BTW?

Not that the PB ratings chart should be the ultimate arbiter of the industry -- the consumer's ears, fingers, eyes, and pocketbook should do that -- the highest rated pianos from China on the chart are (as of this writing):

Kayserburg (Artist series)
Perzina verticals

with the next highest grouping including:

Baldwin
Brodmann (PE)
Cunningham
Hailun
Irmler (Studio)
Perzina grands
Ritmüller (Premium)
G. Steinberg

Steve Cohen re Baldwin:



That's nice.

Insiders tell me they are actually selling better than the Kawai line placed besides them in same showroom.

Congratulations!

Norbert

Well, we all know what Dr. K bought, and it wasn't a Chinese piano. But he might change his mind, today.

But on the subject, a few thoughts (as someone who has owned a couple of them and looked at a bunch of them, in general)...

1. Chinese pianos have come a long way from when GeorgeK started this thread. A lot of people said their build quality would never be good. A lot of people said the Chinese could never build a piano that could "sing". They were wrong.

2. While you won't confuse them with one of the Three B's, build quality on many of the Chinese pianos of today are as good as anything that came out of Korea and maybe as good as some of the older Japanese stuff. Certainly better than some of the Steinways, as they leave the factory. (Where's that stick-out-tongue emoticon when you need it?)

Check out the rim and the plate on a new Cunningham, along with the build quality, and then tell me that's not a piano that will last a long time.

3. I think the Perzina verticals are the cream of the verticals. And yes, I bought one. It's been a no-problem piano, and is now down to being tuned twice a year. Very good piano, and I don't care what you compare it against.

4. Among the better grands, it's come down to what tone you like. Most have actions that can be adjusted for personal preference, so that's not the issue it was in the past.

And the grands do have their own voices. The Rittmueller is melodic, the Broadmann is kinda Steinway-ish. The Baldwin has an American sound,just not quite like the old American Baldwin although the little five footer is outstanding, when you find a good one. Hailun is also a good grand piano. The Cunningham has a totally different tone than the others, but also American-esque.

The acoustic piano market is contracting, there is no arguing with that. But it's still a good time to buy a decent piano, even as the best become inaccessible to the everyday player.

I am not very familiar with piano actually. But after trying few 30+ year old Yamaha U3 and Kawai, I stumbled across Hailun. Tried HL125 and H33P, finally decided on H33P. Hope this will motivate my girl and myself to take on piano:)