2017 was our 20th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad) Piano Sight Reading
train piano sight reading with your iPhone or iPad
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
Who's Online Now
66 members (claburo, 24000rpm, antune, Animisha, cfhosford, brdwyguy, Dfrankjazz, clothearednincompo, 17 invisible), 609 guests, and 447 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
J
JustinS Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
So I bought a Yamaha CP33 off of a friend recently in good condition but I've noticed a few things that I'm not sure are normal or not so I've got a few questions to ask.

First, the piano sample sounds really bright when playing loudly and it gives off a ring. Even on the mellow sample/mellow brilliance it still seems a bit brighter than it should be. Is this normal? Just because the other DP's I've played/owned such as the Yamaha P115 for example were not like this. It was simple, the mellow sounded mellow and bright was bright.

Second, when I hit a key and release it quickly, or sustain a note and release the pedal there's this metallic/rattle/raspy sound I get that annoys me. I notice it a lot when I'm playing scales for example, changing notes quickly. Is this normal because this is byfar the most annoying thing. The brighter I go the more I get the sound which makes sense, but even on the mellow sample you can still hear it a bit and I'd prefer to not hear it at all.

The last problem I'm having is a lot of feedback out of the headphone jack, I'm going to try and move my piano soon out of the room to see if there's some ground loop/interference BS going on but that's pretty annoying too. I've had this issue in all 4 (I think?) DP's I've owned with this same pair of headphones but it is a bit worse with the CP33.

This is def the most "high end" DP I've owned, I'm wondering if my headphones could just simply not be good enough for it? They're 100$ audio technica's. Regardless I will try to get new headphones soon and also a PA amp probably. Anyways, the CP33's action is great! I really want to keep using this piano but I want these few things resolved.

Thanks in advance for your help, not sure if this is the right place to post questions like this. its also my first post shocked

Last edited by JustinS; 06/14/16 01:15 AM.
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 381
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 381
Yes. It is our main piano and is used several times every week.

The sound you hear is probable the key-off samples. You can adjust the volume to your liking in the settings.
I do recommend that you start with a factory reset first for a fresh start. smile

The feedback issue I don't understand. Never had such a problem of any of my Yamahas. Maybe your headphones are broken in some way?

The CP33 is slightly brighter than the new models, but that do make it sound excellent through a PA system. smile


Peace

Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
J
JustinS Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by Rille Stark
Yes. It is our main piano and is used several times every week.

The sound you hear is probable the key-off samples. You can adjust the volume to your liking in the settings.
I do recommend that you start with a factory reset first for a fresh start. smile

The feedback issue I don't understand. Never had such a problem of any of my Yamahas. Maybe your headphones are broken in some way?

The CP33 is slightly brighter than the new models, but that do make it sound excellent through a PA system. smile


Peace


I've done both, factory reset and tried adjusting the key off sample. Both haven't fixed the issue, if this is uncommon or something I def can record it and post it here. The key off seemed to affect the "thud" you get when you release the key but this is more of a rattly type sound. Thanks for the reply though and yeah, I tested it out through my friends PA at first and it sounded amazing, I need to buy one!

Last edited by JustinS; 06/14/16 02:15 AM.
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,238
C
6000 Post Club Member
Offline
6000 Post Club Member
C
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,238
Originally Posted by JustinS

. . .
The last problem I'm having is a lot of feedback out of the headphone jack, I'm going to try and move my piano soon out of the room to see if there's some ground loop/interference BS going on but that's pretty annoying too. I've had this issue in all 4 (I think?) DP's I've owned with this same pair of headphones but it is a bit worse with the CP33.
. . .


What do you mean by "feedback out of the headphone jack" ???? What, exactly, is happening?

Thanks --



. Charles
---------------------------
PX-350 / microKorg XL+ / Pianoteq
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
J
JustinS Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by Charles Cohen
Originally Posted by JustinS

. . .
The last problem I'm having is a lot of feedback out of the headphone jack, I'm going to try and move my piano soon out of the room to see if there's some ground loop/interference BS going on but that's pretty annoying too. I've had this issue in all 4 (I think?) DP's I've owned with this same pair of headphones but it is a bit worse with the CP33.
. . .


What do you mean by "feedback out of the headphone jack" ???? What, exactly, is happening?

Thanks --



Maybe feedback wasn't the right word
https://soundcloud.com/j5k1/test/s-IIMac
here is a quick recording of what it sounds like. The recording is pretty bad quality, could be cause of the cable or something (it also sounds better if I record it from line-out obviously) but I'm recording it straight from the headphone out jack. The piano was off at the start and you can hear it start humming or whatever after I turn it on. This is kind of what I hear through headphones (it doesn't really buzz the same way it does in the recording but it still makes some annoying sound that gets VERY annoying). Make sure to listen with headphones

and the recording also shows an example of the Key-off noise I was talking about. Thanks

Joined: May 2016
Posts: 234
O
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
O
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 234
I don't think it's a headphone "quality" problem (as in: the specific model of headphones).

It may be a headphone failure issue: It sounds like mains or RFI noise being fed into the headphone. (Plus potentially some clipping distortion at 0:27). Have you tried with another pair of headphones? Often it's a cable/connector problem.

If another pair of headphones causes exactly the same symptoms, I don't think there's much you can do without opening the piano (preferably with an electrical schema and an oscilloscope...).

Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
J
JustinS Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by oldmancoyote
I don't think it's a headphone "quality" problem (as in: the specific model of headphones).

It may be a headphone failure issue: It sounds like mains or RFI noise being fed into the headphone. (Plus potentially some clipping distortion at 0:27). Have you tried with another pair of headphones? Often it's a cable/connector problem.

If another pair of headphones causes exactly the same symptoms, I don't think there's much you can do without opening the piano (preferably with an electrical schema and an oscilloscope...).


I don't have any other pairs of headphones to try right now but I'll make it a priority to buy some. Thanks for the advice

Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,238
C
6000 Post Club Member
Offline
6000 Post Club Member
C
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,238
Originally Posted by JustinS


Maybe feedback wasn't the right word
https://soundcloud.com/j5k1/test/s-IIMac


A recording is worth a thousand words . . .

That sounds like power-supply hum, or a ground loop, to me. RFI (or USB noise) usually has a different sound.

Start by disconnecting everything from the piano _except_ the headphones.

If the power supply is separate from the piano, plug it into the piano, and into the wall AC socket.

If the piano plugs into the wall, plug its power cord into the wall AC socket.

Turn on the piano. If the hum starts, it's power-supply hum.

Typically, that's fixable by anyone who works on electronic instruments. Capacitors (one of the p/s components) have a limited lifetime, and a "leaky capacitor" is one of the things that can cause hum.



. Charles
---------------------------
PX-350 / microKorg XL+ / Pianoteq
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 869
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 869
Could always put the line out into a mixer or interface and use the headphones off that.

Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
J
JustinS Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by Charles Cohen
Originally Posted by JustinS


Maybe feedback wasn't the right word
https://soundcloud.com/j5k1/test/s-IIMac


A recording is worth a thousand words . . .

That sounds like power-supply hum, or a ground loop, to me. RFI (or USB noise) usually has a different sound.

Start by disconnecting everything from the piano _except_ the headphones.

If the power supply is separate from the piano, plug it into the piano, and into the wall AC socket.

If the piano plugs into the wall, plug its power cord into the wall AC socket.

Turn on the piano. If the hum starts, it's power-supply hum.

Typically, that's fixable by anyone who works on electronic instruments. Capacitors (one of the p/s components) have a limited lifetime, and a "leaky capacitor" is one of the things that can cause hum.



This sounds convincing considering the piano was bought in 2007 and has probably been used quite a bit. And yes it starts humming as soon as I turn it on. Another thing I mentioned is that I've gotten this hum on all digital pianos I've owned, but it was a lot more mild of a hum that didn't bother me. I can compare it right now to a Casio PX150 I have in the house and I do get the noise, but it's very low and I never felt bothered by it. So I'm not sure if it's normal or not, are you supposed to get crystal clear audio normally? I guess buying a new power supply might be the solution, I don't really think it is the headphones.

Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 869
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 869
Yes, you should expect crystal clear audio from a headphone out. Can't you chuck a keyboard in the car and try it out at work or somewhere to see if running it off another circuit makes a difference? It seems very unlikely it's directly caused by headphones if it shows up in direct recording. I assume you've tried playing the keyboard with nothing else plugged into the keyboard (except phones) or powerpoint, and all the lights and appliances turned off in the house?

Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
J
JustinS Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by AndrewJCW
Could always put the line out into a mixer or interface and use the headphones off that.


True, this is def an option. Being new to this kind of audio equipment, I'm not sure how much an OK mixer would cost me. I've heard about how great it is to invest in a good VST so that could be another way to go

Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,238
C
6000 Post Club Member
Offline
6000 Post Club Member
C
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 6,238
Quote
. . . So I'm not sure if it's normal or not, are you supposed to get crystal clear audio normally? I guess buying a new power supply might be the solution, I don't really think it is the headphones. . . .


I agree, it's not the headphones.

The CP33 is a "pro keyboard". If you're not playing it, it should be silent.

It uses a Yamaha PA130 power supply, $17 at Sweetwater. If that doesn't fix the problem, I'd probably call a repair shop.

But:

That you've had this problem with other DP's -- that's interesting. There may be something peculiar (= wrong, and maybe dangerous) with your house wiring. The easiest way to check that is to get a "ground tester" (= "receptacle analyzer") (at any hardware store or electrical supply house), plug it into the socket you use for the DP, and see what it says.

If the CP33 is connected to other gear -- computer, recorder, etc -- you _could_ have a "ground loop" problem. But that's unlikely (impossible?) if the only connections it has are your headphones, and its power supply.



. Charles
---------------------------
PX-350 / microKorg XL+ / Pianoteq
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
J
JustinS Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by AndrewJCW
Yes, you should expect crystal clear audio from a headphone out. Can't you chuck a keyboard in the car and try it out at work or somewhere to see if running it off another circuit makes a difference? It seems very unlikely it's directly caused by headphones if it shows up in direct recording. I assume you've tried playing the keyboard with nothing else plugged into the keyboard (except phones) or powerpoint, and all the lights and appliances turned off in the house?


I haven't tried it with all the lights and things off. I will try to move it/bring it somewhere as you suggested and see if that fixes any problems. If the audio IS supposed to be crystal clear then ground loop (or whatever you would call this) is def the problem and I just need to figure out a better place to set it up. If not then I'm going back to thinking it's the power supply crazy

Edit: I'll also try to buy a ground tester too because the house im living in was built pretty poorly I believe so everything makes sense haha. Thanks for the help btw, really appreciated

Last edited by JustinS; 06/15/16 01:09 AM.
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 234
O
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
O
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 234
Originally Posted by AndrewJCW
Could always put the line out into a mixer or interface and use the headphones off that.
If there is noise on the line, it won't help... (and neither it will if it's a defect with the connector or the cable on the headphones). However, given the further information added to the thread, I would also think the power supply is the likely culprit - whether the mains or the transformer/supply circuit remains to be seen.

Before you spend money on power supplies, ground testers and the lot, do try switching everything else off (and I mean everything, including the fridge), or at least moving the piano to another room on a different circuit and testing it there.

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,667
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,667
There is a guy who bypassed the DA converter on his CP33 in order to get a direct digital output. I don't know much more than that, but he has a video.



Moderated by  Piano World 

Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
(ad)
Couch to Concert Hall
Couch to Concert Hall
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
The Logo of the Future - Steingraeber
by Skjalg - 04/19/21 10:47 AM
Practuce With Czerny
by BbAltered - 04/19/21 10:05 AM
What to check when getting a new piano
by Dong Huynh - 04/19/21 05:13 AM
Standchen which version of sheet music ?
by jzmeister1 - 04/19/21 03:47 AM
Strings termination
by Guido, Roma - Italy - 04/19/21 03:04 AM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Forum Statistics
Forums42
Topics206,395
Posts3,084,097
Members101,239
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers

Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


© copyright 1997 - 2021 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5