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Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
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...which is all the more reason for YOU to go out and listen to them. These are individual musical instruments, and they DO sound and feel different from each other. Not just Bechstein from Steinway from Fazioli, but this Steinway from that Steinway, and this Fazioli from that one. They will sound more like each other than a Fazioli compared to a Bechstein, but there will be more than enough difference to be heard, and only some of those differences can be reliably erased by preparation/voicing/tuning.

In terms of manufacturing and finishing (and most likely durability - though Fazioli is a much younger manufacturer than the other two, so not many "100 year old" Faziolis yet) they are fundamentally on a par, perhaps the Fazioli is a tiny smidgen more "perfect" in finish than the others, but if the sound and touch aren't what you like best, what's the point?

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Originally Posted by aliash
what i really do not u derstand is why some of reply with such an angry like tone, if you have nothing else to say than just criticize then i would rather have no replies. for the record, i am not a multi-millionairmwho will by this piano for his home decoration on to desplay it to guests without ever playing it. so just wright down advantages, disadvantages, caracter, tone sound, and such things becuase i am a person who can't decide what to buy. if you would ask me i would buy all three plus a bosendorfer and a mason and hamlin (which i have already dismissed). and yes i will buy a brand new instrument.


As I think has already been stated several times in this thread, the pianos you mentioned are all of highest quality construction, and it is nigh impossible to say that one is better constructed than another. Ultimately it boils down to taste and preference: taste for the tonal quality of a particular piano and preference for the action.

Those are qualities that are purely subjective and therefore no one can state which is better. If you seem to think that some responses have a testy tone to them, it is probably because you don't seem to understand the subjectivity of the responses you are asking for, even though that has been underscored several times.

The only way to get satisfactory answers to your questions is for you to try these pianos yourself and find the particular piano that you like best among all those that you try. It is as simple as that.

Regards,


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i am asking myself the same, i am very used to my 23 year old steinway b, so i like that sound immensely, but the fine wood and craftsmanship of fazioli, that's stunning. so i really do not know what to do. i have played them all in different parts of europe, from munich, milan, koln, vienna, hamburg, berlin, only in frankfurt at the fair i hadn't been yet, it's probably to noisy to even hear details....


true piano lover, admirerer, even worshipper if you like...the most beautiful thing in the world. if i could own a perfect piano it would look like the fazioli gold leaf, sound like a steinway C, had the length of a bechstein C and my signature on it 👌🏻
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They're all *very* fine pianos so it just comes down to personal preference, which can also vary from one piano to the next (even of the same model!), depending on that piano's individual character and also depending on how it was prepped. You really need to go try the pianos that you're considering buying and judge for yourself.

Just a personal anecdote: I'm an obsessive Internet researcher and read so much on the different pianos and people's experiences before I went to look for a piano. And I can sometimes hear what other people describe but ultimately it was very clear that we all have different opinions and tastes. There was one piano that grabbed me, that said it was the one. And it was just that one piano-- I played others of the same model that didn't do anything for me. And I hope that's what happens for you. No one can tell you which piano will capture your heart. Others have also suggested some other top tier brands to try and I think it would be worth your time to also try those.

If you're thinking that you can make this decision based on others' opinions, it is the wrong approach, which is why everyone is telling you to go play and find out for yourself. If you've narrowed your choices down to two favorites after playing in person, then I'm sure people would be happy to talk about why one might be a "better buy" than the other.


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thank you twocats, yes i am going to munich and vienna in a couple of weeks time to try some more of the steinway and bechstein models, then i will go to berlin to the bechstein factory and in short to fazioli in sacile. i will try as many as possible and then as my last destination i will go to hamburg, becuase steinway has a slight advantage over bechstein and third placed fazioli. i just found every fazioli that i played not to have such colour nuances and power as the the other ones, especially steinway. in the end the sound will definitely decide.


true piano lover, admirerer, even worshipper if you like...the most beautiful thing in the world. if i could own a perfect piano it would look like the fazioli gold leaf, sound like a steinway C, had the length of a bechstein C and my signature on it 👌🏻
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Best of luck! I am sure we are all interested to hear what YOU think smile


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Have you enough room for a model D Steinway? You can pick them up used and have them re-built to a very high standard for less than a new Model C. Not everyone has the room for a model D so they are surprisingly good value second hand. Indeed the same goes for a concert length Bechstein. Faziolis are pretty hard to come by used as they are produced in less quantity and have been around for less time then either of the other two, and they tend to be expensive when they do come on the used market. If you insist on new then they are all excellent. Fazioli are finished to a particularly high standard, I remember playing several in Jaques Samuels in London and the actions were flawless.

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Aliash, perhaps some people have been a bit harsh on you. You sound to be a serious buyer. What you must remember is that we sometimes get people on here who write about top tier pianos as if they are going to buy one, who then turn out to be complete time wasters. There was a poster who was going to buy a Bosendorfer Imperial. He turned out to be a schoolboy with multiple ids on the forum and was, eventually, banned. (I am not implying that you are a time waster).

The point is that if you want a tier 1 piano they really are all superb. To the list you have given you could add Grotrian Steinweg and Bluthner. You really can't go wrong with any of them! It is down to which one you happen to prefer. That might not happen to be a particular brand but actually an individual piano within that brand. So try as many as you possibly can and take your time.


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OP: Well, if you're going to Vienna, by far and away, whole galaxies far and away the gap was so great, the best piano I played last Oct. was a 9' Bluthner in the dealership there. That was after visits to both the Steinway and Bosendorfer dealers and trying all instruments on their floors. That particular 9' Bluthner which I think is still unsold is not to be missed. In my opinion.

Call Thomas N., the manager there and inquire about it (my advice). I recognise it's not one of the brands you've mentioned but as I said, having visited the other dealers there ... (Although they do of course have more stock in their warehouses close by).

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Not on his list but still top tier!


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Well, since you asked......
Originally Posted by category
-treble sound

All three have amazing treble sound
Originally Posted by category
-bass sound

All three have amazing bass sound
Originally Posted by category
-built quality

All three have high-quality parts, and are built to the highest standards.

Originally Posted by category
-color and shade of sound


All three are great. Fazioli has a nice even tone, Steinway has an interesting tenor section, Bechstein has a bell-like treble. At this level of piano, where all three are top quality, taste is what matters.

Originally Posted by category
-keyboard touch and responsiveness


This depends on how well they are regulated. All three are fully capable.

-------

btw if your favorite thing about the Fazioli is the gold hardware, it wouldn't be expensive to have the hardware on your piano of choice electroplated with gold. The amount of gold it would take to cover all that hardware costs less than $50 (then add in labor costs, whatever that would be).


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hehe ok i am 29 and my first piano was bought for me at age 7 and it was a steinway b so either was i a great potencial or a materialist (at age 7) 😂😂...don't get me wrong, i am serious, i just happen to really struggle with time for traveling and trying them out. so I narrowed the choices to 3 brands which i am not going to make my mind off. yes bluthner and steinweg were also in consideration, but the design and several other factors didn't do it for me so thank you for the advices, i know all this manufacturers. but as said I'm going to pick between the three mentioned, whereas the steinway has i thing the advantage with its sound being so close to me. and as mentioned above, unfortunately i dont have room for a full size grand so the max is at approximately 230, at the apartment i have a yamaha which is a big instrument to, but will sel it because it is very modest at the bass section and also i use it very little.
so hope we have a friendlier and more relaxed corespondence in the future 👍🏻


true piano lover, admirerer, even worshipper if you like...the most beautiful thing in the world. if i could own a perfect piano it would look like the fazioli gold leaf, sound like a steinway C, had the length of a bechstein C and my signature on it 👌🏻
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it doesn't even have to be real gold, just the look would be ok! that's a great idea phantomfive. then i can cover let's say the steinway (y)


true piano lover, admirerer, even worshipper if you like...the most beautiful thing in the world. if i could own a perfect piano it would look like the fazioli gold leaf, sound like a steinway C, had the length of a bechstein C and my signature on it 👌🏻
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Did you want just gold hardware or the whole piano plated in gold? The latter is not going to be easy to get.


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exactly like the gold leaf fazioli, and even the veneer on the inside, its fabolous, i wish steinway would put that kind of veneer on the inside ot their pianos (y)


true piano lover, admirerer, even worshipper if you like...the most beautiful thing in the world. if i could own a perfect piano it would look like the fazioli gold leaf, sound like a steinway C, had the length of a bechstein C and my signature on it 👌🏻
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They probably would, if you prepay for it.


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As piano dealer having to constantly deal with people's money [or lack of it..] comparisons between makes without looking at price has never made much sense to me. It's a more disciplined approach with perhaps less entertainment value but the rewards are much greater in the end.

Like real estate, you don't look at a house in the suburbs and a penthouse in the Trump tower at same time. In fact most real estate agents would call you a fool.

The first decision in this type discussion is IMHO what the "purpose" of the comparison is supposed to be in the first place. And what benefits such comparisons should hold for you.

In my many travels I have played all of the above mentioned pianos plus many,many more.
Sitting down and trying the various models my reactions were from nonchalant to great to fantastic.

There was no particular order or brand consistency usually depending on - what else is new - model prep, location, room acoustics and so on.

However, when asking about "price" things much quicker seemed to fall into place. Who in my mind, would choose a piano of lesser appeal for much higher price, this outside prestige of looks.

I since have shaped my entire business model according to these type considerations and experiences. And done very well.

Frankly. this is how I had discovered Estonia when nobody had even heard of that country.
A piano which keeps performing extremely well according to these guidelines.

What, if for same money you can buy a larger model or better model by someone else, a model which will clearly be superior the the last one you just saw?

It's the guideline I have seen again and again to produce the best results for buyers even when not involving any of our own makes.

Think about that when sitting down next time "comparing" pianos.

Hold your cheque book tight and realize the total sense of what I have just said. If not, and its's for general amusement or discussion only twocats summed things up nicely. thumb

Quote
Just a personal anecdote: I'm an obsessive Internet researcher and read so much on the different pianos and people's experiences before I went to look for a piano. And I can sometimes hear what other people describe but ultimately it was very clear that we all have different opinions and tastes. There was one piano that grabbed me, that said it was the one. And it was just that one piano-- I played others of the same model that didn't do anything for me.


Such indeed, is the nature of things.

Norbert

Last edited by Norbert; 05/23/16 12:12 PM.

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It does seem rather wasteful to have to re-do a brand new piano's finish, where someone had taken such care to bring it to that condition. Seems like the kind of thing that's better to choose during the building process. If you don't fall in love with a single piano but end up narrowing down to a single brand where you feel that you'd be happy, maybe you can work with the factory to make you a custom gold-leaf piano. If gold leaf is that important to you smile


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well to be honest i am I little concerned about how the gold leaf finish would affect the sound if it would be done acter the original polish kr lets say over the original polish, so i would in the end probably decide for a glossy black finish. its a classic an i think we are all used to it.


true piano lover, admirerer, even worshipper if you like...the most beautiful thing in the world. if i could own a perfect piano it would look like the fazioli gold leaf, sound like a steinway C, had the length of a bechstein C and my signature on it 👌🏻
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Apparently there are gold-leaf pianos. I don't think it would affect the sound at all, actually.


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